In-Game XMB and Trophies Confirmed

[Talon-]

Good news for all PS3 owners by way of the official Playstation Blog (http://blog.us.playstation.com/2008/06/17/firmware-v236-coming-soon-v240-to-include-trophies-in-game-xmb/).

We’re happy to officially report that the 2.40 system software update for PS3 will include “XMB” access in-game. The update will also include “trophies,” an exciting new feature that we’ll be providing more details on soon, as well as some other new enhancements.

The phrase "better late than never" comes to mind right about now. Good news nonetheless.

[bapenguin]

Still, it looks like it's two updates away yet. 2.36 comes first...and then this. My guess is right around E3 this will hit.

[pseudopseudo]

Now, please. Kthxbye.

No seriously, the sooner they can implement this, the better.

[frederec]

They seem very quiet on when either 2.40 or 2.36 will come out. Is everyone's guess around E3, or is there more concrete information out there?

[Rogue_hunter]

What's gonna be in 2.36 to make them have to wait for 2.4? It's not like 2.36 stuff can't be slipstreamed into 2.4.

[Talon-]

They seem very quiet on when either 2.40 or 2.36 will come out. Is everyone's guess around E3, or is there more concrete information out there?

It's guesswork. The rumor's been Summer of this year for a while, though, and it isn't summer yet. ;)

This is just a confirmation of a (long needed) feature.

[King Drewsky]

No date = not newsworthy.

[oldjadedgamer]

Does this include cross game invites?

[Siraris]

I'm guessing 2.36 this Thursday for fixes, and then 2.40 at E3, or the week before. I'm guessing the E3 focus will be on the video store on PSN.

What would be nice is, if they elaborated on what in-game XMB was going to offer. If all I can do is check messages and look at photos, I'm going to be pretty upset.

[violentp]

Hot diggity daffodils.

[mister_slim]

Does this include cross game invites?

Cross-game invites are already available. This will make them usable though.

[Entropy Effect]

I am really hoping that the rumor that backwards compatibility for the 40 GB model will be added via firmware update is true as well.

[Deadend]

2.41 for it to work well.

It is better late than never, but you think that with a year after the release of Xbox 360 that Sony would have been able to rip it off at launch.

[Talon-]

I am really hoping that the rumor that backwards compatibility for the 40 GB model will be added via firmware update is true as well.

Could be possible. The software emulation for the 80 GB is slightly...confusing.

Here's the official word from a SCEE rep (by way of Kotaku (http://kotaku.com/gaming/customer-service/sony-could-run-bc-on-40gb-ps3s-they-just-dont-want-to-308467.php) back when the 40 GB launched.

The 40GB model, to be launched in Europe on 10th October, is a new model and is not equipped with any of the semi conductors from the PS2, and backwards compatibility would therefore have to be achieved by software emulation alone. The sheer numbers of PS2 titles available, together with the increased complexity of using a software only solution for each and every title means that to ensure accurate software emulation for the majority would be technically challenging, time consuming and costly. As we have mentioned on several occasions, our engineering resources are now focused on developing new and innovative features and services for the PS3 and, as a result the 40GB model does not have backwards compatibility with PS2 titles.

So this means it's possible, right?

PS2
On the other hand, backwards compatibility for PS2 titles is largely made possible through the use of actual semiconductors, supported by the PS3 system software. The 20GB and 60GB PS3 models launched in Japan and the USA were equipped with both the PS2 Emotion Engine and Graphics Synthesizer chips and we could therefore guarantee over 90% backwards compatibility for PS2 titles.

The 60GB model launched in Europe was a new model (shared with the 80GB model launched subsequently in USA) which contains only a modified version of the Graphics Synthesizer chip from the PS2 and not the Emotion Engine chip. The European launch model therefore used a combination of software and the modified version of the PS2 Graphics Synthesizer chip to deliver backwards compatibility for PS2 titles. As a result the percentage of backwards compatible PS2 titles was slightly reduced.

The 40GB model, to be launched in Europe on 10th October, is a new model and is not equipped with any of the semi conductors from the PS2, and backwards compatibility would therefore have to be achieved by software emulation alone. The sheer numbers of PS2 titles available, together with the increased complexity of using a software only solution for each and every title means that to ensure accurate software emulation for the majority would be technically challenging, time consuming and costly. As we have mentioned on several occasions, our engineering resources are now focused on developing new and innovative features and services for the PS3 and, as a result the 40GB model does not have backwards compatibility with PS2 titles.

The current PS3 system software and future updates will continue to support backwards compatibility for the current 60GB and 80GB models, and publishers can check their new PS2 titles to ensure they play on the 60GB and 80GB models.

