Diablo 3 on its way? [Archive]

bapenguin

10-29-2005, 07:18 AM

From WowGuru.com (http://www.wowguru.com/) comes word that Diablo 3 should be announced at Blizzcon.

From what we've heard Diablo 3 is going to be an MMO, as massive as World of Warcraft, with the concept of Hell invading Heaven. One rumor going around with Diablo 3 is that there will be Guild Housing included. The game is said to be looking brilliant and will be showcased at Blizzcon as their big suprise.
Heaven invading hell? That sounds cool. I'm kinda of dissapointed it's going to be a MMO though...that is...if this holds true.

BleedTheFreak

10-29-2005, 07:36 AM

Wasn't it officially announced there would be no such announcements, other than WoW stuff? I thought I read that news item here at EA a month back or so?

EvilBob46

10-29-2005, 07:37 AM

A Diablo MMO, alongside their WOW MMO? WTF?

Savok

10-29-2005, 07:42 AM

Diablo will be a MMOG like Guild Wars and CoH, combat over atmosphere, WoW is the opposite of that. And anyone who bothered to watch the end movie on Diablo 2's expansion knew this was coming.

EvilBob46

10-29-2005, 07:50 AM

Diablo will be a MMOG like Guild Wars and CoH, combat over atmosphere, WoW is the opposite of that.

Either it is a MMO, or it isn't. Guild Wars and Diablo 2 are not MMOs.

Taco

10-29-2005, 07:52 AM

I imagine it will be similar to Guild Wars. After Diablo 2 I'm not to interested. I'm one of the Starcraft junkies.

Borys

10-29-2005, 07:56 AM

FUCK YOU, BLIZZARD

I hope this rumour is just that - a rumour.

Spigot

10-29-2005, 07:59 AM

While I'd rather it be a single-player game, now I'm jonesing to actually play through the expansion of Diablo 2. I never did get around to that.

Thanks a lot! Like I didn't have enough on my gaming plate as it is.

Mysterio

10-29-2005, 08:01 AM

That would be a surprising announcement, since they'd be stealing from their own market share (WoW). An RTS would likely be a more financially sound decision given the recent resurgence in RTSs.

Savok

10-29-2005, 08:05 AM

They won't be stealing their own market share if they give a discount for subscribing to both.

Mysterio

10-29-2005, 08:24 AM

They won't be stealing their own market share if they give a discount for subscribing to both.

True, but they won't be pulling from another company's market share. Then again, W3 and SC are still extremely popular, so who knows. :confused:

The Iron Weasel

10-29-2005, 08:38 AM

God I hope this isn't true, I just want another Diablo III, that plays like Diablo 2, but with 3D graphics.

TheBigL

10-29-2005, 08:41 AM

Please make it just a rumor.
Some please just cant affort to pay every month to a game that they are barly playing.

And thouse who think it will be like guild wars. I must disagree with you. I dont think so because the system that guild wars uses is exlusive to arena net. Doubt if they will sell it to Blizzard.

Taco

10-29-2005, 08:44 AM

When I say like Guild Wars I don't me so similar they need to pay them.

Nerv

10-29-2005, 08:58 AM

oh god.
HAy guys I've lost mah Dioblo 3 CDKEY ane1 wan ta give me theres? KTHX BYE.

NoName

10-29-2005, 09:01 AM

We offer you Diablo 3! And like previous Diablo games you can play on Battlenet with all your friends in a MMO game!...

Royal Fool

10-29-2005, 09:15 AM

Mmm.... no, I don't think they'll be announcing this now.

alienchild

10-29-2005, 09:16 AM

Blizzard found out how much cash they can make with an MMO, so if this turns out to be true, I wouldnt be surprised.

TheBigL

10-29-2005, 09:21 AM

Blizzard found out how much cash they can make with an MMO, so if this turns out to be true, I wouldnt be surprised.

If that is true all my respect for Blizzard will be gone.

Murmillo

10-29-2005, 09:24 AM

...and soon after the Diablo 3 MMO... the annoucement StarCraft 2 MMO

The 3 evils of blizzard.

Talanvor

10-29-2005, 09:26 AM

StarCraft 2 you bastards!!

thecrazyd

10-29-2005, 09:26 AM

If they made a free MMO, a la Guild Wars, that would definately kill Guild Wars. No one would play it.

Taco

10-29-2005, 09:27 AM

I'd imagine the success of Lineage would contribute to the MMO route more than WOW would. I don't get who'd pay per month for mindless hack and slash but Lineage proved millions will.

earthworm48

10-29-2005, 09:28 AM

I can't say that this sin't true, but I went and read that thing at wowguru and my bullshit-o-meter is right off teh scale.

Dorfl

10-29-2005, 09:33 AM

The guys who haven't seen the game and the guys who are making the game say it looks brilliant? I'm impressed! This kind of praise doesn't come often and doesn't come cheap.

Chimpbot

10-29-2005, 09:36 AM

Diablo will be a MMOG like Guild Wars and CoH, combat over atmosphere, WoW is the opposite of that. And anyone who bothered to watch the end movie on Diablo 2's expansion knew this was coming.

