Disgaea 2 Preview

[bean19]

Gamespot (http://www.gamespot.com) has posted a preview (http://www.gamespot.com/ps2/rpg/disgaea2/index.html) and a developer interview (http://www.gamespot.com/ps2/rpg/disgaea2/media.html) for the sequel to Nippon Ichi's flagship strategy RPG series, Disgaea 2.

Fans of the series may be disheartened to hear that the original cast has been completely replaced (though they may make cameo appearances), but will be glad to hear that the developers have worked to keep the dark, quirky sense of humor that permeated the original title.

The battle system has also undergone several changes, but, according to the preview, will be heavily reminiscent of the original:

Gameplay remains a turn-based affair, but, of course, things in the world of Disgaea are never quite that simple. Certainly you can individually move your characters around the battlefield, placing them in the attack range of enemies and plinking away, but many of the original game's unconventional conventions are reprised here. You'll still be able to, for example, pick up and throw enemies and allies both over the map and into your base panel. The base panel is the spot on the map where you'll normally call forth units from, but you can chuck an enemy into it as well, letting the monster do battle with the allies that have yet to emerge. Combination attacks can still be triggered in the sequel by clustering your allies in spaces adjacent to one another, with the power of these attacks increasing as more characters become involved.

Special geo panels sometimes cover certain areas of the battlefield, and as in the original game, you can strategically destroy little pyramids called geo symbols to catalyze an attack. When a geo symbol is destroyed on a geo panel, you'll have the chance to touch off a chain reaction that both neutralizes the panels and does damage to anyone standing on them (friend or foe). This effect can be great for building up crazy combo attack numbers, but there are times you'll want to keep the geo panels intact, since different colored panels will grant you bonuses when you stand on them. Some will double your earned experience points, some will increase your attack power, and some will make you invincible. There are panels with negative effects, as well, so you'll always have to be mindful of where your characters are standing at any given time.
A Disgaea without Laharl, Prince of Darkness? This just got shifted to a "rent-first" title in my head space. I guess the writers don't know how to write a story that grows characters forward instead of slowly revealing their back stories.

[Mason]

I don't know, there's been a heavy layer of suck to everything NI's done other than Disgaea 1. I'm not sure they understand what they did right, as they're yet to repeat it.

[Tricky Thumb]

Yeah, sure. Just because Laharl isn't in the game it's just a rental now.

Good luck finding THAT at Blockbuster.

Oh and Phantom Brave was awesome, so I don't know what you're talking about Mason.

[bean19]

Yeah, sure. Just because Laharl isn't in the game it's just a rental now.

Good luck finding THAT at Blockbuster.

Gamefly for the win.

[Heretic Machine]

Please don't let it suck as much as Makai Kingdoms, kthxbye.

[Tricky Thumb]

Gamefly for the win.

I'm not too keen on waiting nearly a week for my games to come in the mail. Either way, you're just a silly person for deciding to rent a game first based on the fact that the main character is different.

Please don't let it suck as much as Makai Kingdoms, kthxbye.

Oh god, please yes.... please.

[bean19]

I'm not too keen on waiting nearly a week for my games to come in the mail. Either way, you're just a silly person for deciding to rent a game first based on the fact that the main character is different.

Yeah, the waiting really sucks, but it saves me literally tons of cash. . . and as a college student with a very expensive gaming hobby, it becomes worth the wait.

Not to be a Gamefly commercial, but in my circumstances, it makes sense to only buy outright titles I'm absolutely sure about and to use this service to pre-screen titles that I'm unsure about.

Too often I find myself buying games that I either complete or lose interest in within a week. Gamefly has pretty much put this to a stop. Since I got the service last October, the only purchase I've regretted (for console games) was Dead or Alive 4. . . really neat game but the single player is too hard for me and the multiplayer is weird. . . I don't really want to play in an "arcade" where I spend more time watching than playing. . . or restarting the system when the multiplayer inevitably locks up due to someone leaving.

I'm on the four game plan, and my post office has the scanning doo-dad that allows them to know when I have put a return game in the mail, so I pretty much get the games I want a few days after their release. The end result is that I pretty much always have 2 games in my house ready to play, and 2 making their way to me in the mail.

If the service really takes off, I think it could be very bad for gaming in general though. . . I still spend a fortune on PC titles and on buying trade-in copies of games I loved but resold in order to afford new games. My game collection is actually getting larger while using Gamefly. . . oddly enough.