So the 80 GB model actually uses a combination of a Hardware and Software emulation.

It's possible that Sony actually went back and developed a software solution for emulation. I wouldn't bet on it, though.

[Entropy Effect]

Here's the official word from a SCEE rep

Thanks for all the additional info. I didn't realize before that the 80 GB model still had some hardware components that supported BC. I guess the best hope is that they will develop a pure software emulator to allow the sale of downloadable PS2 games, and that it will also support PS2 discs.

[Gorvi]

It's about damn time.

EDIT: Funny enough, I turn on the PS3 and 2.36 is out right now. Currently downloading.

[Siraris]

Cross-game invites are already available. This will make them usable though.

Proof that they are available?

[Gorvi]

Proof that they are available?
Some games have them, they're just automated PSN messages, which are useless since you can't actually check your messages ingame currently. I think R6: V had them, since for some reason someone sent me an invite to play that game (a game I would probably never own).

[mister_slim]

Some games have them, they're just automated PSN messages, which are useless since you can't actually check your messages ingame currently. I think R6: V had them, since for some reason someone sent me an invite to play that game (a game I would probably never own).

Yes. Rock Band and Army of Two also do this.

[Rogue_hunter]

According to the RSS feed from Joystiq, 2.36 is available now. 2.4 could be as soon as next week (doubtful though)

[diablopath]

According to the RSS feed from Joystiq, 2.36 is available now. 2.4 could be as soon as next week (doubtful though)

Yeah, just downloaded 2.36.

[mister_slim]

In doesn't seem to do much though.

[menage]

Greta news. Hopefully this will work with older games as well (throphies).

If BC is included at some point I will be very happy indeed.

[Morratut]

If this puts in cross game invites and in game messaging AND chat between games then I might start picking up more multiplatform titles for the PS3. It always loses out to my 360 due to the multiplayer aspects. Compared to 360 the multplayer aspects is terrible.

If this is implemented right I might actually be able to sell my friends a PS3. I would love to play Warhawk on a server full of friends :)

[grognard66]

So if Sony finally starts bundling a headset and component cables in their box they can finally match what the 360 offered gamers over 2 years ago. Brilliant.

Sadly, this is pretty useless at this stage in the game. The overwhelming majority of PS3 owners still do not engage in voicechat and are not accustomed to this feature set which will be adopted and incorporated unevenly leading to a segmented community (game by game, rather than across the entire system).

[Yeti2005]

I hope you'll actually be able to see your friend's trophies online (before Home gets here) else what's the point. People love or hate the 360's achievements but honestly they're a great way to see how far your friends are in a given game or if they've accomplished a particularly hard challenge.

Honestly though XMB would be good enough for me at this point.

[Entropy Effect]

So if Sony finally starts bundling a headset and component cables in their box they can finally match what the 360 offered gamers over 2 years ago. Brilliant.

Not that you don't have a valid point, but after getting a PS3 recently, I actually think the hardware provides substantially more value out of the box than the 360. Built-in wireless, a next-gen video player, no fee for on-line play, plus more HDD space and the ability to upgrade with your own HDD.

[Food Nipple]

Not that you don't have a valid point, but after getting a PS3 recently, I actually think the hardware provides substantially more value out of the box than the 360. Built-in wireless, a next-gen video player, no fee for on-line play, plus more HDD space and the ability to upgrade with your own HDD.

I don't think anyone is questioning the value. The problem is that there's essential accessories that aren't included in the box.

[51|RandoM]

So if Sony finally starts bundling a headset and component cables in their box they can finally match what the 360 offered gamers over 2 years ago. Brilliant.


...and if Microsoft starts bundling a BD drive with their 360, bundling wireless, the ability to run an alternative OS, the ability to use any USB peripherals you want, including mice and keyboards, the ability to play multiplayer games without paying a tax for it, the ability to browse the web, the ability to fold@home, the ability to share Live games, the ability to turn on your console without fear of it dying, the ability to use motion control in their games, the ability to network with a handheld they don't even have, and internalizes their humongous power supply they can finally match what the ps3 offered gamers over 2 years ago. Brilliant.

As far as the video cable goes, people who complain about it not being included are being somewhat ignorant. Do you want to buy one cable, the cable you need, or do you want to pay more for a ps3 that includes a component cable, and an hdmi-hdmi cable, and an hdmi-dvi cable? They're saving you money by not making you pay---and the consumer would be the one eating the added costs---for two cables you do not need just to get the one you do need included.

