Test Driving Nintendo's Revolution

[joruussuun]

CNN Money's GAME OVER column with Chris Morris this week has his thoughts on the Revolution Controller (http://money.cnn.com/2005/12/15/commentary/game_over/column_gaming/) after a hands on.

A simple point and shoot demo (like any of the thousands of Web-based Flash games) was more fun than I expected. I effortlessly pulled off loops and flight stunts I've never been able to manage with today's standard controller in a flying demo, simply by holding the controller as I might a paper airplane.
I'm really looking forward to the Revolution!

[emperordahc]

Can't. Freakin'. Wait. :D

(BTW, my little DS is getting more use than my PSP, which is collecting dust. Horsepower has little to do w/ enjoying a game.) With just Animal Crossing: WW and Mario Kart DS, I'm totally happy w/ Nintendo.

[MajSheppard]

You and me both.

[Rirath]

I effortlessly pulled off loops and flight stunts I've never been able to manage with today's standard controller in a flying demo

See, I just have a really hard time buying this unless he is absolutely lousy with a regular controller. There's also a mockup video going around of what the rev controller in action might look like, search Digg.com. Interesting, certainly fun, but I can't see it being the ticket to instant madder skillz.

[screwtape]

So it does have a rumble feature. I wonder how long the batteries will last.

Has anyone talked negatively that actually used the controller? I've seen almost nothing but praise.

[AntB]

I'm horrible at flight games too, so I'm kinda leaning towards him being right. I see how it might be easy to controll a plane with the Rev n00bstick.

[KidCactus]

simply by holding the controller as I might a paper airplane.

I just can't picture in my mind how to hold the controller like a paper airplane... :confused:

[AniAko]

I love the pic:
http://money.cnn.com/2005/12/15/commentary/game_over/column_gaming/cm_mario.jpg
Mario Morris.

[Anju]

I just can't picture in my mind how to hold the controller like a paper airplane... :confused:
I take it you've never made a paper airplane in class?

[XxSATANxX]

Okay so lets say the Nintendo brick turns out to be the bees knees. Uhm so PS3 will have one, uhm 360 will have one, heck they'll have a pc version and of course an Apple one.

I like the idea. But I bet the best one won't be the one on the Revolution.

Can anyone confirm the VR Glasses being made for the 360?????

[Genital Eclipse]

Can anyone confirm the VR Glasses being made for the 360?????


Actually, the VR Glasses for 360 are already out. I saw an old woman wearing them as she was driving yesterday.

[RMan]

Okay so lets say the Nintendo brick turns out to be the bees knees. Uhm so PS3 will have one, uhm 360 will have one, heck they'll have a pc version and of course an Apple one.
Eventually, yea, but the fact that they'll be a peripheral all but guarantees failure (at best, fairly limited support). Good innovation is always copied (especially when MS is involved :)), but the Revolution will clearly be the king of that controller type for this generation.

[zorper]

Well, being and xbox fanboy, I'm surprized that the Nintendo strategy is going to work with me. I'll be buying a Rev for my 4 year old because I think he'll be able to use it right away. So I will be creating a Nintendo fanboy.

[AniAko]

Okay so lets say the Nintendo brick turns out to be the bees knees. Uhm so PS3 will have one, uhm 360 will have one, heck they'll have a pc version and of course an Apple one.

I like the idea. But I bet the best one won't be the one on the Revolution.

Can anyone confirm the VR Glasses being made for the 360?????

You bring up a good point. Gaming would be dead if it wasn't for Nintendo, Atari, and Sega. Now it's Nintendo holding the torch and dashing forwards, everyone else can make their millions copying and re-producing original titles. But the new titles will have to have more to them, thus costing more money, this reducing the millions the company would make.

I once read an article about the cycle of the gaming industry, and it proves out. Sony and MS will make more consoles and more money, but this is incurred directly from the high production costs of their breed. Nintendo wouldn't exist without the copy cats, and vice versa. So who's the best? Anyone who doesn't drown trying, so we have a couple of first place ties....