Maybe you had a different ending movie than I, but the destruction of the World Stone(it's not a spoiler at this point, is it? I think not) didn't scream out, "O NOEZ! AN MMORPG IS THE SEQUEL!" to me.
What it did say is this: They're sure going to have trouble justifying a sequel, what with their title character and his two brothers being permanently dead and all.

Out of the two available lines from Blizzard, I'd rather see Starcraft get the MMORPG treatment over Diablo. We have enough sword & sorcery...give me a good futuristic mmorpg!

Goronmon

10-29-2005, 09:45 AM

God I hope this isn't true, I just want another Diablo III, that plays like Diablo 2, but with 3D graphics.
Seriously? A 3D version of Diablo 2 is exactly what I don't want to see...

Kefkataran

10-29-2005, 10:25 AM

I'm going to go ahead and guess the following:

a.) This is a rumor. It may or may not be true. I, for one, am not buying anything till I hear it officially.

b.) Most of you need to chill the fuck out until at least something is announced for sure. Then you need to chill the fuck out until you at least actually see some pictures. Then you probably need to chill the fuck out until you at least give it a run. Seriously. You are some high-strung individuals.

As much as I'd rather see an RTS sequel to Starcraft, I must admit that an SC MMO has strong appeal. I wouldn't be surprised for it to happen, but I wouldn't expect it for some time (five years at least).

Leaving Hope

10-29-2005, 10:34 AM

StarCraft 2 you bastards!!

http://www.wowguru.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9257 (WowGuru) also claims that "Starcraft 2 is already in development for the PC."

As with others, I would be very upset with Blizzard if they made Diablo III an RPG. But it makes sense for them financially.

Say Blizzard goes non-MMO route with Diablo III and sells 5 million copies to retailers at $30.00 each over a period of 6 months; that brings them a total of $150 million dollars income.

Now say that they instead go the MMO route; instead of selling 5 million copies let's assume they only sell 2.5 million at $30.00/copy because not as many people are receptive for pay-to-play, and that 2 million of those people subscribe for an average of 6 months at $14.99/month. In this scenario they're making $255 million.

Obviously these numbers are just wild guesses, but it's easy to see why Blizzard would opt for an MMO when you see how much they make off of subscriptions. With a non-MMO, they don't get recurring income.

As a CFO, with the potential to easily make $100+ million more on an MMO than a traditional offline RPG, which choice would you make? Sadly, it's not all about the game anymore.

Taco

10-29-2005, 10:38 AM

Well you'd need to take into consideration devlopment and operating costs being much higher for a mmrpg. While the point is still accurate, there are added risks to be considered.

Sloth

10-29-2005, 10:39 AM

diablo 3 as an mmo doesn't sound that promising. i'd rather see diablo 3 set up more like NWN except not as detailed in the toolset. Something more simple like html is to java. Just a quick and dirty throw up a server, change a few quests and storylines, randomize some dungeons, and boom thousands of new worlds at your fingertips.

Atorak

10-29-2005, 10:40 AM

Maybe I'm alone here, but I enjoyed the hell out of both Diablo and Diablo II. Diablo III? Bring it on.

And you can bet your ass that it'll be a paying MMO, and that they'll have a payment sharing plan with WoW. I mean, they do provide a service to the gaming community by creating games, but they are also a business. Blizzard is riding a HUGE wave right now, and they'll do anything to keep it going at this point.

Syl

10-29-2005, 10:42 AM

http://www.wowguru.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9257 (WowGuru) also claims that "Starcraft 2 is already in development for the PC."

Say Blizzard goes non-MMO route with Diablo III and sells 5 million copies to retailers at $30.00 each over a period of 6 months; that brings them a total of $150 million dollars income.

Dude, Diablo II is still selling for $40 (4 years later), and its sold closer to 20 Million copies. That, and the game originally retailed for $50, and its expansion originally retailed for $40.

Yes, Monthly payments bring in more money, but diablo II is a massive cash bringer.

Leaving Hope

10-29-2005, 10:59 AM

Dude, Diablo II is still selling for $40 (4 years later), and its sold closer to 20 Million copies. That, and the game originally retailed for $50, and its expansion originally retailed for $40.

Yes, Monthly payments bring in more money, but diablo II is a massive cash bringer.

I have no idea how many copies Diablo II has sold, so I limited my estimation to a 6 month range. You're right--Diablo II is a "massive cash bringer" for them, but I'm willing to bet that their WoW numbers make their return on Diablo II look much smaller. With an MMO, they can sell less copies and make more money if they retain a decent subscriber base.

If you're not convinced, let's figure it out. Run the numbers on what you think a non-MMO Diablo 3 would sell versus a MMO D3.

Taco was right in his post, too, though. There are other risks and things involved. An MMO could alienate some of the loyal D2 player base. There are costs involved in running an MMO. Et cetera.

WoW has been an enormous success for them. It's also their most recent success. So why not go with what they know worked? The Diablo 2 success was over 10 years ago, and things have changed. Many of the people who created Diablo 2 left Blizzard.

You also have to consider that Diablo II has been copied hundreds of times since its release. How much more can they add to the genre? Would it be enough to distinguish it from the Dungeon Sieges and countless other clones? When Diablo 2 was released, the genre was relatively new and we were satisfied by mindless hack/slash; but I think most of us have evolved as gamers since then. I, personally, want more from my games like community interaction and evolving worlds.

