Microsoft Admits 3 Million Xbox 360s in 90 Days Now Unlikely

[fitbabits]

Thanks to Next Generation (http://www.next-gen.biz) for the details (http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1982&Itemid=2).

Microsoft now admits it will not meet its target of up to 3 million Xbox 360 sales within 90-days of the console's launch.

Analysts believe sales of the console had hit around 1.3 million by the end of the Holiday sales period. But as January moves along, retailers have yet to see evidence of shortages easing.

Xbox 360 chief Peter Moore explained, "Nothing's perfect - you've got a complex piece of hardware that includes1,700 different parts. Every now and again the line will slow down because something's happened and there'll be a component that didn't make it that morning."

He added. "That's just the way of the beast, particularly when you are ramping up factories from ground zero all the way up to full capacity."
Given the shortages and the poor launch in Japan, the 3 million figure always seemed a bit of a reach.

[TrackZero]

Oh noes! This story is so anti-Sony! Oh wait......

(sorry, had to do that)

[fitbabits]

Oh noes! This story is so anti-Sony! Oh wait......

(sorry, had to do that)
I know where you're coming from. I thought about making a funny in my comment, but Winnie persuaded me not to.

[Vandenh]

>Nest Generation

Now that would be cool.... never leave your nest while playing :)

[Morratut]

Oh noes! This story is so anti-Sony! Oh wait......

(sorry, had to do that)

LOL that was funny.

I didn't think they would make it either. If they can't make them fast enough their sales aren't going to be as high as they hoped.

[fitbabits]

>Nest Generation

Now that would be cool.... never leave your nest while playing :)
LOL! Yeah, I caught it and fixed it. Stupid fat fingers is all I'll say. :)

[drakkarim]

one could say as long as sony is sitting there scratching their balls and being all fubar, ms has no real reason to rush anything. they still have months to flood the market with the 360, not to mention do a price cut by the time the ps3 comes out to take the wind out of their sails.

but that'll only happen if the 360 starts coming out with some real games (in quanitity AND quality), cuz if this is the best they can do (in quality and quantity) then the ps3 will have them for lunch.

[bone_matrix]

one could say as long as sony is sitting there scratching their balls and being all fubar, ms has no real reason to rush anything. they still have months to flood the market with the 360, not to mention do a price cut by the time the ps3 comes out to take the wind out of their sails.

but that'll only happen if the 360 starts coming out with some real games (in quanitity AND quality), cuz if this is the best they can do (in quality and quantity) then the ps3 will have them for lunch.

By the time Sony launches, there will be what is out now, and Oblivion, along with Ghost Recon 3 (well, hopefully), and many other games. The PS3 will have MGS4? Maybe? I doubt Sony will have enough good games at lauch to make me want (and buy) 4 games right away, and then another about a month later. That is the most games I've bought for a launch ever. Plus Arcade. No way Sony can beat that.

Oops...I guess that was anti-Sony. Player 1, don't flame me please... :rolleyes:

[Borys]

Haste makes waste.

They all but admitted the 360 is a rushed product.

Will the 4-6M worldwide lead when the PS3 launches be sufficient? The Sony giant isn't sleeping you know. Only time will tell.

[MosBen]

I wish someone would make a graph with millions of units sold on the y-axis and months since launch on the x-axis and then graph the lifespan of several consoles including the Xbox, PS2, Cube, and perhaps a few machines from previous generations.

I know that missing their target isn't a good thing, but 1.3 million machines in the first couple months of the system's lifespan seems like a pretty decent pace to me.

[Kelegacy]

Haste makes waste.

They all but admitted the 360 is a rushed product.

Will the 4-6M worldwide lead when the PS3 launches be sufficient? The Sony giant isn't sleeping you know. Only time will tell.
Hopefully Sony realizes they need not rush. Learning from MS's hasty mistakes would be a smart thing, me thinks.

[Borys]

Here's a tip, Microsoft:

$100 price cut or $50 price cut + bundled Halo 3 at PS3 launch.

Game over, Sony.

[Schnoogs]

Given the shortages and the poor launch in Japan, the 3 million figure always seemed a bit of a reach.

yeah because we all know Japanese product launches somehow control what assembly lines can manufacture.

[Steele Johnson]

Meh, I'm waiting for more games before I buy it anyway.

[AniAko]

I'm surprised and happy with Microsoft's world-wide initiative. I always hated having to wait 4 to 6 months after the launch of Nintendo or Sony product to get the NA version. I'm sure European fans (and some fans in Japan) feel included in Microsoft's initiatives, and not an afterthought. it may set a standard that all console manufactures follow in the future!

[fitbabits]

yeah because we all know Japanese product launches somehow control what assembly lines can manufacture.
Your assinine reply makes no sense and doesn't even touch on the point I made. The 3 million figure was for number of 360s sold worldwide (which, by the way, includes Japan). If the Japanese public are not warming to the 360 the way some expected them to, then obviously it's putting a dent in sales. By all accounts the 360 is widely available in Japan - it's just that not many people are buying them.

[ruprect]

I don't know that I buy that the 360 is rushed.

I am growing more concerned with Sony's determination to not just make a new gaming machine but make a vehicle for BluRay and a demo machine for their Cell processor, and oh. . . it plays games. That seems to be muddling their strategy, and their timeline.

So are early production problems anything to worry about for MS? They might have been if the PS3 would have been on time. But it won't be.

[BabyJesus]

Loyal XBOX consumer here, have 2 XBOX's and 114 games, still can't get my hands on my preordered(lot of good that did) 360. Asshats.

[agentgray]

I dunno. Maybe if there were 3 million available for sale thay would have reached that. :D

[agentgray]

Your assinine reply makes no sense and doesn't even touch on the point I made. The 3 million figure was for number of 360s sold worldwide (which, by the way, includes Japan). If the Japanese public are not warming to the 360 the way some expected them to, then obviously it's putting a dent in sales. By all accounts the 360 is widely available in Japan - it's just that not many people are buying them.
Dang straight. My brother in Japan (Semper Fi!) says they have a pyramid of them in the commissary.

[bapenguin]

Do people still think the 360 launch shortage was faked? This announcement hurts them on an investor level now. I really hope they get their act together or they are gonna get trounced by Sony.

[Borys]

Loyal XBOX consumer here, have 2 XBOX's and 114 games, still can't get my hands on my preordered(lot of good that did) 360. Asshats.

Ironic, isn't it?

Fly to Japan and buy a few ;p

[BabyJesus]

Ironic, isn't it?

Fly to Japan and buy a few ;p

As if Sony won't repeat the same scenario whenever the PS3 launches. Nintendo doesn't have to worry, they only need to manufacture 3 or 4 units when they launch the Rehasholution.

[Borys]

Sony shouldn't just do a worldwide launch, it does more bad than good IMO.

Of course the same problems, shortages etc. will be present at PS3 launch - that I am aware of.

As for Nintendo... who cares, really :) ? They will trounce PS3 in Japan and that will be a big success alone.

[bean19]

They've already fumbled their early release advantage quite a bit by not being able to meet demand during the holiday season. That soft market has dried up, so now they have to have the games in their library that will make them the choice that kids clammer for next Christmas season.

[Citizen Philip]

So.. is anyone still waiting on a pre-order? I would be throwing friendly rocks through windows at this point.

Or maybe it was rocks through friendly windows?

It's nice to see that discussing a shortage of one system is not mutally exclusive without slamming everything else: particuarly since it's concerning the site's favourite box.

Because it hasn't been mentioned: The shortage means that PC gaming is dead, it also means that you suck if you don't agree. They are faceless corporate monsters going after you wallet.

[Balthasar]

Oh noes! This story is so anti-Sony! Oh wait......

