VE3D has the full text. ‘Crusader’, as GameSpot calls him, attorney Jack Thompson has written an open letter to a long list of Entertainment Software Association members, comprising developers and publishers. In it, he (in this order) lists his credentials and those of co-campaigner Hillary Clinton, criticises the actions or lack thereof of George Bush, and then for the remaining half of the letter launches a personal attack on ESA president Doug Lowenstein, interjected with scoldings for keeping him and demands to find a replacement.
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When Hitler invaded Russia, opening up an Eastern offensive on the eve of winter, Britain’s Prime Minister Winston Churchill noted that “Hitler must have been rather loosely educated, not having learned the lesson of Napoleon’s autumn advance on Moscow…Your Doug Lowenstein is similarly “loosely educated” about the United States Constitution.”
Be sure to read the whole letter before making any judgements.
All I’ll say is remember: just because someone is acting like a prick, doesn’t mean everything they say is automatically wrong.
Uh, OK. I guess it was quite lengthy. Here's the original post though, I want to keep it up:
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VE3D has the full text. 'Crusader', as GameSpot calls him, attorney Jack Thompson has written an open letter to a long list of Entertainment Software Association members, compromising developers and publishers. In it, he (in this order) lists his credentials and those of co-campaigner Hillary Clinton, criticises the actions or lack thereof of George Bush, and then for the remaining half of the letter launches a personal attack on ESA president Doug Lowenstein, interjected with scoldings for keeping him and demands to find a replacement.
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Dear ESA Members:
Today, United States Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton, with initiatives she will announce at a 10 am news conference in our nation's capital, is acting decisively in furtherance of what for her has been a strong leadership role on these issues since Columbine—a tragedy caused in part by the violent video game industry. Millions of American parents should be thankful to the Senator for striking back against what can be fairly called "Grand Theft Innocence" at the expense of our children by only some within your industry.
The letter makes disturbing reading at some points: Thompson accuses the Bush administration's handling of the industry of 'training terrorists' and accuses Lowenstein of going on 'ad hominem jihads intended to obscure real concerns about real industry abuses' (which, you might argue, is exactly what Thompson is doing by saying so).
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Lowenstein has done this time and time again, alienating lawmakers and turning off media with his "You're a fool, and I'm a genius" mindset. With friends like Lowenstein, your industry doesn't need any enemies. But he winds up growing them like topsy.
He also juxtaposes Lowenstein with Hitler:
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When Hitler invaded Russia, opening up an Eastern offensive on the eve of winter, Britain's Prime Minister Winston Churchill noted that "Hitler must have been rather loosely educated, not having learned the lesson of Napoleon's autumn advance on Moscow…Your Doug Lowenstein is similarly "loosely educated" about the United States Constitution."
The message ends with a personal warning and telling off/insult to the ESA members:
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If you want your fledgling industry destroyed for all of you, keep Doug Lowenstein right where he is. Events, like Columbine to the factor of ten, will take care of that. You won't be able to blame Senator Rodham Clinton. She is trying to prevent that calamity.
But if you want to be a partner with America's parents by together taking our children out of harm's way, then look for an ESA president who has the common decency to recognize the truth, speak it, and then act upon it.
It's your choice. You've made some pretty bad choices to date. Make a good one for a change.
Dump Doug.
These quotes are of course the edited highlights: be sure to read the whole letter before making any judgements.
All I'll say is remember: just because someone is acting like a prick, doesn't mean everything they say is automatically wrong.
All I'll say is remember: just because someone is acting like a prick, doesn?t mean everythingthey say is automatically wrong.
Well, if someone is acting like a prick and making hysteric exaggerated statements like he does, I cannot take him seriously. I really can't grasp how a MOD could be made into a skandal that large. Unbelievable.
Thompson is a bit of a joke, continuing with that nonsense about Doom being used to train killers and when he starts talking about Hitler and using his faith to give him the moral high-ground I'm appalled (and I'm a Christian).
But I do think he's right about the immaturity of the games industry. In the UK it's less of an issue. ELSPA has done a great job of lobbying government and there seems to be the understanding in those of power that games exist for different ages. We also have games legally rated 18, but which are still sold in most stores because they tend not to take some moral stance on such matters.
It's ironic that the Hot Coffee scandal has gone so far, the content unlocked is tamer than most of the regular things that happen in the game. But the US does get uppity about sex at times, just look at the storm in a teacup over the Janet Jackson nipple slip.
