Alcatraz to Become a 'Peace Center'?

[Dr.Finger]

This story just made my day (http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080205/od_uk_nm/oukoe_uk_usa_politics_alcatraz_1). SAN FRANCISCO (Reuters) - San Francisco voters will decide on Tuesday whether to remove the famous Alcatraz Prison visited by thousands of tourists a day and instead create a "global peace centre."

The proposition sharing the presidential primary ballot comes from the director of the California-based Global Peace Foundation who gives his name as Da Vid. He says transforming Alcatraz will "liberate energies, raising the whole consciousness of the Bay Area."

Supporters would like to raze the prison and build a medicine wheel, a labyrinth and a conference centre for non-violent conflict resolution. Volunteers collected 10,350 voter signatures last year to put it on the local ballot.

But even in a city long famed for its embrace of counterculture, many are sceptical[sic] about he plan.

"Perhaps we haven't reached the proper stage of enlightenment yet, but we're more inclined to support propositions with defined sources of funding attached to them," the San Francisco Chronicle said in an editorial.

Alcatraz is San Francisco's second-most popular paid tourist attraction after cable cars, luring 1.4 million visitors annually on a short ferry ride into San Francisco Bay.California has a history of putting some...interesting proposals on the ballot, but this one is almost too funny to be true.

If I hadn't seen the Reuters byline I would have said that this was some sort of parody of San Francisco. From the quote attributed to 'Da Vid' to the line about the desire to "liberate energies, raising the whole consciousness of the Bay Area" the whole things sounds too funny to be true. Except that it (apparently) is. Part of me still thinks this is a prank taken a step further than expected, but part of me is also laughing my ass off.

[violentp]

Eh, reading this on the sidebar I was praying it'd end with "Theme Park".

[H.Bogard]

http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/3552/alcatraz2smfh1.jpg
^
Not happy

[Disgustipated]

Does anyone else find it ironic that you'd build a peace center on a place where you kept murderers and rapists? Heh. I guess the new visitors wouldn't be too far from the old ones.

This is one big joke that, knowing these crazy San Franians, might come true.

[iHap]

I hope everyone decides to keep the famous prison there. I still have yet to visit, and would still like to. "Fucking West Coast hippies. Go eat some granola."

[Baron Samedi]

Maybe them can turn it into a gay love farm! Oh wait....

[TheKeck]

Eh, reading this on the sidebar I was praying it'd end with "Theme Park".
I was hoping for "Paintball Arena".

[NationalKato]

"Now this is something the other tour guides won't tell you. In this particular cell-block, Machine Gun Kelly had what we call in the prison system, a "bitch". And one night in a jealous rage Kelly took a make-shift knife - or "shiv" - and cut out the bitch's eyes. And as if this wasn't enough retribution for Kelly, the next day he and four other inmates took turns pissing into the bitch's ocular cavities. [short pause] This way to the cafeteria!" - John Johnson (aka "Vicky"), So I Married An Axe Murderer

[violentp]

I was hoping for "Paintball Arena".

Damn. That sounds fucking hot.

[walkstheplanes]

This story just made my day (http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080205/od_uk_nm/oukoe_uk_usa_politics_alcatraz_1).California has a history of putting some...interesting proposals on the ballot, but this one is almost too funny to be true.


Support for this is fairly small (compared to everyone else who thinks this idea is stupid), so don't make fun of us Californians yet.

[IrishWhiskey]

Chances of this passing: 0%

[baggle]

California has a history of putting some...interesting proposals on the ballot, but this one is almost too funny to be true.
Let's be fair here, this isn't California voting for this, which is a big, diverse state (yes, even politically), this is San Francisco, where pretentious hippies are made and ignorance is fostered, as long as it fits in with their world view. If this were a state-wide vote, it would go down in some serious flames. However, as a SF city vote, no one really knows how it will go.

[walkstheplanes]

Let's be fair here, this isn't California voting for this, which is a big, diverse state (yes, even politically), this is San Francisco, where pretentious hippies are made and ignorance is fostered, as long as it fits in with their world view. If this were a state-wide vote, it would go down in some serious flames. However, as a SF city vote, no one really knows how it will go.

Don't be a victim of the same accusations you gave to Mal in that Cloned Animal thread.

Give us Bay Area folk a little bit more credit, the majority of us definitely are definitely not ignorant hippies (though pretentious, yes). This proposal will not happen, and it won't be close at all.

[Disgustipated]

Don't be a victim of the same accusations you gave to Mal in that Cloned Animal thread.

Give us Bay Area folk a little bit more credit, the majority of us definitely are definitely not ignorant hippies (though pretentious, yes). This proposal will not happen, and it won't be close at all.

Heh, the Bay Area has a higher level of education than most places.

[baggle]

Don't be a victim of the same accusations you gave to Mal in that Cloned Animal thread.

Give us Bay Area folk a little bit more credit. This proposal will not happen, and it won't be close at all.

Sorry if I wasn't clear, I know that not all San Franciscans are like that (some of my best friends are from SF), but there is a significant minority of people in San Fran who are total stereotypical super-liberal hippies. It's definitely a 'safe place' for that type of mindset to take refuge.