(sorry, had to do that)
Funny you would say that, because reading through the responses so far, some of you guys have managed to do just that. See, what you don't understand is that it's not just that negative news about Sony is posted and negative news about Microsoft is not posted (though there is certainly a lot less negative Microsoft news here). It's also that when there is negative Microsoft news, it's often twisted. The general attitude so far in this thread seems to be: "Microsoft didn't sell 3 Million, what could anyone have expected? C'est la vie..." However, if a Sony exec had made a statement claiming the PS3 will sell 3 million units in 3 months or less, the responses would have been: "That's what Sony gets for making such an arrogant proclaimation, can't wait to watch them burn in flames, etc." Just a few responses up, I caught such gems as:
I am growing more concerned with Sony's determination to not just make a new gaming machine but make a vehicle for BluRay and a demo machine for their Cell processor, and oh. . . it plays games. That seems to be muddling their strategy, and their timeline. So are early production problems anything to worry about for MS? They might have been if the PS3 would have been on time. But it won't be.
What does that have to do with the fact that Microsoft's console is not selling as well as Microsoft would have liked? Not much. And the comments that stick to Microsoft?

I'm surprised and happy with Microsoft's world-wide initiative. I always hated having to wait 4 to 6 months after the launch of a Japan-based company product to get the NA version. I'm sure European fans (and some fans in Japan) feel included in Microsoft's initiatives, and not an afterthought.
If this place isn't extremely slanted, explain to me how negative news about Microsoft turns into a negative Sony post like that?

[Borys]

Balthasar:

It's always like that, get used to it and move along.

[Schnoogs]

Your assinine reply makes no sense and doesn't even touch on the point I made. The 3 million figure was for number of 360s sold worldwide (which, by the way, includes Japan). If the Japanese public are not warming to the 360 the way some expected them to, then obviously it's putting a dent in sales. By all accounts the 360 is widely available in Japan - it's just that not many people are buying them.

HAHAH! Worst attempt at trying to dodge a bullet.

You used the word shortage not sales. Manufacturing causes shortages not poor sales...poor sales would mean units sitting on the shelves and therefore there would be no shortage.

You are the assanine poster...clearly you have no comprehension of what you type and when confronted about it you respond with equal ignorance as your initial post.

Look up the word shortage so the next time you type it you know what you mean.

Let me save for some time...

short·age ( P ) Pronunciation Key (shôrtj)
n.
A deficiency in amount; an insufficiency

Hmm...I don't see the "When the Japanese don't buy something and the units sit on the shelf".

[AniAko]

I'm surprised and happy with Microsoft's world-wide initiative. I always hated having to wait 4 to 6 months after the launch of a Japan-based company product to get the NA version. I'm sure European fans (and some fans in Japan) feel included in Microsoft's initiatives, and not an afterthought.
If this place isn't extremely slanted, explain to me how negative news about Microsoft turns into a negative Sony post like that?

Actually "Japan-based company" includes Nintendo as well. Unless you know of other countries producing consoles, I apologize for my statement sounding so narrow. That post honestly had nothing to do with bashing Sony, but I understand how it may have sounded that way.

I'm just happy this direction of wold-wide launching is being tried. It might not be a success. But if I pick up my PS3 or Revolution the same day, or shortly after I see all the great reviews of Japanese titles. I'll be happy I don't have to wait, and won't be tempted by imports.

[TheKeck]

HAHAH! Worst attempt at trying to dodge a bullet.

You used the word shortage not sales. Manufacturing causes shortages not poor sales...poor sales would mean units sitting on the shelves and therefore there would be no shortage.

You are the assanine poster...clearly you have no comprehension of what you type and when confronted about it you respond with equal ignorance as your initial post.

Look up the word shortage so the next time you type it you know what you mean.

Let me save for some time...



Hmm...I don't see the "When the Japanese don't buy something and the units sit on the shelf".

OK, here is what he said:

Originally Posted by fitbabits
Given the shortages and the poor launch in Japan, the 3 million figure always seemed a bit of a reach.

In short, you are a complete idiot. Nothing you've said about the word shortage has anything to do with his post, or your truly assenine response.

[bean19]

They've already fumbled their early release advantage quite a bit by not being able to meet demand during the holiday season. That soft market has dried up, so now they have to have the games in their library that will make them the choice that kids clammer for next Christmas season.

Balthasar - I'm quoting myself here. How am I pandering to Microsoft?

How is fitbabits saying that their figure of 3 million was too optimistic because of their shortage and poor Japanese sales (the 2 biggest negative news stories about the X360 launch) pandering?

I think you simply can't be pleased.

[Balthasar]

Actually "Japan-based company" includes Nintendo as well. Unless you know of other countries producing consoles, I apologize for my statement sounding so narrow. That post honestly had nothing to do with bashing Sony, but I understand how it may have sounded that way.
No, that was just an example of the pro-Microsoft posts in this supposedly "negative" Microsoft newsthread.

[Schnoogs]

OK, here is what he said:



In short, you are a complete idiot. Nothing you've said about the word shortage has anything to do with his post, or your truly assenine response.

You sir are an idiot...if you are not smart to understand that shortages can exist because of manufacturing and not poor sales then you must be a Jr. High student who has yet to take any economics classes.

Supply and demand. If noone is buying something then the demand is low and therefore there isnt a shortage. This is economics 101.

Noone would ever say "The japanese aren't buying the product therefore we now have a shortage". Does that make sense to anyone with an IQ over 25?

You are an idiot...do not waste my time with some idiotic response. My advice is to read up on supply and demand.

I am done with you and will not respond to any future comments you post.

[bean19]

Assassin - Go back and reread TheKeck's post. He is saying that you misread fitbabits statement, and it appears that you have. Fitbabits said that poor sales in Japan and poor production are probably why Microsoft is not making it's goal.

[Balthasar]

Balthasar - I'm quoting myself here. How am I pandering to Microsoft?

How is fitbabits saying that their figure of 3 million was too optimistic because of their shortage and poor Japanese sales (the 2 biggest negative news stories about the X360 launch) pandering?

I think you simply can't be pleased.
I think you did not read what I said. I said "some of you guys have managed to do just that" in reference to spining the negative Microsoft news to negative Sony news and/or positive Microsoft news. Some, not all.

[TheKeck]

You sir are an idiot...if you are not smart to understand that shortages can exist because of manufacturing and not poor sales then you must be a Jr. High student who has yet to take any economics classes.

Supply and demand. If noone is buying something then the demand is low and therefore there isnt a shortage. This is economics 101.

Noone would ever say "The japanese aren't buying the product therefore we now have a shortage". Does that make sense to anyone with an IQ over 25?

You are an idiot...do not waste my time with some idiotic response. My advice is to read up on supply and demand.

I am done with you and will not respond to any future comments you post.

No, you're actually still an idiot. Choose not to respond to me, if you wish, but I'm still going to clear things up. Let's post, one more time for those who apparently still haven't grasped it, what fitbabits said.

Originally Posted by fitbabits
Given the shortages and the poor launch in Japan, the 3 million figure always seemed a bit of a reach.

You'll notice a key word in this sentence. It's a conjuction. Namely: and. Two reasons are being given for the lack of 3 million X-Box sales.

The first of these two reasons is a shortage. You seem to have picked up on this part. There is, indeed, a shortage of X-Box 360s in North America. This hurts sales. It is a part of the reason that Microsoft will probably not sell 3 million consoles.

The second reason is a poor launch in Japan. This has nothing to do with a shortage. Nobody ever said it did, except for you. There is no shortage in Japan. People are simply not buying the consoles available to them. This also hurts sales. It is, in fact, another reason why Microsoft will probably not sell 3 million consoles.

Now, if you can't understand that, Mr. Econ 101, perhaps you should try a 3rd grade English class.

[TheKeck]

Assassin - Go back and reread TheKeck's post. He is saying that you misread fitbabits statement, and it appears that you have. Fitbabits said that poor sales in Japan and poor production are probably why Microsoft is not making it's goal.