[Mason]

Phantom Brave had quite possibly the lamest story of all time. In any format. It hurt to watch the cutscenes. Not to mention that the AI didn't know how to navigate the game's movement system, and the occasions in which an AI character would actually make it over to you and hit you would be pretty sparse. Even if you were only a few steps away, quite frequently the NPC would just hop over you or slide out of attack range or something. It's a strategy RPG where your opponent was a spastic child. Makai Kingdom was actually a huge improvement on that front.

Disgaea 2 actually seems to change very little from the original, gameplay wise. This is kind of unfortunate. I'd much rather see them move over to a FFT-esque time-based system, instead of the alternating sides. The alternating sides just makes the whole game about pumping up your attack to ridiculous levels, such that you can wipe out all the enemies before they get a chance to attack. Weak.

Some of the trailers show Laharl and Etna coming back, but then you also see plenty of folks from Makai Kingdoms show up. And the anime parts of it look great, but it seems like that'll be a single anime intro instead of anime cutscenes throughout the game. It's the standard NI sprite puppet show for cutscenes, sadly. Don't they now have the money to up production values a bit more?

Still, it's slim pickings for SRPG fans, so I'll probably get it unless it is universally panned.

[bean19]

Some of the trailers show Laharl and Etna coming back, but then you also see plenty of folks from Makai Kingdoms show up. And the anime parts of it look great, but it seems like that'll be a single anime intro instead of anime cutscenes throughout the game. It's the standard NI sprite puppet show for cutscenes, sadly. Don't they now have the money to up production values a bit more?

Check out some of the gameplay footage. Special attacks now get anime-awesome cutscenes. . . which I'm sure get old after their first three views.

[Kefkataran]

Threadjack of the moment:

Gamefly takes a week to ship? What's the deal? You think they could pull of some Netflix-style speediness if they wanted?

[Mason]

Check out some of the gameplay footage. Special attacks now get anime-awesome cutscenes. . . which I'm sure get old after their first three views.
I watched all the trailers, the game has the exact same special attack style of all other NI games. The individual attacks are just different.

[Mason]

And seriously, in Disgaea you were an amoral demon who could optionally conquer and enslave the Earth.

In Phantom Brave, you were a little girl who found affirmation and confidence in the kindness of others

Double-you Tee Eff?

[Mozgus]

Never understood the love for the NI series. Hated it all. None of them even come close to the perfection of Final Fantasy Tactics. No balance or strategy in these at all. I think the fanbase for this series exists, simply because there was an extreme lack of titles in the genre for years, then one comes along that only moderately sucks, so it gets labled as the Second Coming.

[Mason]

Never understood the love for the NI series. Hated it all. None of them even come close to the perfection of Final Fantasy Tactics. No balance or strategy in these at all. I think the fanbase for this series exists, simply because there was an extreme lack of titles in the genre for years, then one comes along that only moderately sucks, so it gets labled as the Second Coming.
Word. And the in many ways I'd argue that NI SRPGs don't actually fit the genre. They're way more focused on the meta-game of picking the player-time investment that will advance your characters most speedily, instead of any actual tactics. When your guys can one-shot enemies that can't scratch you, tactics just don't apply.

The Disgaea missions with clever use of geotiles actually had some strategy, but that's about it. Couple those segments with good music and plot (at least the first half) and you've got a game of decent quality. But the ProgressQuest aspects of Disgaea and all other Nippon Ichi SRPGs should not be lauded, by any means.

[bean19]

Threadjack of the moment:

Gamefly takes a week to ship? What's the deal? You think they could pull of some Netflix-style speediness if they wanted?

It actually takes about three days (less if you live close to California). That is, except for new releases. They have to get these in and process them into their system or something. Anyway, they don't ship until about a day or two after they show up in stores.

So 3 days for library titles, and 5 for new releases.

It does suck, but it works for my poor ass.

[Kefkataran]

It does suck, but it works for my poor ass.

Oh, no, I totally understand it, and I'd probably use Gamefly if I thought I had the time to put into the titles I'd rent, but still. It'd be cool if they got their shit down the way Netflix does. Heh.

[bean19]

Kefka - I think it has to do with the way that games ship compared to the way that videos ship. Videostores get DVDs BEFORE they are allowed to put them on shelves while videogame release dates are the day that the games ship. . . not the actual date that the games will arrive in stores.

If they had them previous to the day, they could work on getting them into the system and ship them on the release date.

Anyway, I can deal with it since I have a flow of games coming in and out now.

