Jade Empire Sequel Confirmed

[earthworm48]

From Gamespot.com (www.gamespot.com) and here is the link. (http://www.gamespot.com/news/6139680.html)

"BioWare definitely plans to continue the Jade Empire franchise," reads one of Muzyka's responses. "The Jade team did a great job with the first game in that series; we have great teams working on all of our games here. We've also said in the past that we're working on not just one, but two Xbox 360 titles. Enough said ; )"
I didn't really enjoy the first a great deal, but its Bioware so I'm allowing myself some hope!

[The Iron Weasel]

So...Mass Effect and JE2 are in the mix right now?

[Mason]

"It's Bioware" has lost most of its meaning. I tried really hard to like Jade Empire, and yet it defeated me with its mediocrity.

Enough with the freaking good-evil moral continuum RPGs. Let it die. It made total sense in the Star Wars universe, but it is pointless outside of it. When games like Oblivion are evolving morality as a relative and complex social construct, the old good-option bad-option mechanics are clearly outdated.

[The Iron Weasel]

I enjoyed Jade Empire, sure its combat was about the furthest thing from deep. But the dialogue, and story were awesome. Heres hoping that they go back to making stuff like KoToR, NwN, and most importantly BG2.

[jacob.armitage]

i really enjoyed Jade Empire, i think mostly just from the original setting.

[The Iron Weasel]

I thought the game was fun, pure and simple. KoToR was better, but as I understand this was soposed to help people who typically don't like RPGs, to try it, it was way more accessable. I'm hoping that Bioware makes KoToR3 and its just rocks everyone socks! Heres hoping that Mass Effect will be the next comming of KoToR.

[Leaving Hope]

So...Mass Effect and JE2 are in the mix right now?

And Dragon Age, but I assume you're talking about console games.

[The Iron Weasel]

Yeah, I ment for X360. I keep forgeting Dragon Age is in development because they NEVER SAY ANYTHING ABOUT IT!

[Kelegacy]

"It's Bioware" has lost most of its meaning. I tried really hard to like Jade Empire, and yet it defeated me with its mediocrity.

Thanks for saying it for me, so I need not to.

The last game I truly enjoyed from Bioware was BG2. No, maybe NWN. Bioware used to be my favorite RPG developer (after Baldur's Gate, how can you NOT love them?) but in the past couple years they took a great big dump on my steak.

I think my disdain stems from their rabid focus on the consoles, and the progressive nosedive with game quality and content. 2 complete games for the Xbox, none for PC in that same span (not counting the KotoR "port" or NWN modules).

[AspectVoid]

The problem is that people look at Jade Empire and immeadiately try to compare it to Baldur's Gate. That's stupid since they're two different styles of games. Jade Empire is an action RPG in the vein of BG: Dark Alliance, Champions of Norath, and the like. Looking at it in the proper subgroup, Jade Empire is the best Action-RPG I have ever played. No other game is even semi-close.

Finally, I have no problems with Bioware making console RPGs. Why? Because the sales of those console RPGs will allow Bioware to take their time and make killer PC RPGs. Now, if Dragon Age bombs, then I'll have problems with it. Until then though, I'm fine.

[Captain Awesome]

Loved JE, hopefully they learned from this first release and make it even better in the sequel.

[Kelegacy]

Finally, I have no problems with Bioware making console RPGs. Why? Because the sales of those console RPGs will allow Bioware to take their time and make killer PC RPGs.

Now, do you honestly believe that? If Bioware has immense success in the console biz, you think they'll return to the PC with greater force?

I have no problems with them making console RPGs. Just stop adding water.

[Cubfan]

I thought KOTOR was great, and I've played the BG games and enjoyed them as well. I don't see the huge disparity in quality. They're two distinct games, they differ in style of play, combat, presentation, etc., PC or console, makes no difference to me, I just wanna play good games.

[Phades]

I really think Jade Empire is a great game. Sorry if it didn't turn out how you think it should. It wasn't trying to be another Baldur's Gate 2. They're very different games. Might as well criticize Blizzard because you don't like World of Warcraft as much as you enjoyed Warcraft 3.