I myself cheated and just used the component cable from my PS2. ;)

Headset works the same way, why make everybody pay for a headset that many will not want in the first place and many will end up replacing anyways? You get to buy whatever type of headset you want---if you even want one, don't forget that multiplayer is still the minority when it comes to console gaming---be it wired or wireless, and if you happen to have a USB or Bluetooth headset already you don't have to buy another licensed peripheral. The flipside is that generally speaking, the people on PSN with a headset bought it because they recognize the value voicecom adds to teamplay, which makes for a more civil environment than what you get on Live where half the people seem to think the headset is their enabler for anonymous Internet assholery.

[Talon-]

So if Sony finally starts bundling a headset and component cables in their box they can finally match what the 360 offered gamers over 2 years ago. Brilliant.

Sadly, this is pretty useless at this stage in the game. The overwhelming majority of PS3 owners still do not engage in voicechat and are not accustomed to this feature set which will be adopted and incorporated unevenly leading to a segmented community (game by game, rather than across the entire system).

Sometimes I wish the 360 didn't bundle a headset.

Especially when there's an asshat singing the "Numa Numa" song.

[Mashidar]

The flipside is that generally speaking, the people on PSN with a headset bought it because they recognize the value voicecom adds to teamplay, which makes for a more civil environment than what you get on Live where half the people seem to think the headset is their enabler for anonymous Internet assholery.

Oi wish I could agree here with you Random. So far most of the folks i've encountered on voice chat with the PSN are cut from the same cloth as those on Xbox Live. From Warhawk, MG Online, and Texas Hold'em I always run into the usual bunch that I would as easy on Xbox Live. Heck last night in both Metal Gear Online and in Warhawk I had to mute folks because they were that annoying.

I do wish that the Playstation had a mic for all folks with the system just because more folks might use it. So far in most of my Metal Gear matchs there's myself and another one or two folks that are using a mic and the same goes for Warhawk. At least with the xbox I know most folks have a mic and are deciding not to use it instead of knowing that some folks just don't want to have to pay for a USB mic or a Bluetooth headset.

[MrE]

Can we get a list of older games that support trophies? Or, is this up to the developer to update the achievem..., er, trophies list?

[pseudopseudo]

The flipside is that generally speaking, the people on PSN with a headset bought it because they recognize the value voicecom adds to teamplay, which makes for a more civil environment than what you get on Live where half the people seem to think the headset is their enabler for anonymous Internet assholery.

I don't know. After playing quite a few hours of Warhawk, I can't be inclined to agree with you on that point. Seems to be an equal amount of asshats on PSN (in my experience with that single game) as there are on Live.

I've not played MGS4 online yet... I can't imagine the environment's too much better.

Also:

...and if Microsoft starts bundling a BD drive with their 360, bundling wireless, the ability to run an alternative OS, the ability to use any USB peripherals you want, including mice and keyboards, the ability to play multiplayer games without paying a tax for it, the ability to browse the web, the ability to fold@home, the ability to share Live games, the ability to turn on your console without fear of it dying, the ability to use motion control in their games, the ability to network with a handheld they don't even have, and internalizes their humongous power supply they can finally match what the ps3 offered gamers over 2 years ago. Brilliant.

If a majority of gamers cared about BD movies, alternative OS', USB peripherals, browsing the web on their console, folding@home, motion control (in the way Sony does it anyhow - obviously, people are retarded over the way Nintendo implemented it), networking with handhelds, and the power supply that would be a pretty damning list. As it stands, most don't (keyword: "most" - not all).

If you asked me, yeah, PS3 is definitely more impressive out of the box. However, I would've been happier with half of those things and another $100 off the price.

[grognard66]

...and if Microsoft starts bundling a BD drive with their 360, bundling wireless, the ability to run an alternative OS, the ability to use any USB peripherals you want, including mice and keyboards, the ability to play multiplayer games without paying a tax for it, the ability to browse the web, the ability to fold@home, the ability to share Live games, the ability to turn on your console without fear of it dying, the ability to use motion control in their games, the ability to network with a handheld they don't even have, and internalizes their humongous power supply they can finally match what the ps3 offered gamers over 2 years ago. Brilliant.

As far as the video cable goes, people who complain about it not being included are being somewhat ignorant. Do you want to buy one cable, the cable you need, or do you want to pay more for a ps3 that includes a component cable, and an hdmi-hdmi cable, and an hdmi-dvi cable? They're saving you money by not making you pay---and the consumer would be the one eating the added costs---for two cables you do not need just to get the one you do need included.

