Phil Harrison - "The High Definition Era Starts with PS3"

[fitbabits]

In an interview that is sure to ruffle a few feathers and start numerous flame wars, Eurogamer (http://www.eurogamer.net) has posted a few snippets (http://www.eurogamer.net/article.php?article_id=62137) of an interview conducted by GameIndustry.biz (http://www.gameindustry.biz) with Phil Harrison, president of Sony Computer Entertainment Worldwide Studios.

"The true definition of HD is the three elements of the HD value chain - the display, the content and the hardware to play back that content," he explained, "and PlayStation and Sony is the only organisation that has all three bits of the value chain together."

"As you well know," he continued, "the Xbox 360 doesn't play high definition movies and doesn't have true HD functionality - PlayStation 3 is the only format that has 1080-progressive, which is the true definition of HD, so it's really premature to be talking about the HD era."

"The HD era really only starts when we are on the market," he concluded.
In the immortal words of Johnny Storm - FLAME ON!

Oh, and all this talk amounts to nothing more than talk - show us what you've got, Sony, and maybe then I'll start believing you.

[earthworm48]

I've had enough of both sides. I think he forgot to mention that lots if not most games will not have 1080p support (films will though) and that 1080p sets are rather pricey.

Also I think Sony should sort out their online service rather than pushing 1080p.

[The Letter 3]

Micro$oft sucks! Sony hackorz! And Nintendo is for little kids! They are all super sucky-orz people! haha I'm so smart! Go N-Gage! N-Gage is for real men and not pussies who need HD or fun games!

[fitbabits]

Micro$oft sucks! Sony hackorz! And Nintendo is for little kids! They are all super sucky-orz people! haha I'm so smart! Go N-Gage! N-Gage is for real men and not pussies who need HD or fun games!
Dude, where have you been? The N-Gage is no more! (http://www.evilavatar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7453&highlight=n-gage) :)

[Ernst_Jager]

Well considering that of the probably 10-15 people I know with a HD tv, not one of them supports 1080p, I see this meaning very little to the average person...hell even the above average person.

[Borys]

Killzone, Motorstorm or FF7 Remake quality graphics in launch titles OR ELSE Sony.

You've got a supporter here, make everything to not lose him.

[The Letter 3]

Dude, where have you been? The N-Gage is no more! (http://www.evilavatar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7453&highlight=n-gage) :)
err... That's sort of the joke fitbabits. Not to steal your thunder or anything, though. Here, have it back. *Gives thunder.* You looked so lonely without it. ;)

[fitbabits]

err... That's sort of the joke fitbabits. Not to steal your thunder or anything, though. Here, have it back. *Gives thunder.* You looked so lonely without it. ;)
I know, I was playing along. ;)

And you can stick your thunder where the sun don't shine! :)

[ackbrack]

Regardless of which company is saying it, this kind of talk is the apex of absurdity.

This dude should just say the Playstation 3 will be a better console because there's more letters in "Playstation" than there are in "Xbox" and be done with it.

[phantomhitman]

hell yeah, 1080p on my standard tv is going to be awesome!!!1111!!

[bapenguin]

The problem with 1080p is it's so late to the game. There have been an enormous amount of HDTV sales this year....and maybe 1% of those sales were 1080p sets. Now....I don't know about you...but most people aren't going to be buying a new HDTV set in 4 or 5 years. Hell...1080p is hardly on the map for this coming year with only a handful of sets and projectors set to support it...and that's only in the high end market.

People thought Microsoft was nuts with their target market of HDTV owners. Now take 1% (that's probably generous) of that market and that's what Sony's "true" HDTV userbase is.

[Gaz]

I love these kinds of "news" snippets, it means that Sony and other assorted companies spend less money on advertising and line their pockets with gold that little bit more. Sony saying that "The HD era" starts with their product? SHOCK! This really is the kind of marketing I would expect from Microsoft and Sony, I'm glad that Ninty don't operate by such methods. Kinda reminds me of the "Zen of gaming", seeing as the BS is coming almost as thick and fast as it was then. Sounds like less of an interview and more like one of those faux articles that you get in magazines advertising cars or consumer electronics.

[crashedout]

Or how about that not even this years sony 1080p tv's actually accept a 1080p signal. Fantastic.

[markster3000]

the 360 isn't HD because... it doesn't play HD movies?

We have got to stop posting news that amounts to "Prez of Sony/MS says 'My system R0xx0rz!!!'"


Dude, where have you been? The N-Gage is no more! (http://www.evilavatar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7453&highlight=n-gage) :)
For some reason, despite this, I now see more ads than ever for the N-Gage.