[mister_slim]

I like Bioware, but I'd like to see them do something more interesting. A little pollution from Pandemic could produce some much more interesting games.
The problem is that people look at Jade Empire and immeadiately try to compare it to Baldur's Gate. That's stupid since they're two different styles of games. Jade Empire is an action RPG in the vein of BG: Dark Alliance, Champions of Norath, and the like. Looking at it in the proper subgroup, Jade Empire is the best Action-RPG I have ever played. No other game is even semi-close.
And if we move the goalposts a little further Super Mario Brothers 3 is the Greatest Action RPG I Have Ever Played.

[Spigot]

I enjoyed Jade Empire, sure its combat was about the furthest thing from deep. But the dialogue, and story were awesome. Heres hoping that they go back to making stuff like KoToR, NwN, and most importantly BG2.

I'm assuming you mean Baldur's Gate 3, what with Baldur's Gate 2 having been out for a few years now...

[wait, I just reread your comment and I see what you mean... but I'm too tired to find my backspace key...]

That said, I loved Jade Empire. The characters and dialogue were hilarious. I also really enjoyed the setting because it was something you really haven't seen much in games. It was almost familiar but also very exotic. I'd play the sequel.

[MaiXu]

I didn't really enjoy the first a great deal, but its Bioware so I'm allowing myself some hope!

Gotta agree with you here. The first one was sub-par for me, in many ways. For one, the great and complex interaction of team mates that I *loved* from KotOR was virtually absent. Just something about them not running around with you ...

And for all the graphical flourishes in Jade Empire, the game still felt like a thinly-veiled dungeon crawler with bloom lighting. At least in KotOR I felt like I was in a highly-structured environment ... but when I can't explore a cave beyond the beaten path like I can in Zelda, in a game that trys to emulate a lot of Zelda's action-adventure feel, well ...

Anyway, here's hoping Bioware can really make the sequel shine. Because if not, it's a lot of wasted energy into making a new franchise.

[TrackZero]

I liked Jade Empire. My BIG beef with it was just the loading times. If they can address that shit, then it should be enjoyable.

[TrackZero]

Gotta agree with you here. The first one was sub-par for me, in many ways. For one, the great and complex interaction of team mates that I *loved* from KotOR was virtually absent. Just something about them not running around with you ...

And for all the graphical flourishes in Jade Empire, the game still felt like a thinly-veiled dungeon crawler with bloom lighting. At least in KotOR I felt like I was in a highly-structured environment ... but when I can't explore a cave beyond the beaten path like I can in Zelda, in a game that trys to emulate a lot of Zelda's action-adventure feel, well ...

Anyway, here's hoping Bioware can really make the sequel shine. Because if not, it's a lot of wasted energy into making a new franchise.

JE tried to emulate Zelda's action-adventure??? Are we talking about the same game? I'd never have made that comparison if you gave me 100 guesses at what game you were thinking of.

[The Iron Weasel]

Yeah, I agree with TrackZero, theres no way in hell, that Jade Empire was trying to be like zelda.

[Zeal]

Can't wait for this. The first game was incredible.

[Deadend]

Jade Empire just needs some expanding.

More cities, more styles (that are worth it, most in JE1 were interchangable). Possibly add in some physics.
Whoever said the Good/Evil system is old is damn right. Jade Empire should modify the closed/open thing into codes, and still havee the good/evil. Or something where following the laws is not the right thing to do. Complex moral situations are fun!

JE2 also needs more comments from the followers, and maybe multiple followers at once. Puzzles would be nice to have too... maybe some more dungeons and diffrent towns, as JE1 was basically 2 towns. Or better focus, as the Imperial City would make a good setting, if it was much larger. I hate to say it like this but... kung-fu-grip grand-theft-horse. You adventure around the Imperial City using your martial arts skills and wits. The game also needs a scene where you run away, but use awesome kung-fu skills to have amazing set-piece events (Go watch either chase in Ong-Bak).