Thanks bean19. I was starting to think I might be taking crazy pills. ;)

[Schnoogs]

Assassin - Go back and reread TheKeck's post. He is saying that you misread fitbabits statement, and it appears that you have. Fitbabits said that poor sales in Japan and poor production are probably why Microsoft is not making it's goal.

There's a difference between what someone means and what they actually say. I pointed out that he attributed the shortages too poor sales which on an intuitive level makes no sense.

Shortages 99% of the time is used to describe insufficient supply. If he meant shortages in sales he chose his wording poorly which is why I pointed it out.

Noone would say we've had a shortage of sales...if you read his initial comment it makes no sense. Just because you know what he meant to say doesnt change the fact that its an erroneous and illogical statement.

[baz]

Assasin dude, I think you need to work on your reading comprehension a bit... and maybe take some anger management courses. Chill winston.

[bapenguin]

No, that was just an example of the pro-Microsoft posts in this supposedly "negative" Microsoft newsthread.

I fail to see how anything mentioned in this thread is pro Microsoft, or even twisted anyway remotely to be good.

The company is losing possible sale and any possible ground it hoped to gain against it's competitors. Its losing face to loyal customers like some of mentioned in this thread by not even having preorders fulfilled. It's losing credibility to it's investors by not meeting an internal goal. How ANY of that is twisted to look "good" is purely idiotic if that's what you are seeing.

I'd like to end my post with a quote from a certain Doc Holiday: "It appears my hypocrisy knows no bounds."

It pertains to all of us, including myself. The sooner you realize it, the sooner you'll be able to read posts without popping a gasket.

[Schnoogs]

Assasin dude, I think you need to work on your reading comprehension a bit... and maybe take some anger management courses. Chill winston.

Another lame attempt at trying to dodge the fact that low demand does not equal a shortage.

Keep trying!

[TheKeck]

Another lame attempt at trying to dodge the fact that low demand does not equal a shortage.

Keep trying!

You just really can't get a clue, can you?

[Schnoogs]

Just for the record...in case anyone is hiring. The following members believe that shortages are incurred when noone wants a product.

baz
TheKeck
bean19

I see a bright future for these 3 in sales and marketing.

I haven't laughed this hard in years.

[holycrapper]

it's okay, he likes the new star wars movies, that means he has the language comprehension of a 3 year old.


I pointed out that he attributed the shortages too poor sales which on an intuitive level makes no sense.

and from a guy who is pointing at a perfectly logical and concise statement and crying fowl, you really should fix this sentence, shit like that really pisses me off.

[bean19]

I think you did not read what I said. I said "some of you guys have managed to do just that" in reference to spining the negative Microsoft news to negative Sony news and/or positive Microsoft news. Some, not all.

That's my point about the spectrum. There are Microsoft fanboys here and there are Sony and Nintendo fanboys too.

Mostly, I've gotten used to it, but I don't like that the site is being insulted simply because you feel there are more Microsoft fanboys here than the other group.

I'm not sure whether you are right or not, there may be more Microsoft lovers, but what I think you are seeing mostly is the moderates like myself taking the side of Microsoft or going against Sony a lot lately based on the news. . . but I plan on buying every system.

Microsoft: I really love my X360. I really hated waiting to get one due to their inexcusable shortages. Their Japanese launch was disappointing. . . I want them to do well there so that I get more Japanese games on the X360.

Sony: I wish they were adopting a better online experience. . . hopefully one that would compete with Xbox Live. I wish they would show us more of the games for the upcoming console so that I could believe it will actually be out (at least in Japan) by Spring. I think that attaching the Blu-Ray device will help them win the HD-movie format war, but I hope they still make games on DVD so that I don't have to sit through long load screens.

You see. . . I'm a moderate, but RIGHT NOW and for the last 2 months, Microsoft has just launched a cool next gen system that I'm having fun playing. While Sony is being quiet, and not really doing anything to raise my expectations. I'm not loyal to either company, but I know that I'll buy every system because I am loyal to some of the games on each system.

The point is. . . the moderates are probably adding to the "fanboy" total that you are perceiving because the news RIGHT NOW is pretty good from Microsoft.

I think you'll see us moderates stray less from the middle when both systems are out and we can firmly say, "I love both of my machines! All you fanboys are suckers!" But until then, we tend to take sides with the system that we already have that is providing us with a lot of fun.

[Schnoogs]

it's okay, he likes the new star wars movies, that means he has the language comprehension of a 3 year old.

HAHAHAHAHA!! You got me there...that comeback proves beyond a doubt that indeed shortages ARE incurred by low demand.

Wow that was brilliant. Keep the comments coming...my side is aching from the laughter.

[TheKeck]

Just for the record...in case anyone is hiring. The following members believe that shortages are incurred when noone wants a product.

baz
TheKeck
bean19

I see a bright future for these 3 in sales and marketing.

I haven't laughed this hard in years.

Shortages are incurred when a company can not manufacture enough product to meet demand. This is exactly the situation we have in North America.

May I add, that you are still an idiot.

[bean19]

There's a difference between what someone means and what they actually say. I pointed out that he attributed the shortages too poor sales which on an intuitive level makes no sense.

Shortages 99% of the time is used to describe insufficient supply. If he meant shortages in sales he chose his wording poorly which is why I pointed it out.

Fitbabits said "shortages and the poor launch in Japan". That is a compound subject which clearly states two reasons for the bad sales and does not relate them to each other. That appears to be what he said and meant to say. . . I've read it several times now and can't see how someone could misunderstand that sentence as it is clear and correct grammar.

[Schnoogs]

Fitbabits said "shortages and the poor launch in Japan". That is a compound subject which clearly states two reasons for the bad sales and does not relate them to each other. That appears to be what he said and meant to say. . . I've read it several times now and can't see how someone could misunderstand that sentence as it is clear and correct grammar.


Still trying to dodge the fact that you implied that shortages are caused by low demand?

[bean19]

Still trying to dodge the fact that you implied that shortages are caused by low demand?

Who did that in this thread? Can you quote them?

I think you misunderstood something and now you are trying to maneuver others into representing the ridiculous argument you oppose. I was trying to point out your misunderstanding, but I've never taken up the whole Economics 101 discussion you want to have at any point.

[TheKeck]

Still trying to dodge the fact that you implied that shortages are caused by low demand?

Nobody EVER implied that shortages come from low demand!!!! Where the HELL are you getting that from?????? :confused:

[Schnoogs]

Nobody EVER implied that shortages come from low demand!!!! Where the HELL are you getting that from?????? :confused:

So you've been arguing with me for the hell of it then.

So you're thought process is "Well I agree with him but it's my day to argue with random people".

That makes sense...I keep saying shortages are caused by manufacturing problems not lack of demand. You and 3 others keep saying that I'm an idiot for saying that therefore you must think that shortages are caused by lack of demand.

[Citizen Philip]

Urm. Who exactly is a big PS/3Sony fan on this site? I like meeting minorities and learning about their difference cultures and experiences. I've seen a few Nintendo fans posts every once in awhile but.. I don't recall someone saying PS3/Sony fan.

Anyone?

[TheKeck]

So you've been arguing with me for the hell of it then.

So you're thought process is "Well I agree with him but it's my day to argue with random people".

That makes sense...I keep saying shortages are caused by manufacturing problems not lack of demand. You and 3 others keep saying that I'm an idiot for saying that therefore you must think that shortages are caused by lack of demand.

Talking with you makes my head hurt.

1) Fitbabits made a perfectly reasonable comment.
2) You THOUGHT you were contradicting his comment, but were just confused.
3) Fitbabits called your comment assenine because it was totally off.
4) You railed on Fitbabits claiming that he said all kinds of things that he didn't.
5) I defended Fitbabits, because you were in the wrong.
6) You continued to spout off saying that people were implying things that they never did.
7) Several of us tried to show you how you were missing the point.
8) You continued to think that we were implying whatever crazy things we were never talking about in the first place.
9) We told you that we were never implying what you thought we were.
10) You're confused about why we argued.