I myself cheated and just used the component cable from my PS2. ;)

Headset works the same way, why make everybody pay for a headset that many will not want in the first place and many will end up replacing anyways? You get to buy whatever type of headset you want---if you even want one, don't forget that multiplayer is still the minority when it comes to console gaming---be it wired or wireless, and if you happen to have a USB or Bluetooth headset already you don't have to buy another licensed peripheral. The flipside is that generally speaking, the people on PSN with a headset bought it because they recognize the value voicecom adds to teamplay, which makes for a more civil environment than what you get on Live where half the people seem to think the headset is their enabler for anonymous Internet assholery.

I was very careful to say what 360 offered GAMERS compared to PS3. BD offers value to people who want a movie player but is actually a detrement to gamers with its slow speed. It's ironic that the Blu-Ray has required several gig installs (multiple installs in MGS4's case) which kind of defeats the purpose of all that space on the disc in the first place. If you're going to go through that hassle why not just have a separate install disc like PC games do sometimes where all the critical assets are put on the HD and then have a separate Play disc - that solves the supposed DVD size issue right there.

As far as wireless, no one that is serious about online gaming would go wireless. I understand your reservations about bundling the cables and the headset, but I think the lack of the headset is the biggest reason PS3 has such a terrible online community. It's a shame that games such as Warhawk which require good communication are doomed because the overwhelming majority of PS3 gamers don't use a headset simply because it wasn't included. Sure, most people that do talk on either PSN or 360 are immature homophobic racist jerks, but with the right tools and feature set you can sift through that to build up a robust list of like minded gamers eventually.

folding@home, web browsing and running an alt OS are just gimmicks to divert consumers from the fact that they have far fewer quality games to actually play on their GAMING system and a diminished gaming experience thanks to the poor (but free!) PSN service when the rare exclusive does come along worth trying.

[pseudopseudo]

It's a shame that games such as Warhawk which require good communication are doomed because the overwhelming majority of PS3 gamers don't use a headset simply because it wasn't included. Sure, most people that do talk on either PSN or 360 are immature homophobic racist jerks, but with the right tools and feature set you can sift through that to build up a robust list of like minded gamers eventually.

Just throwing this out there, but the retail version of Warhawk *did* come with a headset. Also... why is it doomed? I play without a headset, and I haven't run into too many problems yet. (Asshats aside.)

[Gorvi]

I'll still never understand why people think online gaming on the PS3 is "poor". I can play a game online if I want, that's all I need (as someone who doesn't do a ton of online gaming). All the little extra things LIVE has for online are nice I guess, but they're superfluous for the most part. Other than the fact that LIVE does have a standard, of course, and Sony seems to let devs do whatever the hell they want with some things (like the asinine Konami IDs) I don't see the problem.

[oldjadedgamer]

I'll still never understand why people think online gaming on the PS3 is "poor". I can play a game online if I want, that's all I need (as someone who doesn't do a ton of online gaming). All the little extra things LIVE has for online are nice I guess, but they're superfluous for the most part. Other than the fact that LIVE does have a standard, of course, and Sony seems to let devs do whatever the hell they want with some things (like the asinine Konami IDs) I don't see the problem.

Take for instance COD4. When the game first came out there were only problems with the PS3 version and not the 360/PC version making the PS3 version unplayable. And as well, there was an issue where PS3 users could not mute anyone in the PS3 version of the game until a patch came out and anyone will tell you that has played COD4, this is a nightmare to not be able to mute people.

http://threespeech.com/blog/2007/11/call-of-duty-4-issues-solved/

Then there was the PS3 issue of GTA4 where Rockstar had to issue a patch and Sony had to issue a firmware update for it.

http://www.eurogamer.net/article.php?article_id=137406

Then the cherry on top of that is the nightmare process it takes and the three different log ins it requires to sign into MGO.

If you only play online games once or so a year then it's not a problem. From what I hear the majority of games work fine but to answer your question, the major games having big problems only on PS3 gives the impression that the service is "poor". It's pretty much a gamble with how well the game is going to run.

[grognard66]

I'll still never understand why people think online gaming on the PS3 is "poor". I can play a game online if I want, that's all I need (as someone who doesn't do a ton of online gaming). All the little extra things LIVE has for online are nice I guess, but they're superfluous for the most part. Other than the fact that LIVE does have a standard, of course, and Sony seems to let devs do whatever the hell they want with some things (like the asinine Konami IDs) I don't see the problem.

It definitely comes down to what you are looking for in an online experience, Gorvi, and I understand that for many people PSN meets their expectations (yeah, that MGS4 sign up crap aside). The community aspect of Live is what I find so appealing and worth the money. While PS3 has game specific communities, I like all the tools Live offers me to find like minded gamers and play a wide variety of games with them which is more difficult to do on PSN. I guess it boils down to a preference of scale for online habits (game vs. system).