Don't get me wrong, Syl. I ~want~ D3 to be non-MMO. But I don't see it happening.

Taco

10-29-2005, 11:03 AM

How about I piss everyone off with the thought it may be 360 exclusive ;).

I would cry. There's a better chance of it being cross platform. I could see PC and XBox players together in a Diablo type game.

A-Team

10-29-2005, 11:17 AM

Please excuse my ignorance, but are you referring to this blurb on the page bap?

That is not the huge leak though ... Wanna know the HUGE thing they are introducing at BlizzCon?? Diablo 3 - Hell is invading Heaven and that is the concept of the game ... It looks awesome - Darkness invading light and all ... They showed it to us at this thing Blizzard has twice a year called "Show n Tell" for all the regular employess.... All I have to say is Diablo 3 will be on epic preperation like WoW will be except they are going to have guild housing FINALLY! - There was a rumor that WoW was coming to 360 which is completely false. Blizzard tried to squash the rumor saying it was just going to preview new MS Vista software ( http://1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3145078) but Diablo is what they are really going to show coming to 360 ... Ghost is too late in development and a big fuck up in Blizzards eyes and stuck on the PS2 - XBOX
Or is there better evidence that I'm just not seeing?

Savok

10-29-2005, 11:45 AM

Maybe you had a different ending movie than I, but the destruction of the World Stone(it's not a spoiler at this point, is it? I think not) didn't scream out, "O NOEZ! AN MMORPG IS THE SEQUEL!" to me.
What it did say is this: They're sure going to have trouble justifying a sequel, what with their title character and his two brothers being permanently dead and all.

Out of the two available lines from Blizzard, I'd rather see Starcraft get the MMORPG treatment over Diablo. We have enough sword & sorcery...give me a good futuristic mmorpg!
And that meant all the barriers were gone and everything has pretty much literally gone to hell, this isn't Diablo's travels and what he leaves behind, but the entire game world becoming a war zone. What part of that doesn't scream MMOG?

Not to mention room for near endless expansions, where WoW's game world is very clearly defined, Diablo's isn't, you can just add layers of hell and other dimensions or something.

Captain Awesome

10-29-2005, 12:03 PM

Diablo MMO? Fucking lame.

Klade

10-29-2005, 12:03 PM

I'm calling bullshit on this one. Other people have already said it but its still true, blizzard is not going to eat its own market share. People who don't like WoW probably aren't going to go out and buy a Diablo MMO.

And as someone else already pointed out Blizzard announced a while ago that there was only going to be one big announcement and that it was going to be the expansion to WoW. This is just floor room gossip and hence crap.

Mason

10-29-2005, 12:04 PM

I have no idea how many copies Diablo II has sold, so I limited my estimation to a 6 month range. You're right--Diablo II is a "massive cash bringer" for them, but I'm willing to bet that their WoW numbers make their return on Diablo II look much smaller. With an MMO, they can sell less copies and make more money if they retain a decent subscriber base.

You're missing the point. You can't keep on making multiple blockbuster MMORPGs that're out concurrently, as people only subscribe to one. Offering a combo subscription price isn't a great solution, since even dual-subscribers can only be really active in one game, so one of the two games is pretty much doomed to being second-tier. And if one of the games totally eclipses the other, then all Blizzard will have done is spend a ton of money developing two MMOs, but with half the revenue stream they could expect. Not a wise investment.

A GW-style game would work pretty well. You could capitalize a lot better on the Diablo heritage by going for small-team combat than giant raids. Former Diablo fans would be more likely to follow a sequel that felt more along the lines of the previous titles. It could keep more of the pace of the previous games.

And for the nit-pickers, it is not a crime against humanity to call a GW-style game a MMORPG. I've had this discussion too many times before, but the final result is that to define MMORPG in such a way as to exclude GW makes it a ridiculously narrow little genre. So reports that D3 is a MMO doesn't preclude that it is a MMO yet still fundamentally unlike WoW enough that they won't be seen as direct competitors.

SuperMonkeyFighter2

10-29-2005, 12:10 PM

http://www.wowguru.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9257 (WowGuru) also claims that "Starcraft 2 is already in development for the PC."

As with others, I would be very upset with Blizzard if they made Diablo III an RPG. But it makes sense for them financially.

Say Blizzard goes non-MMO route with Diablo III and sells 5 million copies to retailers at $30.00 each over a period of 6 months; that brings them a total of $150 million dollars income.

Now say that they instead go the MMO route; instead of selling 5 million copies let's assume they only sell 2.5 million at $30.00/copy because not as many people are receptive for pay-to-play, and that 2 million of those people subscribe for an average of 6 months at $14.99/month. In this scenario they're making $255 million.

Obviously these numbers are just wild guesses, but it's easy to see why Blizzard would opt for an MMO when you see how much they make off of subscriptions. With a non-MMO, they don't get recurring income.

As a CFO, with the potential to easily make $100+ million more on an MMO than a traditional offline RPG, which choice would you make? Sadly, it's not all about the game anymore.