Read this article at Lost Garden (http://lostgarden.com/2005/09/nintendos-genre-innovation-strategy.html), to date it's the best article I've ever read. It discusses Nintendo's "innovation strategy", how it works, and how the industry relies on the little back of a 3 foot plumber.

[Rafer]

Eventually, yea, but the fact that they'll be a peripheral all but guarantees failure (at best, fairly limited support). Good innovation is always copied (especially when MS is involved :)), but the Revolution will clearly be the king of that controller type for this generation.

So I guess you're saying that it might turn out like the N64 analog stick, both the PS1 and Saturn copied it with the Dual Shock and the Nights controller, but very few games for those systems actually ended up using them.

[Krull]

Okay so lets say the Nintendo brick turns out to be the bees knees. Uhm so PS3 will have one, uhm 360 will have one, heck they'll have a pc version and of course an Apple one.

I like the idea. But I bet the best one won't be the one on the Revolution.

Can anyone confirm the VR Glasses being made for the 360?????

Why do people even bother to post outside of there "Console of Choice" forums?

Let’s take a quick look back in time shall we? Nintendo releases the NES, the first controller with a D-Pad, which every company has since copied. Then came the SNES with its more rounded ergo designed controller, the addition of 4 more buttons (2 action and 2 shoulder) which included the first shoulder buttons. The SNES controller is the most copied controller design. Then came the N64 with its innovative analog stick, this radical design change introduce the world to 3D controls via an analog stick which everyone uses to this day. Next you have the Gamecube and the Wavebird, by far not the first wireless controller, but Nintendo perfected it and the Wavebird is considered the best wireless controller out there. Now we have the Revolution, a total change in design and control once again.

Nintendo is trying to revolutionize the industry and if the controler is a success like every article I have seen to date claims, you will be right. Every console will have there own version and some may in fact be better but why knock on the company that created the design and took a chance.

So my question to you is this, where would gameing be with out Nintendo?

[trip1eX]

I'm just wondering how the aiming in the Metroid demo exactly works. I haven't read any very specific details on this.

At first I was thinking you directly aim at something on the screen. Guy in the upper left corner means aiming at the upper left corner until you bring down the guy. Then maybe to turn left/right or look up/down you'd aim the controller off screen in the appropriate direction.

Or was it like an analog stick where turning left/right or looking up/down means moving the controller left/right or up/down of center. In this manner you're not directly aiming at anything. Less like a mouse and more like an analog stick. Tho more precise than a stick and more intuitive.

Or it could work just like a mouse where distance and speed moved translates to distance and speed moved on the screen. The problem here tho is simulating the 'pick-up' of the mouse when you've too far to left/right, up/down. YOu could hold a button anytime you want to center your controller again.

I wish someone who tries it out would explain this in more detail. Most seem to just have cut and pasted what the other 10 articles on the subject have said.

[agentgray]

Can't. Freakin'. Wait. :D

(BTW, my little DS is getting more use than my PSP, which is collecting dust. Horsepower has little to do w/ enjoying a game.) With just Animal Crossing: WW and Mario Kart DS, I'm totally happy w/ Nintendo.
Same here. I traded the PSP in and have been loving the DS ever since. Thanks, Sony, for the rootkit fiasco.

I can't wait to see how they might us the DS with the system.

[JazGalaxy]

I'm convinced that people who aren't psyched about the Rev controller just don't understand it. I know people don't like to hear that, but this time next year I'm pretty sure everyone will be on board with it and then be pretending they weren't against it now. Just like they were about Microsoft being a player in the games industry.