[AspectVoid]

And if we move the goalposts a little further Super Mario Brothers 3 is the Greatest Action RPG I Have Ever Played.

Then, keeping that goalpost still out a bit, Joust is the greatest RPG I've ever played, period. The birds, the knightly honor of defeating my opponent in an honorable duel, that game had it all.
/sarcasm

Look, everyone here knows what the standard definitions for the various game genre's are. You don't look cool or funny saying stuff like that. You look like an idiot.

[Apex]

The story of Jade Empire was pretty good. But the game play was a step back. There I Was, excited that I just gained the Dragon fly an that it was going to be the same as in Kotor (being able to use it to fly from place to place) and visit different locations and ... no, didnt happen.

I was disappointed with Jade Empire personally. And the combat sucked. All you need to do was master switching between 3 styles and you've beaten the game more or less unless you were fighting demons.

[Royal Fool]

Look, everyone here knows what the standard definitions for the various game genre's are. You don't look cool or funny saying stuff like that. You look like an idiot.

But it seems that journalists (And even Bioware itself) would rather look at Jade Empire as a standard RPG. That's just plain wrong.

[sanitystream]

Bioware's focus on consoles does not surprise me in the least.

Not too long ago I spoke with someone who worked at Obsidian, and they said KOTOR 2 sold 80% on the Xbox, and only 20% on the PC.

So why would a developer devote resources to the PC when it's such a lop-sided market share?

Plus, now with the Xbox 360 you can guarantee that every player will enjoy ALL the graphical goodness a developer puts into a game, as opposed to a scaling system on the PC where only those with $500 graphic cards get the HDR lighting, and the rest of us are stuck at 800x600 struggling to get good frame rates.

As for Bioware's style -- I love 'em! They make the deepest, most entertaining games around right now with dialogue that doesn't sound like they wrote it up at the last minute on a napkin in the employee break room.

[Mason]

Ugh, fine, make me dissect it.

Action: JE was boring as hell when it came to action. You could approach each fight with the same strategy. The game made Fable's combat seem deep and complex in comparison. And the game engine wasn't up for the challenge, so the shallow combat was also jerky and unpolished.

RPG (Character System): The character system was also, sadly, shallow. Power up a couple attacks, upgrade your weapon whenever the plot lets you, and you've basically maxed yourself out. And the jewels and whatnot were supposed to make you specialize your character, but there's no real need. And there's very little sensation of character growth, since you play basically the same at the end of the game as you do at the beginning. Anything interesting about the character system was streamlined away a long time ago.

RPG (NPC System): As I mentioned above, it's the exact same goddamn good-evil system that's been humped to death in console RPGs. Do you want to return the stolen money or keep it for yourself? I invest myself heavily in this binary decision.

Really, it is time to move on. There are so many more things that one could do with an explicit morality system than simple good/bad. There are many distinct moral philosophies that could be represented. But then the future of RPGs probably lies in losing the explicit morality system altogether and simply having an AI-driven world of consequences for one's actions.

JE has a crappy, lightweight system for both action and all aspects of RPG play. This makes it a bad action RPG. KOTOR could get away with its so-so action system, since its RPG system was pretty solid for its setting. But that was 2 years ago.

Quibble about genres all you want, there's no aspect of JE's gameplay that is strong.

[Kelegacy]

Can't wait for this. The first game was incredible.

You're all over the place. Sometimes I think we have things in common in regards to games we enjoy, but then you go and say something like that. Good game, nothing more. But that's my opinion, and you know what they say about those.

Jade Empire just needs some expanding.

More cities, more styles (that are worth it, most in JE1 were interchangable). Possibly add in some physics.
Whoever said the Good/Evil system is old is damn right. Jade Empire should modify the closed/open thing into codes, and still havee the good/evil. Or something where following the laws is not the right thing to do. Complex moral situations are fun!

How about a bigger, interactive world to explore. Being confined really pisses me off. Radiata Stories was the last game that did that shit. JRPGs are confining in terms of linearity, but the game worlds are so big that you can go many places on an overland map. JE just felt constricted.

Oh, and while we're talking about things JE2 needs, why not a better fighting engine. The first one gave me syphillis.