Wow, you're being overly generous with those #'s. On that scale, Blizzard would be lucky to attract 200,000 paid subscribers. Emphasis on the luck.
My company looked into the MMO market VERY hard. OUr findings? MMO games (subscriber) do in fact share the same people. No new people are introduced (at big #'s). All of the people who are playing Wow right now are not new to the genre. These are people who were playing EQ who just moved over. This is why EQ is contracting, why EQ2 does not have the numbers they hoped, why Matrix Online failed so bad (besides the fact it sucked), etc.
The thing is, people have so little expendable income ... between cell phones, internet costs, AOL for the mainstream, rent, car payments, etc ... that spending $12 a month for a video game can be allowable, but only one at a time. Even at a discount, people would not be willing to support 2 games at a subscription en masse.
So the question is, would Blizzard be willing to cut into their own game (WoW) with a Diablo game? How many people do they think they can steal away from Star Wars, EQ, EQ2, Final Fantasy, CoH, Lineage, etc? Plus, with more MMO's coming like Marvel and DC Online, how long would they be able to maintain a profitable model? These are all guesses, as Blizzard has no announced anything.

Zeal

10-29-2005, 12:11 PM

This is bunk.

if76

10-29-2005, 12:15 PM

how exactly is diablo's gameplay so different from an MMO? You pick your class, go on quests, manage an inventory and gain levels through a barely interactive combat system. If you want a single player diablo-like experience just don't talk to anyone and venture off by yourself.

The Iron Weasel

10-29-2005, 12:24 PM

Seriously? A 3D version of Diablo 2 is exactly what I don't want to see...

Well I was sort of hoping that they'd move it up in the timeperiod area, but I just dont want to see a god damn Diablo MMO, it would ruin the series no matter how good an mmo it was, i just want another Action RPG, that i dont have to pay a god damn montly fee. And if they call it Diablo 3, its blasphmey. If this happens then all the good minds behind blizzard are now at Arena.Net, and Flagship Studios.

Wonka

10-29-2005, 12:26 PM

Well lets see...

It seems likely that an MMO would stand to make a lot more money for Blizzard (or at least more than a free matchmaking thing like Diablo had). This should hold if they can replicate their success from WOW.

And Blizzard is a company. Which means that their existance is dependent on making as much money as possible. So I don't find the idea of this hard to believe at all. We shall see if it's true or not. If it's purely a rumor, then its a believable one thats for sure.

It's also true that there are GREAT risks with launching an MMO. Most MMOs simply fail hands down. Publishers tend fear funding projects like this. And rightfully so. But those fears would likely be mostly offset by their previous sucess (including in this exact genre).

It my opinion that Blizzard would be foolish not to try and leverage their previous success in this area, given the incredible financial position that having a successful MMO has undoubtably already put them in. I would rather they made another Diablo game in the older game style, but this rumour sounds VERY believable to me...

Wonka

10-29-2005, 12:40 PM

Wow, you're being overly generous with those #'s. On that scale, Blizzard would be lucky to attract 200,000 paid subscribers. Emphasis on the luck.
My company looked into the MMO market VERY hard. OUr findings? MMO games (subscriber) do in fact share the same people. No new people are introduced (at big #'s). All of the people who are playing Wow right now are not new to the genre. These are people who were playing EQ who just moved over. This is why EQ is contracting, why EQ2 does not have the numbers they hoped, why Matrix Online failed so bad (besides the fact it sucked), etc.
The thing is, people have so little expendable income ... between cell phones, internet costs, AOL for the mainstream, rent, car payments, etc ... that spending $12 a month for a video game can be allowable, but only one at a time. Even at a discount, people would not be willing to support 2 games at a subscription en masse.
So the question is, would Blizzard be willing to cut into their own game (WoW) with a Diablo game? How many people do they think they can steal away from Star Wars, EQ, EQ2, Final Fantasy, CoH, Lineage, etc? Plus, with more MMO's coming like Marvel and DC Online, how long would they be able to maintain a profitable model? These are all guesses, as Blizzard has no announced anything.

I think that all this would be totally true if I did not also believe that MMOs were not about to expand into the console space. Since I think that consoles are probably about to get their 1st successful MMO experiences (meaning within the next 4-5 years) then I would argue that the potential marketspace for this is about to expand in a large way. Time will tell. You might be right. It is POSSIBLE that only PC gamers want to explore virtual worlds cooperatively with their friends. But that notion sounds patently absurd to me. So I am going to bet that console gamers DO want to have these experiences, and are just waiting for someone out there to actually provide them with it.

And before you mention it, I am aware that this has been tried before on the PS2. But it hasn't been done right yet. Console gamers need an MMO that can be played without having to nurse a keyboard on their lap. One that has been designed for their platform. I believe this will happen eventually. Progress is very very slow though, because these games are already a next-next-gen budgets to produce.

Nesta

10-29-2005, 12:48 PM

I never did play Dialbo 1 or 2. Just wanted to put that out there.

Taco

10-29-2005, 12:57 PM

Diablo1 rocked my Freshman and Sophomore years at high school. Silly school board let them switch all the crap VMS dummy terminals to brand new P200's with Windows just as Diablo was released.

Diablo2, eh, I thought is sucked from the get go.

kizke

10-29-2005, 01:19 PM

I smell bullshit, to be honest; not that they're developing Diabo 3, because they wouldn't let a hot property die, but that this guy knows what he's talking about.

