Splinter Cell: Conviction Goes "Back to the Drawing Board"?

[Dr.Finger]

UK magazine Xbox World 360 is reporting (via CVG (http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=189247)) that Ubisoft Montreal is unhappy enough with the upcoming Splinter Cell: Conviction that they're taking it "back to the drawing board."

The magazine reports that the decision to put the game back in the can for further development will delay it until 2009, or possibly all the way back to 2010. Ubisoft themselves have declined to comment on the story, although they will be holding their Gamer's Day in Paris next week, so answers may be forthcoming then.

Conviction was supposed to incorporate things like crowd stealth and environmental combat, similar to another Ubisoft Montreal creation: Assassin's Creed, into the traditional Splinter Cell stealth-action gameplay.

Here you have one of the tough questions that developers and publishers have to ask themselves. Do we keep running with the same gameplay and risk letting the property get stale, or do we change things up and risk alienating our core audience? I wasn't enamored with the changes they made to the last Splinter Cell, Double Agent, and I wasn't really looking forward to Conviction. However I applaud Ubi for taking a stand and trying to re work the game this late in the game rather than just shove it out the door. A number of games have taken similar breathers lately, and in most cases it seemed to improve the final product.

[Maskatron]

It's too bad they couldn't have done that with Assassin's Creed, a game that certainly had some good things going for it but was missing a lot. But it looks like they may have learned a lesson.

[TrackZero]

It's too bad they couldn't have done that with Assassin's Creed, a game that certainly had some good things going for it but was missing a lot. But it looks like they may have learned a lesson.

Hey now. Let's not get into that, because not everyone agrees with you on that front.

But where we can agree, it's nice to see a publisher pull a project back instead of just throwing unfinished crap out onto the market.

[Flatpicker]

Was this the 360 exclusive?
If so, does that mean they have to give MS the money back for the exclusive?

[jeffool]

Well said Finglesworth. I applaud Ubi. I mean, then again, they were the ones that said "Third party Nintendo games don't sell? Well, that was probably because we made shit..." So, y'know, Ubisoft fucking rocks in my book.

[Psykoboy2]

I knew something was up. I've been asking about this game for the past month or so and haven't heard anything until now.

[Grey]

They might have rather learned from the latest and worst Splinter Cell... Assassins Creed is another story.

I dont know enough of SCC to judge the decision, but I appreciate UbiSofts atempt to make a good game.

[Grey]

Was this the 360 exclusive?
If so, does that mean they have to give MS the money back for the exclusive?

No it was Microsoft exclusive - PC included :P

[Itchyeyes]

I for one am glad for this. The Splinter Cell series was reaching a point where they were churning them out too fast and diluting the franchise. Making the commitment to taking the next game through a lengthy development cycle and ensuring that they get it right is just what the series needed.

[Kryopsis]

I'd like to remind everybody that Ubisoft Montreal only made two Splinter Cell games so far: the original and Chaos Theory.
Pandora Tomorrow and Double Agent are made by Ubisoft Shanghai.

[GigaFuzz]

I'd like to remind everybody that Ubisoft Montreal only made two Splinter Cell games so far: the original and Chaos Theory.
Pandora Tomorrow and Double Agent are made by Ubisoft Shanghai.

Wasn't Double Agent a bit mixed up? I think the 360 version was made by Shanghai, while the Xbox and PS2 versions were made by Montreal (and were significantly different). I don't know about the PC version.

The better games have certainly come from Montreal though. Call of Duty appears to be following the same formula with same success rate.

Anyway, if this leads to a better game, then I'm all for it. I was a bit worried about the Splinter Cells getting churned out too quickly.

[Grey]

Wasn't Double Agent a bit mixed up? I think the 360 version was made by Shanghai, while the Xbox and PS2 versions were made by Montreal (and were significantly different). I don't know about the PC version.

That's correct. The PC and 360 Version were made by the Shanghai studio while all other versions were made by the Montreal studio.

The Montreal studio is responsible for most of their well known franchise.

[Flatpicker]

I actually wouldn't mind SC taking a break if they replaced it with a new IP.
I don't mean a remade POP, but, something new.

[Grey]

I actually wouldn't mind SC taking a break if they replaced it with a new IP.
I don't mean a remade POP, but, something new.

Why so?

At least UbiSoft isn't Eidos and trys new ways with their IPs. Thats what I high appreciate about Ubi, even if the last SC was terrible on PC.