Bioware's focus on consoles does not surprise me in the least.

Not too long ago I spoke with someone who worked at Obsidian, and they said KOTOR 2 sold 80% on the Xbox, and only 20% on the PC.

So why would a developer devote resources to the PC when it's such a lop-sided market share?

Plus, now with the Xbox 360 you can guarantee that every player will enjoy ALL the graphical goodness a developer puts into a game, as opposed to a scaling system on the PC where only those with $500 graphic cards get the HDR lighting, and the rest of us are stuck at 800x600 struggling to get good frame rates.

As for Bioware's style -- I love 'em! They make the deepest, most entertaining games around right now with dialogue that doesn't sound like they wrote it up at the last minute on a napkin in the employee break room.

Deep games from Bioware are becoming a thing of the past. Dialogue is good because there is no need for localization because the developers speak English. Much in JRPGs gets lost in translation. I also have no problem with console RPGs from Bioware. They could switch directly to the consoles and I wouldn't care. But here's the rub: their console RPGs have been diluted in too much solution. It might not be fair to compare their console RPGs to their PC creations, but you cannot escape your past, not when you start out that strong. You should always aim to top yourself, not relax and grow comfortable. Bioware is like a guy I knew in high school that went to college a brainiac and uber athlete with tremendous academic accomplishments under his belt, but winded up drinking too much, sleeping in and missing classes, and losing his scholarships. I think he pumps my gas now.

What I'm saying is, if they want to create console RPGs, why cant they try to rival their original material in terms of quality, content, and sheer brilliance that was so prevalent on the PC?

Look, everyone here knows what the standard definitions for the various game genre's are. You don't look cool or funny saying stuff like that. You look like an idiot.

I actually think mister_slim's posts are quite jocular and enjoyable. But then again, I admire wit and panache, so I'm predisposed to impartiality.

[omnithrope]

I, for one, am happy.

[mister_slim]

Look, everyone here knows what the standard definitions for the various game genre's are. You don't look cool or funny saying stuff like that. You look like an idiot.
Well, Tales of Symphonia had far more interesting combat and better written characters. Hell, FFX-2's combat was more interesting.

Most of the games you mentioned are more hack 'n slash dungeon crawlers than actual RPGs. So your self-serving definition doesn't stand up very well.

[51|RandoM]

Bioware's focus on consoles does not surprise me in the least.

Not too long ago I spoke with someone who worked at Obsidian, and they said KOTOR 2 sold 80% on the Xbox, and only 20% on the PC.

So why would a developer devote resources to the PC when it's such a lop-sided market share?



I think you're making the wrong conclusion. The reason KOTOR 2 did so much better on console than on PC is because it is targeted at console gamers, quite frankly.

KOTOR and Jade Empire are fairly simple action games, and that is console bread and butter. Before you jump all over me about this, realize I'm making no judgement on the "quality" of these games. I'm just saying they're not what any longtime pc gamer would consider a real RPG.

If Kotor2 had just happened to be Baldur's Gate 3, I think the figures would've been quite a bit different, don't you? I'm sort of kidding myself with this one, as games of that complexity don't even exist on consoles.

Take a look at AAA games that are actually built with the PC in mind, and you'll see that the numbers are there. Blizzard and Valve seem to know that, don't you think?

[Frogleg Special]

KOTOR has a 4-6 months exclusivity in the Xbox. I don't think we have a fair competition here where people are forced to buy the Xbox version if they want to play it early. If both came at the same time we could look at 60%-40% instead of 80-20. An added bonus of console interface (big icons and menu) and a very mainstream subject (Star Wars) help to sell on the consoles anyway. Sell Planescape Torment in both platforms, you'd see a turnaround.

[Beelzebud]

We've all been letting Bioware get away with a lot recently, IMO.

When are they going to get back to making in-depth PC RPG'S, if ever?

[earthworm48]

The gameplay of KOTOR and BG is basically the same. You move around and pick your spells/attacks and talk to people. There was just more in BG as they could get away with 2D and tons of non-spoken dialogue. Theres less dialogue in KOTOR as they wanted it to be spoken, and there isn't as much due to the increased cost and time they spent working in 3D.