[Borys]

Not to mention Sony is screwing people who bought 1080i Sony HD-TVs.

I don't expect any of PS3 games to be running in 1080p. For me 1600x1200 is the sweet spot, anything higher - waste of pixel clocks.

[saran_js]

Well considering that of the probably 10-15 people I know with a HD tv, not one of them supports 1080p, I see this meaning very little to the average person...hell even the above average person.

Hell man, then it's definitely obvious that those HD tvs are not true HD. Didn't you just read what the man said.
:eek:

[Beelzebud]

I think if there is one thing Sony has already trounced the competiton at, it's this:

HYPE

[rein]

The only thing I want to hear coming from Sony is a date and a price.

[Kelegacy]

I don't care much for HDTV stuff (even though I own one), but if Sony does nearly the exact same stuff, puts out the same quality games on their machines as they did with the PS2 (this includes 3rd parties), I will be MORE than happy.

[ruprect]

1080p is true HD? So I've been lied to the past 4 or 5 years about what an HD television is?
Thank God for Sony, looking to help me out from the goodness of their heart.

Next thing they'll tell me is that unless a speaker system has 8 subwoofers it isn't true Surround Sound.

I hate marketing.

[The Letter 3]

I know, I was playing along. ;)

And you can stick your thunder where the sun don't shine! :)
I was counter-playing along. I guess that means I got a headshot! :p

But seriously, about that thunder, let's just return it to Zeus.

[Reanimated]

so why are all the PS3 games targeted for 720p? Ninja Theory recently confirmed that Heavenly Sword would get downgraded to 720p.

So I guess I don't get what this guy is talking about.

[Mason]

Killzone, Motorstorm or FF7 Remake quality graphics in launch titles OR ELSE Sony.

You've got a supporter here, make everything to not lose him.

There's going to be a sad boy next spring.

Seriously, if they had actual games which looked that amazing, why wouldn't they have released a ton of screenshots/movies/reviewer-demos on, oh, say, December 2nd? I mean, you probably would've had lot fewer people excited about Kameo, let's say. But they're letting the 360 go unchallenged for now, with only the occasional bit of executive trash-talk.

But we're 3-5 months away from their confirmed launch window, with nothing of substance since E3. I personally hope that they just screwed up their PR strategy and will actually be able to deliver everything on time, but it isn't a good pattern.

It's like HL2's original release date. It kept getting closer and closer, with no major info being released. Everyone was excited but anxious, as Valve had just stopped talking. Then, at the last possible second, it turns out the game was pushed back a year. Probably Valve's least honorable moment, but instructional in the way that large organizations behave when they've made a very public mistake, which they don't want to admit to themselves.

Maybe Sony's been silent because they finished their console and tons of great launch games and they're all sitting around playing them and eating Cheetos. Let's hope.

[SymetriX]

Well I won't get into the 1080p/i debate. Sure it's great to have but everyone is right in that there really is only one TV made by HP that supports an *input* of 1080p.

There are a few limitations of the 360 which are more important that I think the PS3 can take advantage of:

1. No HD-DVD playback
2. Smaller disc capacity
3. Lower resolution

#2 is probably most relevant as far as games are concerned.

Let me expand on the last point: YES, the 360 can output any game at 1080i, but it is through up-sampling a lower-rez image.

So far all games are supporting the minimum 720 resolution but I'm not aware of any that provide a native 1080. In fact, there was an article a while back that PGR3 was outputting at a native resolution slightly under 720, so in other words the 360 was up-sampling the image to both 720 and 1080.

So does the resolution really matter that much? I've seen a 360 in stores and on a buddy's HD projector and the games look great, especially Gotham, whether it natively has a resolution of 720 or not.

BUT, next to a PS3 running at 1080, you'll surely be able to notice a difference. I can always tell when I'm watching CBS football which outputs at 1080, as opposed to FOX which outputs at 720.

The catch is this: if the PS3 is going to make claims about being true HD, can they back it up by keeping a consistent framerate at 1080, while also providing full screen anti-aliasing and intensive per-pixel effects?

And I guess more importantly, will anyone else other than a videophile such as myself notice? My wife can barely tell the difference between PS2 quality and XBOX, or even sometimes HDTV vs regular TV, and we have an HD set.

It's going to come down to games like it always does, so I think in leiu of stealing properties that are normally Sony-exclusive, MS is doing the right thing by sticking to their core competancy and providing a superior online experience for all of their titles. And Sony as usual will have its exclusive titles to sell their system.

My prediction in the console wars? A tie. Just my 2 cents.

[Borys]

So I guess I don't get what this guy is talking about.

Hype.

Downplaying competition.

It's Sony's favourite game and who can blame them?