[mister_slim]

Oh, no, I totally understand it, and I'd probably use Gamefly if I thought I had the time to put into the titles I'd rent, but still. It'd be cool if they got their shit down the way Netflix does. Heh.
I always have a game or two lying around while the others are in the mail, so it's worth the wait. I really can't play that many games at a time.

[Kefkataran]

Kefka - I think it has to do with the way that games ship compared to the way that videos ship. Videostores get DVDs BEFORE they are allowed to put them on shelves while videogame release dates are the day that the games ship. . . not the actual date that the games will arrive in stores.

I'm not talking about new games shipping. I'm talking about anything that you pick. If you have a brand new title in your Netflix queue sometimes you have a wait also. But usually with normal titles it's one or two days to ship at the absolute most.


I always have a game or two lying around while the others are in the mail, so it's worth the wait. I really can't play that many games at a time.

Yes, I have about a million games lying around and little time anyways, so that's why I'm not a Gamefly subscriber. :p

Anyways, back on topic: Disgaea 2. I suck at SRPGs.

[Savok]

How many games let you run a gauntlet of levels to power up a candy bar?

I rest my case.

[Kefkataran]

How many games let you run a gauntlet of levels to power up a candy bar?

I rest my case.

Hell, that's a good point.

[Balthasar]

How many games let you run a gauntlet of levels to power up a candy bar?

I rest my case.
I did like this aspect of the game, but it would be so much better if it had the level of strategy that FFT required of the player. That game is still one of my all time favorites for kicking my ass so many times on the first play-through.

[ElectricMonk]

they need to reprint disgaea, if it's popular enough for a sequel

[Kefkataran]

they need to reprint disgaea, if it's popular enough for a sequel

I thought they already had?

[Heretic Machine]

I did like this aspect of the game, but it would be so much better if it had the level of strategy that FFT required of the player. That game is still one of my all time favorites for kicking my ass so many times on the first play-through.

I loved FFT, but it definetly was not without it's flaws. I remember one play-through where I got stuck, the game became completly unbeatable. There was no way for me to level, I was only able to go into one area where I would get into a plot fight. Before I got a chance to move, one of my NPC's would move automatically and get killed. The end. This should NEVER happen in a video game. I had beaten it several times before, and I've beaten it since, but that playthrough had to be completly scrapped.

[Balthasar]

I loved FFT, but it definetly was not without it's flaws. I remember one play-through where I got stuck, the game became completly unbeatable. There was no way for me to level, I was only able to go into one area where I would get into a plot fight. Before I got a chance to move, one of my NPC's would move automatically and get killed. The end. This should NEVER happen in a video game. I had beaten it several times before, and I've beaten it since, but that playthrough had to be completly scrapped.
What area was this?

[Skizott]

I loved FFT for the difficulty. Some of the fights in there were plain Unfair *Fight with Gafgarion*

If Disgaea used more of strategic thinking like FFT, I would love it.

[Heretic Machine]

What area was this?

Hell if I know. It was after a plot fight, couldn't go anywhere but forward into another plot fight. NPC moves first, gets pwned by the bad guys. I lose.

[Mirabelle]

Did anyone else find that the game music in FFT induces narcolepsy? I have seriously never had such good naps as when watching the SO play this. I don't think I could stay awake during those battles if I had to. =)

Also, Disgaea has almost my favorite VG story of all time. Up there with Psychonauts and FF7 for me.

[Balthasar]

Hell if I know. It was after a plot fight, couldn't go anywhere but forward into another plot fight. NPC moves first, gets pwned by the bad guys. I lose.
A large majority of the enemies you face in the game have levels that are scaled to your levels, so if you are tactically adept, this should never happen.

[Balthasar]

Did anyone else find that the game music in FFT induces narcolepsy?
No? It's one of the best video game soundtracks of that era.

Also, Disgaea has almost my favorite VG story of all time. Up there with Psychonauts and FF7 for me.
I loved Disgaea, but by video game standards that plot was thoroughly mediocre.

[Heretic Machine]

A large majority of the enemies you face in the game have levels that are scaled to your levels, so if you are tactically adept, this should never happen.

Has nothing to do with tactics. I don't move in that battle. The NPC moves itself, gets pwned, I lose. I make approximetly 0 moves. I had no problem dealing with the previous battle. Maybe I just got lucky in the previous battles, and should of been higher level to get where I was, I don't know. What I do know, is that I should never reach a wall in a video game and not be able to turn back.