In retrospect it would tie in nicely with the ending of Diablo 2 LoD.

I don't want another Guild Wars, though... I want a game where you and a couple friends can jump on Battle.Net from any computer and play for hours at a time, killing 20 enemies per character at a time. WoW pissed me off because my character felt so weak; I missed being able to set traps or use frozen orb and just wipe out screen after screen of enemies. I missed the magic find runs, the hellcow runs...

Suffice it to say I played probably no less than 1000 hours of Diablo 2. It is my most-played game of all time and it holds a very special place in my life. I still play it, for that matter, and I bought it launch day.

Anyway...if Blizzard knows their fans (and 9 times out of 10 they do) they'll retain the classic wild gameplay of Diablo 2 but incorporate a greater social structure and perhaps a bigger sense of scale. But if I can't kill thirty fetishes in under two seconds after a good deal of leveling, I'm gonna be pissed. :p

SuperMonkeyFighter2

10-29-2005, 01:43 PM

And before you mention it, I am aware that this has been tried before on the PS2. But it hasn't been done right yet. Console gamers need an MMO that can be played without having to nurse a keyboard on their lap. One that has been designed for their platform. I believe this will happen eventually. Progress is very very slow though, because these games are already a next-next-gen budgets to produce.

Actually, Final Fantasy XI was the most played MMO out there when I pulled #'s about a year ago. Not sure how it stacks up to WoW now ... but FF was pulling over 1 million paid subscibers.

This of course lends support to your line of thought ... but I don't know if that argument would exist in this sense (ie: IF Diablo 3 is a MMO, which would most likely be for PC). But with that said, I just added speculation ON TOP of speculation. Double whammy

There is potential money to be made from a console MMO, as you leave the confines of PC gaming (which is not very lucrative in comparison to console gaming).

We'll see ...

Crabby

10-29-2005, 01:46 PM

Anyone notice that same source mentioning hero classes for WoW in the expansion? Yeah...

Neverborne

10-29-2005, 02:13 PM

Jesus Christ, I seriously don't get some people (everyone on the internet); they beg for more of what they love, and, when it is hinted that they are going to get it, they cry and whine about it.

Kefkataran

10-29-2005, 02:14 PM

Actually, Final Fantasy XI was the most played MMO out there when I pulled #'s about a year ago. Not sure how it stacks up to WoW now ... but FF was pulling over 1 million paid subscibers.

Probably true, worldwide, although I'm still a bit surprised. But it's nowhere near WoW now, and I'm sure it's gone down.

Jesus Christ, I seriously don't get some people (everyone on the internet); they beg for more of what they love, and, when it is hinted that they are going to get it, they cry and whine about it.

The craziest part is the amount of whining that can be pulled out of a mere (and unlikely) RUMOR. Heh.

Kelegacy

10-29-2005, 02:28 PM

We need another MMO like I need another outbreak of herpes.

omnithrope

10-29-2005, 02:32 PM

Seriously? A 3D version of Diablo 2 is exactly what I don't want to see...

I hope you're a minority.

bapenguin

10-29-2005, 02:52 PM

Please excuse my ignorance, but are you referring to this blurb on the page bap?

Or is there better evidence that I'm just not seeing?

That's it.

mister_slim

10-29-2005, 03:00 PM

More Diablo? Excellent. How about some atmosphere this time? And maybe design it with consoles in mind?

Zeal

10-29-2005, 03:25 PM

Blizzard splitting its MMORPG userbase is simply not a good business decision. Besides, WoW is just about to undergo its first expansion, and the introduction of another MMORPG is way too premature.

Kelegacy

10-29-2005, 03:32 PM

Blizzard splitting its MMORPG userbase is simply not a good business decision. Besides, WoW is just about to undergo its first expansion, and the introduction of another MMORPG is way too premature.
Unless they do that Sony-multi-MMORPG thing, where you pay one price and can use any of their MMOs. That might work a bit.

derjester

10-29-2005, 04:08 PM

It's funny how many people are buying this story. WoW has 4.5 million users world wide. It's broken every record EQ has ever set. Saying WoW didn't bring new players to the MMO market is ignorant.
That said, D3 is most definately not going to be console and not going to be MMO. It took forever for VUG to go with the idea of WoW. Without WoW having a successful expansion I don't see they backing Blizzard for a Diablo 3 MMO.
Blizzard also recent aquired their own console team to develop console game. Currently the only thing in the pipe line is Ghost. And judging by what people at the con have said about it, it's about as far from failure as Mr. Hartgraves is from intelligent.
Obviously Blizzard North is working on something. And I'm sure that something has been worked on for quite some time. I don't see them jumping Genre's. I see them innovating the hack and slash RPG light the way starcraft, and warcraft 3 innovated the RTS genre.

Kefkataran

10-29-2005, 04:25 PM

We need another MMO like I need another outbreak of herpes.

Another MMO is going to happen no matter what. I mean, that's just a given. Might as well make it a Blizzard MMO, since they seem to do well (at least thusfar).

Unless they do that Sony-multi-MMORPG thing, where you pay one price and can use any of their MMOs. That might work a bit.