Splinter Cell is by far still the best stealth action game on the PC. I would love to see more titles coming. Also since they "just" bought the whole TC IP I don't think the end of SC is near. At least Sam deserves a perfect end and that wouldn't be DA.

[Wackman3000]

Although I have never cared for the Splinter Cell series, I do applaud a company for their actions. Better than seeing just another piece of crap full of bugs and stale gameplay.

[Flatpicker]

The yearly SC releases got tiring to me.

[Smoof]

I hope they don't hand the port over to Shanghai, as Double Agent was optimized like shit and ran like shit. Hell, they STILL don't even support the GeForce 8-series and I can't get it to run on my system anymore because of that (I had played it awhile ago when I had a 7-series).

I definitely hope they've done a better job with this latest one when it finally comes out, as I do love the Splinter Cell franchise.

[sleepbox]

Looked like crap. Glad they are re-working it.

[PostedOval]

Last year's Double Agent was the weakest in the series, and the description of the newest game didn't really do much for me. This announcement means they are taking the criticism serious, which is good.

[Kryopsis]

Splinter Cell is by far still the best stealth action game

Fixed it for you. ;0)
The best stealth action games (at the time) were Thief I and II but since Looking Glass was closed down, Splinter Cell/Chaos Theory is the best pure-Stealth action game around.

[rvieira]

I bet this having nothing to do with quality, and they are moving the development staff to work on Assassins Creed Sequel, and I don’t be surprised if part of the development already made would become part of the next AC.

Why bet in an already milked to death IP if you have a pretty new one to milk.

[jeffool]

Because they just paid a ton of cash to be able to freely slap Tom Clancy's name on games with abandon? And at a certain point it's more profitable to just shove crap out the door and hope the next one does better. While I have no clue if they were at that point, that they were thinking long term is a "Good Thing."

[BlueBomber]

Fixed it for you. ;0)
The best stealth action games (at the time) were Thief I and II but since Looking Glass was closed down, Splinter Cell/Chaos Theory is the best pure-Stealth action game around.
How do these games compare to the Metal Gear franchise? I've always enjoyed sneaking games (even Tenchu!), and have always been meaning to try out the Splinter Cell games. I just...never gotten around to it :(.

[51|RandoM]

How do these games compare to the Metal Gear franchise? I've always enjoyed sneaking games (even Tenchu!), and have always been meaning to try out the Splinter Cell games. I just...never gotten around to it :(.

Splinter Cell is basically MGS with all of the wacky removed, and most of the "epicness" drained out of it.

If they were TV shows, Splinter Cell would be 24 and MGS would be Lost.

I think I've used up my bizarre allotment for today between this comparison and my rp post in the Conan thread.

[WaltJay]

I actually wouldn't mind SC taking a break if they replaced it with a new IP.
I don't mean a remade POP, but, something new.

An open-world Batman game running on the Assassin's Creed engine. Do it, Ubisoft! :D

[DaXIthR]

Although I have never cared for the Splinter Cell series, I do applaud a company for their actions. Better than seeing just another piece of crap full of bugs and stale gameplay.

My sentiments exactly. In fact, I hate the SC gameplay, but this is a good move from UbiSoft, as they've been getting a bit lazy lately. Call it 'giant publisher syndrome'.

[Flatpicker]

I bet this having nothing to do with quality, and they are moving the development staff to work on Assassins Creed Sequel, and I don’t be surprised if part of the development already made would become part of the next AC.

Why bet in an already milked to death IP if you have a pretty new one to milk.


That doesn't make sense. They would be giving up 08 revenue for a reduced 09 revenue. AC is going to sell regardless and all you would be doing is doubling dev costs.

Chances are SC:C was sucking donkey balls.

[Dr.Finger]

An open-world Batman game running on the Assassin's Creed engine. Do it, Ubisoft! :DI've been saying for a while now, combine the free running of Assassin's Creed with the stealth and gadgets of Splinter Cell and you'd have the makings of an incredible Batman game.

[Flatpicker]

I've been saying for a while now, combine the free running of Assassin's Creed with the stealth and gadgets of Splinter Cell and you'd have the makings of an incredible Batman game.
But, you would have to add in the detective elements.
Story seems to be Ubi's weakness.

[Wackman3000]

I've been saying for a while now, combine the free running of Assassin's Creed with the stealth and gadgets of Splinter Cell and you'd have the makings of an incredible Batman game.

