China bans minors from playing violent online video games [Archive]

bandersnatch

08-03-2005, 08:12 PM

GameInsider is reporting (http://www.gameinsider.com/comments.php?id=837&catid=1) that China has landed the banhammer on minors who play violent MMORPG's.

"Effective immediately, all minors are banned from playing online games in which players are allowed to kill other players, an activity that has been termed Player Kills (PK). China's Ministry of Culture (MOC) and Ministry of Information Industry (MII) have also ordered the country's online game operators to develop identity authentication systems that prevent minors from playing games These authentication systems would require all players to first enter their Citizen ID Card numbers before being allowed to play games that allow Player Kills. No timetable was given for when these authentication systems must be implemented.

"Minors should not be allowed to play online games that have PK content, that allow players to increase the power of their own online game characters by killing other players," Liu Shifa, head of the MOC's Internet Culture Division, which drafts policies governing the online gaming market, told Interfax. "Online games that have PK content usually also contain acts of violence and leads to players spending too much time trying to increase the power of their characters. They are harmful to young people.""Poor Blizzard and Sony.

Abash Alarmist

08-03-2005, 09:52 PM

That is actually one of the best things to ever come out of China...Save thousands of years of culute, medicine, and scientific innovations...

Crabby

08-03-2005, 09:55 PM

Don't panic, folks! They're communists. :cool:

Babbster

08-03-2005, 10:05 PM

Young PRC citizens should receive nothing but the warm glow of their government's appreciation for killing their countrymen.

Claus DuBois

08-03-2005, 10:27 PM

We don't need no stinkin badges!

Sweet, serious maiming and dismemberment is ok, just no PK'ing! Now we know where the line for evil is drawn. Now developers can design around this where players and NPC's don't die, they just flop around screaming for the rest of the level.

Hmmmm, I wonder if the U.S. could get a big-ass batch of those high-tech Citizen I.D. cards to better control our borders?

NACIONAL

08-03-2005, 10:40 PM

i will allways say one thing... there is no substitute for good parenting...

I'm from Colombia, a country, which a lot of people thinks it is really violent and in some way, some people think that we live in war every day... but heck, we don't have 10 year old kids killing each other because of videogames... why?, because we all know that killing a sprit is a lot different than kill a person...

I'm not going to say that we don't have violence here...we have... but we don't waste time blaming media... we have violence because some cultural circumstances, not because a young person banged a hooker in GTA.

I think that china is growing a time bomb there... all their repressions will reverse to them one day.

Babbster

08-03-2005, 10:46 PM

Hmmmm, I wonder if the U.S. could get a big-ass batch of those high-tech Citizen I.D. cards to better control our borders?

Naw. See, the US doesn't have forced abortions of children which requires staying very up-to-date (married women of child-bearing age are required to undergo quarterly pregnancy examinations) on how many babies someone has carried to term.

mkelehan

08-03-2005, 10:51 PM

If you're a minor, you're restricted to non-PVP servers. Not a big deal.

Plac1d

08-03-2005, 10:52 PM

Doesn't Asia have the lowest crime rate in the world already?

Whatever their reason is, I bet Nike is in support of this newfound law. "No fun for you! Get back in there and make some shoes."

if76

08-03-2005, 11:02 PM

I can't tell if this is a measure to censor violent content from children or to just get them to stop wasting their time with these games.

Deadend

08-03-2005, 11:04 PM

Doesn't Asia have the lowest crime rate in the world already?

Whatever their reason is, I bet Nike is in support of this newfound law. "No fun for you! Get back in there and make some shoes."

Somehow... I am not quite sure on that.

China probably has alot of crimes, but not as many reported, and even fewer that we can know about.

The government there does censor everything, and they have such strange stances on things that both Democrats and Republicans have things to hate about China, as well as those who think free speech is a good thing.

Vjornaxx

08-03-2005, 11:17 PM

I think this will just get the code monkeys more incentive to find cracks. Minors in China will still be able to get games. In Beijing, I know of three markets in which you can buy pirated truckloads of software for dirt cheap. The parrots whisper "CD" to you, and you can negotiate the price from 25 yuan down to 10.

Meshyf

08-03-2005, 11:31 PM

I'm from Colombia, a country, which a lot of people thinks it is really violent and in some way, some people think that we live in war every day... but heck, we don't have 10 year old kids killing each other because of videogames... why?,

So 10 year olds kill each other for some other reason? (j/k)
But seriously you can't possibly think you're speaking for your whole contry. Sure America has problems. More problems then any other country in the world probably and if not we're the ones that are under the most preassure about them. If a 10 year old killed another 10 year old in Columbia would more then 1,000 people find out? Or even give a crap?