[Wonka]

Thats a good point. A better comparison would probably be Morrowind. Morrowind was made with PCs in mind and ran like utter crap on Xbox (a real slideshow). Morrowind came out on PCs 1st. Then shortly after it finally released on Xbox I saw an interview with one for the Bethseda guys where they said how surprised they were about how much better the game was selling on the Xbox than it had sold on the PC. The fact of the matter is that consoles have just got a TREMENDOUS installed base of people who want to buy games. PC games will always be made because there are enough people who like to game on them to make money, but consoles are likely to remain the choice of the masses... Bethseda realized after their last game that people on consoles DO in fact want a more complex type of RPG, and so they have made the next Morrowind game for both platforms at the same time (accomodating both this time instead of favoring one platform over the other). For my part I am glad that Bethseda is making wise business decisions. I like their games and I would like for them to stay employed.

But I don't think that you can really argue about whether console games or equivalent PC games can sell more. Unless the game type has not been successfully translated to consoles (like RTS games) it should really sell better on a console based on pure numbers.

[The Iron Weasel]

Well in fairness, the game ran like utter crap on pc when it came out.

[Spigot]

I think that you also have to realize that developing for a console is a lot easier than developing for PC's because you have a standard set of hardware that you have to code for. If you're developing a big game like Oblivion and can focus your resources on one particular set of hardware as opposed to the myriad options presented by the PC community, why wouldn't you focus on the console community first?

Thankfully PC's are still very good at what they do and developers haven't abandoned them. I still think that eventually consoles and PC's will have merged into something that is neither one or the other (think of an upgradable console or a PC that only uses standardized hardware). This will allow developers to focus on making ONE version of a game (or at least only having to focus on 2-3 different sets of hardware as opposed to zillions).

Of course, this is probably something that will happen YEARS down the road. This new generation of game consoles is probably showing us that it is close at hand, but they said the same thing of this past generation with all of the multiuse functions of the PS2 and Xbox.

[DigiWiz]

Awesome, a Jade sequel. I tremendously enjoyed the game, but I can see why someone who expected it to be another KotOR or BG would be angry about it. It's not easy to realize that you get Action-RPG when there is Action-RPG on the box :p


Deep games from Bioware are becoming a thing of the past. Dialogue is good because there is no need for localization because the developers speak English. Much in JRPGs gets lost in translation. I also have no problem with console RPGs from Bioware. They could switch directly to the consoles and I wouldn't care.


You care ...

I think my disdain stems from their rabid focus on the consoles, and the progressive nosedive with game quality and content. 2 complete games for the Xbox, none for PC in that same span (not counting the KotoR "port" or NWN modules).

[Kelegacy]

You care ...

No, if the same quality that their past PC games have had were transferred to the consoles--even if the company went strictly console and not PC--I'd be fine. The console games, while fun in their own right, pale in comparison to the PC games created prior to the console shift. That's what I care about: finding extremely deep and intriguing games on the console that the PC once had.

I have faced facts: the consoles are far cheaper, have more games, are getting better at integrating online play, and dont require upgrading (yet). If games were only for the consoles, I'd be fine with it. We've seen with games like Morrowind that the consoles can attempt and mostly handle PC-type games. Now, if a game came out like Baldur's Gate, deep, rich, engrossing, and filled with gameplay and content, and was for developed for the consoles, I'd be ecstatic. The switch to 3D has made more emphasis on looks and action instead of actual RPGing. I'd still be happy with the Infinity Engine, with the static camera, 2D graphics, and prerendered backgrounds, but most people care only about how a game looks. If it doesn't pass the eye candy test, the rest is worthless. Give me an immensely ugly game anyday, if it plays awesome.

[DigiWiz]

I'd still be happy with the Infinity Engine, with the static camera, 2D graphics, and prerendered backgrounds, but most people care only about how a game looks. If it doesn't pass the eye candy test, the rest is worthless. Give me an immensely ugly game anyday, if it plays awesome.