[Schnoogs]

Xbox 360 chief Peter Moore explained, "Nothing's perfect - you've got a complex piece of hardware that includes1,700 different parts. Every now and again the line will slow down because something's happened and there'll be a component that didn't make it that morning."

He added. "That's just the way of the beast, particularly when you are ramping up factories from ground zero all the way up to full capacity."

The funny thing is that when you read the initial article Moore talks about the manufacturing process and factories having to ramp up.

Why does he say this? Because he's attributing the shortage to a manufacturing problem. Nowhere does he say "We're not going to make the target because of poor sales".

The idiots in this thread dont even realize that the remaining units he speaks of havent even been built yet so how on earth can poor Japanese sales affect units that hevent even been built.

Jordan fades, he shoots, he SCORES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[TheKeck]

The funny thing is that when you read the initial article Moore talks about the manufacturing process and factories having to ramp up.

Why does he say this? Because he's attributing the shortage to a manufacturing problem. Nowhere does he say "We're not going to make the target because of poor sales".

The idiots in this thread dont even realize that the remaining units he speaks of havent even been built yet so how on earth can poor Japanese sales affect units that hevent even been built.

Jordan fades, he shoots, he SCORES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The funny thing is... that you somehow still think you're "winning" this argument, when you obviously are still missing the point. When four people blatantly tell you that you've misunderstood somebody's comments, and nobody agrees with you, does it even occur to you to TRY and see if you've made a mistake?

[Schnoogs]

The funny thing is... that you somehow still think you're "winning" this argument, when you obviously are still missing the point. When four people blatantly tell you that you've misunderstood somebody's comments, and nobody agrees with you, does it even occur to you to TRY and see if you've made a mistake?

Yeah because we all know going along with the group mentality is the smart way.

"But everyone else thinks the earth is flat."

Another brilliant comment from TheKeck. Please don't reproduce...do the species a favor.

[TheKeck]

Yeah because we all know going along with the group mentality is the smart way.

"But everyone else thinks the earth is flat."

Another brilliant comment from TheKeck. Please don't reproduce...do the species a favor.

Wait, here's a surprise, Assassin misses the point.

I didn't say you should go along with the crowd. I'm not talking about people disagreeing with your opinions. I'm talking about when four people tell you that you've made A MISTAKE, does it not occur to you to EVALUATE things a little closely and see if MAYBE they were telling you that for a reason.

How about a little dialogue, just for fun, to give an analogy to this whole thing.


Fitbabits: Be careful guys, there's a hole you might fall into over there.
Assassin: What are you talking about, holes are great!
Fitbabits: I'm not saying holes are bad, I'm warning you that you're about to fall into one.
Assassin: Nice try Fitbabits! Holes are the best. You can't cover up your statement of hating holes.
TheKeck: Assassin, he's not arguing that holes are bad. He's telling you, You're about to fall into a hole!!
Assassin: You idiot, TheKeck! I'm not even going to respond to that idiotic comment. Haven't you taken Holes 101?
Bean19: Assassin, TheKeck wasn't saying holes are bad, he was telling you that you misunderstood Fitbabits.
Baz: Yeah, Assassin, you're missing the point.
Assassin: Idiots who don't believe holes are great: TheKeck, bean19, Baz.
TheKeck: Holes are great.
Bean19: That's not what Fitbabits meant.
Assassin: You can't deny that holes are great!!!!
TheKeck: Nobody ever denied that they're great.
Assassin: Well, then what are we arguing for?
TheKeck: You were all confused.
Assassin: Look, it even says here in the article, holes are great!!!
TheKeck: Look, Assassin, you're about to fall in a hole. Aren't you going to even try to listen to all of us warning you, and see if you haven't made a mistake?
Assassin: Yeah, right, I should listen to the crowd. Smart thinking.

[Assassin falls in a hole]



I'm sure Assassin will read this and ignore it, or misunderstand it, but maybe SOMEBODY will get a kick out of it.

[Borys]

This thread gives me the headache.

[TheKeck]

This thread gives me the headache.

I know how you feel, having suffered many headaches. ;)

[Sl1pstream]

Fitbabits: Be careful guys, there's a hole you might fall into over there.
Assassin: What are you talking about, holes are great!
Fitbabits: I'm not saying holes are bad, I'm warning you that you're about to fall into one.
Assassin: Nice try Fitbabits! Holes are the best. You can't cover up your statement of hating holes.
TheKeck: Assassin, he's not arguing that holes are bad. He's telling you, You're about to fall into a hole!!
Assassin: You idiot, TheKeck! I'm not even going to respond to that idiotic comment. Haven't you taken Holes 101?
Bean19: Assassin, TheKeck wasn't saying holes are bad, he was telling you that you misunderstood Fitbabits.
Baz: Yeah, Assassin, you're missing the point.
Assassin: Idiots who don't believe holes are great: TheKeck, bean19, Baz.
TheKeck: Holes are great.
Bean19: That's not what Fitbabits meant.
Assassin: You can't deny that holes are great!!!!
TheKeck: Nobody ever denied that they're great.
Assassin: Well, then what are we arguing for?
TheKeck: You were all confused.
Assassin: Look, it even says here in the article, holes are great!!!
TheKeck: Look, Assassin, you're about to fall in a hole. Aren't you going to even try to listen to all of us warning you, and see if you haven't made a mistake?
Assassin: Yeah, right, I should listen to the crowd. Smart thinking.

[Assassin falls in a hole]



I'm sure Assassin will read this and ignore it, or misunderstand it, but maybe SOMEBODY will get a kick out of it.

So you're saying there should be more hole-related newsposts?

[Schnoogs]

Wait, here's a surprise, Assassin misses the point.

I didn't say you should go along with the crowd. I'm not talking about people disagreeing with your opinions. I'm talking about when four people tell you that you've made A MISTAKE, does it not occur to you to EVALUATE things a little closely and see if MAYBE they were telling you that for a reason.

How about a little dialogue, just for fun, to give an analogy to this whole thing.


Fitbabits: Be careful guys, there's a hole you might fall into over there.
Assassin: What are you talking about, holes are great!
Fitbabits: I'm not saying holes are bad, I'm warning you that you're about to fall into one.
Assassin: Nice try Fitbabits! Holes are the best. You can't cover up your statement of hating holes.
TheKeck: Assassin, he's not arguing that holes are bad. He's telling you, You're about to fall into a hole!!
Assassin: You idiot, TheKeck! I'm not even going to respond to that idiotic comment. Haven't you taken Holes 101?
Bean19: Assassin, TheKeck wasn't saying holes are bad, he was telling you that you misunderstood Fitbabits.
Baz: Yeah, Assassin, you're missing the point.
Assassin: Idiots who don't believe holes are great: TheKeck, bean19, Baz.
TheKeck: Holes are great.
Bean19: That's not what Fitbabits meant.
Assassin: You can't deny that holes are great!!!!
TheKeck: Nobody ever denied that they're great.
Assassin: Well, then what are we arguing for?
TheKeck: You were all confused.
Assassin: Look, it even says here in the article, holes are great!!!
TheKeck: Look, Assassin, you're about to fall in a hole. Aren't you going to even try to listen to all of us warning you, and see if you haven't made a mistake?
Assassin: Yeah, right, I should listen to the crowd. Smart thinking.

[Assassin falls in a hole]



I'm sure Assassin will read this and ignore it, or misunderstand it, but maybe SOMEBODY will get a kick out of it.

You actually spent time typing that?? Maybe you should have spent the time reading up on economics and reading the initial post.

Then maybe you will understand whats going on.

[TheKeck]

So you're saying there should be more hole-related newsposts?

Exactly!! :D

[Schnoogs]

Exactly!! :D

Speaking of a hole

[TheKeck]

You actually spent time typing that?? Maybe you should have spent the time reading up on economics and reading the initial post.