Rockstar isn't helping either, it churns out a diet of extreme violence. Bully and The Warriors (the latter I saw a presentation of earlier this week) are going to continue this. I do worry that Rockstar is giving the industry a bad name and unfarely, as most games do not feature any violence.
This will have about the same impact overall as Chick publications, and Mike Warnkie novellas had on D&D, and Rock Music. Personally I ignore the ESRB If my Daughter wants a Game or wants to watch a particular movie I preview it with my wife and we make a decision from there, it's called parenting.
*laugh* Hehe - yeah - Marilyn Manson prob works as a freelance advisor for Rockstar Games! Blame them all!
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Originally Posted by Akeldama
Rockstar isn't helping either, it churns out a diet of extreme violence. [...] I do worry that Rockstar is giving the industry a bad name and unfarely, as most games do not feature any violence.
Yes, Rockstar does indeed a good job at getting their "reputation". Anyway, people should be smart enough to differentiate between various developers. Saying they give video games a "bad name" is kinda like saying "porn is giving film making a bad name". Well - that's of course exaggerated, and I can see your point, but anyway... People should learn like in any media you have products for every niche.
Anyway, I have to give Rockstar some kudos for being so stubborn. IMO they just do all this crap for publicity, and taking the risk of backfiring does take some guts.
All I’ll say is remember: just because someone is acting like a prick, doesn’t mean everything they say is automatically wrong.
You can be a real tool. This asshole Godwin's his own open letter, and then starts bringing up shit like Columbine? BECAUSE A GAME HAS SOME VIRTUAL FUCKING?
Hey, Civilization, please, GET A GRIP.
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Yeah, I read the letter. Seems like the same old horseshit to me. He'll spend his whole life creating controvery out of nothing waiting for that one big pay day.
No, it wasn't the parents fault their daughters were gunned down but it wasn't DOOMs fault he did it. Lots of youngsters play video games but they don't train you to aim a freaking rifle and compare demonic bodies to human beings. The kid was fucked up and his parents let him have access to weaponry.
Games don't kill people, people kill people. I forgot the part where we have free will and choice. Jack the Ripper wasn't exactly a people person either. Guess he trained to kill on tic-tac-toe.
Ohgawd, Jack Thompson. It blows my mind how people will so rabidly attack everything other than the source of the problem. Everytime something like this gets brought up, the same solutions are agreed upon here.
Be better parents. Review what your kids do. I mean, suggesting that kids have no access to violent video games is a bit of an overstep. But if your kid has violent tendencies, I don't think giving him a copy of Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas is a good idea. In this day and age, it's just so common for parents to have "more important things to do," like let the TV raise their kids.
For once, I would love it if an actual gamer got his/her own say (without being editted/censored), because all of this is so lopsided.
--VIDEO GAMES ARE BAD! WHAT DO YOU HAVE TO SAY FOR YOURSELF?
"Well--"
--HERESY! YOUR PRODUCTS TRAIN KIDS TO KILL. COLUMBINECOLUMBINE!!!!RA!RA!RA!
Mr. Thompson may have some valid points, but he says nothing to really substantiate them.
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Millions of American parents should be thankful to the Senator for striking back against what can be fairly called "Grand Theft Innocence" at the expense of our children by only some within your industry.
I don't understand this sentence, nor what he means by "Grand Theft Innocence". I know he's trying to allude to something about grandtheft auto, but what? Is it stealing the innocence of children? Is it Rockstar claiming their innocence? Looking at it I think he means the latter, taking the childrens innocence. As the letter is often hard to decipher like that I shall not say anything about that difficulty except that he should get someone to help him write letters. "I think it's because he's a lawyer. Ever tried reading legel documents? They're written like that so lawyers have jobs.)
Anyway children aren't all that innocent to beging with. They can be pretty vicious without the help of video games. There are movies, books, and of course news sources that speak of violence akin to that in video games.
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It has been my privilege, as a lifelong Republican, to provide facts—not feelings--about the reckless practices of certain members of this industry, some of which are Members of the ESA, in the midst of responsible fact-gathering by Senator Rodham Clinton's staff.
Soo.. Only republicans can give facts? Do they not have feelings?
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George Bush simply said "Parents just have to be better parents."
I agree with Bush on something... wow(context-link real violence and videogame violence)
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"Hot Coffee" mod scandal
I find it silly that a sex mod constitutes more of a scandal than the violence itself in this case. I mean when you have a child, you'd realisticly expect your child to have sex one day. But I doubt that you'd expect your child to go kill people. Sex is rated worse than killing people though.