And hey, I was right about Malo. She came to preach, knew nothing about gaming, and never bothered posting in another thread. I'd say I was 3 for 3 there ;)

[baggle]

Heh, the Bay Area has a higher level of education than most places.

Ignorance != education. Some ignorance is born from being uneducated, other ignorance is intentional. "Close minded" might be a better phrase for it. Maybe. It's the same attitude that you would get in super religious, conservative areas of the south, I'd imagine. I don't have experience with those people, though, I have experience with San Fran, so that's what I talk about.

[Ten19]

A labyrinth! Think of the possibilities.

http://crapfilter.net/images/bowie_labyrinth.jpg

[Dr.Finger]

Let's be fair here, this isn't California voting for this, which is a big, diverse state (yes, even politically), this is San Francisco, where pretentious hippies are made and ignorance is fostered, as long as it fits in with their world view. If this were a state-wide vote, it would go down in some serious flames. However, as a SF city vote, no one really knows how it will go.I know. I know that SF isn't the parody of itself that this proposal tries to turn it into. Most people there, I'm sure, roll their eyes at this kind of crap.

But no other state in the union uses referendums (referendia?) like California does.

[IrishWhiskey]

I know. I know that SF isn't the parody of itself that this proposal tries to turn it into. Most people there, I'm sure, roll their eyes at this kind of crap.

But no other state in the union uses referendums (referendia?) like California does. Too much direct democracy and voters being able to come up with their own proposition is what leads to this stuff. "When are people going to learn. Democracy. Doesn't. Work!"

[GunnyMo]

I hope everyone decides to keep the famous prison there. I still have yet to visit, and would still like to. "Fucking West Coast hippies. Go eat some granola."

Thank you. Goddamn hippies.

[walkstheplanes]

Sorry if I wasn't clear, I know that not all San Franciscans are like that (some of my best friends are from SF), but there is a significant minority of people in San Fran who are total stereotypical super-liberal hippies. It's definitely a 'safe place' for that type of mindset to take refuge.


It's a safe place for that kind of thought, but, as you said, it is the minority. It's going to be far from close. I'd go so far as to say over 90-95% of the people there don't lean farther left than most liberal democrats. Now, if you rewind the tape 30 years, that's a completely different story (and that's the era where this whole stereotype comes from).

Now if you excuse me, I've got a lot of trees to hug.

[TrackZero]

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51DXzj2tc%2BL._SS500_.jpg

[jeffbax]

Maybe its well intentioned, but I'd prefer it be some kind of landmark.

[Magnanimous Gnome]

Maybe them can turn it into a gay love farm! Oh wait....



Kalaquinn for president! :p

[Darkholmme]

Holy crap, that's my step grandfather... no joke.

[H1PO]

Maybe San Fransisco should spend money on a global peace areas when we have, you know, global peace? Just my thought.

[Gilius Thunderhead]

In a newspaper interview (I'm local; I get those), the guy behind it is like, "I'm a dreamer, and enough other people are dreamers, too. I think this could happen." (or something along those lines.

Unfortunately, not only will such dreaming not fix the state's present--ever-present--budget crisis such that we would be able to afford to make this dream a realization, but such dreaming is part of the reason the state has a budget crisis. The more frivolous projects; the more money given to those who don't, apparently, earn enough, the more money we run out of faster.

Plus, something like that would likely constantly lose the state more money for upkeep. I imagine that Alcatraz is at least a bit profitable (or runs at cost; still, that's better than red) as a tourist attraction, and I bet it does San Fran more good in terms of dollars through tourism than some fucking frippery like a peace center could pull.

And, lest I forget:

First they took away Stroud's birds...now they're taking away his home!?
Twenty points (useless and non-refundable) for catching the reference. Go!

[Darkholmme]

First they took away Stroud's birds...now they're taking away his home!?
Twenty points (useless and non-refundable) for catching the reference. Go!

I assume you're talking about the guy with the parrots in SF?

This is really freaky... I remember back in high school, when I first heard about these guys planning on converting Alcatraz into an intergalactic space port, complete with a glass pyramid... never would have thought that he'd go through with it so far.

[AbeLincoln]

It is designated a national land mark within a national recreation area administered by the national park service...

My point being, will a city or state resolution even be able to actually do anything to the island?

[Gilius Thunderhead]

I assume you're talking about the guy with the parrots in SF?


You seem to have missed the reference.

Another hint: Stroud died good while ago.

[Primus]

I was hoping for "Paintball Arena".

Best idea award.

[baggle]

Birdman of Alcatraz...right?

[Gilius Thunderhead]

Birdman of Alcatraz...right?

Baggle wins.

Here you go: Twenty points. You can't see them, but that's none of my business anymore. Enjoy!

[baggle]

Baggle wins.

Here you go: Twenty points. You can't see them, but that's none of my business anymore. Enjoy!

Yay! Paying the extra $10 for the tape-recorded tour paid off!

[Gilius Thunderhead]

Pfft. Read the book! It's actually quite entertaining, even if the facts can be questioned. Airbrushed like a supermodel, the details.

[baggle]

Pfft. Read the book! It's actually quite entertaining, even if the facts can be questioned. Airbrushed like a supermodel, the details.

Reading is for nerds! :)