[fitbabits]

I was counter-playing along. I guess that means I got a headshot! :p

But seriously, about that thunder, let's just return it to Zeus.
Ah, but I anticipated your counter and I countered that! So there! No returns. :)

Yes, let's give the thunder back to Zeus. Phil Harrison needs a rude awakening.

[Noiz]

"Value chain"

Seriously, did no-one else almost spray coffee over their keyboard at this awesome new marketing buzzphrase?

[bapenguin]

BUT, next to a PS3 running at 1080, you'll surely be able to notice a difference. I can always tell when I'm watching CBS football which outputs at 1080, as opposed to FOX which outputs at 720.


Please don't use fox's 720P implementation as your standard for measurement. Their 720p is garbage. Try to check out something on ABC rather that's broadcast in 720HD. Better yet check out DiscoveryHD or something like that.

The other factor here is the set's native resolution. In most cases a native 720p display looks best with 720p HD rather than 1080i stuff. And vice versa, a 1080i set looks better with 1080i stuff rather than 720p. Lots of factors here...it's not so cut and dry.

[saran_js]

1080p is true HD? So I've been lied to the past 4 or 5 years about what an HD television is?
Thank God for Sony, looking to help me out from the goodness of their heart.

Next thing they'll tell me is that unless a speaker system has 8 subwoofers it isn't true Surround Sound.

I hate marketing.

No. you have Dolby, THX and DTS telling you that and you need more than 8.

[fitbabits]

"Value chain"

Seriously, did no-one else almost spray coffee over their keyboard at this awesome new marketing buzzphrase?
I did! I'm also going to use it in every conversation from this point on!

Check out my new value chain ride.

[Reanimated]

Hype.

Downplaying competition.

It's Sony's favourite game and who can blame them?




Yeah I get it, but what is he hyping? Blu Ray? Because all of the games in development now have been confirmed 720p by various sources. So if the games are all 720p, is it Blu Ray & 1080p that makes this the the REAL HD device? Because, uh, my TV doesn't support 1080p, so I guess I'm screwed in this mythical TRUE HD era.

[Roc Ingersol]

Exactly - if Sony says that nothing below 1080p is 'real' High Defintion, I'd be suing me some Sony for selling 1080i 'HD' TVs.

I didn't need an xbox or PS2 to watch DVDs.
I won't need a 360 or PS3 to watch HD-DVD, Blu-Ray, or What's Behind Door #3.

Seriously - has no-one else noticed how laughable it is, for Sony to repeatedly assert that movie formats need console support? Rewrite history much?

[Noiz]

So far all games are supporting the minimum 720 resolution but I'm not aware of any that provide a native 1080.

Condemned supports 1080i natively. There may be more but that's the only one that I own that does (out of Condemned, Kameo and PGR3).

Edit: I just wanna say it again... Value chain. :D

[Mason]

1. No HD-DVD playback
2. Smaller disc capacity
3. Lower resolution

1. Nothing's free, buddy. A crappy first-gen HD-DVD player would've tacked a large sum onto the 360's price, for something that most people won't need for a long time (and they can get as a standalone unit for a lot cheaper when they do need it). Wait until we get PS3+accessory pricing and a figure of how much money Sony loses on each box before calling their BR drive a sweeping success.
2. See above.
3. No one actually has the 1080p sets though, and I haven't casually heard of any games supporting 1080p (please correct if there are recent announcements to the contrary). I'm sure they will down the road, but when the game developers see no point in supporting the format, hyping it as an advantage is disingenuous.

Everyone wants a generation to be a tie, as that's best for the consumer (so long as it is a tie with mostly multiplatform titles). And maybe Sony's just exercising great spannungsbogen and will hit hard in 2006. But pointing to a Sony-authored feature grid and saying that that's what will determine how the generation is won is really detached from the disquieting reality of their situation.

[Morratut]

Phil Harrison is such a idiot.

All of a sudden 1080p is the only resolution for HD. Errr fuck off Phil. Sony likes rewrite the rules don't they. God I hate Sony so fucking much now. I used to like Sony a lot.

[Suicidal ShiZuru]

Uh the 360 doesnt use a next gen optical drive/disc does it? Blue ray, HD dvd UberSuperVD?? Anyhting?? No? Then no its not true HD.

[Jacob Singer]

So far all games are supporting the minimum 720 resolution but I'm not aware of any that provide a native 1080. In fact, there was an article a while back that PGR3 was outputting at a native resolution slightly under 720, so in other words the 360 was up-sampling the image to both 720 and 1080.

Call of Duty 2 and Madden both support native 1080i. And I believe there are others as well.