But that's you, the majority of users think differently, and for some reason you are disgruntled about a company doing the right thing - making games that sell to more people. The market demands 3D, an infinity engine game would get bashed to the ground by reviewers - not much one can do about it.

Look at it this way - if they made just PC games, they'd be gone by now, like Troika, like Looking Glass, like Ion Storm (the good one).

This way we will at least get a shot at their next game - Dragon Age, which seems to shape up pretty decent (read: huge) if you follow the forum posts.

[earthworm48]

A) I believe ALL of Ion Storm went. The first to go was the Daikatana studio I believe (Dallas?) and then the other did after DE:IW and T3 (Austin?). My memory is a little fuzzy.

B) I think lots of RPG fans would put up with the infinity engine, but its time has past. There has to be evolution in the games for them to compete, as has been said. I wonder if there should have been a few more of those RPGs until 3D was called for and the tech was a bit better, but there were quite a few of those games out a few years back. Eventually we will hopefully be at a stage where we can have not quite as good 3D games that are as large as BG. (From the shots DA seems to go this way, but the current thing from what some people have said on the forums is like 30 - 40 hours gameplay, but maybe thats as quick as possible, or maybe its with all side quests. The devs keep pushing that the game will be epic though).

[Kelegacy]

But that's you, the majority of users think differently, and for some reason you are disgruntled about a company doing the right thing - making games that sell to more people. The market demands 3D, an infinity engine game would get bashed to the ground by reviewers - not much one can do about it.

Look at it this way - if they made just PC games, they'd be gone by now, like Troika, like Looking Glass, like Ion Storm (the good one).

This way we will at least get a shot at their next game - Dragon Age, which seems to shape up pretty decent (read: huge) if you follow the forum posts.

I wasn't saying that I want shitty looking games, just that I'd be happy with them if they offered more than what Bioware has given recently. Jade Empire was not up to normal standards. KotoR was good, but no matter how much people try to spin it, it was not a Baldur's Gate successor.

And if you think that making games that sell to the masses is a great thing (and I'm not arguing that it isn't) then you must love Electronic Arts.

You know a great franchise that has overshadowed anything Bioware has put out recently? Gothic. Now, if Gothic 3 came out on Xbox 360, THAT would be a console RPG worth playing. The series has beauty, gameplay, and a massive gameworld, AND it's in 3D. The only thing hurting the series is the controls, which could be worked out easy enough, I think. Gothic is a great example of classic RPGing done right in the era of 3D.

Remember, I love JRPGs and Western RPGs alike, and I'm a console gamer at heart. I can put up with a lot of stuff, like numerous random encounters, shoddy graphics, trite characters and bad dialogue...but Jade Empire caused me to further question Bioware's console foray. If they put out more games like that, I might just stop caring about them. In the end, that's why I am so vocal about this...because I, a loyal fan, care.

[51|RandoM]

The gameplay of KOTOR and BG is basically the same. You move around and pick your spells/attacks and talk to people. There was just more in BG as they could get away with 2D and tons of non-spoken dialogue. Theres less dialogue in KOTOR as they wanted it to be spoken, and there isn't as much due to the increased cost and time they spent working in 3D.

That is some good shit you're smoking.

The "more" you speak of is the most important difference. There is more of everything other than star wars and minigames. More character development, more npcs, more dialogue, more stories, more quests, more party members, multiplayer, more environments, more items, more abilities, more conditions, more tactics. And it just isn't more for the sake of more, it is more to add depth to the overall experience, depth sadly lacking in either kotor or je.

I rue the day they lost the D&D license. That is the real reason we don't see full-fledged RPGs from them anymore, imho. I honestly preferred Black Isle's efforts over Bioware's, but they were both great at the time.

The infinity engine was/is brilliant for that game archetype, and they were still enhancing the graphics on it till the last day. No reason they couldn't have kept doing so, refining the mechanics while enhancing the graphics a bit with each further release. Heck, the hand-drawn 2d environments are still better than anything I've seen in 3d.

