Red Orchestra: Ostfront 41-45 Preloading Now

[Evil Avatar]

In the spirt of "Charging for Free Stuff", Valve sends along word that Red Orchestra: Ostfront 41-45, is Pre-Loading now via Valve's Steam (http://www.steampowered.com/) downloading platform.

Red Orchestra: Ostfront 41-45 is now available for pre-load and pre-purchase via Steam. Red Orchestra is a realistic WWII online action game that features one dozen scenarios, a wide arsenal, and drivable vehicles. Pre-loading is available with no obligation to purchase. Those who pre-purchase will save 10% off of the regular price of $24.95. For more details, please visit www.steampowered.com (http://www.steampowered.com/).
Kind of a shame to see a Mod go Pay all the sudden. If they had made a new game with the same name, that would be different, but charging for the same Mod that was available for free a few months ago? A darn shame.

[Rakael]

A great mod too. I played the shit out of that one for a long time.

[Mason]

Red Orchestra is a realistic WWII online *snore*...

[Ph00p]

NICE!!! Especially since they've already recieved a ton of money in that contest they won back in the day.

Steam is a horrible POS every shmuck nowadays is putting junk on there and charing a premium for what is only worth the orignal asking price FREE.

[Draft]

Wow, that is a little steep for a mod. Is there someplace one could read up on what was added? Cause I really like Red Orchestra, but maybe not enough to pony up $25 to play it on Steam...

[Rakael]

RO really does take a lot of skill to play, much less play well. With no crosshairs, you have to use iron sights to aim. Thus you have to hit a key to pull the gun to your shoulder, which slows your movement. Of course, after playing for so long it becomes second nature to use the iron sights, and also to nail a dude shooting from the hip.

I felt the same way you do Mason, until I installed it on a whim. After I got used to it, no other fps can measure up, WWII or not.

Of course, there is no way in hell I would pay that much for it. Get real. $10 to $15 would have been a great price. I would have paid that just to help those guys out.

[killer_dk]

Red Orchestra the MOD and Red Orchestra: Ostfront 41-45 ... is not the excact same game , the core gameplay is the same, yes. but there is a lot of new weapons and new classes and new features e.g ( you can rest you weapon on window sill or other stuff, for better aim. Tank combat should also be pretty cool.
Have a look....

Red Orchestra: Ostfront 41-45 : officail new trailer
http://www.gamershell.com/download_12546.shtml HI-RES
http://www.gamershell.com/download_12547.shtml Low-RES

[InstaPete]

Man. Those guys want to get paid for their hard work instead of giving it away for free?

Fuck them!

[Rakael]

Sorry, but unless its changed dramaticaly, tank combat in RO blows.

[Evil Avatar]

Red Orchestra the MOD and Red Orchestra: Ostfront 41-45 ... is not the excact same game , the core gameplay is the same, yes. but there is a lot of new weapons and new classes and new features e.g ( you can rest you weapon on window sill or other stuff, for better aim. Tank combat should also be pretty cool.

Right. That would explain why the second they won that Unreal license that they took the download links to the Mod version off their website.

[killer_dk]

NICE!!! Especially since they've already recieved a ton of money in that contest they won back in the day.

Steam is a horrible POS every shmuck nowadays is putting junk on there and charing a premium for what is only worth the orignal asking price FREE.

That's not true !!!

Quote from and artikel :

And there were 60 guys that worked on that game so when you split $100,000 between 60 guys, that’s not a lot of money. The four leads saw that we had $30,000 between us and we said, “Hey, let’s start a game studio.”

So over the entire contest, it all equaled one million dollars and that included the Unreal license which is worth about $300,000 or $400,000.

The full artikel "and inteview with the makers of Red Orchestra" interesting read by they way :
http://www.gameinformer.com/News/Story/200602/N06.0208.1901.19923.htm

[Evil Avatar]

Man. Those guys want to get paid for their hard work instead of giving it away for free?

Fuck them!

No, fuck them for taking something that WAS a free mod and then turning around and trying to charge for it AFTER they won some contest.

(Not to mention the fucked up sneaky way they took the download links to the Mod off their website after they won the contest.)

If they want to make a new game and get paid for it - more power to them. They have their prize money and their Unreal engine license, that is a good place to start.

Oh, and don't forget the money they got from Bold Games (http://www.boldgames.com/).