[Nite_Moogle]

I'm just wondering how the aiming in the Metroid demo exactly works.
Hold the controller straight at your center point and you don't do anything. This center point is determined based on where your sensors are at, I'm sure. Tilt the controller left and your POV moves left until you move it back to center, like an analog stick. The more drastically you move it away from center the faster you'll turn. Same thing up or down. It isn't a light gun, you can move the "pointer" way past the edges of the screen.
I can't see using the controller as a literal direction that you face, you'd do some pretty weird convolutions to try and shoot at something that was "behind" you :P

[CapnBob]

I'm just wondering how the aiming in the Metroid demo exactly works. I haven't read any very specific details on this.

I seem to recall Matt mentioning this. If I recall correctly it was sort of a hybrid. Point the controller past a certain point and it acts like a analog stick, turning the view in that direction up to the maximum allowed speed. If you just point at the screen, however, you can scan or shoot anything on the screen by pointing at it directly. The lock-on was still available, and when you were locked on to an enemy you could aim at other areas of the screen independently of your target in order to lead your shots or potentially hit another nearby enemy.

[Worldcrafter]

Can anyone confirm the VR Glasses being made for the 360?????

Actually, the VR Glasses for 360 are already out. I saw an old woman wearing them as she was driving yesterday.


I just wanted to point out that this response == comic gold.

[bean19]

All about the games. I hope they get some 3rd party support this gen. I'm going to try and just borrow or rent the system if they only have 2 to 3 excellent "must have" titles each year like the Gamecube. Love those 2 to 3 titles, but trying to be frugal.

[outontheporch]

Just like they were about Microsoft being a player in the games industry.

I dunno, I'm still against this...

Oh yeah and I got an ipod video recently, so looks like I'll be trading in my PSP, since I was just using it for movies.

[RMan]

So I guess you're saying that it might turn out like the N64 analog stick, both the PS1 and Saturn copied it with the Dual Shock and the Nights controller, but very few games for those systems actually ended up using them.
Yea, pretty much, except likely less successful than those. This time around, copying the Revolution controller will likely be a little harder, resulting in a slightly longer turnaround for getting the controller to market. After getting it to market, it’ll be a fairly expensive peripheral (I’m guessing) and coupled with the rather heavy price of the 360 and PS3 compared to what we imagine will be a much lower price for the Revolution it’s unlikely that the controller would get much penetration since hardcore gamers will likely buy a Revolution anyway (at least before buying a peripheral with limited software support). There’s a good possibility that the games that make the Revolution controller really cool looking just won’t work well on a standard controller, so developers aren’t likely to bother putting those games on systems where the controller that makes them good isn’t generally there.

[CapnBob]

All about the games. I hope they get some 3rd party support this gen. I'm going to try and just borrow or rent the system if they only have 2 to 3 excellent "must have" titles each year like the Gamecube. Love those 2 to 3 titles, but trying to be frugal.

You read the part where they expect the system to launch for $150 or less, maybe even $100... right? Even for only 3 games a year, buying the system will probably cost the same or less than renting it. It's hard to be much more frugal than that.

[Rirath]

I'm convinced that people who aren't psyched about the Rev controller just don't understand it. I know people don't like to hear that

Equating lack of blind faith to lack of understanding does tend to make people a little agitated, yes. It also doesn't tend to make for the best debates.

"The Rev controller will own!"
"But, you haven't even seen it in action yet, much less used one."
"You just don't understand it."

I'm perfectly willing to accept it may be nifty. I'm also perfectly willing to accept it may be a gimmick. Reporters lucky enough to get an early sneak peek don't really sway me all too much these days as most of them seem taken in by the "gee-whiz" factor. I buy my consoles for the games.

[joruussuun]

I'm just wondering how the aiming in the Metroid demo exactly works. I haven't read any very specific details on this.

I coulda swore with any FPS like that (ok, people have called it First Person Adventure but whatever!) you use the nunchuck dongle thing. That joystick is just like the left stick on other controllers, controlling forward/backward and turning left/right. The Revolution remote is like holding the gun, moving that up and down, side-to-side, firing and so on.