[Noiz]

Uh the 360 doesnt use a next gen optical drive/disc does it? Blue ray, HD dvd UberSuperVD?? Anyhting?? No? Then no its not true HD.

You appear to be confusing High Definition and High Density. Apparently the two combined represent the best value chain, but you can have either independently of the other.

[Roc Ingersol]

Uh the 360 doesnt use a next gen optical drive/disc does it? Blue ray, HD dvd UberSuperVD?? Anyhting?? No? Then no its not true HD.
Neither use gigabit ethernet.
Clearly they're both worthless piles of low def crap.

[TrackZero]

"the display, the content and the hardware to play back that content"

I noticed how "the content" right away probably refers to the media.

In other words, they're trying to make blu-ray seem more important than it is.

Bah, I'm getting sick of this whole thing. Show me what you have Sony, or shut the hell up.

[Stormwatcher]

Shit, that stuff is dumb. And NO sound standard tells us we need 8 SUBWOOFERS. Maybe 8 speakers, but never 8 SUBWOOFERS!!! I've seen a speaker setup with 2 subwoofers, though.

[Stormeh]

Claiming that 1080p is the only "true" HD video mode is pretty ignorant. This is just more of Sony blowing their own horn. Sony's scared this generation, now that they have some real competition, and it's a shame to see them resort to such low tactics.

[Reanimated]

This "value chain" really sounds like a chain of Sony employees behind me fucking me in the ass.

Hey, buy our 30 dollar Blu Ray movies. Hey, buy our 5000 dollar 1080p HDTV. Hey, buy our 500 dollar (my guess) console with no hard drive. Hey, but guess what, all of our GAMES are still native 720p. Sorry about that. But HEY, this is a "true" HD GAMING machine!

Are they selling me a "true" HD GAMING console, or a fucking Blu Ray player? Because, honestly, I couldn't care less about fucking Blu Ray.

[reimomo]

This "value chain" really sounds like a chain of Sony employees behind me fucking me in the ass.

Wouldn't that be the "value train"? ZING!

[Reanimated]

Either way, it's a consumer meatsicle.

[CapnBob]

It's not HD until it's 2160p.

[phantomhitman]

Wouldn't that be the "value train"? ZING!

you forgot to add "woot woot" at the end for added internet effect!

[Reanimated]

It's not HD until it's 2160p.




Is it still gaming? :(

[Noiz]

I think that depends on how long the value chain is. Or maybe which station the value train is at. Woot woot. Toot toot. etc etc.

[thegameguru]

as others have said there are very few true 1080P sets on the market today.. sure eventually next year there will be more and more true 1080P sets available but they will still be fairly pricey for larger screens.

Hell...HDMI transmitters that support 1080P are just now arriving to market. Most of the rear projection DLP sets advertised as 1080P are actually not true 1920X1200 sets.. they use a technology called wobulation to "simulate" a 1080P image.

Most in fact will not even accept a true 1080P signal via their HDMI ports.. it simply wont work.

There are LCoS sets from Sony/JVC that will be true 1080P sets....eventually..and at $5K and up...and I'm sure eventually TI will have a true 1080P DLP chipset/wheel

But as others say..I'd be shocked if a significant number of Sony PS3 games support 1080P.. rather I would expect a few puzzle type games to be hyped as 1080P with the more graphically demanding games actually running at 720P..

Because no matter how pretty the game looks if you've got ass frame rates then people will bitch

[Hellstorm]

Revolution FTW!

[fitbabits]

Revolution FTW!
That was.... insightful! :)

[RMan]

Next thing they'll tell me is that unless a speaker system has 8 subwoofers it isn't true Surround Sound.
If it's not a 9 speaker system, then it sounds like crap. I'm not even sure it qualifies as music if it's coming through only 8 speakers. If you don’t buy the new 9 speaker system, well, you’re just not cool.

Seriously, what’s even worse than this nonsense that Sony is spewing is that many people will swallow it. The power of persuasion never ceases to amaze me.

[Reanimated]

You guys are fucking killing me.

So now I have to buy a 5000 dollar 1080p HDTV, a 500 dollar PS3, AND a 1000 dollar sound system to get into "next-gen" gaming?

I need a second job.

[wudi]

I'm guessing that the minute I try and plug a PS3 in with RCA connectors one of those batarang controllers will fly out of nowhere to bitch slap me for being so cheap, right? Looking forward to that...

I seem to care as much about "The HD era" as sony cares about "actual games" for the system that supposedly launces this spring. That whole value chain business, though? That's just damn infectious!

[Player 1]

Nintendo hype = good
Sony hype = bad
MS hype = redundant due to the product actually being out

The difference? The bias of the reader.