[dartt]

I think you are all being a bit unfair to the Red Orchestra team here.

1. Ostrfront is not a mod, it's a stand alone game.

2. They have added a lot of new features and content.

3. They have put years of work into Red Orchestra.

I think Steam is a great platform for small development teams to launch their products from and I don't think there are many more deserving of a bit of success than the RO team.

[Redline]

The worth of the product and whether or not it can be sold should be evaluated based on it's quality, not some random moral/ethical debate (which is completely subjective) about how it 'used to be free'. Afterall, that sounds like whining.

If their product is quality enough to be sold, more power to them. There's been far worse travestys of justice in the gaming field where the intention all along was to sell the product, and the product was just trash.

[Dr Quincy]

Well I've just gone and bought it. It looks entertaining and I welcome Steam's continued support of the indie games community.

[killer_dk]

what are you taking about , Evil ? you can still download the mod version of Red Orchestra :

http://redorchestra.clanservers.com/ro2k4downloads.html

[Majai]

Right. That would explain why the second they won that Unreal license that they took the download links to the Mod version off their website.

No they dident. There are 2 sites one for the mod and one for the game.

www.redorchestramod.com
www.redorchestragame.com

[dartt]

No, fuck them for taking something that WAS a free mod and then turning around and trying to charge for it AFTER they won some contest.

(Not to mention the fucked up sneaky way they took the download links to the Mod off their website after they won the contest.)

If they want to make a new game and get paid for it - more power to them. They have their prize money and their Unreal engine license, that is a good place to start.

Oh so they should just drop all the work they have done for RO to date?

Or perhaps they shoud have developed a new game AND worked on Ostfront for free?

How dare they have any intention of making money for producing a great game! How very dare they!

I don't see how anyone has the nerve to complain about this...

[Mozgus]

I could never seem to enjoy RO on UT2004. I found that I enjoyed many other mods more, especially those which employ heavy use of air based vehicles in strategic ways. Lately I've been most addicted to this one particular custom server for UT2004, which has:
Some modern day weapons thrown into the core game
All weapons tweaked in some way (Flak cannon's bomb is like Worms' super banana bomb)
All vehicles tweaked in some way
Modern day vehicles like helicoptors
low gravity and quad jumping
and so on...

ut2004://69.13.214.130:7777

[Schnoogs]

No, fuck them for taking something that WAS a free mod and then turning around and trying to charge for it AFTER they won some contest.

(Not to mention the fucked up sneaky way they took the download links to the Mod off their website after they won the contest.)

If they want to make a new game and get paid for it - more power to them. They have their prize money and their Unreal engine license, that is a good place to start.

Oh, and don't forget the money they got from Bold Games (http://www.boldgames.com/).

What on earth are you talking about...first of all you can still download the mods from about 100 different sites on the web.

And second of all this new version is a full game seeing as they won an Unreal license.

Where do any of you get off criticising them for trying to earn a living from their hard work?? If you don't want this retail version than don't buy it...thats called capitalism and it works.

They won the contest fair and square and are using the money and license to start their own company...

[Liquidize105]

The new Ostfront is an enhanced version of the mod, there's no singleplayer to speak of. Of course the original mod itself was a lot of work to put together, and since it's the dream of every mod team to go retail, they got what they wanted.

$25's probably bittersweet for everyone: Higher than what most people want to dish out for what was originally a mod, lower than the makers who know 1st hand all the labor that went in.

Personally, I won't be buying it. I didn't enjoy the mod enough to do that.

[Schnoogs]

The new Ostfront is an enhanced version of the mod, there's no singleplayer to speak of. Of course the original mod itself was a lot of work to put together, and since it's the dream of every mod team to go retail, they got what they wanted.

$25's probably bittersweet for everyone: Higher than what most people want to dish out for what was originally a mod, lower than the makers who know 1st hand all the labor that went in.

Personally, I won't be buying it. I didn't enjoy the mod enough to do that.

I think the most important thing you hit on was your last statement...I downloaded the mod and realized that there was nothing about it that was better than Day of Defeat.

Frankly i don't understand the appeal...I won't be buying it because of quality. If it was good I would have no problem rewarding them for their hard work though.

[Captain Awesome]

No, fuck them for taking something that WAS a free mod and then turning around and trying to charge for it AFTER they won some contest.