Have they ever managed to make a successful batman game? I remember as a kid playing countless crappy iterations of Batman games, all failing to get the job done.

I think you are on the right track with that train of thought my friend.

[H.Bogard]

Splinter Cell is by far still the best stealth action game on the PC.

You need to play some more PC stealth games. (http://www.eidosinteractive.co.uk/gss/thief_ds/)

[Dr.Finger]

Have they ever managed to make a successful batman game? I remember as a kid playing countless crappy iterations of Batman games, all failing to get the job done.

I think you are on the right track with that train of thought my friend.There hasn't been a good game based on a DC property since the SNES days, while they've also been responsible for several of the worst games of all time. The track record is not good, to say the least.
But, you would have to add in the detective elements.
Story seems to be Ubi's weakness.Detective gameplay is tough to do without turning it into a straight up Myst-like adventure game. The investigations from AC would be a good start, maybe with a little bit of the gadgets from Condemned.

As for story, there are a bunch of writers out there that have dome great Batman books, and several of them have experience with VG writing (Greg Rucka, Doug Moensch, JM DeMatteis, etc) so you can get a good to great story, if the developer and publisher are willing to spend a few extra bucks on it.

[tombofsoldier]

Awesome! Conviction looked nothing like a Splinter Cell game, it also looked like it was going to be monumentally stupid. The pretending to be a priest stuff was not only stupid, but boring in Assassins Creed, I can't imagine how bad an entire game based around that would be.

While they're at it could they remove a lot of shooting the series seems to have taken on over time? I want my stealthy Splinter Cell 1 gameplay back, not the sneak up behind people and murder them game the series has become.

[CynicSter]

I love the splinter cells and this is good. Conviction looked terrible. I really like Double Agent. The co-op LIve play was fun.

[Claus DuBois]

Fixed it for you. ;0)
The best stealth action games (at the time) were Thief I and II but since Looking Glass was closed down, Splinter Cell/Chaos Theory is the best pure-Stealth action game around.

I agree, the two early Thief series were tremendous, and the user mods for these two games were often lengthier and better than most new games pushed out the door today. Although I thourougly enjoyed Assassin's Creed, Thief 1 & 2 are both far superior in my book because (1) the stealth really actually mattered in T1 & T2 and (2) the immense variety of missons in T1 & T2. Now if you could just update Thief 1 & 2 with the Assassin's Creed graphics/engine or the early SC graphics/engine I'd have a wet dream. I still return to Thief 1 & 2 when I want some supreme stealth action, with the first 3 SC's for a secondary stealth fix.

[Kryopsis]

You need to play some more PC stealth games. (http://www.eidosinteractive.co.uk/gss/thief_ds/)

Try again (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thief_II).

[Grey]

Try again (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thief_II).

Try it now (http://www.thedarkmod.com/) :)

[DarkDaY]

Im glad for this also, too many games coming to begin with and something about Conviction wasn't doing it for me. Maybe it was the emo hair. Maybe Ubi is waiting to find out if there is going to be a new fad/trend with the younger disenchanted generation and their hair styles.

[Kryopsis]

Truly a game that never dies. I played the ThieveryUT mod and it was quite fun...
Thief III/Deadly Shadows was a good game, don't get me wrong, but it wasn't as good as II and some of the design decisions were questionable. Also, with the exception of the Keepers, the other factions were a joke. Shoot cornerstones with moss arrows? Come on!

[Xerxes]

So Sam Fisher will be Jason Bourne no more... I actually thought crowd stealth would be interesting after thinking about how Jason was hiding in the crowd at the train station in the last movie. It's still cool. I still have 5 Splinter Cell games I need to beat.

[Deadend]

For a taste of what Conviction would probably have ended up like, play the first seqence of the Bourne demo.

It would be really hard to make the game both challenging, open and where you don't get fucked over easily by blind corners. Even though the idea is fun, of a game based around being sneaky, but not shadowbased, but like walking incognito in AC was veeery boring because of the slow pacing... I figure with the social stealth thing, it's really boring, but easy to not be seen. Add in the trouble of having a game at a fast pace where you are running away, without a clear way to show escape routes, players will be having to constantly die and restart.

But then again, this is the studio that did Prince of Persia, and you can bet your ass they are watching Mirrors Edge to see some solutions to their issues.