Then maybe you will understand whats going on.

Snicker. Yeah, maybe I'LL understand what's going on. :rolleyes:

[bapenguin]

This thread gives me the headache.

Yes...threads lately have been spiraling out of control with personal attacks. It's not cool.

[TheKeck]

HA HA HA HA!!!! He made it his sig! That's priceless.

[AniAko]

No, that was just an example of the pro-Microsoft posts in this supposedly "negative" Microsoft newsthread.

The connotation of this thread isn't governed by the nature of the news. Fitbabits posted facts and quotes, he can't help how people respond to it. My comment was my accolade for Microsoft trying to pull off something rarely attempted.

[Citizen Philip]

Yes...threads lately have been spiraling out of control with personal attacks. It's not cool.

Agreed we need more platform/publisher/developer based attacks, they tend to attract a more positive attitude.

[TheKeck]

Yes...threads lately have been spiraling out of control with personal attacks. It's not cool.

I'm not usually the attacking type. I tried to stick to the subject for the most part. Anyway, I'll stop.

[Schnoogs]

Snicker. Yeah, maybe I'LL understand what's going on. :rolleyes:

You make me laugh...either too stupid or too stubborn to realize that everything you've posted has done nothing to support or validate the initial post that I commented on.

You still have yet to prove that a shortage in supply can be caused by poor sales. Once you do that then you've validated the initial post and therefore shot down my criticism of it.

I'm waiting.

[Schnoogs]

Hmmm....Microsoft wants to manufacture 3 million units and they won't succeed.

What's more likely to cause someone to miss a supply target? A manufacturing issue or a demand issue?

Hmmm...let me think about this.

According to the initial post the target wont be riched in part due to poor sales in Japan. Now why would that prevent Microsoft from manufacturing??

You can manufacture to your hearts content regardless of the demand...you'll just lose money if noone wants it. But low demand doesn't somehow slow your assembly line. Or effect the supplier of your parts and materials.

Still waiting.

[Zanzibar]

I've said it before:

He's such an ass, he had to put it in his name twice.

[Schnoogs]

Yawn...so sleepy.

[TheKeck]

Hmmm....Microsoft wants to manufacture 3 million units and they won't succeed.

What's more likely to cause someone to miss a supply target? A manufacturing issue or a demand issue?

Hmmm...let me think about this.

According to the initial post the target wont be riched in part due to poor sales in Japan. Now why would that prevent Microsoft from manufacturing??

You can manufacture to your hearts content regardless of the demand...you'll just lose money if noone wants it. But low demand doesn't somehow slow your assembly line. Or effect the supplier of your parts and materials.

Still waiting.

Microsoft now admits it will not meet its target of up to 3 million Xbox 360 sales within 90-days of the console's launch.

Think about it.

[Schnoogs]

I've said it before:

He's such an ass, he had to put it in his name twice.

Man..another brilliant argument. This definitly proves beyond a doubt that manufacturing shortages are in fact caused by low demand.

[Schnoogs]

Think about it.

We're talking about manufacturing...nice try though.

Shortage...not sales....shortage.....see the difference.

[Schnoogs]

Still waiting.

[Zanzibar]

Assassin. Stop. Seriously.

I just read this thread for the THIRD TIME looking for someone equating low demand with manufacturing shortages. At NO POINT did ANYONE say such a thing. The original post from Fit said:

Given the shortages and the poor launch in Japan, the 3 million figure always seemed a bit of a reach.

Your reply TO THAT STATEMENT said:

yeah because we all know Japanese product launches somehow control what assembly lines can manufacture.

To start off with, DO YOU DISAGREE with the ORDER and CONTENT of the posts I'm quoting? Yes or no?

[Schnoogs]

Assassin. Stop. Seriously.

I just read this thread for the THIRD TIME looking for someone equating low demand with manufacturing shortages. At NO POINT did ANYONE say such a thing. The original post from Fit said:

Given the shortages and the poor launch in Japan, the 3 million figure always seemed a bit of a reach.

Your reply TO THAT STATEMENT said:

yeah because we all know Japanese product launches somehow control what assembly lines can manufacture.

To start off with, DO YOU DISAGREE with the ORDER and CONTENT of the posts I'm quoting? Yes or no?

Seeing as my response quoted the original that would sort of suggest that it came in that order.

You got any other brilliant questions?

[Sl1pstream]

that a shortage in supply can be caused by poor sales.

That wasn't the point. They can't sell the Japanese systems in another region, as you wouldn't be able to play games from that region on the system. Yes, there a lot of systems still on the shelves in Japan, but they can't sell them elsewhere. There is a shortage of both American and European systems though.

The sales figures aren't that high because people aren't buying those Japanese systems. No shortage over there.

People ARE buying the systems in the other regions. There are shortages. They didn't make 3 million US/EU systems, so the sales figures will be lower than 3 million.

If they had 1 million systems in each territory and all territories would sell out, they would've sold 3 millions systems. Japan didn't buy the system, so they can only sell 2 million systems, sales figures will be lower because there are still systems on the shelves they can't sell elsewhere.

....

That made no sense :/

[Zanzibar]

Seeing as my response quoted the original that would sort of suggest that it came in that order.

You got any other brilliant questions?

Okay, now that we've agreed, how exactly does fit's statement, which has TWO clearly defined components - shortage of supplies, AND, SEPARATELY, a low demand in Japan - deserve your statement which tries to lump them together?

[Schnoogs]

That wasn't the point. They can't sell the Japanese systems in another region, as you wouldn't be able to play games from that region on the system. Yes, there a lot of systems still on the shelves in Japan, but they can't sell them elsewhere. There is a shortage of both American and European systems though.

The sales figures aren't that high because people aren't buying those Japanese systems. No shortage over there.

People ARE buying the systems in the other regions. There are shortages. They didn't make 3 million US/EU systems, so the sales figures will be lower than 3 million.

If they had 1 million systems in each territory and all territories would sell out, they would've sold 3 millions systems. Japan didn't buy the system, so they can only sell 2 million systems, sales figures will be lower because there are still systems on the shelves they can't sell elsewhere.

....

That made no sense :/

Are you smart enough to realize that when you post something and someone flames you back it means they disagree with you.

There mere fact that people flamed is proof that they believe the opposite of what I posted therefore the geniuses here must believe that low demand in Japan causes manufacturing shortages.

If I come on here and say "2+2 = 4" and people respond "you're totally wrong idiot" they must believe that 2+2 in fact DOES NOT equal 4.

Unless they are so stupid that they would argue against something that they actually believe is true.

[Sl1pstream]

Are you smart enough to realize that when you post something and someone flames you back it means they disagree with you.

There mere fact that people flamed is proof that they believe the opposite of what I posted therefore the geniuses here must believe that low demand in Japan causes manufacturing shortages.

If I come on here and say "2+2 = 4" and people respond "you're totally wrong idiot" they must believe that 2+2 in fact DOES NOT equal 4.

Unless they are so stupid that they would argue against something that they actually believe is true.

Then again, that didn't make sense either.

[Schnoogs]

No WE'RE not talking about manufacturing. WE'RE talking about the arcticle, which is talking about sales. YOU'RE the only one talking about manufacturing.

That makes sense...so you dont look at the validity of someones comments.

TheKeck "2+3 = 5"
Assassin "2+2 = 4"
TheKeck "You're an idiot...thats the dumbest thing I've ever heard"
Assassin "But 2+2 does equal 4"
TheKeck "You're an idiot...I'm gonna type a length story now to prove how much you're an idiot"
Assassin "But doesnt 2+2=4"
TheKeck "No it doesnt because we're talkign about 2+3"

[Zanzibar]

Are you smart enough to realize that when you post something and someone flames you back it means they disagree with you.

There mere fact that people flamed is proof that they believe the opposite of what I posted therefore the geniuses here must believe that low demand in Japan causes manufacturing shortages.