(Not to mention the fucked up sneaky way they took the download links to the Mod off their website after they won the contest.)

If they want to make a new game and get paid for it - more power to them. They have their prize money and their Unreal engine license, that is a good place to start.

Oh, and don't forget the money they got from Bold Games (http://www.boldgames.com/).


Holycrap EA, whats up your ass?

The links for the original mod are still active(?) This was the same practice Introversion Software did on the cusp of releasing Darwinia on steam. It's just to get peoples attention to go to Steam to see the new announcements. You can still download the original mod off of various sites. I dont know why this was hard to find for yourself or to understand? If they want to charge for the new and extra enhancement they did add to it after taking a 1 year hiatus, why is that wrong?

What, because it started off as a "mod"? I figure all the work they did put into it and all the original assets, its a bit more than a simple "mod" now.

Christ man, I expect a bit more out of you than this "boo-fucking-hoo" attitude.

[Sensei-X]

That's not true !!!

Quote from and artikel :

And there were 60 guys that worked on that game so when you split $100,000 between 60 guys, that’s not a lot of money. The four leads saw that we had $30,000 between us and we said, “Hey, let’s start a game studio.”

So over the entire contest, it all equaled one million dollars and that included the Unreal license which is worth about $300,000 or $400,000.

The full artikel "and inteview with the makers of Red Orchestra" interesting read by they way :
http://www.gameinformer.com/News/Story/200602/N06.0208.1901.19923.htm

I sure hope the 4 leads did a huge portion of the work, because it seems odd that 4 of the 60 guys ended up with 30% of the cash and the license of top of that. Especially when they mention that there were 20 really talented people in their team.

[Citizen Philip]

I think $25 is too much. I applaud their ability, and on a second title I would be more than happy to pay $25 to $35 after they have proven themselves.

The problem I see, from a person who has never played it before is: you haven't proven yourself. Yes, you've won a contest and got a license, very amendable; I've never heard of you (my fault) and from what I've seen, a mod and then a remake of a mod on a new engine doesn't equate to a full online retail price.

[Maskatron]

$15 would have been a much better price point. It does seem like a lot of work though went into the retail release so I may wait to see what the word is when it comes out. In the meantime I'll keep playing BF2 and DoD source.

[F3nyx]

I sure hope the 4 leads did a huge portion of the work, because it seems odd that 4 of the 60 guys ended up with 30% of the cash and the license of top of that. Especially when they mention that there were 20 really talented people in their team.The workload is rarely evenly distributed in mod development. Probably most of those 60 people just created a few weapons or props each.

[Suicidal ShiZuru]

So mods are supposed to be totally free now? Since when?...

[pur3r4ge]

I sure hope the 4 leads did a huge portion of the work, because it seems odd that 4 of the 60 guys ended up with 30% of the cash and the license of top of that. Especially when they mention that there were 20 really talented people in their team.

It wouldn't suprise me if they did at all. I've been working on a mod for over a year now, as the lead mapper, and have not put in anywhere near the work that the two leads have over the last nearly 3 years. We've had a lot of people work for us, but not a lot of people do a lot of work. Mods seem to attract people enough to make a few models or skins or a map, then they drift off.

I'd imagine that of those 60 guys, the vast majority contributed a small portion of work, all valuable, but very low percentage-wise.

Also: EA: RO is the team's hard labor, and they can do with it what they please. They don't owe you a free game for life.

[Kem0sabe]

Well, Valve pulled the same sh*t with counter strike, bunch of mods for half life 1 developed into retail projects, same thing with Unreal tournament. I cant critisise these guys for trying to make a living doing what they love (developing games).

Now 25$ might be a bit steep, especilay considering the 2 other games you can buy on steam (not counting all the valve stuff), hostile waters and gal civ, both have much higher production values than RO and i personaly find them much better games. As i said, not much bang for your money, at 25$.

[drakkarim]

personally i won't pay for any game that i can't hold in my hands in a retail box, not even $5.

[Abash Alarmist]

personally i won't pay for any game that i can't hold in my hands in a retail box, not even $5.

Good to know you aren't going to be part of the gaming culture in 5-10 years.

[Schnoogs]

personally i won't pay for any game that i can't hold in my hands in a retail box, not even $5.

good luck playing games, watcing movies, and listening to music in the future.


rolls eyes

[Evil Avatar]

So mods are supposed to be totally free now? Since when?...