[grognard66]

Just throwing this out there, but the retail version of Warhawk *did* come with a headset. Also... why is it doomed? I play without a headset, and I haven't run into too many problems yet. (Asshats aside.)

Yeah, but the online version didn't and based on retail sales figures most of the people playing the game must have downloaded it! :)

I didn't phrase that post very well. I didn't mean to imply it was doomed from a financial perspective, but doomed in terms of meeting the intent of the developers as everything I read from them emphasized the importance of strong communication and coordination which is difficult without voicechat.

[digitalErich]

So...another form of nerd dollars for me to ignore? (I have to come up with a better nickname for PSN trophies, damn it)

[Rogue_hunter]

(I have to come up with a better nickname for PSN trophies, damn it)

Nerd trophies?

[Talon-]

So...another form of nerd dollars for me to ignore? (I have to come up with a better nickname for PSN trophies, damn it)

Anti-poon Points.

[Talon-]

As far as wireless, no one that is serious about online gaming would go wireless. I understand your reservations about bundling the cables and the headset, but I think the lack of the headset is the biggest reason PS3 has such a terrible online community. It's a shame that games such as Warhawk which require good communication are doomed because the overwhelming majority of PS3 gamers don't use a headset simply because it wasn't included. Sure, most people that do talk on either PSN or 360 are immature homophobic racist jerks, but with the right tools and feature set you can sift through that to build up a robust list of like minded gamers eventually.

I play on Live pretty often, and I've used my headset maybe twice.

Maybe I'm not getting the "full experience," but I do just fine playing Halo every so often online because I stay away from the team objective games.

[BlueBomber]

http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.ps3fanboy.com/media/2008/06/possiblytrophiespossiblynotwhoknows.jpg

http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.ps3fanboy.com/media/2008/06/ps3gamercardpage1240608425.jpg
via PS3 Fanboy. (http://www.ps3fanboy.com/2008/06/23/rumor-does-this-image-show-a-ps3-trophy-screen/) Interesting.

[Dukefrukem]

hmm. what do the trophies represent? number of games completed?

[Micasa]

I'll still never understand why people think online gaming on the PS3 is "poor". I can play a game online if I want, that's all I need (as someone who doesn't do a ton of online gaming). All the little extra things LIVE has for online are nice I guess, but they're superfluous for the most part. Other than the fact that LIVE does have a standard, of course, and Sony seems to let devs do whatever the hell they want with some things (like the asinine Konami IDs) I don't see the problem.

Yeah, I don't know why people want to play online with a system that has VOICE CHAT as a standard. I was playing HSG the other day and a friend came over. He watched for a while, but he wanted to head downtown and I said I had to finish the match. He said to just pause it...though I was playing online. He couldn't tell I was playing online.

And that's not because it's so seamless.

[Gorvi]

Yeah, I don't know why people want to play online with a system that has VOICE CHAT as a standard. I was playing HSG the other day and a friend came over. He watched for a while, but he wanted to head downtown and I said I had to finish the match. He said to just pause it...though I was playing online. He couldn't tell I was playing online.

And that's not because it's so seamless.
Did you miss the part where I said LIVE has a standard (which is a good thing)? Part of that is voice chat in every game, something Sony can't seem to get right even in first party games like HSG and GT5:P. Those are the exceptions, though, not the rule.

[Johan]

Wait...they're promising that two updates away they'll have these features?

Wake me when it's actually DONE!

[Vanthar]

Wait...they're promising that two updates away they'll have these features?

Wake me when it's actually DONE!

When they announced it was 2 updates, the first of the two came out within 24 hours. It still isn't done, so your point is valid.

[NationalKato]

So...another form of nerd dollars for me to ignore?

You've already failed to ignore it by posting here. My condolences.

[inmostlight]

Is it just me or do those shots look very amateurish? Like an intern whipped up the design some afternoon?

[Johan]

It still isn't done, so your point is valid.

My only point is this...

I don't give two shits (not even one) what a company says. DO IT. When it's done, tell me about it. I guess I have a second point. Sony, in particular, LIES through "future" promises.

[digitalErich]

You've already failed to ignore it by posting here. My condolences.
I know, I know. I blame MS...the 360's achievements have tricked me into thinking people care about my trivial actions. Their plan worked.

But back to the topic at hand, we have invisible nerd dollars for Achievements, I still need a derogatory zing for trophies to make myself feel better for not having any. We had two good tries, but I wasn't feeling either of those.