[RandomViolence]

Hold the controller straight at your center point and you don't do anything. This center point is determined based on where your sensors are at, I'm sure. Tilt the controller left and your POV moves left until you move it back to center, like an analog stick. The more drastically you move it away from center the faster you'll turn. Same thing up or down. It isn't a light gun, you can move the "pointer" way past the edges of the screen.
I can't see using the controller as a literal direction that you face, you'd do some pretty weird convolutions to try and shoot at something that was "behind" you :P

That sounds incredibly counterintuitive. Imagine trying to play a current FPS like that. What you're describing sounds like a far worse version of an analog stick controller.

I'd prefer something more like, say, a Mechwarrior style game. You use the stick for direct aim within the front half of your view, and you'd need to turn with the joystick add-on to turn your body's facing. I agree that shooting behind you would be difficult. I don't know. Now that I read this over again the limited turning and separate body movement doesn't sound fantastic, but maybe it'd work. I just can't see having a controller like the Revolution's and using it in an FPS the way you're describing when the way seems so much more natural. Maybe it'll be better in implementation.

[jacktion]

I seem to recall Matt mentioning this. If I recall correctly it was sort of a hybrid. Point the controller past a certain point and it acts like a analog stick, turning the view in that direction up to the maximum allowed speed. If you just point at the screen, however, you can scan or shoot anything on the screen by pointing at it directly. The lock-on was still available, and when you were locked on to an enemy you could aim at other areas of the screen independently of your target in order to lead your shots or potentially hit another nearby enemy.

That makes sense. If you aim directly at the screen it moves the cursor anywhere you can see. If you move it past the edge of the screen it makes you turn in place like an analog stick. Seems pretty intuitive. Can't wait to try it.

[Nessus]

As many others have said, the DS makes me think they can pull it off.

When I first heard about DS I had pretty much the same reaction: "What the fuck?"

But now I play DS more than my GameCube, PS2, or Xbox.

I think Rev will start out similarly to DS. The initial batch of 3rd party and even some 1st party games will be gimmicky and will not fully realize the potential of the system. There will be a learning curve. But once people get a hang of the hardware things will really pick up.

Though this time I think it'll be slightly different because I think there's a good chance they'll have Metroid Prime 3 ready for launch. And if that's the case I'll get one at launch. Whereas I waited until June to get a DS for Meteos and Kirby: Canvass Curse.

[Nite_Moogle]

That sounds incredibly counterintuitive. Imagine trying to play a current FPS like that. What you're describing sounds like a far worse version of an analog stick controller.

You've done it for years already when you use a joystick, you might be surprised how easy it is ;)

[Loganrapp]

This generation the controller for the Revolution will be the only one.

The Dual Shock controller did not really "catch on" and become standard until the PS2, so throughout the N64 generation, they were really "up" with the joystick. Of course, the controller was obviously made so that your penis would have to hold the center handle just to keep the controller upright (hence the Rumble Pak).

But then the PS2 came along, made it work wonderfully with dual joysticks, and then XBOX came along as well.

Nintendo's usually the "R&D" for game companies to test out things, and then refine it in future game systems. I imagine some of the Revolution's strong points will be taken for the PS4 or the 720, as it were.

[Magnanimous Gnome]

Yea, pretty much, except likely less successful than those. This time around, copying the Revolution controller will likely be a little harder, resulting in a slightly longer turnaround for getting the controller to market. After getting it to market, it’ll be a fairly expensive peripheral (I’m guessing) and coupled with the rather heavy price of the 360 and PS3 compared to what we imagine will be a much lower price for the Revolution it’s unlikely that the controller would get much penetration since hardcore gamers will likely buy a Revolution anyway (at least before buying a peripheral with limited software support). There’s a good possibility that the games that make the Revolution controller really cool looking just won’t work well on a standard controller, so developers aren’t likely to bother putting those games on systems where the controller that makes them good isn’t generally there.