No, but it would be nice if free mods stayed free. Don't you think?

Unless they added a single player campaign in there somewhere and I missed the announcement???

[Smithersnz]

But is it still a mod? I know it began as one, but now that it is stand-alone does it still count as a mod?

The way I see it, the "Mod" is still free to download, but you need UT to play it. The one on steam is stand-alone, so it isn't a mod. You have to pay either way, whether you buy UT or off steam, so where's the problem? If anything, it's opening up this product to a new audience, one who don't own UT. I may get it, because I never got UT.

And if the success of these guys helps encourage other mod developers to make quality games like this, then it's worth it.

[Schnoogs]

No, but it would be nice if free mods stayed free. Don't you think?

Unless they added a single player campaign in there somewhere and I missed the announcement???

Its a stand alone game now...why would they give that away for free?

[mightbe]

In the spirt of "Charging for Free Stuff"
...
Kind of a shame to see a Mod go Pay all the sudden.
And at 25 bucks no less. We Todd Ed. For that I could get mount&blade and a used PS2/Xbox/Cube game.

Maybe steam should try a "steam pass" subscription where you can play any of the steam content and they reward developers revenue from subscriptions based on downloads and playtime. I know steam tracks that shit.

[Skjef]

And at 25 bucks no less. We Todd Ed. For that I could get mount&blade and a used PS2/Xbox/Cube game.

Maybe steam should try a "steam pass" subscription where you can play any of the steam content and they reward developers revenue from subscriptions based on downloads and playtime. I know steam tracks that shit.
Don't even start, man. Paying $20 for a game once (Darwinia) is much better than playing $10-15/month for a bunch of games you MIGHT play.

If Steam goes subscription, I'm outta there.

[mightbe]

Don't even start, man. Paying $20 for a game once (Darwinia) is much better than playing $10-15/month for a bunch of games you MIGHT play.

If Steam goes subscription, I'm outta there.

Clean the wax out of your montior.. er eyes... er something.

I didn't say "only offer a subscription". I said "offer a subscription".

You don't even start. *snaps* Girlfriend.

[Skjef]

Clean the wax out of your montior.. er eyes... er something.

I didn't say "only offer a subscription". I said "offer a subscription".

You don't even start. *snaps* Girlfriend.
Wait, I'm supposed to clear the wax out of my ears to hear your omission? :D

I see what you're saying, but I really hate monthly fees. You very rarely get your money's worth, in my experience. For example, right now I'm at university, behind a residence internet connection. It won't let me play any internet games (other than Worms:Armageddon, oddly), so I pretty much only play HL2 and Darwinia. Everything else is just wasted space at this point.

[The Continental]

No, but it would be nice if free mods stayed free. Don't you think?

Unless they added a single player campaign in there somewhere and I missed the announcement???

The MOD is still free, how are you not understanding this after the 5 or so replies with links to the FREE mod download?

The new stand alone game which DOES NOT REQUIRE A COPY OF UT2004 is what they are charging for. I personally think the price is a little steep, but it's their work and if they can get that much for them, more power to them.

[Schnoogs]

I don't think Evil realizes that the mod is free for those who own UT2003/2004.

Where as this game is stand alone and therefore you have to pay for it.

Look at it this way Evil...you can either pay $40 for UT2004 and download the mod OR pay $25 and get the stand alone.

[mylittlepwny]

Oh dear. I had to actually register, the bashing was so irritating.

Wake up from the dreamworld you are living in where mods were a few bits of code and maybe some new maps for an established game.

It's amazing how people can get so caught up in semantics. Just because something was spawned as a "mod" from a "mod contest" doesn't mean it didn't have as many man-hours put into it as "usual FPS done on the unreal or latest iD engine."

I suppose Deus Ex was a mod too? Call of Duty? Pretty much any F.P.S. game that Epic or iD don't make are just mods?

Absolutely the answer is *yes*, and absolutely the answer is *no*.

Stop getting hung up on the word mod. This is a product that was made by people giving up loads of their time and putting it into something that they gave away for free. Something that you can still get for free today. Now there is a commercial version that they have put even more time into. What the heck is the problem?