Which they probably would. I would hope. God, why the fuck isn't NCSoft doing this yet?

inmostlight

10-29-2005, 04:30 PM

As long as we're just engaging in wild, unsubstantiated speculation....how about a sandbox Blackthorne game?

SuperMonkeyFighter2

10-29-2005, 04:57 PM

Saying WoW didn't bring new players to the MMO market is ignorant.

I could be wrong then, but I do not believe WoW brought new players en masse to the MMO market

How many people played MMO games worldwide before WoW? How many after? How many people migrated from existing MMORPGs?

The biggest contributer to the market to my knowledge was Lineage, in that it took people who did not play MMO RPGs and bring them to the table (over 3 million to be exact). Of that 3, 1 million Lineage subscribers went on to Lineage 2 (They have a 2 million sub base).

Meanwhile, Dark Age, CoH, EQ, EQ 2, Star Wars, Runescape, Ragnarock, FF XI, UO, Planetside, Aheron's Call, (and many more) all shared #'s of 100 K or more. Not to mention the list of those that are under 100K (Games like Shadowbane and Eve online)

Now, those are quite a few games listed ... each had some pretty good subscriber #'s. My question is, how many people who play WoW are "Brand New" players? How many jumped ship?

We have a good amount of people who actively play MMO RPGs, but the biggest addition that anyone has brought to the table was Lineage.

These are the #'s I have as of June 2005. Like I said, I could be wrong. There are many factors that need to really be looked at to be certain. But at a quick glance, it just looks like WoW is using existing subscribers.

On a quirky sidenote, Lineage 2 (as of June 05) has (had?) a bigger marketshare than WoW.Not a knock on WoW, as what they have done is amazing. That fact made me do a double take though

Kefkataran

10-29-2005, 05:09 PM

As long as we're just engaging in wild, unsubstantiated speculation....how about a sandbox Blackthorne game?

Mmmhmm.

My question is, how many people who play WoW are "Brand New" players? How many jumped ship?

I could be wrong then, but I do not believe WoW brought new players en masse to the MMO market

You may not believe so, but yes, you would be wrong. The number of people I know who started playing WoW as their first MMORPG and first monthly fee game is pretty staggering. I know at least 20 in my college alone. WoW definitely was a big step towards opening up the genre to new players, and I seriously do believe it has accomplished that and will probably continue to.

The biggest contributer to the market to my knowledge was Lineage, in that it took people who did not play MMO RPGs and bring them to the table (over 3 million to be exact). Of that 3, 1 million Lineage subscribers went on to Lineage 2 (They have a 2 million sub base).

We have a good amount of people who actively play MMO RPGs, but the biggest addition that anyone has brought to the table was Lineage.

Lineage didn't take players who never played MMOs in the U.S. Lineage was a huge hit in Korea. Lineage 2 still is. In the U.S. they're both pretty unpopular. I'm fairily certain that updated states probably put WoW at a bigger playerbase worldwide now, as last I remember hearing they've gone over 3 million subscribers and by now are probably close to 4 million. Anyways, I'm not sure why you'd assume more of WoW's players are old MMO players than Lineage's.

Sazime

10-29-2005, 05:10 PM

On a quirky sidenote, Lineage 2 (as of June 05) has (had?) a bigger marketshare than WoW.Not a knock on WoW, as what they have done is amazing. That fact made me do a double take though

Koreans play MMOs more than all other genres put together, and Lineage is very popular in Korea. Has to do with the fact most don't own PCs, they use cafes, and clans/guilds are a huge part of their gaming culture. They hand at the same cafes, etc. It is amazing and scary at the same time.

Heretic Machine

10-29-2005, 05:14 PM

Which they probably would. I would hope. God, why the fuck isn't NCSoft doing this yet?

Because NCsoft makes a decent amount of good games. While SOE has approximently: None, with the possible exception of SWG.

Kefkataran

10-29-2005, 05:16 PM

Because NCsoft makes a decent amount of good games. While SOE has approximently: None, with the possible exception of SWG.

Which is why a lot of people would be super-eager to just pay them 20 or 30 bucks a month to play any of the games. I'm sure they'd make more off sales of games and in monthly fees with that than they are now without it.

Wyrm

10-29-2005, 06:59 PM

I think a Starcraft MMO would be best. WoW made the most sense to start with, whereas Diablo seems to work just fine where it is. I want them to make a new one with a different engine but keep the gameplay largely the same.

Unfortunately, there may be some truth in this claim. Who knows if they'll actually anounce it here or not, but the rumors about WoW expansion turned out to all be true. Food for thought.

Wyrm

10-29-2005, 07:01 PM

And I would like to see a new game world come to life from Blizzard. Dont get me wrong, I adore each of their unbelievably cool universes, but I want so badly for them to do something unique again. Of course, I'd settle for Starcraft 2 any day.

Rommel

10-29-2005, 07:02 PM

WoW isn't Diablo III?

Derella

10-29-2005, 08:04 PM

I doubt I'd play a Diablo MMO. A Starcraft one though? It would be the first Sci-Fi MMO that didn't suck.

nonchalance

10-29-2005, 08:12 PM

Everything I want from Diablo 3 is right here (http://www.hellgatelondon.com/).