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No opponent could possibly be acting upon principle, in the world according to Doug Lowenstein. Only he is the oracle of truth. All others are scum. It is his way.
I think the same might be said about Jack Thompson maybe. Take this letter for example.
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His approach, as the President of your Entertainment Software Association, is to demonize critics and to engage in ad hominem jihads intended to obscure real concerns about real industry abuses. All this does is deepen the resolve of your critics to act. I know.
Jack Thompson labaling Doug Lowenstein a terrorist with the word "Jihad" in his jihad against videogames.
Mr. Thompson then seperates video games from movies by refering to MPAA Pres. Jack Valenti. A rather subtle differentiation, but supporting Mr. Valenti is about the same as supporting movies in general even if he might not like specific films. But, it's also hypocritical as I have seen films with more sex than GTA with only an R rating. For example; Eyes Wide Shut.
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When Hitler invaded Russia, opening up an Eastern offensive on the eve of winter, Britain's Prime Minister Winston Churchill noted that "Hitler must have been rather loosely educated, not having learned the lesson of Napoleon's autumn advance on Moscow ."
Your Doug Lowenstein is similarly "loosely educated" about the United States Constitution. I have never, in my eighteen years of public interest law practice against the excesses of the entertainment industry, run into an individual more devoid of even an elementary understanding of the meaning and scope of the First Amendment. Even Howard Stern's lawyers look like Alexander Hamilton compared to Lowenstein.
Compairing the President of the ESA to Hitler. Ment to make an emotional point and and explain the depth of Mr. Lowenstein's uneducated-ness due to the stupidity of invading Russia in Winter. But Mr. Thompson doesn't really explain what Mr. Lowenstein Doesn't know about the first amendment. Though it could be assumed he's saying that videogames aren't covered in the first amendment. It would be nice if he said why that was so, wouldn't it?
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Doug Lowenstein embarrasses each and every one of you when he holds forth about what the "Founders" intended when they drafted the Bill of Rights. For Doug, the Founders are GTA's Tommy Vercetti and Carl Johnson. Doug never met a pixilated prostitute he didn't like, and I'm sure James Madison would be impressed.
Oh, because "For Doug, the Founders are GTA's Tommy Vercetti and Carl Johnson." And he likes pixulated prostitutes.
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When well-intended citizens and legislators have tried to get your industry to adhere to the logic of the "M for mature" ratings label,...
Fine, treat them like R rated movies and don't give them to kids in stores. Have their parents buy them for them if they think their child is mature enough to differentiate reality from fantasy, and can handle the graphic elements.
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...Lowenstein has flown into a fury, claiming children have a constitutional right to consume pornography and violence.
But if you're going to say things like this, back it up in the same letter, because I for one would not belive some one would say that. How do I say this? It's a constitutional right to make it, to sell it, and to "consume" it for everyone. Censorship for anyone including children should not be decided by the government. It should start and end with parents for their own children.
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If those of you who understand that any technology can be used for either good or for ill and that "responsibility" is something that adults are supposed to exercise in all walks of life, even in the entertainment industry, then get rid of this highly-paid thug and replace him with someone with sense.
MAIN POINT OF ENTIRE LETTER. I honesty have no clue about Mr. Lowenstein's performance in his job. I don't care. I can buy video games, porn, cigerettes, see R rated movies and join the army and kill people. But with my own discretion and not government regulations would I choose not to give children all of that. I think that's what Mr. Thompson doesn't like. That people could use their own descretion for their children and not his. So he uses insults and emotions to convince people of his opinions. He could have said "Mr. Lowenstein has been negligent in his duties as head of the ESA." And then list the reasons. But he didn't and doesn't in everything I read from him.
Stupidity makes me angry, if you think anything I said was stupid tell me, and I'll think about changing my opinion. Maybe.
Last edited by Valchael; 07-15-2005 at 05:47 AM..
Reason: Title
You can be a real tool. This asshole Godwin's his own open letter, and then starts bringing up shit like Columbine? BECAUSE A GAME HAS SOME VIRTUAL FUCKING?
He does have, somewhere underneath the bile, a point. If you can't see or understand it, that's perfectly OK.
He does have, somewhere underneath the bile, a point. If you can't see or understand it, that's perfectly OK.
Awww, a wittle passive aggressive condescension. His point, whatever the fuck you think it may be, is lost in a sea of putrescent babbling that should insult the ears of any reasonably intelligent individual.
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