Should they have started a completely new project in their status as commercial developers? No way. Why waste the name/art/codebase that they have been spending all their free time establishing. They made the smart move. Time is money. Spending time working on something that doesn't earn you money is lost money. If you think all mods should be handouts ....again dreamworld. If you think "once a mod always a mod"...well, I dunno what to say, that's just ungrateful, narrowminded and selfish. A good way to take the wind out of aspiring developers sails tho.

This in no way compares to counterstrike. Back in the day, Counterstrike was the mod of all mods. However it used plenty of Half Life models, relied on the community to make maps, and was a success due to the concept and execution rather than being a massive piece of work.

Over the years it has evolved into something greater, and yes, Valve charge for it, they are MORE than welcome to, Valve are one of the most generous, pro-consumer companies out there right now. Without them, Countersrike wold probably be dead, or certainly not the polished product it is. And lets not forget it's still FREE with your original HL1 / HL2 cdkey. Valve are more than generous. And I can't count the times I've wished Battlefield 2 had steam-like patching.

[Evil Avatar]

Its a stand alone game now...why would they give that away for free?

Because no matter how you slice it, it is still just the same Mod that they have been giving away for two years.

[thecrazyd]

Oh dear. I had to actually register, the bashing was so irritating.

Wake up from the dreamworld you are living in where mods were a few bits of code and maybe some new maps for an established game.

It's amazing how people can get so caught up in semantics. Just because something was spawned as a "mod" from a "mod contest" doesn't mean it didn't have as many man-hours put into it as "usual FPS done on the unreal or latest iD engine."

I suppose Deus Ex was a mod too? Call of Duty? Pretty much any F.P.S. game that Epic or iD don't make are just mods?

Absolutely the answer is *yes*, and absolutely the answer is *no*.

Stop getting hung up on the word mod. This is a product that was made by people giving up loads of their time and putting it into something that they gave away for free. Something that you can still get for free today. Now there is a commercial version that they have put even more time into. What the heck is the problem?

Should they have started a completely new project in their status as commercial developers? No way. Why waste the name/art/codebase that they have been spending all their free time establishing. They made the smart move. Time is money. Spending time working on something that doesn't earn you money is lost money. If you think all mods should be handouts ....again dreamworld. If you think "once a mod always a mod"...well, I dunno what to say, that's just ungrateful, narrowminded and selfish. A good way to take the wind out of aspiring developers sails tho.

This in no way compares to counterstrike. Back in the day, Counterstrike was the mod of all mods. However it used plenty of Half Life models, relied on the community to make maps, and was a success due to the concept and execution rather than being a massive piece of work.

Over the years it has evolved into something greater, and yes, Valve charge for it, they are MORE than welcome to, Valve are one of the most generous, pro-consumer companies out there right now. Without them, Countersrike wold probably be dead, or certainly not the polished product it is. And lets not forget it's still FREE with your original HL1 / HL2 cdkey. Valve are more than generous. And I can't count the times I've wished Battlefield 2 had steam-like patching.
Preach on, mother fucker. Some people just cannot seem to grasp the difference between a total conversion mod, and a unique game. That is, there really isn't one.

[Smithersnz]

Because no matter how you slice it, it is still just the same Mod that they have been giving away for two years.


And they are still giving it away. Where I live, it's cheaper to buy it off steam than buy UT and then download the free mod. No matter how you look at it, you have to pay someone at some point. Why not pay the mod makers instead of Epic (or whoever publishes UT)?

[Ondo]

And they are still giving it away. Where I live, it's cheaper to buy it off steam than buy UT and then download the free mod.
Unreal Tournament has been available for less than $25 for a long time now. It's $13 at GoGamer.com currently.

[Evil Avatar]

Unreal Tournament has been available for less than $25 for a long time now. It's $13 at GoGamer.com currently.

Thank you, Ondo. Now take a bow.

[Evil Avatar]

And they are still giving it away. Where I live, it's cheaper to buy it off steam than buy UT and then download the free mod.

Yes, but if you buy Unreal Tournament 2004 and then download the Mod, you still get to keep a copy of Unreal Tournament 2004.

If you buy it off Steam, all you get is the new version of the Mod.

[Evil Avatar]

I suppose Deus Ex was a mod too? Call of Duty? Pretty much any F.P.S. game that Epic or iD don't make are just mods?Deus Ex had a single player game. Red Orchestra doesn't. :)

Should they have started a completely new project in their status as commercial developers?If it was their intention to do more than just throw away an Unreal license worth in excess of $300k, then I suppose that they should have done more than just start charging for what people were playing for free (and as other posters have pointed out - that can still be downloaded and played for free).