Derella

10-29-2005, 08:18 PM

Everything I want from Diablo 3 is right here (http://www.hellgatelondon.com/).
So true...

SuperMonkeyFighter2

10-29-2005, 08:35 PM

You may not believe so, but yes, you would be wrong. The number of people I know who started playing WoW as their first MMORPG and first monthly fee game is pretty staggering. I know at least 20 in my college alone. WoW definitely was a big step towards opening up the genre to new players, and I seriously do believe it has accomplished that and will probably continue to.

Lineage didn't take players who never played MMOs in the U.S. Lineage was a huge hit in Korea. Lineage 2 still is. In the U.S. they're both pretty unpopular. I'm fairily certain that updated states probably put WoW at a bigger playerbase worldwide now, as last I remember hearing they've gone over 3 million subscribers and by now are probably close to 4 million. Anyways, I'm not sure why you'd assume more of WoW's players are old MMO players than Lineage's.

Now hang on ... how can you tell me that I am wrong, yet not back up your theories with real #'s? You use speculation and theory. There's nothing wrong with taking an educated guess ... but acknowledge it as just that ... a guess. The same way I can not say for certain whether or not those players migrated is the same way you can not verify your guess.

And yes, Lineage did take players who never played MMO's before and introduce them to the fold. There was NO MMORPG in Korea, or a combination of which from which to draw the MILLIONS that Lineage did. Unlike in America where the MMORPG market already had millions from which to draw and migrate. EQ and Ultima online existed in the US and did VERY well between them (EQ especially). Others followed, and expanded the market space from which WoW drew from.

Dude I have no problem admitting when I'm wrong, but at least I look at the facts first.
You drop items like "fairly certain" in your argument ... not a good basis when saying the other is wrong.

If you wish to disagree, fine. But don't do the "You're wrong because I'm fairly certain of it" routine.

Kefkataran

10-29-2005, 09:54 PM

Now hang on ... how can you tell me that I am wrong, yet not back up your theories with real #'s? You use speculation and theory.

Blizzard's been flaunting their high subscription #'s for the last six months, giving ocassional updates with the # reached. Last I remember was 3 mil. I'm not concerned enough to look up info, but we've had posts here regarding it. It's fairly common knowledge that WoW is raking in the huge number of subscribers.

There was NO MMORPG in Korea, or a combination of which from which to draw the MILLIONS that Lineage did.

Umm... that's what I said. See:

Lineage didn't take players who never played MMOs in the U.S. Lineage was a huge hit in Korea.

Didn't bring in people in America. Did bring in people in Korea. You said WoW didn't bring in new subscribers at all. I think it brought it a lot of new American subscribers.

Dude I have no problem admitting when I'm wrong, but at least I look at the facts first.

You're making a pretty big deal out of this. It's nothing personal. You looked at the fact, but you interpreted them in a way that isn't totally sensible. There's no real way to know how many of the millions of subscribers from both WoW and Lineage are first-time MMO players. I'm definitely willing to agree, though, that Lineage probably created many in Korea while WoW has created man in the U.S.

If you wish to disagree, fine. But don't do the "You're wrong because I'm fairly certain of it" routine.

Okay. You're wrong because I'm totally certain? :) Really, though, it's not a big deal.

Also: Blizzcon over. Diablo 3 not announced. Stupid. Fucking. Rumor.

Venkman

10-29-2005, 10:48 PM

FUCK YOU, BLIZZARD

I hope this rumour is just that - a rumour.

LOL! I'm pretty tired of their "upcoming awesome surprises" being more and more MMO stuff. I want my Starcraft 2!

Voodoo

10-29-2005, 11:03 PM

Starcraft 2 is inevitable. We still have to deal with the master race whom created the Zerg and Protoss...

Diablo 3... I've not heard a single peep from any of my sources about it. It would be very difficult too now to create another MMORPG with WoW being alive and doing quite well. Plus, those that were the masterminds behind Diablo are long gone from Blizzard. The creative director that is doing all the story boarding right now for Blizzard is big on two things... Warcraft and Starcraft.

If anything, I wouldn't be suprised by two things...

The new alliance race is something completely new, keep in mind Tauren didn't exist in Warcraft 1 and 2.

Blizzard has their eyes on a new IP.

saran_js

10-29-2005, 11:09 PM

WTF is with all this MMOGs ??!?!?! I want to play with myself. Is that too fucking difficult for these asswipes to understand ??!!? Fuck them. Give me Diablo 3, Give me StarCraft 2, Gimme a new universe to play, but stow the fucking MMOG shit.
I have never played or payed for a MMOG and I never will. Why you say ? cuz it takes dedication, constant playing, time, effort, money and a whole slew of other things. I just want to spend some time just playing without having to worry about all this shit. As if real life wasn't enough. Are these idiots too fucking stupid to understand that the market for people who don't play online is a whole lot bigger than those who do ??? Fuck you Fuck yo Fuck you if it is true.

SuperMonkeyFighter2

10-29-2005, 11:12 PM

Also: Blizzcon over. Diablo 3 not announced. Stupid. Fucking. Rumor.

That is what this whole topic is about, isn't it? Too funny.