Hype is hype.

[bapenguin]

Man...now it's a tough call. The word of the day....is it wobulation or value train? :)

[fitbabits]

Man...now it's a tough call. The word of the day....is it wobulation or value train? :)
Wobulation? What the hell? :confused:

[The Iron Weasel]

Wobulation? What the hell? :confused:

Yeah, I'm joining fitbabits in the confusion.

Edit: For the record, my latest Samsung tv is way better then any Sony tv I've seen.

[Demo_Boy]

After playing 720p on X360 I can only call it HDef. Current analog sets don't compare.

[DropD98]

So I guess Phil thinks that it takes 1080p to be true high definition? Damn, looks like I need to take back my 51" Toshiba I just bought and wait for the 1080p sets to come out, right? hehe... I don't care what the guy says, I'll take my new HD set that does 1080i compared to my old 27" standard def television for my gaming pleasure...

Edit: besides, if I wanted "true" HD, I don't think I could afford it anyway... :(

[TRiLoGY]

Im just gonna use my pc monitor..

[Reanimated]

Im just gonna use my pc monitor..



lol, shit dude, my PC monitor doesn't even have resolution that high. :(

[t3g]

Until HD TVs are really cheap to the average consumer, I dont see this being too important until the PS4 or next Xbox.

[atariv8]

I just shot a commercial on super16 film and had it transfered to 1080P. We've done tests switching from a downcoverted 720P to the full 1080P on our non 1080P native Sony plasma monitors and you can' tell the difference. I would like to see the one and only native 1080P monitor next to a similar size 720P monitor with a 1080P game out of the PS3 and see how much of a difference there is. I'll go for more geometry and frame rate than HD size anyday...

Now 1080i up against 1080P or 720P would show a difference because of the interlacing and probably look more jagged.

[Stormwatcher]

Value chain is actually an old Marketing term, which, strangely enough, means something.
Wobulator, OTOH, is precious.

[bapenguin]

Wobulation? What the hell? :confused:

Hell...HDMI transmitters that support 1080P are just now arriving to market. Most of the rear projection DLP sets advertised as 1080P are actually not true 1920X1200 sets.. they use a technology called wobulation to "simulate" a 1080P image.

See....wobulation. :)

[Bumbuliuz]

Sony are such dicks :)

[fitbabits]

Wobulation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wobulation)

[Ozymandias]

The problem with 1080p is it's so late to the game. There have been an enormous amount of HDTV sales this year....and maybe 1% of those sales were 1080p sets. Now....I don't know about you...but most people aren't going to be buying a new HDTV set in 4 or 5 years. Hell...1080p is hardly on the map for this coming year with only a handful of sets and projectors set to support it...and that's only in the high end market.

People thought Microsoft was nuts with their target market of HDTV owners. Now take 1% (that's probably generous) of that market and that's what Sony's "true" HDTV userbase is.

While I agree with the above, I'd add that the greater issue with 1080p is that games simply won't target it. Publishers have to target across multiple platforms, and it's simply much, much easier for them to have a consistent target across the board... for this generation, it'll be 720p. In addition, 720p is the sweet spot for performance... some games may stretch to hit 1080i (and maybe even a couple of Sony 1st parties will try to have a 1080p mode), but they simply won't be able to do as much visually.

This is one of the reasons you see Sony/Microsoft battling for exclusives - including time-exclusives, where the game will come out on their platform first. Both have realized that consumers won't see much difference, and they're likely to buy the game for whatever platform they currently own (and not feel as though they need to seek out another).

[MosBen]

I'm still not convinced that either BluRay or HD DVD are actually going to succeed as formats, so the idea of the HD Era not beginning until the lauch of a platform that I see as having questionable chances of success is a little laughable. Trying to upstage MS's HD Era marketing campaign just seems a little silly to me. It seems to me that it's much more effective to grant them the honor of being first in the HD Era and then simply claim that you are entering the Era doing things better. Oh well, as has been said, we really haven't heard anything out of Sony other than trash talk while MS has released a function console with some very pretty games.

[Achilles]

Or how about that not even this years sony 1080p tv's actually accept a 1080p signal. Fantastic.Well the only thing that will display a 1080p signal right now is a PC, and you need a DVI to HDMI connection to hook it up to the TV, but if you do that I’m pretty damn sure it will accept a 1080p signal, I haven’t gotten the cable yet to hook it up though so I haven’t verified that, but it’s what the manual says. The maximum output of a VGA cable is 720p, or 1080 in 4:3, keep in mind, and it’ll display both through its VGA-in.

It would have been stupid to put an HD-DVD player in the 360 given the fact that there aren’t any HD-DVDs yet, and they don’t yet know which the standard format will be. MS can’t control the value chain after all. Value chain… yeah.