[Abash Alarmist]

If it was their intention to do more than just throw away an Unreal license worth in excess of $300k, then I suppose that they should have done more than just start charging for what people were playing for free (and as other posters have pointed out - that can still be downloaded and played for free).

As you should be more thna well aware, it takes time, money, and dedication to create a quality game. These folks are needing capital to actually start creating a quality game with the engine that was awarded to them. These guys have worked hard for what they have done, and why shouldn't they make some money off of it?(Real market, not just awards from Epic). It is a stand alone/seperate game, it has extra features and gameplay mechanics that isn't in the FREE mod that you are STILL able to get. Is $25 a bit excessive? Personally, yes. Is your ranting and raving about how you are pissed these folks are making some money on their hard earned work excessive? Yes.

[UnderHero5]

Deus Ex had a single player game. Red Orchestra doesn't. :)

If it was their intention to do more than just throw away an Unreal license worth in excess of $300k, then I suppose that they should have done more than just start charging for what people were playing for free (and as other posters have pointed out - that can still be downloaded and played for free).

Since when does a single player campagne have ANYTHING to do with what counts as a real game or not??
Okay, so a single player mod such as They Hunger wouldn't be considered a mod in your book, it would be a real game?
Counter Strike doesn't have single player... does that make it less of a game?
Deus Ex doesn't have multiplayer... does that make it less of a game?
I personally ONLY play multiplayer games on PC (or 90% of the time) because they offer MORE replay value than a single player game, imo.

At any rate.. Evil.. you may run this website but you're honestly pretty damn dense.
First you scream "THEY TOOK THE DOWNLOAD DOWN".... people prove you wrong and you don't even admit you were wrong... instead you point out it's cheaper to buy UT2k4 than RO? What the fuck does that prove?
It was a mod (and still is) which is FREE. It is now stand-alone, has extra features/weapons etc, and they own a liscence to the engine.

You know the game Prey, that's coming out? RO is no less of a game than that will be. Both are using liscenced engines to create what is essentially a total conversion mod. A MODIFIED version of that engine.
Mods for games are free because it's illegal to charge for them. Does that mean that any less time and effort went into making them? No. If you think it does you're a bigger fool than I already think you are.

The sad part is, you probably don't even play RO in the first place, and you're complaining for no reason.

I personally think RO is a fun mod which still needed a lot of pollish. That seems to be what they have done with RO:Ostfront, among other things, so I may pick it up.

You're like the people who complain about DoD:Source being charged for.
It's NOT the same game. A LOT has been done, all art assest have been redone, etc etc... Just because it has the same name and similar gameplay doesn't mean it should be free.
Hell, if you think like that then every SEQUAL to a game should be free. What the hell is Halo 2? Pretty much an improved Halo 1. Improved engine, added content, etc. See where I'm going with this?

Or how about a game like Alien Hominid? http://www.gamespot.com/xbox/action/alienhominid/index.html
That started as a *gasp* FREE flash based game, and later the devs got a publisher and added more gameplay and extra's (exactly what is being done with RO) and sold it as a stand-alone game!!
So you honestly think Alien Hominid should be FREE because it started off as a free game?
Do you understand how your logic is flawed?

How about Ragdoll Kung Fu? The dev was going to give it away for FREE but he put so much time and effort into it he wanted something in return. Do you think that should be free too, because it started free? (keep in mind that how "good" the game in question is has nothing to do with the discussion. That's purely opinion).

Understand, rubberband? Or should I go on (not going to).

You're a grown man, you should realise that very little in the gaming world is free. You should also realise that we aren't entitled to FREE stuff just because we want it. These people worked hard on RO and RO:Ostfront and if they want to charge for it then they CAN and they SHOULD. Regardless of what you think of the game, time and effort was put into it and they deserve money. Keep in mind you are in no way being forced to purshase the game and the original mod is STILL, and always will be, free.

End rant.

[Liquidize105]

Just FYI, Deus Ex does have a multiplayer mode. It's pretty fast-paced.

[Beelzebud]

Wow EA, you've really gone into the Jackass Hall Of Fame with this one.