XenonCJ

10-29-2005, 11:47 PM

WoW isn't Diablo III?Exactly - Jewlcrafting is the latest element from Diablo melded into WoW. Even some of the quest story lines in WoW run into Diablo story lines. It would make much more sense, if they were going to make another MMO, to use the StarCraft universe - since it's like actually different and stuff.

However I'd just like to see StarCraft 2 as a regualr RTS. Diablo 3 just like Diablo 2 with better graphics 3D plus an advancement of the storyline, and of course a WarCraft 4 RTS would be nice as well. Then they can dump the elements from WarCraft 4 into one of WoW's future expansions...

derjester

10-30-2005, 12:14 AM

As far as the raw numbers go it's hard to get any solid data on who's new and who's not. People play multiple MMO's and people quit MMO's for good. Last I heard WoW had hit 4.5 million subscriptions. You also have to keep in mind that the Warcraft fanbase is going to buy into whatever gets dished out. Those that played all the RTS games would be rabid to run around the game on foot. I could see many of the subscriptions coming from that as well as the Diablo fan base. Mainly due to the Online RPG elements.
Again, it's jsut pure speculation but it would be logical to say that many new MMO players entered the genre to play Warcraft.
It's also interesting to note that Warcraft is the worst selling Blizzard game. Diablo and Starcraft both out sell Warcraft. It's interesting to see them use their least popular lore to start an MMO. Although it's probably the most developed. Just tossing that out there. Unfortunately I don't have anything to site to back it up though. Sorry.

Savok

10-30-2005, 12:37 AM

WoW is huge, most people I meet say it's their first MMOG. Same with most people I know as well.

bto

10-30-2005, 01:38 AM

Blizzcon came and went, and still, no Diablo 3 announcement or any signs of it....

DeadPixel

10-30-2005, 02:41 AM

Lets see, I clearly remember threads where people begged for Diablo 3, yet I keep reading all this whining. 80+ posts and 1/2 of them are cynical messages of how Diablo 3 is a bad idea, MMO or not.

Somehow I'm not suprised.

Thin_J

10-30-2005, 04:43 AM

WoW is huge, most people I meet say it's their first MMOG. Same with most people I know as well.

Yeah, I know of at least a couple of people who've never played computer games before, but they play WoW almost religiously.

holysin

10-30-2005, 07:19 AM

Everything I want from Diablo 3 is right here (http://www.hellgatelondon.com/).

ok... so it's "just like diablo", only in first person insted of third person isometric, and it's in the future rathar than in the past...

I still fail to see the relation :)
I think as hell fate london as serious sam with rpg elements heh

Kefkataran

10-30-2005, 09:47 AM

LOL! I'm pretty tired of their "upcoming awesome surprises" being more and more MMO stuff. I want my Starcraft 2!

It wasn't an MMO. There was no surprise. This was a stupid rumor. Shut up.

WTF is with all this MMOGs ??!?!?! I want to play with myself. Is that too fucking difficult for these asswipes to understand ??!!? Fuck them.

but stow the fucking MMOG shit.
I have never played or payed for a MMOG and I never will.

Are these idiots too fucking stupid to understand that the market for people who don't play online is a whole lot bigger than those who do ??? Fuck you Fuck yo Fuck you if it is true.

They didn't announce another MMO. This was a stupid rumor. Shut. Up.

WoW is huge, most people I meet say it's their first MMOG. Same with most people I know as well.

Quote for truth (and because Savok's backing me up on an argument, and that's a novelty for sure).

Blizzcon came and went, and still, no Diablo 3 announcement or any signs of it....

Thank you.

ok... so it's "just like diablo", only in first person insted of third person isometric, and it's in the future rathar than in the past...

I still fail to see the relation
I think as hell fate london as serious sam with rpg elements heh

You get inventory and level up and such the same way as Diablo and it's made by ex-Bliz employees who originally created Diablo. The only real non-Diablo elements are the two you named -- it's first-person and in the future.

Also: most of you get way too worked up over dumb rumors. And games in general. Chill out.

The_Darr

10-30-2005, 10:03 AM

Diablo MMO? Fucking lame.
1000 times ditto.

Murmillo

10-30-2005, 10:39 AM

Either way, if an Diablo MMO was announced, all you little bitches would have bent over with your monthy $15 in hand going "Yes Sir! Thank You Blizzard! May I Have Another!"

51|RandoM

10-30-2005, 11:09 AM

More Diablo? Excellent. How about some atmosphere this time? And maybe design it with consoles in mind?

uh, your two requirements are mutually exclusive.

Shifteh

10-30-2005, 11:09 AM

Heaven invading hell? Uh, no, it seems to say the opposite.

51|RandoM

10-30-2005, 11:16 AM

Just because somebody says "MMO", don't assume it is the rev. 1 MMO gameplay we're all familiar with, that blizzard capitalized on by polishing just about every facet it of in WoW.

I think what people are seeing when they see MMO is SUBSCRIPTION MMO and that is why they're freaking. Me, I'm all for persistant universes, challenge from other players, and a real community. Doesn't mean I can't spend most of my real adventuring solo, though---just like in most of WoW, you might notice.

I very much enjoyed the first diablo, while thought the second diablo was just MotS, with a less interesting story.