Savok

08-03-2005, 11:37 PM

No 12 year old kiddies screaming "fagz11" at you? I'm going to China.

Orphiuchus

08-03-2005, 11:51 PM

I wondered why world of warcraft was more fun tonight.

jeffool

08-04-2005, 12:51 AM

I think that china is growing a time bomb there... all their repressions will reverse to them one day.Amen pal. And when it does reverse, watch the fuck out! Coke and hookers for everyone!No 12 year old kiddies screaming "fagz11" at you? I'm going to China.Wow. Good point.

*Legion*

08-04-2005, 01:17 AM

Doesn't Asia have the lowest crime rate in the world already?

Depends. Do you count governments?

Qoz

08-04-2005, 01:26 AM

Criminals are executed in China. What a way to keep crime down.
Oh wait! Thats what America has been doing all along so it must be right.

Last of the Red Hot Mamas

08-04-2005, 01:41 AM

Criminals are executed in China. What a way to keep crime down.
Oh wait! Thats what America has been doing all along so it must be right.

What?

MrMeatshake

08-04-2005, 02:43 AM

Naw. See, the US doesn't have forced abortions of children which requires staying very up-to-date (married women of child-bearing age are required to undergo quarterly pregnancy examinations) on how many babies someone has carried to term.

I was talking to an old work colleague who'd emmigrated from China about this, and she said that this is done for the poorer women - which is obviously VERY elitist and harsh, but it makes a kinda sense, I suppose. I've often mused about a way to make all the local townies infertile... Put something in the stella, maybe...

Babbster

08-04-2005, 03:20 AM

I was talking to an old work colleague who'd emmigrated from China about this, and she said that this is done for the poorer women - which is obviously VERY elitist and harsh, but it makes a kinda sense, I suppose. I've often mused about a way to make all the local townies infertile... Put something in the stella, maybe...

"A kinda sense"? Let's see. China's economy is booming, they have plenty of free space, they're in danger of having a culturally crippling gender imbalance...Sure, it makes a bucket of sense.

(BTW- Yes, I'm aware that I'm making barely on-topic, if not completely off-topic, posts here but I take any opportunity to throw a few shots the way of the Chinese government. They truly are evil.)

Heretic Machine

08-04-2005, 03:37 AM

"A kinda sense"? Let's see. China's economy is booming, they have plenty of free space, they're in danger of having a culturally crippling gender imbalance...Sure, it makes a bucket of sense.

They also have too many babez.

But they still but to SeXXoR teh ChiXXOR.

Don't want teh babez?

Use a condom.

Or mandatory abortions, either way... No more babez.

dead

08-04-2005, 03:59 AM

Don't panic, folks! They're communists.

what kind of reason to not panic is that?

Justin_McElroy

08-04-2005, 05:10 AM

Uh oh, this looks like an Evil Avatar politics thread! Buckle in everybody! Maybe if we get the inane discussion up to 88 mph we'll go back in time to before this was posted.

MrMeatshake

08-04-2005, 05:21 AM

Want 2 SeXXoR teh ChiXXOR? Don't want teh babez?
Use a condom.

good idea, this. geek safe-sex propoganda. if it's in l33t, they have to pay attention!

OUX

08-04-2005, 05:39 AM

Does anyone know the minors age requirement in China? When I read it the first I just assumed 18 but then I remembered "Hey communists. No telling what those crazy commi cats are gonna do."

jacktion

08-04-2005, 06:15 AM

Doesn't Asia have the lowest crime rate in the world already?

Our nationalistic fervor causes us to bash anyone different from us.

Maybe the fact that Asian countries have low crime rates and they actively work to keep their kids insulated from death and violence are connected?

Restricting minors to non PVP servers is not a big deal.

vornskr

08-04-2005, 06:26 AM

Our nationalistic fervor causes us to bash anyone different from us.

Maybe the fact that Asian countries have low crime rates and they actively work to keep their kids insulated from death and violence are connected?

Restricting minors to non PVP servers is not a big deal.

You're right in that restricting minors to non PvP servers isn't a big deal, however..

With a few exceptions, most Asian (especially southeast Asian) countries have a low crime rate because the punishment for such crimes are brutal and the government has very invasive procedures for apprehending suspects. And the people who live there know it. It really has nothing to do with the level of insulation minors recieve.

Klade

08-04-2005, 06:28 AM

Does anyone know the minors age requirement in China? When I read it the first I just assumed 18 but then I remembered "Hey communists. No telling what those crazy commi cats are gonna do."

My thought exactly. Who knows what the age is over there. Plus if theres anyone who can get around the crapy govt sensors then its the young gaming culture, they are the ones with all the technical knowledge.