[Double T]

Hmm, I would have guessed the COD2 was 1080i and Perfect Dark was 720p, but apparently it's the other way around

http://www.xbox.com/en-US/games/p/perfectdarkzero/
http://www.xbox.com/en-US/games/c/callofduty2/

That's funny since PDZ looks graphically inferior and less clear.

But this is interesting

http://www.xbox.com/en-US/games/p/perfectdarkzerolimitededition/

now it's 720p...

What about this?

http://www.xbox.com/en-US/games/n/nba2k6xbox360/

480p? I thought all Xbox games had to be 720p...

I can't find any other 1080i games yet. I wonder if those games that are 720p will look better if I set the Xbox to only output at 720 rather than upscaling.

After some more digging, it appears all of the simple games are 1080i. Most Live Arcade games are 1080i and PDZ being not a graphical powerhouse is also a 1080i game. Everything else seems to be 720p.

[crashedout]

Actually there is a Mitsu DLP that has a dedicated 1080p connection, and the HP DLP's accept 1080p...but you are right the only source at this point are PC's. That may change at CES though. My point was that the company that is pushing 1080p has no way to display it, yet.

[GrinR]

I'll be happy if I can get my god damn hands on ANYTHING that runs on my HDTV.

Who cares what resolution the console puts out if I can't buy the fucking thing.

[bapenguin]

Interesting Double T...I know for a fact NBA supports 720P. I'll have to look at the box but I imagine it's a misprint on the site.

[Schnoogs]

I have a 23" panel that does 1080p and I'm getting the soon to be released Dell 30" that does 1080p.

I'm set!! ;)

[Bane]

This is so funny!! Sony doesn't even have a TV that supports native 1080P input. They have one that upconverts 720P or 1080I input to 1080P, but not one set of theirs can take a 1080P signal direct into any of the inputs. Currently there are very few companies that have sets that will take a 1080P input, in fact the only company i can think of sells a $10000 set, Brillian. Most sets that say they are 1080P do not take a native 1080 input, ask the manufacturer of your set.

So I fail to see how they have the complete package.

[Achilles]

This is so funny!! Sony doesn't even have a TV that supports native 1080P input. They have one that upconverts 720P or 1080I input to 1080P, but not one set of theirs can take a 1080P signal direct into any of the inputs. Currently there are very few companies that have sets that will take a 1080P input, in fact the only company i can think of sells a $10000 set, Brillian. Most sets that say they are 1080P do not take a native 1080 input, ask the manufacturer of your set.

So I fail to see how they have the complete package.This is what Crashedout was saying as well. Are you guys sure their SXRD (http://www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/eCS/Store/en/-/USD/SY_DisplayProductInformation-Start;sid=AYyla8bHQOelBYVYNpKvYInXShaTB6yDIMg=?Cat egoryName=&ProductSKU=KDSR50XBR1&TabName=specs&var2=) sets don't accept a native 1080p resolution, because it'll display a PC set at that according to the manual.

[RMan]

Hehe, besides the lack of support for this HHD (higher high def) resolution Sony's pushing, it's pretty much the exact Revolution vs. 360 resolution debate all over again. I knew I'd see the same debate roll around eventually, but I didn't think I'd see it this generation.

[Reanimated]

Hehe, besides the lack of support for this HHD (higher high def) resolution Sony's pushing, it's pretty much the exact Revolution vs. 360 resolution debate all over again. I knew I'd see the same debate roll around eventually, but I didn't think I'd see it this generation.




Dude, the difference between 480p and 1080i IS NOT the same as the difference between 1080i and 1080p.

480p isn't even an HD resolution. It's ED.

[Syrinx]

This is what Crashedout was saying as well. Are you guys sure their SXRD (http://www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/eCS/Store/en/-/USD/SY_DisplayProductInformation-Start;sid=AYyla8bHQOelBYVYNpKvYInXShaTB6yDIMg=?Cat egoryName=&ProductSKU=KDSR50XBR1&TabName=specs&var2=) sets don't accept a native 1080p resolution, because it'll display a PC set at that according to the manual.

Most TVs that I've seen support 1080p will only do it through the VGA input.

[Schnoogs]

Most TVs that I've seen support 1080p will only do it through the VGA input.

Or DVI or HDMI.

My 23" Apple supports DVI and does 1920x1200.

[Bane]

This is what Crashedout was saying as well. Are you guys sure their SXRD (http://www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/eCS/Store/en/-/USD/SY_DisplayProductInformation-Start;sid=AYyla8bHQOelBYVYNpKvYInXShaTB6yDIMg=?Cat egoryName=&ProductSKU=KDSR50XBR1&TabName=specs&var2=) sets don't accept a native 1080p resolution, because it'll display a PC set at that according to the manual.