If I come on here and say "2+2 = 4" and people respond "you're totally wrong idiot" they must believe that 2+2 in fact DOES NOT equal 4.

Unless they are so stupid that they would argue against something that they actually believe is true.

You got flamed because YOU tried to belittle Fit for making a VERY CORRECT STATEMENT. There were two - count 'em, TWO - components to Fit's suggestion, that 3mil wasn't likely because of 1. supply shortages, and 2. low demand in japan for the systems that WERE available.

It's that simple. You were wrong, maybe you read his statement incorrectly, but the REST OF US understood what he was saying. Now you're just rationalizing your INCORRECT POST.

[Schnoogs]

Then again, that didn't make sense either.

That doesnt make sense? are you serious? you dont understand that when people argue its almost always over a disagreement??

are you joking? are you suggestign that you argue with people over things you agree on?

this is amazing...what planet do you hail from?

[TheKeck]

Are you smart enough to realize that when you post something and someone flames you back it means they disagree with you.

There mere fact that people flamed is proof that they believe the opposite of what I posted therefore the geniuses here must believe that low demand in Japan causes manufacturing shortages.

If I come on here and say "2+2 = 4" and people respond "you're totally wrong idiot" they must believe that 2+2 in fact DOES NOT equal 4.

Unless they are so stupid that they would argue against something that they actually believe is true.

If you come on here and CALL SOMEBODY AN IDIOT and say "2+2 = 4" and then SEVERAL people call you an idiot and say "That guy wasn't saying 2+2 != 4", that does NOT mean they all think that 2+2 != 4.


EDIT: You should also note that, generally, when you quote someone, you should use words that they've said at some point.

[Zanzibar]

Okay, now that we've agreed, how exactly does fit's statement, which has TWO clearly defined components - shortage of supplies, AND, SEPARATELY, a low demand in Japan - deserve your statement which tries to lump them together?

I can play this game too:

I'm waiting.

[Schnoogs]

You got flamed because YOU tried to belittle Fit for making a VERY CORRECT STATEMENT. There were two - count 'em, TWO - components to Fit's suggestion, that 3mil wasn't likely because of 1. supply shortages, and 2. low demand in japan for the systems that WERE available.

It's that simple. You were wrong, maybe you read his statement incorrectly, but the REST OF US understood what he was saying. Now you're just rationalizing your INCORRECT POST.

If I'm rationalizing that low demand does not cause a manufacturing shortage then in fact low demand DOES cause it. So therefore if you believe I'm rationalizing something you must disagree with me and therefore you believe that low demand can cause manufacturing shortages.

unless you're just weird and like to argue about things you agree on.

[Schnoogs]

If you come on here and CALL SOMEBODY AN IDIOT and say "2+2 = 4" and then SEVERAL people call you an idiot and say "That guy wasn't saying 2+2 != 4", that does NOT mean they all think that 2+2 != 4.

But that is what you said.

[Schnoogs]

I can play this game too:

I'm waiting.

Keep waiting...I'm sure a clue will eventually find you

[Zanzibar]

Do you see how Fit's post has two components? Yes or no.

[TheKeck]

But that is what you said.

Actually, this is what I said.

In short, you are a complete idiot. Nothing you've said about the word shortage has anything to do with his post, or your truly assenine response.

Get that... I said that what you said HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH his post. I DIDN'T, in fact, say that what you said is the opposite of the truth.

[Schnoogs]

Do you see how Fit's post has two components? Yes or no.

yes...and one of them does not lend itself to manufacturing shortages.

Simple math lesson for you...if half of a statement is correct the overall statement is still wrong.

But I can see why you would believe that seeing as you said earlier his statement was "very correct". There are degrees of correctness...

Sort of correct
Very correct
Mostly correct
Could have been correct
Super correct
Maybe if I was drunk I would believe its correct
Not quite incorrect

[Zanzibar]

If I'm rationalizing that low demand does not cause a manufacturing shortage then in fact low demand DOES cause it. So therefore if you believe I'm rationalizing something you must disagree with me and therefore you believe that low demand can cause manufacturing shortages.

unless you're just weird and like to argue about things you agree on.

What I meant by 'rationalizing' means that you are here being a blowhard because deep down you know you're wrong about your first post in reply to Fit's.

I do not believe that shortages equal low demand. I really, really don't understand this method of reasoning. Your logic that 'you disagree with me' = 'you believe low demand can cause manufacturing shortages' is UNBELIEVABLY FLAWED.

[Schnoogs]

Actually, this is what I said.



Get that... I said that what you said HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH his post. I DIDN'T, in fact, say that what you said is the opposite of the truth.


Which is funny because Moore talks about manufacturing which is what I talked about.

[Zanzibar]

yes...and one of them does not lend itself to manufacturing shortages.

Simple math lesson for you...if half of a statement is correct the overall statement is still wrong.

But I can see why you would believe that seeing as you said earlier his statement was "very correct". There are degrees of correctness...

Sort of correct
Very correct
Mostly correct
Could have been correct
Super correct
Maybe if I was drunk I would believe its correct
Not quite incorrect

BUT HE'S NOT EQUATING THE TWO COMPONENTS, CAN YOU NOT SEE THAT? HE'S NOT SAYING THAT ONE CAUSES THE OTHER!!!!! WHAT THE HELL?

[Schnoogs]

What I meant by 'rationalizing' means that you are here being a blowhard because deep down you know you're wrong about your first post in reply to Fit's.

I do not believe that shortages equal low demand. I really, really don't understand this method of reasoning. Your logic that 'you disagree with me' = 'you believe low demand can cause manufacturing shortages' is UNBELIEVABLY FLAWED.

If its flawed that would mean that you believe people argue over things they agree on.

Assassin "2+2=4"
Zanzibar "No you dumb ass 2+2=4"
Assassin "Look you wank 2+2=4"
Zanzibar "what a bafoon everyone...he thinks 2+2=4 when we clearly know that 2+2=4"

I'm sure this works well for you.

[TheKeck]

Ok, Assassin, I think I've got it. You're trolling us, right? You're just going to keep arguing this until we all give up just to see how long you can keep us at it. Have I figured it out?

[Schnoogs]

Its been fun...off to lunch.

Closing comment...I wish Japan would buy up those 360's so they can make more over here.

[Zurik]

This thread should be posted on Something Awful.

[Borys]

Yes...threads lately have been spiraling out of control with personal attacks. It's not cool.

I'm guilty as well :|

Kinda bad feeling when I read you saying it.

[Kefkataran]

Oh noes! This story is so anti-Sony! Oh wait......

Oh come now. We all know if this were a story about Sony's inability to fill demand for their product, we'd get both a snide remark from the guy who posted it and a lot more mindless bitching in the thread itself.

Me, I'm not too affected by this. Again, it's stuff like this that makes me wait to buy most systems instead of springing for it at launch.

[thegameguru]

I didnt bother to read the entire thread since it seemed silly...but in fact I will say that the OP is incorrect.

Microsoft inability to reach 3 million units in 90 days has ZERO to do with Japan.. IF Microsoft could have manufactured 3 Million NA units in 90 days they would have had no problem selling through that allocation in the NA region alone in 90 days.

I personally know 17 people that WANT Xbox 360's and simply cannot find them for sale in a retail store.

People need to get over this idea that Japan matters in any way for the success or lack of for the Xbox 360 (or PS3 or Revolution for that matter) anymore the rest of the world is plenty sufficient for any console (to produce a healthly bottom line that is)

[TheKeck]

I didnt bother to read the entire thread since it seemed silly...but in fact I will say that the OP is incorrect.

Microsoft inability to reach 3 million units in 90 days has ZERO to do with Japan.. IF Microsoft could have manufactured 3 Million NA units in 90 days they would have had no problem selling through that allocation in the NA region alone in 90 days.

I personally know 17 people that WANT Xbox 360's and simply cannot find them for sale in a retail store.