Not to mention that making a Revolution-style controller and then releasing it is quite a bit different then just tacking some analog sticks on to your current controller (ahem Sony...). Some people seem to think that this will be a lot easier to copy than it actually will be. The Revolution controller isn't just getting one or two little buttons or a stick or something - it's totally different, and thus a lot harder to copy than past controllers.

I'm not saying MS and Sony won't copy it though - I just don't think it will be implented on their systems this gen. If it is then it will probably be expensive, and almost certainly not well supported. Expect to see something similar next round though if Nintendo succeeds.

[DoubleUranium]

I'm perfectly willing to accept it may be nifty. I'm also perfectly willing to accept it may be a gimmick. Reporters lucky enough to get an early sneak peek don't really sway me all too much these days as most of them seem taken in by the "gee-whiz" factor. I buy my consoles for the games.

That's pretty much where I'm at. Wait and see, hope for the best. Positive first hand reports like this are a good thing, but until someone is actually playing a game, it's all hype. My biggest concern with moving to a more physical controller is the simple fact that it's physical. I like the physical interface arcade games in small doses, but can't imagine having to hold a paper airplane and maneuver it for 2 hours straight. I hope it all pans out though, fanboy hype aside. A real breakthrough would be nice.

[AniAko]

Has anyone thought that maybe the technology Nintendo is coming up with is patented? Nintendo would be smart to grab what ever patents they could to deter Sony and MS from copying the controller

[Hagetaka]

Let’s take a quick look back in time shall we? Nintendo releases the NES, the first controller with a D-Pad, which every company has since copied. Then came the SNES with its more rounded ergo designed controller, the addition of 4 more buttons (2 action and 2 shoulder) which included the first shoulder buttons. The SNES controller is the most copied controller design. Then came the N64 with its innovative analog stick, this radical design change introduce the world to 3D controls via an analog stick which everyone uses to this day. Next you have the Gamecube and the Wavebird, by far not the first wireless controller, but Nintendo perfected it and the Wavebird is considered the best wireless controller out there. Now we have the Revolution, a total change in design and control once again.

Nintendo is trying to revolutionize the industry and if the controler is a success like every article I have seen to date claims, you will be right. Every console will have there own version and some may in fact be better but why knock on the company that created the design and took a chance.

So my question to you is this, where would gameing be with out Nintendo?

Thats a good example of post hoc my friend. Simply because they made it first is not to say that it would not have of been invented at all. Yet,to answer your question, where would gaming be without Nintendo? Who knows, maybe it would be better off. Nintendo hasnt always had the best ideas (Virtual Boy anyone?). Though, I cant strip all of the credit away from Nintendo, certainly, they have had a great influence on the market.

/sorry if im repeating what someone has already said, dont have much time left at work...

[mister_slim]

I always wondered why nobody ever released a lightgun game that plugged into the Xbox controller expansion port. That seems like it would have worked very well (for those of us with CRTs anyway).
That sounds incredibly counterintuitive. Imagine trying to play a current FPS like that. What you're describing sounds like a far worse version of an analog stick controller.

Point towards what you want to shoot. The game realizes you are pointing away from center and moves the aim towards the direction you are pointing. As your target moves toward the center of the screen you track, so that as the target arrives in the center of the screen so does your controller. Interestingly enough, people tend to develop the ability to track moving objects with their eyes and their hands.

[rein]

I have still not read a negative comment about this controller from anyone who has experience with it. Until I do, I will ignore all of the people who cry doom for Nintendo or down play the controller. It seems this controller really is the Knees Bees.

[JazGalaxy]

I always wondered why nobody ever released a lightgun game that plugged into the Xbox controller expansion port. That seems like it would have worked very well (for those of us with CRTs anyway).