Iron Maiden

08-04-2005, 06:34 AM

they can play eVe "Cold War Edition" only one server there

Savok

08-04-2005, 06:52 AM

China is the same as most other places, anyone under 18 is a minor.

OUX

08-04-2005, 06:56 AM

Most places? The age of minors is different in Canada and Mexico and pretty much everywhere I was always under the ipression that 18 was a rarity.

kokyunage

08-04-2005, 06:58 AM

Criminals are executed in China. What a way to keep crime down.
Oh wait! Thats what America has been doing all along so it must be right.

Not directly related to your quote, but I thought I'd add some fuel to the fire. Harsh punishments DO NOT prevent crime. There has NEVER been any proof or study that harsh punishments prevent crime. It's a conservative myth.

mad-hunter

08-04-2005, 07:25 AM

Just my 2cents but did any of you ever think that this might be a game embargo towards outside countries. Think about it for a second blizzard said they have like 1.5 million WoW subscribers in china, how much do you think Sony has, and other violent game companies. If I were a politician in China concerned about our youth's future this would be the best step towards nationwide scholastic growth.

All I can say is fear the 170 billion pound train. :)

jpublic

08-04-2005, 07:46 AM

Woohoo! Maybe MMOs will stop putting in lame-ass PVP content now.

jacktion

08-04-2005, 07:53 AM

China is the same as most other places, anyone under 18 is a minor.

Actually I tried to look it up and it seems to be 14 over there. Can anyone verify this?
It makes this a little more of a "minor" problem.

Savok

08-04-2005, 08:12 AM

I did look it up.

Legally, a minor is a person under 18, but there are quite a few laws about minors under 14, when that's the case they specify. Minor is still the umbrella term however.

Qoz

08-04-2005, 08:52 AM

Not directly related to your quote, but I thought I'd add some fuel to the fire. Harsh punishments DO NOT prevent crime. There has NEVER been any proof or study that harsh punishments prevent crime. It's a conservative myth.

Precisely.

What really interested me was the alleged low crime-rate in China. How can we know for certain? It's not like we know alot of internal demographics about China in the first place. They do not let out information like that unless it is positive. I'm sure China has alot of crimes commited that we will never know of. And it will only get worse I think. When the average chinese figure out what options we have in other parts of the world they will want more.

net7runner

08-04-2005, 09:08 AM

Maybe the fact that Asian countries have low crime rates and they actively work to keep their kids insulated from death and violence are connected?

AHAHAHAHAHAHA you're funny. Watched any Asian TV lately?

Grave

08-04-2005, 09:30 AM

World of Warcraft Client Patch 1.25(c)
- We are revamping the current "health points" system.
- Health points are having their name changed to Fatigue Points
- The fatigue points bar will be colored green instead of red
- When your fatigue bar reachs 0 your character is knocked out and after 6 minutes they enter a zen like out of body experience in which they must make a spiritual journey back to their corporal form.
- Introduced a new battle ground that doesn't suck.

Thank you,
Blizzard China Development team

DRINK COKE KEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEEKEEKE

jacktion

08-04-2005, 09:52 AM

Precisely.

What really interested me was the alleged low crime-rate in China. How can we know for certain? I'm sure China has a lot of crimes commited that we will never know of.

You are sure? Based on what? A hunch? That is just what you want to believe because you are biased against China. Just like people are biased against America because they beat up minorities in their country and torture and kill them in other countries. Is any of this the truth or just what people want to believe? I don't know.

I do know that in big authoritarian communist governments generally there is less petty crime. The government is pretty harsh and will mess you up pretty bad if you are a petty criminal (unless you can pay them off). So people try to toe the line more. Although there is lots of corruption.
A family member visited post-communist Russia and she heard a lot of women talk about how it is less safe now. Back in the Communist days women could walk home at midnight and never worry because the government was watching and if a mugger tried to get them he would be killed. Now they are "free" but criminals are everywhere and they aren't safe.
You hear the same thing again and again in Iraq. They are "free" now but they are much less safe. Crime was much lower with the dictator dispensing swift brutal justice. They still could get massively abused by the government but for the average dope working his 9-5 job they were safer.

What do you think?

Savok

08-04-2005, 10:05 AM

Russia's problem is the power vaccum was filled by the mafia rather then a real government. Iraq's problem is there's a war on.

1FSTCAT

08-04-2005, 10:08 AM

OUX

08-04-2005, 10:51 AM

Here check this (http://www.nationmaster.com/country/ch/Crime&b_define=1) out and then argue your China crime points with info backin it up,

Wombat

08-04-2005, 11:32 AM

It occurs to me that this may have less to do with protecting children, and more to do with the fact that this games are huge, largely anonymous chat rooms, and the Chinese government may be using the child protection card to make sure a Citizen ID number is clearly attached to every user so they know who is saying what.