I remember a good chunk of the stealth used to revolve around using a hoodie, or other forms of dressup, that would get really boring and lame after awhile, to be constantly changing clothes when spotted.

As the concept is really ambitious, but there are sooo many ways for it to fuck up and be not fun. Then you have the combat, the objectives, and the story to worry about as well. At this point, they might as well just make the game a new IP as it's so far from Spinter Cell, fuck may as well roll this into the Desmond segments for AC2.

[Grey]

Truly a game that never dies. I played the ThieveryUT mod and it was quite fun...
Thief III/Deadly Shadows was a good game, don't get me wrong, but it wasn't as good as II and some of the design decisions were questionable. Also, with the exception of the Keepers, the other factions were a joke. Shoot cornerstones with moss arrows? Come on!

Funny thing while this is actualy a Splinter Cell topic: the worst thing for me (besides some gameplay glitches) was the retarded graphic. DS came out after SCPT and UT2004 which both had way better visuals.

No offense, but IS literally raped the UE for releasing it multiplattform. I wont dare to mention Deus Ex 2.... -.-

[archon]

I liked Double Agent... on the original Xbox. Montreal did that version and in my opinion it is superior in every way except for graphics to the 360 edition, and when you play it in 720p/1080p backwards compatible mode, it looks damn near like a 360 game itself. It's great.

Secondly: http://www.eurogamer.net/article.php?article_id=141197

Ubisoft is denying the claim that they have went back to the drawing board. I guess we'll see what the truth is eventually.

[H.Bogard]

Truly a game that never dies. I played the ThieveryUT mod and it was quite fun...
Thief III/Deadly Shadows was a good game, don't get me wrong, but it wasn't as good as II and some of the design decisions were questionable. Also, with the exception of the Keepers, the other factions were a joke. Shoot cornerstones with moss arrows? Come on!

The Shalebridge Cradle alone made it worth the price of admission, and superior to the previous games in every way.

[Grey]

The Shalebridge Cradle alone made it worth the price of admission, and superior to the previous games in every way.

I think I and II had somehow more style... they are more edgy, but I like them still more as DS. Shalebridge Cradle was realy creepy and well done... though I've missed something in general.

[Freak705]

Thank god. I used to be a Splinter Cell nut, I loved the first 3 games to death, and the original (PT and CT) Spies vs Mercs was such a deep and enjoyable multiplayer experience. I thought Chaos Theory was the best game there was for the original Xbox. But Double Agent really sucked. They took a step way back, I thought the HUD-less type presentation was awful (where's my detailed stealth and sound meter?), and going into daytime I thought was a bad move. Sam Fisher\s missions by nature require a stealthy atmosphere.. And then the 'new' Spies vs Mercs was such a simplified mess it offended me.. :p

Here's hoping they go back in the Chaos Theory direction. Pummeling people with chairs was just not very Splinter Cell-y

[The Iron Weasel]

They'll never top Chaos Theory. Ever.

[Xerxes]

I liked Double Agent... on the original Xbox. Montreal did that version and in my opinion it is superior in every way except for graphics to the 360 edition, and when you play it in 720p/1080p backwards compatible mode, it looks damn near like a 360 game itself. It's great.

This. I think the story is even more of a in between Chaos Theory and the next gen version. This is why I claim 5 games to play. Yeah yeah skip the Shanghai games, but I'd play it all if I sat down with them.


Secondly: http://www.eurogamer.net/article.php?article_id=141197

Ubisoft is denying the claim that they have went back to the drawing board. I guess we'll see what the truth is eventually.

That's interesting. I think it can go either way. The soft whites from the last video I saw did look like AC.

[Freak705]

Thats unfortunate. I hope its reworked. At this point I don't even have the tiniest bit of interest in it, as-it-is.

[archon]

Exactly, Xerxes. Plus, Xbox version even had coop. IT HAD COOP, PEOPLE! It's just a better Splinter Cell game, and a solid follow up to Chaos Theory.

If they want to take a new direction with the series, I say ditch Sam Fisher and stay with Third Echelon. You're a new Splinter Cell working for US government, but it can be more futuristic/high tech than in previous games. Not to the point where it becomes 100% sci fi, because it'll still at its core be about sneaking around in the shadows, but perhaps more gadgety... maybe more Batman/ninja-ish. It'd be kinda cool to do more parkour/freerunning type stuff.

[Rogue_hunter]

Splinter Cell is basically MGS with all of the wacky removed, and most of the "epicness" drained out of it.