LOL Can't even acknowledge you were totally wrong about them removing the download to the mod.

[UnderHero5]

Just FYI, Deus Ex does have a multiplayer mode.
Haha, I never actually played Deus Ex (runs and hides). Don't kill me!

But yeah, you get the point either way. Insert any single player game in there. Morrowind. There you go.

[Wyrm]

Shit, Counterstrike was free at one point. I cant believe I remember that...

[Liquidize105]

I think we all know wassup in this thread, so let's not be vultures and pick the poor sucker apart.

And you UnderHero5, I don't even know why you waste time with other games... Maybe it's for the best - after playing Deus Ex, nothing measures up and you'd be disappointed from then on. :o

[UnderHero5]

I think we all know wassup in this thread, so let's not be vultures and pick the poor sucker apart.

And you UnderHero5, I don't even know why you waste time with other games... Maybe it's for the best - after playing Deus Ex, no other game measures up to it.

Well when it came out I just.. overlooked it. About a year ago I attempted to play it and I played for maybe an hour and said "what's the big deal?" (because, obviously, everyone loves it).
Maybe I didn't give it enough time, but it just didn't seem as amazing as everyone always made it out to be. Keep in mind I was playing it years after release, and many, many FPS's after release.
I should really give it another try some time, I honestly didn't play it for long enough to make a valid opinion. I just got a little bored with it at the beginning and stopped. Sadly, the exact same thing happened with System Shock 2.

I feel like I shouldn't call myself a FPS player because I haven't played through those two games (though I've played, seriously, almost every FPS in the last 5 years, save a few of the Tom Clancy games and the REAL stinkers).

Oh well. Eventually I will go back to them and play through them whether I like them or not!

[Liquidize105]

Dude, years don't matter in this case, Deus Ex is still unsurpassed.

Well, I shouldn't say. I got into it in 2002, took me 2 tries myself. That's innovation for you, it takes willingness. Just let it do its thing, you'll get it 1-2 hr. in.

[Emabulator]

I'm waiting for Valve to release Minesweeper on Steam. ;)

[Wyrm]

In the source engine.

[Varsity]

Resist! Resist change! Burn the machines!

[Heretic Machine]

I'm going to agree with Evil on this one... but only becaues they won a mod contest. If they had made a mod, and then at some point decided to start charging for it (with the proper license) I would of been cool with it. But they won a contest, a contest that was meant to make a good mod team into a team with a future in the industry, for making a free contribution to the community. I feel that taking the license they got and using it to turn what is essentially the old mod into a product goes against the spirit of the contest. I wouldn't be surprised if Epic started putting a clause into the "Make Something Unreal" contest that made it to where you couldn't do this sort of thing.

At least, that's what I would do...

[Smithersnz]

Unreal Tournament has been available for less than $25 for a long time now. It's $13 at GoGamer.com currently.

If you live in the states. Where I live it would cost me $44US to buy it, whereas if I got RO off steam it would be half that.

[Zawath]

It's a cheap price. They have been working on the game fulltime for quite long so they deserve the money. Sure Dod:Source was cheaper but that didn't really have much content. Only 4 maps when this is going to have a dozen plus much improved tank fightings & infantry combat.

[Liquidize105]

I'm going to agree with Evil on this one... but only becaues they won a mod contest. If they had made a mod, and then at some point decided to start charging for it (with the proper license) I would of been cool with it. But they won a contest, a contest that was meant to make a good mod team into a team with a future in the industry, for making a free contribution to the community. I feel that taking the license they got and using it to turn what is essentially the old mod into a product goes against the spirit of the contest. I wouldn't be surprised if Epic started putting a clause into the "Make Something Unreal" contest that made it to where you couldn't do this sort of thing.

At least, that's what I would do...
Yes, that'd be ideal, except it takes years to make a game. The license they got, go ahead and correct me if I'm wrong as there seems to be different sayings surrounding the contest, is the UT 2.X engine, not 3. Besides, it's hard enough for an upstart to make a game let along get the kind of recognition that RO has gotten. With their engine license + contest + steam, they've essentially bypassed the publisher barrier.

The 25 goddamned smackers though is saying something. Professional dev houses don't even get that much! Minus the steam commission, that's a pretty penny they're packing in. They could've really slashed the price down and looked good.