Quite certain. Many people over on avsforum.com have the SXRD and have tested it with every resolution. 1080P input is not supported. Many of us from the avsforum have been waitng to purchase new sets until a set came out that could support a native 1080P input, as we hope to be able to use home theater PCs at that resolution.

[RMan]

Dude, the difference between 480p and 1080i IS NOT the same as the difference between 1080i and 1080p.
If you actually read my post it'll make more sense. The difference between 480 and 720 (which is what we expect most 360 games to be, and the resolution we were talking about with HD before Sony's attempt to redefine it), and 720 and 1080 is pretty much the same ratio.

[Syrinx]

Or DVI or HDMI.

My 23" Apple supports DVI and does 1920x1200.

Computer monitors might, but I'm not aware of any TVs that accept 1080p over HDMI and certainly not over DVI (at this point).

[Zeal]

As much as I hate Sony, what he said is actually true.

But, it is going to be a long ass time before 1080p becomes standard and affordable on TVs, so it's pretty worthless.

[bapenguin]

As much as I hate Sony, what he said is actually true.

But, it is going to be a long ass time before 1080p becomes standard and affordable on TVs, so it's pretty worthless.

Fuck...we might as well go straight to UHDTV (http://www.cinematography.net/Pages%20DW/UltraHighDefinition-UHDTV.htm). Fucking 7680P. Now that's the future. :)

[aversion2k]

The High Definition Era Started with pc

[JazGalaxy]

Give me your opinion on this, guys...

Isn't it a little silly for Sony to be advertising the PS3 to look better than it ever will for customers? I mean, if they're playing these 1080 kiosks and take a game home only to find that it doesn't look anything LIKE that on their standard tv's, won't they be upset?

Or will it be the same as with the PS1's photoshopped screenshots that they used throughout the life of the system where people just don't care that hte games don't actually look like that?

[Chalex]

Neither use gigabit ethernet.
Clearly they're both worthless piles of low def crap.


Communication
Ethernet (10BASE-T, 100BASE-TX, 1000BASE-T ) x 3 (input x 1 + output x 2)
Wi-Fi IEEE 802.11 b/g
Bluetooth 2.0

http://ps3.ign.com/articles/614/614682p1.html

[Sl1pstream]

Give me your opinion on this, guys...

Isn't it a little silly for Sony to be advertising the PS3 to look better than it ever will for customers? I mean, if they're playing these 1080 kiosks and take a game home only to find that it doesn't look anything LIKE that on their standard tv's, won't they be upset?

Or will it be the same as with the PS1's photoshopped screenshots that they used throughout the life of the system where people just don't care that hte games don't actually look like that?

Most people won't even know the difference between 1080p en 720p or won't notice the difference because the images get downscaled on their HD or analog tv. Besides, it's Sony, the mainstream won't say a thing, just as long as their games look better than this generation.

[bobbler]

Give me your opinion on this, guys...

Isn't it a little silly for Sony to be advertising the PS3 to look better than it ever will for customers? I mean, if they're playing these 1080 kiosks and take a game home only to find that it doesn't look anything LIKE that on their standard tv's, won't they be upset?

Isn't that exactly the same situation the Xbox360 is in for the vast majority of buyers...? Considering most people don't have any sort of HDTV at all, I don't really understand the logic in being selective in your questioning. The term "ever" is also a rather poor choice.

[Heretic Machine]

"As you well know," he continued, "the Xbox 360 doesn't play high definition movies and doesn't have true HD functionality - PlayStation 3 is the only format that has 1080-progressive, which is the true definition of HD, so it's really premature to be talking about the HD era."

Someone want to get this man a technical dictionary, he obviously doesn't know that 720p is considered HD.

[rjcombo]

I'm guessing that the minute I try and plug a PS3 in with RCA connectors one of those batarang controllers will fly out of nowhere to bitch slap me for being so cheap, right? Looking forward to that...
LMAO!

Yep, Sony's laying it on thick now. They have to realize software, a department Microsoft is clearly making forward progress in, will ultimately determine the success of the hardware. Sony had the advantage this generation in game library size, breadth, and exclusives, but it appears that won't be as much of a factor for next-gen. The 360 has a 6-month headstart, is much easier to develop for, sports a superior online service and community, and is receiving increased publisher support. Sounds to me like Sony is reaching for rhetoric in the face of those facts.

[Schnoogs]

Computer monitors might, but I'm not aware of any TVs that accept 1080p over HDMI and certainly not over DVI (at this point).