If they were TV shows, Splinter Cell would be 24 and MGS would be Lost.

I think I've used up my bizarre allotment for today between this comparison and my rp post in the Conan thread.

Such a great comparison, damn. I don't think this is really bizarre, but whatever.

As to the delay, I just hope this is not being developed by the dev team that did the PC version of Double Agent, as all the fun was completely drained away. And hopefully emo Sam has also been wiped out.

[Abash Alarmist]

I just want the multiplayer of Chaos Theory...I had no love for the ADD addled version that they gave us for Double Agent.

[Xerxes]

Exactly, Xerxes. Plus, Xbox version even had coop. IT HAD COOP, PEOPLE! It's just a better Splinter Cell game, and a solid follow up to Chaos Theory.

If they want to take a new direction with the series, I say ditch Sam Fisher and stay with Third Echelon. You're a new Splinter Cell working for US government, but it can be more futuristic/high tech than in previous games. Not to the point where it becomes 100% sci fi, because it'll still at its core be about sneaking around in the shadows, but perhaps more gadgety... maybe more Batman/ninja-ish. It'd be kinda cool to do more parkour/freerunning type stuff.

Ditch Sam Fisher? Sounds like you talking some foolishness now. Like the same foolishness that got Ding Chavez leading a reworked rainbow squads.

[archon]

Ditch Sam Fisher? Sounds like you talking some foolishness now. Like the same foolishness that got Ding Chavez leading a reworked rainbow squads.

heh, well at least Ding was an actual character from the Clancy novels, so it kinda makes sense. The Rainbow series more or less appeared to turn out okay (although I don't play them anymore). I don't see why it'd be such a big deal to have a main character besides Sam Fisher. I mean it is Tom Clancy's Splinter Cell and not Tom Clancy's Sam Fisher. They could still have him be a secondary character somehow, like maybe have you hunt him down since it's after Double Agent.

[TrackZero]

That's correct. The PC and 360 Version were made by the Shanghai studio while all other versions were made by the Montreal studio.

The Montreal studio is responsible for most of their well known franchise.

I thought Chaos Theory was 3 studios? (Or teams at least.) One for single player, one for the co-op missions and one for the online deathmatch/other modes.

[Abash Alarmist]

I thought Chaos Theory was 3 studios? (Or teams at least.) One for single player, one for the co-op missions and one for the online deathmatch/other modes.

Two. Montreal for SP and an outsourced one for both multiplayer components.

[Abash Alarmist]

Two. Montreal for SP and an outsourced one for both multiplayer components.

Why can't I edit my own post? What the hell.

Anyways, Montreal for SP and coop and Ubisoft Annecy for Versus.

[Crowe]

So my net has been down for over a week now. And I spent the whole time replaying every splinter cell game. Chaos Theory rocked, I had a great time with it and was really looking forward to getting into Double Agent.

Needless to say I was pretty disappointed from the get go. The introduction sucked pretty bad, could they not have found a better way to introduce the death of Fisher's daughter and how he hit rock bottom. The gameplay itself wasn't too bad but it felt like a step down. Come the end of the game I felt pretty let down and I don't know how I feel about this next game.

[Variable Gear]

Chaos Theory is indeed awesome, if you can ignore the horrible cheating AI.

I've always wanted to see the series played with a touch-screen controller, so it'd be nice if Ubi could delay Conviction until then. :p

[Crowe]

Chaos Theory is indeed awesome, if you can ignore the horrible cheating AI.


The Korean Lvl where you had to prevent the arming of the bomb mid-air was actually the Matrix. Only Neo could have jumped to the side dodging the bullet heading for his face.....Everytime. Other than that though I thought it was super easy easy to sneak up on enemies Chaos Theory.

[Wolvie]

Another game did this back in the day. Yeah I'm talking about Resident Evil 2. And that turned out to be one of the greatest games of all time. This could turn SC:C from an average game, to a great game.

[Yeti2005]

Splinter Cell was the first game to do stealth multiplayer correctly (sorry MGS). I'm glad they're taking their time.

[the soUL TRAder]

I agree, let them take all the time they need.

But, could they at least release a XBL game with Co-op and ChoasTheory MP, even if it's an overpriced Marketplace game.

[Shankle Bunny]

I am sad because i was REALLY looking forward to this, but glad because my wallet needs the breathing room. It's a day 1 purchase for me, whenever it comes out.