[mightbe]

The 25 goddamned bucks though is a little greedy, professional dev houses don't even get that much! Minus the steam commission, they should've really slashed the price down.

Exactly! And since when do I give my money to companies that "deserve it". I give my money to companies that give me what I want.

I sure as hell don't want RO for half the price of a first teir game.

[Zawath]

Yes, that'd be ideal, except it takes years to make a game. The license they got, go ahead and correct me if I'm wrong as there seems to be different sayings surrounding the contest, is the UT 2.X engine, not 3. Besides, it's hard enough for an upstart to make a game let along get the kind of recognition that RO has gotten. With their engine license + contest + steam, they've essentially bypassed the publisher barrier.

The 25 goddamned smackers though is saying something. Professional dev houses don't even get that much! Minus the steam commission, that's a pretty penny they're packing in. They could've really slashed the price down and looked good.

Professional dev houses don't get that much because large publishers are funding them. The RO team doesn't get any money from publishers so they have to fund the game development themselves and that costs a lot of money.

[Liquidize105]

I don't think many people quit their day jobs for this, besides with no publisher they could work at their own pace. There's also the prize money from various stages of the contest, and what they essentially did was expanded and probably polished their own mod.

It used to be a labor of love; for doing the samething now, they're getting paid a lot of money. Like I said, it's bittersweet for everybody.

[Gel214th]

<sarcasm>Yeah, fuck them for wanting to make money and making business decisions which allow them to do so. The bastards.</sarcasm>

[bapenguin]

Well as long as it has more content and plays better than DoD: Source more power too them. DoD: source is a frickin joke, I can't believe they are charging 20 bucks for that.

[see colon]

the path from mod->retail has a long history. counter-strike and purge both saw retail releases, and various other teams and team members got jobs because of their mod work.

RO is a good mod. the time an effort those guys put into things really shows. and the retail version looks to add even more features. stop crying that they want to sell their product. noone here is bitching that evilavatar.com has adds all over it. the internet used to be free, you know.

[Schnoogs]

Because no matter how you slice it, it is still just the same Mod that they have been giving away for two years.

Last time I checked Evil UT2004 costs money...so how again are they giving it away?

Either way you have to pay...hey that rhymed!

[Schnoogs]

Well as long as it has more content and plays better than DoD: Source more power too them. DoD: source is a frickin joke, I can't believe they are charging 20 bucks for that.

Free to anyone that bought HL2...I think DoDS is the best online game currently...I'd gladly play extra for it.

[see colon]

Free to anyone that bought HL2...I think DoDS is the best online game currently...I'd gladly play extra for it.
it's not free to me, and i bought HL2. DOD:S came with some HL2 packages, not all.

[PacerDawn]

Only the hard-core who have downloaded this mod and learned how to use it will even (should even) be interested in purchasing. It's not an easy mod to get into or enjoy. I downloaded it and installed it (6 months ago I think). I remember it being sluggish, firing was very difficult, and the controls were not intuitive at all. And there was little to no instruction as to how to configure and what to do. Hell, it took me a while to figure out how to even get into the game! I sat at the char selection screen forever hitting all manner of keys with nothing happening. Then when I did get in, it felt like my character was running through molasses, and I couldn't hit anything because it's hard to aim. That definately wasn't worth the 100k+ it occupied on my HD so I deleted it and went back to having fun with plain old UT2k4, and sticking with Battlefield for my WWII fix.

[DingBat]

Because no matter how you slice it, it is still just the same Mod that they have been giving away for two years.

Hey EA,

I've been a long time fan of this site. Keep up the great work.

However, I should also admit right now that I'm a level designer working for Tripwire on Red Orchestra: Ostfront.

I have to respectfully correct you when you say that this is the same mod that has been given away. It is not.

What has changed?

- The art assets have been totally redone. We had to, we didn't own a lot of them.
- The engine has been heavily modified.
- New player movements, including "leaning".
- A completely overhauled vehicle system.
- Improved bot support.
- There are 14 maps, 10 are completely new, 4 were seen in the mod but have been completely overhauled.

That's just an abbreviated list, btw.

As I said, I am biased, but I believe that RO:O offers quite a bit more than was seen in the mod. If the objection is that any mod should never make the move to retail product, well, we're clearly guilty of that. However, if the claim is that Tripwire is charging for something previously given away for free with no improvements, again I respectfully suggest that this is not correct.

Regards