Baldur's Gate

Features

Baldur's Gate features revolutionary graphics using an isometric view, dynamic lighting, 3D height maps, and real-time light-sourcing and sprites moving through a pre-rendered world of 16-bit color objects and terrain on five CDs full of over 10,000 scrolling game screens.

Engine

Baldur's Gate uses the Bioware Infinity Engine. The Infinity Engine is a 2D, top-down, isometric game graphics engine, which allows for the display of 16-, 24-, or 32-bit non-tiled, prerendered art, and includes features such as a clipping map for foreground effects, animated background tiles, search maps, 3D height maps, and luminosity maps. It is the foundation of Baldur's Gate, and Black Isle Studios has licensed this engine from BioWare for use in their next RPGs, Planescape: Torment and Icewind Dale

Interface

The interface is clean, crisp, and powerful. Character creation is simple and easy, while staying true to the AD&D system. Inventory can easily be determined for all members in your party, making the normally challenging process of trading items a simple task. The game allows you to easily set all kinds of varied formations for the adventure group, allowing you to place your mages or clerics at the rear while the fighters take the brunt of close combat. You can import custom portraits and character sounds to personalize your character. This customization is in addition to choosing the hair, skin and clothing colors of your character, which along with their equipment, are all visible as the adventurer walks around the world.

Combat

Combat is real-time, with the option for pseudo turn-based control. Tapping the space bar freezes time, and while the game is frozen, you can plan out the actions of your party members. Once you tap the space bar again, time resumes, and the characters act on the directions you give them. It is also possible to set conditions that will automatically pause the game such as each time it is a character's turn or when characters lose a certain percentage of their hit points. This lets players plan out and strategically maneuver their party during intense combat without having to cycle through tons of menus each time, especially when the action is fast and furious.

Multiplayer

A maximum of six people can join in a multiplayer game over the Internet with a TCP/IP connection, on a LAN, or by a direct modem-to-modem or serial connection. Upon starting the game together, they each generate a new character, although it is possible for each player to control more than one character. A player entering the game after it has begun may be assigned control of one or more NPCs by the hosting player, or import their own character. The host determines what items and experience any character that joins the game can bring in. The host also designates the rights players have in the game such as the ability to talk with NPCs or buy items at stores. The game is saved on the host's computer, but each player will also be able to export their character(s) to their own computers. Even if you can't be there to witness the adventure one night, your character can continue under the control of another player.

Environment

Baldur's Gate features over 100 hours of gameplay in an immense game world depicted with vibrance and fluidity, featuring visually impressive special effects like dynamic full-color lighting effects, dynamic changes in character appearance, realistic day to night changes, rain, snow, fog, lightning, all occuring in real-time. Spells and monsters come to life in accurate detail, appearing in real-time exactly the way you imagine AD&D spells and monsters to behave.

Scripting

The character artificial intelligence (AI) involves either premade character scripts or scripts easily modified by the player. The scripting language is easy to use and quick to implement, and will allow for a party to be managed in real-time more easily than in the games of the past. The characters in the player's party interact with each other and with their environment - some characters like each other and complement each other, while others have antipathy for each other and will actively try and fight - either verbal sparring or actual combat! A party of up to six characters adds a lot to the flavour of the game - the party system, with specialists in different areas all contributing to the game, adds immensely to the feeling of playing a game of AD&D.

KotOR

# Immersive, action-packed Star Wars role-playing experience with customizable and evolving playable characters.
# Choose from nine customizable characters to build your party of three adventurers, including humans, droids, Twi'leks, Wookiees and more.
# Journey spans seven different worlds including Tatooine, Sith world of Korriban, Jedi Academy on Dantooine and Wookiee homeworld of Kashyyyk.
# Build your party and upgrade your equipment in your own starship, the Ebon Hawk.
# Fast paced mini-games -- such as racing swoop bikes, or manning turret guns

[Kelegacy]

Now that you mention it, did anyone play Baldur's Gate multiplayer? I find the concept of multiple people playing the same RPG fascinating. None of this MMO bullshit either. I think I recall my college roommate freshman year attempting it. Hell, BG was such an awesome game that a guy who didn't even play games got sucked into it, after seeing me play it one day.