Point towards what you want to shoot. The game realizes you are pointing away from center and moves the aim towards the direction you are pointing. As your target moves toward the center of the screen you track, so that as the target arrives in the center of the screen so does your controller. Interestingly enough, people tend to develop the ability to track moving objects with their eyes and their hands.

Well, here's the deal.

Anybody else out there who is a digital artist will probably have worked with digital tablets. I have one sitting right here in front of me. Basically the way it works is that there is a big tablet which emulates the computer monitor. If I pick up the pen and place it in the top right corner of my pad, the cursor will blink tot he top right corner of my monitor. If i do the same for the bottom left, it will blink to the bottom left. It is, essentially, a 1 to 1 representation of a touch screen monitor... just in different places. Anyone who uses these can vouch for the fact that navigating Windows is very intuitive. If you want to scroll a window, you just move the cursor to the edge and hold it there while it scrolls. This is exacly how the Revolution controller will, I think, handle playing FPS games like metroid. People with DSs should also be familiar with the concept.

[Pantsmonkey]

My pick for the fisrt Revolution game.

Mario 128 + Duckhunt 2 =)

[trip1eX]

Well, here's the deal.

Anybody else out there who is a digital artist will probably have worked with digital tablets. I have one sitting right here in front of me. Basically the way it works is that there is a big tablet which emulates the computer monitor. If I pick up the pen and place it in the top right corner of my pad, the cursor will blink tot he top right corner of my monitor. If i do the same for the bottom left, it will blink to the bottom left. It is, essentially, a 1 to 1 representation of a touch screen monitor... just in different places. Anyone who uses these can vouch for the fact that navigating Windows is very intuitive. If you want to scroll a window, you just move the cursor to the edge and hold it there while it scrolls. This is exacly how the Revolution controller will, I think, handle playing FPS games like metroid. People with DSs should also be familiar with the concept.

The DS is different. The DS is exactly like a mouse for fps. YOu don't hold your stylus at the edge of the touchscreen screen to turn. You move it left or right, up or down. And you pick it up and move it back to center (like a mouse) when you hit the edge of the touchscreen.

The DS touchscreen/stylus combo also features mouse-like acceleration where accelerating really fast covers alot of distance on the monitor(DS top screen) while requiring less distance on the mousepad(touchscreen) than slowly moving the mouse does. rinse and repeat.

The Rev controller will probably be more like your digital tablet... and maybe have some combination of scrolling at the edges of the screen and direct aiming everywhere else or it will be a direct port of the analog stick but with more precision and intuitiveness.

And actually the controller would be capable of many different first person aiming and looking control schemes. They could make it more mouselike or more analog stick like or more digital pad like you've described. I was just wondering earlier how the Metroid demo exactly operated in this regard. No one who's tried it has bothered to give us a more detailed accurate description of how it operated. afaik.

[JazGalaxy]

well I may be wrong about this since I don't personally own a DS, but does it not also support touch screen functionality? That is to say, in Metroid Prime Hunters, to turn into a morph ball you just touch the morph ball button, correct? For this to work, the DS should also be capable of concocting a control scheme like the one for the digital tablets.

I think, anyhow.

[Twigmaster]

FPS games for the Revolution are gonna kick ass cuz you actually move your hand to control the game rather than using just your thumbs.

[Vandenh]

>I have still not read a negative comment about this controller from anyone who has experience with it.

Well the only thing that worries me, is that you have to place "receivers" next to your TV. Are these guys gonna be wireless? Or cabled? Frankly I don't wanne put anything on my plasma... it is hanging on the wall in a very arty way ;) I am sure many people are trying to get rid of cables (hance wireless controllers), adding more stuff to put on TV table is a very bad idea.

[Hellstorm]

I have still not read a negative comment about this controller from anyone who has experience with it. Until I do, I will ignore all of the people who cry doom for Nintendo or down play the controller. It seems this controller really is the Knees Bees.

*cough* Mark Rein *cough* Oh wait, you said from people who have USED it. Oh, then you are correct.