People need to get over this idea that Japan matters in any way for the success or lack of for the Xbox 360 (or PS3 or Revolution for that matter) anymore the rest of the world is plenty sufficient for any console (to produce a healthly bottom line that is)

I don't think the issue is people thinking "Oh no, this thing is failing in Japan, so it's going to fail overall." My question is, how many 360's actually were sent to Japan? If all of those consoles were made for the US instead, they would obvioulsy have been bought by now. That's why the Japan thing is hurting sales.

Now, I don't know the numbers. If there are only 100,000 360's in Japan, then even if those were all sold, it wouldn't really help meet the 3 million mark. But if there are millions over there, that would be a big deal.

[GrinR]

Wow. You guys bothered with a pathetic lightweight troll like Assassin for this long...

Jesus FUCKING Christ! I'm insulted! All my years of articulate, witty trolling should have seasoned you people to recognize his absurdly feeble efforts!

Assassin is like the polar opposite of Mason - instead of being a long-winded confucian in love with his own voice, he's like a babbling idiot in love with his own voice. Never would I have dreamed of missing the hot breeze of Mason's monologue, til now.

[TrackZero]

Me, I'm not too affected by this. Again, it's stuff like this that makes me wait to buy most systems instead of springing for it at launch.

Ditto, I'm not touching the 360 until I'm sure there's a second version released with a rubber stopper in the drive to keep discs from being shredded if it ends up moving vert<->horiz. while I'm playing a game, for any reason. As well, usually later releases have quieter fans and optical drives, etc. I'm in no rush to grab a 360 yet, maybe in the summer I'll find a good reason to pick it up. (No pressure on me, especially since I don't even have an HDTV right now.)

[TheKeck]

Wow. You guys bothered with a pathetic lightweight troll like Assassin for this long...

Jesus FUCKING Christ! I'm insulted! All my years of articulate, witty trolling should have seasoned you people to recognize his absurdly feeble efforts!

Assassin is like the polar opposite of Mason - instead of being a long-winded confucian in love with his own voice, he's like a babbling idiot in love with his own voice. Never would I have dreamed of missing the hot breeze of Mason's monologue, til now.

Well, at least I got my nice little story about holes out of it. I'm telling that one to my grandkids. :o

[Balthasar]

The connotation of this thread isn't governed by the nature of the news. Fitbabits posted facts and quotes, he can't help how people respond to it. My comment was my accolade for Microsoft trying to pull off something rarely attempted.
I know exactly what your comment was, and that isn't what I was responding to. You have to go back to the initial comments. I was using your comment as an example. I don't begrudge you for enjoying the X-Box launch, or anyone else. I do have a problem with biased snipping. If you don't know what I mean, just try to remember all of this, then wait until the PS3 and Revolution launch.

[Achilles]

Wow.

If the 360 sold out in Japan the total sales of the system would be ~80,000 units higher than whatever it is that they currently are. I doubt with 80,000 systems sitting on store shelves from the 150,000 they initially shipped over there, they’ve shipped any more.

So what we’re looking at is 80,000 loss from Japan, and the rest of not meeting the 3,000,000 number is because of manufacturing problems. If they took the 80k out of Japan they could sell them in an hour elsewhere, but they won’t so that’s their problem. Nor should they I’ll point out. Because without a good supply of those systems around if/when a big game hits the 360 won’t be able to gain ground there.

I just wonder how many they’ll manage to make before next Christmas when the PS3 hits, which will undoubtedly have the same manufacturing problems that the 360 is having. If they can make 10 million by that time I bet they'll sell them, 3 mil in 90 days would have put them on track to the 10, which I'm sure was their goal.

Balthasar, your comment was a great many pages ago about this news being well received. It’s being well received because people realize that the problem isn’t the system selling poorly, it’s the system selling out and them not being able to make enough. In terms of this not happening with the other system’s news, your accusation of bias; it happened with the Revolution about a month ago when they said it wouldn’t be much more powerful than the Game Cube and apart from me and maybe 3 other guys there was a 70 post thread praising Nintendo for making a significantly weaker system.

[AniAko]

I know exactly what your comment was, and that isn't what I was responding to. You have to go back to the initial comments. I was using your comment as an example. I don't begrudge you for enjoying the X-Box launch, or anyone else. I do have a problem with biased snipping. If you don't know what I mean, just try to remember all of this, then wait until the PS3 and Revolution launch.

I understand, I just thought my quote didn't fit what you were trying to say at first. It's cool. ;)

[Zanzibar]

Wow. You guys bothered with a pathetic lightweight troll like Assassin for this long...

Jesus FUCKING Christ! I'm insulted! All my years of articulate, witty trolling should have seasoned you people to recognize his absurdly feeble efforts!

Assassin is like the polar opposite of Mason - instead of being a long-winded confucian in love with his own voice, he's like a babbling idiot in love with his own voice. Never would I have dreamed of missing the hot breeze of Mason's monologue, til now.

I know. I feel terrible. I humbly apologize to everyone except ASS_ASS_in.

[BabyJesus]

They've already fumbled their early release advantage quite a bit by not being able to meet demand during the holiday season. That soft market has dried up, so now they have to have the games in their library that will make them the choice that kids clammer for next Christmas season.

Agreed, they could have blown the early launch advantage if they don't have something awesome to push next X-Mas.

Its rediculous that I still don't have mine almost 2 months after launch.. By the time I get to play the 2 games I bought they will be $19.99 titles. $30 x2 loss for me... So far I have put out $150 for an system I don't have.. How fucked up is that? :confused: :eek:

[Balthasar]

If I'm rationalizing that low demand does not cause a manufacturing shortage then in fact low demand DOES cause it. So therefore if you believe I'm rationalizing something you must disagree with me and therefore you believe that low demand can cause manufacturing shortages.

unless you're just weird and like to argue about things you agree on.
Seriously man, reading your posts are painful. I'm thinking you backed yourself in a wall and don't know how to get out short of a mea culpa. In the event that this is not the case, I'll try my hand at this (and likely get a headache as a result).

Fitbabits was not, at any point, trying to state that low demand causes a manufacturing shortage. Your argument is a Straw Man; you are harping on points never made in the first place. What everyone is trying to tell you is what he was actually saying--which was that the 360 didn't meet expected sales numbers due to the shortages (worldwide) and the low demand (in Japan). It's pretty clear to everyone but you, apparently. About the only leg you might have to stand on is that he did not specify where the shortages were, so if a person was not privy to the information we all here are regarding where these shortages are taking place, one might infer via syntax that the shortages and the low demand are occuring in Japan only. But you can't play that hand, because you have already demonstrated that you have been reading up on the launch issues and know full well there are no shortages in Japan. Whatever logical conclusions you think you can draw from your argument and the reactions to them are wrong, because this whole thing is a Straw Man. Just quitely fade into the night and forget this ever happened.

[GrinR]

The cheeky monkey PMed me with this masterwork of wit:

Subject: Hi.
Go fuck yourself.

Sad, really.

[AniAko]

blah blah
.....
blip blip blip!!!!!
...
...
...
Blah blah blah!


The conclusion I've come to after reading this is that most people posting here like fitbabits enough to defend him! :p Seriously, while this thread has been better than others on the rocks (a-hem, I'll apologize for one :o) is this all over a few misunderstandings? Or does anyone have any hard facts? Other than the actual news posted by fitbabits? No one has linked to any proven economic algorithms, or statements, or reports on the matter. If you believe it's for a reason someone disagrees with, that's ok, but you can't get in this thread and demand that your opinion be accepted as fact without any sources to back you up.

[Steele Johnson]

There were at least a million people in the US that were looking to buy a 360 at Christmas but couldn't find one. Anyone who thinks that MS faked this shortage is a complete idiot. No company would plan to lose that much for the sake of raising demand or any other reason.

Let's face it, they fucked up. But let it rest already. There's hardly any games for it anyway.