Too bad more RPGs don't do some sort of co-op like this. Yes, you are limited by the gamescreen, but it could be a way to make more Single Player RPGs have extended replayability.

[Twigz'N'Berries]

For my .02, I must say I really liked Jade and loved the two K.O.T.O.R's. If they made Jade 2 basically the same (except, no load screens) with graphical updates and a slight interface change....i'd plunk down my $60 bucks.

[51|RandoM]

Now that you mention it, did anyone play Baldur's Gate multiplayer? I find the concept of multiple people playing the same RPG fascinating. None of this MMO bullshit either. I think I recall my college roommate freshman year attempting it. Hell, BG was such an awesome game that a guy who didn't even play games got sucked into it, after seeing me play it one day.


I did, it was quite a bit of fun. You got to focus more on being your character(s) as opposed to keeping the entire team working towards the same goal. For instance, your mage would spot the time needed for a certain combo and just do it, instead of you having to pause, switch to the mage, lay down web, stinking cloud, cloudkill and then watch everybody die, lol. You didn't have to constantly micromanage your thief to keep him hidden, detecting traps and you didn't have to manually pull him back to safety after he snuck behind lines to take out the enemy mage or cleric. Your missile users knew what the priority targets were and could be counted on to lay interrupts on the casters.

I wish they would've have explored the multiplayer opportunities here instead of going off on neverwinter nights. The big advantage to NWN was/is that it was 3d instead of hand-painted, so it was very easy to build new environments/modules with many reusable objects. It doesn't look near as good, but you can churn out $20-$30 modules very quickly. I think that was their intention, doesn't appear to have come to fruition, though, sadly.

The downside of course, is that once you knew most of the encounters in the game, there was very little challenge. Not any different from an MMO, though, I suppose, where knowing the encounter is the only challenge---other than managing a group of humans.

My favorite RPG and/or RPG-type games have been the series that used the same engine and/or mechanics for a number of games: Almost all of the SSI stuff, especially the gold box games, and of course the Eye of the Beholder series, the BG series, the icewind dale series, planescape torment, darksun:wotr, darksun:sl, the summoning, veil of darkness, menzoberranzan.

Hmm, looking at that list, almost all of it was published by SSI. sniffle. I just checked www.ssionline.com and it doesn't even redirect to ubisoft anymore.

[LogainAblar]

I agree to a certain extent about the more recent Bioware RPG's not being nearly as deep in terms of options, but you absolutely have to consider their reasons for the way KOTOR and JE turned out:

1) Their move to 3D was inevitable; sure, the isometric, 2D RPG's have their audience, but how long can you milk the same cow? To say nothing of the rest of the market moving to 3D. They had to do it sometime, and it clearly takes much more work to create a new 3D engine than it does to re-use a 2D one and add in new environments.

2) If you hadn't noticed by the time JE came out, Bioware has been moving to make the games much more immersive, and the most obvious change to this was the combat. To do this, they had to remove the static, turn-based combat system in favor of a more action-oriented one, where the player himself (or herself) gets to control the outcome of the fights, not dice rolls.

Whether you agree with these two fundamental changes or not, it was done so they could stay alive in a largely unpredictable market. I personally liked both KOTOR and JE, though I believe that both had aspects which could be improved upon. Still, I do not believe they are abandoning their CRPG roots, but rather I imagine they hope to recreate those experiences from a different angle, starting from the ground up.

Seeing as how they are going to continue developing for consoles, the extra horse-power of these new machines can only mean they will have the ability to create a much deeper experience all-around. In my opinion JE itself was more of a starting point, and now that have laid the groundwork, the sequel will hopefully contain much deepr content.

[The Iron Weasel]

I want KoToR 3 to be as big as BG2, as much as I love BG2, and see how good it is, I just can't get into it anymore, I did for a little while, but then my save file got deleted after a virus caused me to reformat. And I made a small backup of save games, I grabbed my NwN file, but sadly not BG2.