Not true...1080p DLP is already on the market...Mitsubishi has one for example...used HDMI.

Don't forget about front and rear projectors guys...1080p is already on the market and they take HDMI and DVI as input.

DLP baby!!!

[Syrinx]

Not true...1080p DLP is already on the market...Mitsubishi has one for example...used HDMI.

Don't forget about front and rear projectors guys...1080p is already on the market and they take HDMI and DVI as input.

DLP baby!!!

Ahh didn't think about projectors. Wasn't aware of that. Thanks! I will agree that DLP is nice :) Enjoying mine right now as I type this.

[bone_matrix]

Hmm, I would have guessed the COD2 was 1080i and Perfect Dark was 720p, but apparently it's the other way around

http://www.xbox.com/en-US/games/p/perfectdarkzero/
http://www.xbox.com/en-US/games/c/callofduty2/

That's funny since PDZ looks graphically inferior and less clear.

But this is interesting

http://www.xbox.com/en-US/games/p/perfectdarkzerolimitededition/

now it's 720p...

What about this?

http://www.xbox.com/en-US/games/n/nba2k6xbox360/

480p? I thought all Xbox games had to be 720p...

I can't find any other 1080i games yet. I wonder if those games that are 720p will look better if I set the Xbox to only output at 720 rather than upscaling.

After some more digging, it appears all of the simple games are 1080i. Most Live Arcade games are 1080i and PDZ being not a graphical powerhouse is also a 1080i game. Everything else seems to be 720p.

On the back of the Call of Duty 2 box it says HDTV 480p/720p/1080i, Kameo, PGR3, and PD0 only say HDTV 720p, so I don't know what is going on with the website. just some info.

As far as this Sony stuff, I just bought a Panasonic HDTV, 26" widescreen. It doesn't support 720p (thought it did, but read it wrong) but does do 480p and 1080i. Everything (well, the 4 games I listed) look great on it, even though they don't all do 1080i natively (is that what I shoudl call it?)

There is no way I will be able to afford a newer tv with 1080p in the future, and I guess that makes me a loser for not being in the "true" HD era. I just hope they fix the batarang. Yes, I haven't touched it. Yes, it looks like it feels like ass. Yes, its time for a change, hell, at least refine it like the 360 is a refined controller S.

[JazGalaxy]

Isn't that exactly the same situation the Xbox360 is in for the vast majority of buyers...? Considering most people don't have any sort of HDTV at all, I don't really understand the logic in being selective in your questioning. The term "ever" is also a rather poor choice.

It's not the same as with the X360, because people hwo have a standard TV understand that their standard TV is not an HD TV. If they go buy an HD TV, they will achieve graphics that are the same as Microsoft advertises. With this "real HD is only 1080!" bit.. and nobody having, and likely to have that setup in their home, Sony would be displaying "HD" graphics that most "HD" owners would not be able to achieve. That is far more confusing than just the "you have it or you don't" mentality.

"No sir... your graphics don't look like this becuase you don't have HD"

"I bought an HD TV"

"We... it's not the right kind of HD"

"So what IS the right kind of HD?"

"The one you'll never afford. Sorry about that."

[TheBrainKills]

Sony is such a joke. So my HDTV labelled TV is not true HD? My HDTV satellite receiver is not true HD, which by the way already displays movies in Hi def. And all those networks that transmit in HD, they aren't just because they don't do it at 1080p? I'm so confused. What loonie bin did this guy escape from. And where do I catch this Value train?

[Royal Fool]

I, for one, can't wait to buy a PS3 and play all those amazing next-generation games with innovative and refined gameplay in 1080p resolution on my $10.000 HDTV.

And when I grow weary of the truly next-gen gameplay and mind-boggling graphics, I can just log on to Sony's central movie servers and download movies to watch through distributed computing, thanks to the Cell technology. And the movies will all be automatically converted to high-definition standards thanks to Sony's groundbreaking enhancement technology that makes my movies age like fine wine.

Can't you see? PlayStation 3 is the future! MICRO$OFT IS TEH GHEY LOLZ! NINTANDO IS KIDDY CRAP!

[The Iron Weasel]

I have a samsung DLP but its one of the first gens so it cant do 1080p.

[Roc Ingersol]

Communication
Ethernet (10BASE-T, 100BASE-TX, 1000BASE-T ) x 3 (input x 1 + output x 2)
Wi-Fi IEEE 802.11 b/g
Bluetooth 2.0

http://ps3.ign.com/articles/614/614682p1.html
if it's still listing 3 ethernet jacks, I think you may want to hold off a bit...

*you do get a cookie for completely missing the point though.