Microsoft Research True Skill Ranking System

[ldi222]

What is the TrueSkill™ Ranking system?

The TrueSkill ranking system is a skill based ranking system for Xbox Live developed at Microsoft Research. The purpose of a ranking system is to both identify and track the skills of gamers in a game (mode) in order to be able to match them into competitive matches. The TrueSkill ranking system only uses the final standings of all teams in a game in order to update the skill estimates (ranks) of all gamers playing in this game. Ranking systems have been proposed for many sports but possibly the most prominent ranking system in use today is ELO.

Link (http://www.research.microsoft.com/mlp/trueskill/default.aspx)

Funny, all this complicated math and formulas just to be exploited by a snot-nosed 12 year-old who would join a multitude of games and repeatedly commit suicide.

[Heretic Machine]

Yay! They discovered a bell curve.... woohoo!

[IndependentGMR]

What is the TrueSkill™ Ranking system?

A piece of crap.

[ldi222]

Its a bit more complicated than a bell curve. In fact far more than I would have thought for simple matchmaking purposes. Still, the irony is the more complicated it becomes to attempt to make for a fair game, the more the system will get abused to make games unfair.

[doyama]

Official ranking systems in general can vary widely in their ability to actually 'rank' players or teams. Chess rankings are widely regarded as a good indicator of a player's ability. On the low end, the BSC ratings and World Cup seedings sometimes defy logic.

The main problem with online ranking systems is that there is no referee watching each game. So it's difficult to rely on the end game stats to determine a player's rank.

I don't know of a system, but I think the way to go is to weight the ranking system such that there is a high level of uncertaintly in the low to mid range ranking, but make it difficult to cheat the high end scale. But even here it could be difficult becuase you can run into scenarios where an entire clan of 20 people could collude to raise their rank artificially.

[TKO]

Well, if it's based on end-game stats that's a good thing to stop those 12 year old bastards dropping all the time. They have to finish to get ranked. Yay! There should also be a significant penalty for dropping out of games to stop strategic dropping. (Or maybe for dropping out of ranked games? ..so people can forgo the quality matchmaking for a quick blast.)

IMHO that's the main issues people have to address to stop s**ty behaviour online. ..Maybe not an immediate hard penalty for dropping, but one that quickly ramps up if people do it a lot.

[GWhite]

I am kind of surprised that Microsoft has never tried to implement a community moderation system, with mods getting free Live! or points. Live! is a centralized system so it might take a relatively small number of active volunteers to police people.
I have never played it but does not WoW implement a similar system with GMs? How well does that work?

[Montgomery_Python]

IMHO that's the main issues people have to address to stop s**ty behaviour online.

Sooty? Just a guess. ;)

[DarkEternal]

I am kind of surprised that Microsoft has never tried to implement a community moderation system, with mods getting free Live! or points. Live! is a centralized system so it might take a relatively small number of active volunteers to police people.
I have never played it but does not WoW implement a similar system with GMs? How well does that work?

I really like that idea. Just have a handful of people who are handpicked to be mods and just play Live and ban people who act like idiots. I would assume that that would cut down a lot on the unpleasantness of matchmaking, as you would never know who is a mod. Not that it would ever be implemented. Microsoft being the big company that it is, community mods would never work for them because they couldn't be policed at all times. However, maybe they could hire some people...

[GrinR]

Why pay people to moderate games when gamers are born with their hands in a death-grip on their ankles?

[dolbex]

Yea, the white papers were put up some time back in October. It is more complex than a bell curve but Idi222 is right, it lends it self to assist exploiters, not hurt them, if they go uncaught.

Here are my thoughts (http://www.mlgpro.com/youraccount.php?profile=1&blogid=700) about TrueSkill back in November.

[MrMeatshake]

I really like that idea. Just have a handful of people who are handpicked to be mods and just play Live and ban people who act like idiots. I would assume that that would cut down a lot on the unpleasantness of matchmaking, as you would never know who is a mod.

yeah. me likey that idea. might finally stop being called an asshole as soon as anyone realises i'm not from emerica. :( hm, more likely the mods'll just do it as well ;)

[bapenguin]

yeah. me likey that idea. might finally stop being called an asshole as soon as anyone realises i'm not from emerica. :( hm, more likely the mods'll just do it as well ;)

you're not from America? Asshole. ;)

[Vandenh]

It is an interesting system and certainly has some very good points (punishing grievers like team killers). Still it can easily be exploited. When your whole team is a bunch of pro-gamers, your rank will go up so just like in WoW a crack team can boost individual players to high levels. The question is.... why would people do this ;) since without that noob they could even gain a higher rank. Also fixed games is still possible... that is something that the game matchmaking service itself has to try to combat. I like the fact that devs now have a common ranking system on Live and don't need to spend time developing something themselves (== quicker, cheaper and better games?).

BTW Major Nelson has an interview with the TrueSkill guys on his blog. (www.majornelson.com)

[Heretic Machine]

I am kind of surprised that Microsoft has never tried to implement a community moderation system, with mods getting free Live! or points. Live! is a centralized system so it might take a relatively small number of active volunteers to police people.
I have never played it but does not WoW implement a similar system with GMs? How well does that work?

Well, I haven't seen a system like that since way back in the days of Ultima Online. They had "Counselors" who acted as tech support, and "Seers" who did stories for individual servers. One day EA decided to disband the groups, and then they got sued for backwages... it was a whole big mess. I doubt you'll see a system like that again.

[ChristopherA]

If you'd like to understand a bit more about ranking systems in general, and TrueSkill in specific, you might want to look at Collective Choice: Competitive Rating Systems (http://www.lifewithalacrity.com/2006/01/ranking_systems.html).

-- Christopher Allen

[MrMeatshake]

If you'd like to understand a bit more about ranking systems in general, and TrueSkill in specific, you might want to look at Collective Choice: Competitive Rating Systems (http://www.lifewithalacrity.com/2006/01/ranking_systems.html).

-- Christopher Allen

thanks, man. another useful post! what's going on @tm.