[Balthasar]

Has nothing to do with tactics. I don't move in that battle. The NPC moves itself, gets pwned, I lose. I make approximetly 0 moves. I had no problem dealing with the previous battle. Maybe I just got lucky in the previous battles, and should of been higher level to get where I was, I don't know. What I do know, is that I should never reach a wall in a video game and not be able to turn back.
Considering that you said you've played this game through multiple times, I wonder why you don't recall which battle this was and the specific circumstances under your not being able to go forward or go back and strengthen your characters? But as I said before, enemies scale their level to your characters, so brute leveling is not an effective way of beating enemies in the game anyway.

[Savok]

I've never played FFT.

See PAL never got it.

[bobbler]

Makai Kingdoms was a great one from NIS - you get to play as "the badass freakin' overlord!" who bound his soul to a book, so hes essentially powerless. It's a bit more dark (like disgaea) unlike some of their other stuff (la pucelle, phantom brave, and atelier iris).

From what I've played so far it seems if you liked Disgaea you'd likely enjoy this one too. I haven't finished it, so the story could turn all kind hearted before the end -- I don't know. The characters are absolutely great, and the typical insane whoring of SRPG is there (part of the NIS fun!). I'm more excited for Makai Wars (although its likely another year away, at least, seeing its a PS3 title) than I am for Disgaea 2, actually.

[bobbler]

I've never played FFT.

See PAL never got it.

FFT is a fantastic game. It's actually the reason I'm excited for FF12 (same game world -- Ivalice)... the guy behind FFT and Vagrant story is doing a lot for the game (I believe hes in charge of the story/gameplay part).

Import it or something!

It would rock if they did a remake/port for PSP or DS even... although it's likely a bit too soon. FFT:A was garbage in comparison =/

[Heretic Machine]

FFT is a fantastic game. It's actually the reason I'm excited for FF12 (same game world -- Ivalice)

Once again, I get to crush someone's dreams. FF12 is not set in the same world as FFT. It is set in the same world as FFTA. You know, the one with judges and moogles that don't look like moogles... etc.

[Kefkataran]

Once again, I get to crush someone's dreams. FF12 is not set in the same world as FFT. It is set in the same world as FFTA. You know, the one with judges and moogles that don't look like moogles... etc.

Once again, I get to crush someones crushing of someone's dreams. It's not set on the same world as either FFT or FFTA. It's set in a world that has the same name (and very vague connections) to BOTH FFT, FFTA, and Vagrant Story but isn't really directly connected to any of them, storyline or otherwise.

[bobbler]

Once again, I get to crush someones crushing of someone's dreams. It's not set on the same world as either FFT or FFTA. It's set in a world that has the same name (and very vague connections) to BOTH FFT, FFTA, and Vagrant Story but isn't really directly connected to any of them, storyline or otherwise.

Ah! I didn't know that -- I saw Ivalice and thought it would be the same...

I guess my comment wasn't well worded, I meant the reason I was excited was because of the guy behind FFT and Vagrant Story has a big part in FFXII's creation. FFT and Vagrant Story (FFT especially) are two of my favorites from Square.

[Balthasar]

FFT and Vagrant Story (FFT especially) are two of my favorites from Square.
Vagrant story is subtle, for a video game. It lags somewhere in the early-to-middle portions of the plot, but really picks up from there. FFT was God on my Playstation before Xenogears arrived.

[Heretic Machine]

Considering that you said you've played this game through multiple times, I wonder why you don't recall which battle this was and the specific circumstances under your not being able to go forward or go back and strengthen your characters? But as I said before, enemies scale their level to your characters, so brute leveling is not an effective way of beating enemies in the game anyway.

Umm... do you know how long FFT has been out? I bought it when it came out. It's been MANY years since I've so much as looked at the case. So no, I don't remember the specific name of the battle.

[Kefkataran]

Vagrant story is subtle, for a video game. It lags somewhere in the early-to-middle portions of the plot, but really picks up from there. FFT was God on my Playstation before Xenogears arrived.

You know, I really need to finish playing Vagrant Story one day. I've tried playing it several times and I always get right up to that point where the story's supposed to start picking up and then drop it. Bleh.

[Balthasar]

Umm... do you know how long FFT has been out? I bought it when it came out. It's been MANY years since I've so much as looked at the case. So no, I don't remember the specific name of the battle.
I bought it when it came out too. And the story battles I don't remember, I can easily jog my memory about with GameFaqs.