[Balthasar]

I fail to see how anything mentioned in this thread is pro Microsoft, or even twisted anyway remotely to be good.

The company is losing possible sale and any possible ground it hoped to gain against it's competitors. Its losing face to loyal customers like some of mentioned in this thread by not even having preorders fulfilled. It's losing credibility to it's investors by not meeting an internal goal. How ANY of that is twisted to look "good" is purely idiotic if that's what you are seeing.
Whatever this launch looks like to the general populace and their response is not the subject of my comment. We're talking about here, on Evil Avatar, where none of us are investors. Do you see Microsoft as somehow less credible because of this incident? The people I've seen complain about not having their preorder have not treated this as some insult to them as a consumer; indeed, much of the responses I have seen about the shortages have been rational. What you are failing to understand is, when the shoe is on the other foot, be it Sony or Nintendo, such a calm, rational approach to the issue doesn't exist. Furthermore, most of the posts in this thread have not been about how Microsoft is screwing up and how they are going to "lose the console wars" because of the shortages. I pointed out an early comment where someone took the opportunity to turn the news item into what Sony isn't doing right, thus making Microsoft's misstep okay. It's almost a moot point as far as this thread is concerned because of some moronic semantic game going on, but when I had commented on it, that is the way it was skewing.

It pertains to all of us, including myself. The sooner you realize it, the sooner you'll be able to read posts without popping a gasket.
I don't know about you, but I'm pretty relaxed. I have much better things to "pop a gasket" over.

[Zanzibar]

The conclusion I've come to after reading this is that most people posting here like fitbabits enough to defend him! :p Seriously, while this thread has been better than others on the rocks (a-hem, I'll apologize for one :o) is this all over a few misunderstandings? Or does anyone have any hard facts? Other than the actual news posted by fitbabits? No one has linked to any proven economic algorithms, or statements, or reports on the matter. If you believe it's for a reason someone disagrees with, that's ok, but you can't get in this thread and demand that your opinion be accepted as fact without any sources to back you up.

My two cents:
Fit suggested that, based on this article and on other info that EA people read regularly, is that a few things are happening. One is that there is indeed fewer X360 consoles coming from the manufacturers than expected at this point. (That's from this article.) Another is that those retailers that sell X360s are STILL not seeing enough supplies to match demand post-Christmas. (That's from another article that I recall seeing, probably from last week.) Thirdly, we've seen articles that say that there are plenty of X360s on Japanese shelves unsold. (Yet another article from a week or so ago.)

As far as I can tell, Assassin thought Fit was saying that the shortages were CAUSED BY the Japanese lack of demand. Or that the lack of demand in Japan was causing the shortages. Assassin then laid into Fit by basically saying 'they're not related. Duh.' Fit then said 'Lissen, asshole, I never said they were related.' Ass took offense, and then anyone who defended Fit and attacked Ass (according to Ass) apparently believed Ass's original interpretation, that demand/shortages were related. That's the crux of the misunderstanding BY ASS that caused this.

[fitbabits]

And that, as they say, is that. I'll be closing this thread at 6:00pm EST for the sake of everyone's sanity. You have 15 minutes to add your thoughts. PM me if you disagree with me closing this.

[31 Flavas]

Given the shortages and the poor launch in Japan, the 3 million figure always seemed a bit of a reach.ugh.. 117 replys to read... Pardon this treadjack, but did Anyone make mention of Nintendo selling nearly 2 million DS, in japan, in December alone? (Nov 28 - Jan 01, so 35 days actually, ~1.85 million units)

And Evil Avitar said the DS didn't offer anything, at all, anyone would want... :p PSP did sell half a million units in the same time though.

[Balthasar]

As far as I can tell, Assassin thought Fit was saying that the shortages were CAUSED BY the Japanese lack of demand. Or that the lack of demand in Japan was causing the shortages. Assassin then laid into Fit by basically saying 'they're not related. Duh.' Fit then said 'Lissen, asshole, I never said they were related.' Ass took offense, and then anyone who defended Fit and attacked Ass (according to Ass) apparently believed Ass's original interpretation, that demand/shortages were related. That's the crux of the misunderstanding BY ASS that caused this.
More central to the confusion is that Fitbabits did technically make a grammatical error when he said the poor sales were likely due to "the shortages and the poor sales in Japan." It is not clear from the first clause where the shortages are, so it is most logical, without outside knowledge, to assume the shortages are in Japan. The only two possibilities I see here are that Assassin genuinely thought that is what he was saying (and ignored Fit's more clear elaboration of his statement right after he made it), or else Assassin was trolling you guys pretty hard. Not really sure which.

[Schnoogs]

More central to the confusion is that Fitbabits did technically make a grammatical error when he said the poor sales were likely due to "the shortages and the poor sales in Japan." It is not clear from the first clause where the shortages are, so it is most logical, without outside knowledge, to assume the shortages are in Japan. The only two possibilities I see here are that Assassin genuinely thought that is what he was saying (and ignored Fit's more clear elaboration of his statement right after he made it), or else Assassin was trolling you guys pretty hard. Not really sure which.

I wasnt trolling...I was simply making a sarcastic remark to something that seemed illogical to me.

Things got heated when Fitabits responded by calling me an idiot or something to that effect. Yet I'm the troll despite the fact that he completely over reacted.

Sarcasm met with hostility....nice.

[AniAko]

And that, as they say, is that. I'll be closing this thread at 6:00pm EST for the sake of everyone's sanity. You have 15 minutes to add your thoughts. PM me if you disagree with me closing this.

Check-mate. But no matter, this argument will spill over into another thread in the future I'm sure.

My final comment:
No one, knows how the events came to be, nor how they're going to end up, unless you're privvy to sitting in on the conference calls *** has about these issues, or have a *** contact that told you the details of the situation. In which case if you are, and can disclose this information, please clarify the matter. Otherwise, we are none the wiser.

[Zanzibar]

More central to the confusion is that Fitbabits did technically make a grammatical error when he said the poor sales were likely due to "the shortages and the poor sales in Japan." It is not clear from the first clause where the shortages are, so it is most logical, without outside knowledge, to assume the shortages are in Japan. The only two possibilities I see here are that Assassin genuinely thought that is what he was saying (and ignored Fit's more clear elaboration of his statement right after he made it), or else Assassin was trolling you guys pretty hard. Not really sure which.

Gotcha. Yeah, that's a valid point. But anyone interpreting it that way would also probably therefore think that shortages are ONLY happening in Japan, which anyone who's the least bit internet-savvy would know is not true.

[fitbabits]

I wasnt trolling...I was simply making a sarcastic remark to something that seemed illogical to me.

Things got heated when Fitabits responded by calling me an idiot or something to that effect. Yet I'm the troll despite the fact that he completely over reacted.

Sarcasm met with hostility....nice.
Dude, I did not call you an idiot, nor would I.

[Zanzibar]

Originally Posted by Assassin
yeah because we all know Japanese product launches somehow control what assembly lines can manufacture.

Originally Posted by Fitbabits
Your assinine reply makes no sense and doesn't even touch on the point I made. The 3 million figure was for number of 360s sold worldwide (which, by the way, includes Japan). If the Japanese public are not warming to the 360 the way some expected them to, then obviously it's putting a dent in sales. By all accounts the 360 is widely available in Japan - it's just that not many people are buying them.

Sarcasm that is wrongly applied = asinine.

[Schnoogs]

Sarcasm that is wrongly applied = asinine.

Luckily for those of us in the free world it's not up to you Zartan to determine what the level of sarcasm is for a given statement.

I wasn't trolling I was merely fending off the 5 or 6 of you who started out your responses with "You're an idiot".

As smart as you think you are you have the tact of a 10 year old.

And GrinR....he knows what I think of him.

[GrinR]

How does one /ignore in these forums? I haven't the time to waste, really.

[fitbabits]

Okay, thread now officially closed.

Feel free to send me either a PM or an email if you'd like to discuss.