Shifteh

08-04-2005, 12:13 PM

Naw. See, the US doesn't have forced abortions of children which requires staying very up-to-date (married women of child-bearing age are required to undergo quarterly pregnancy examinations) on how many babies someone has carried to term.

This is one of the most dumbfuck things I've ever heard.

The "one-child" law means that you have to pay a tax when you have more than one child.

Jesus Christ people, before you come up with these moronic "omfg Cinese aer teh babie eatars!11111" comments, actually do some goddamn research.

Living, as I do, in Vancouver BC (which is currently about 45% Chinese immigrant) I get to hear a lot about China, why they left, etc. None of these reasons include the Government hunting women down to check them to see how many children they've had.

Not only is that not an issue - the one-child tax comes simply from various surveys, etc - they wouldn't be able to do it. Why? Because there are five-hundred million women in China. Can you imagine trying to check every single one that often? It would be impossible.

I suggest before you make yourself look like an even dumber random American (I'm assuming American), you actually find out some facts about China, instead of whatever bizarre propaganda you've heard thus far.

Shifteh

08-04-2005, 12:18 PM

Thank you,
Blizzard China Development team

DRINK COKE KEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEEKEEKE

"keke" is Korean. Thanks for playing.

bean19

08-04-2005, 12:48 PM

This really isn't that big a deal.

Our own country has laws that prohibit the sale of certain items to minors. It is just interesting that the Chinese regard player-killing as adult. I wonder if they will attempt to bar FPS games that are COMPLETELY player-killing and generally much more graphic than. . . you know, using a tauren druid to cast vines on your feet and send magical green orbs at you. Man. . . Druids are gay. ;)

Which brings me to a really big tangent: Would an MMO that went whole hog for that Mature rating and created truly graphical violence (like Soldier of Fortune 2 but with current graphical standards) do well? What if in WoW, your character showed showed a slight hit animation until the one that takes you down to 0 health and then a gory kill animation reminiscant of "God of War" plays?

That would be sweet.

Orphiuchus

08-04-2005, 12:54 PM

Crabby

08-04-2005, 01:03 PM

bean19

08-04-2005, 01:16 PM

http://www.lifesite.net/ldn/2005/jul/05071304.html
http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/ertelt200409080924.asp
http://commdocs.house.gov/committees/intlrel/hfa49740.000/hfa49740_0f.htm
http://web.amnesty.org/wire/October2004/China
http://archives.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/asiapcf/east/07/19/taiwan.china.abortion/
http://www.lifesite.net/ldn/2005/may/05052706.html
http://web.amnesty.org/report2005/chn-summary-eng

I can find a lot of stories confirming forced abortions in china, and not a single one denying them. Thats some Thorough propaganda.

So. . . are you against forced abortions?

Seriously though, this is something that I studied in cultural anthropology last year. Human's most base motives are very animalistic. This can be simple need fulfillment (need to eat, be clean for health, have shelter, etc.) This can be seen in a lot of religious rituals. Christians discard old commandments about the prepartion of food because this religious ritual is no longer needed for cleanliness.

That's one of the interesting things about different cultures. Their morals grow and change based on the needs of their societies.

In the United States, the idea of forced abortion is terrible. We would rebel against it as inhumane and oppressive. However, in China, where the population is so high and living conditions are so low that starvation and disease from malnutrition are common causes of death, forced abortion for those who break the population control laws is an accepted practice. Certainly, it is most probably oppossed by very vocal groups both inside and outside of China, but that does not change the fact that it is accepted broadly.

With genetic engineering and cloning making rapid advances, the United States is probably going to have even more moral "crisis" coming it's way in the next decade. One of the interesting questions that I think will expose the hypocrisy of fundamentalists will be: "Should women impregnated with cloned DNA (creating a clone of a human) or genetically altered DNA (gene-splicing for "better" traits) be forced to abort if such genetic engineerig is made illegal?"

kickmybum

08-04-2005, 01:25 PM

Yay, there goes all the young sweatshop farmers in Lineage II!!!

jacktion

08-04-2005, 01:53 PM

I can find a lot of stories confirming forced abortions in china, and not a single one denying them. Thats some Thorough propaganda.

I can find 20 stories on child molesting in America too. So Americans are all child-rapers and every child is raped? No.

Crabby

08-04-2005, 02:32 PM

So. . . are you against forced abortions?

Seriously though, this is something that I studied in cultural anthropology last year. Human's most base motives are very animalistic. This can be simple need fulfillment (need to eat, be clean for health, have shelter, etc.) This can be seen in a lot of religious rituals. Christians discard old commandments about the prepartion of food because this religious ritual is no longer needed for cleanliness.

That's one of the interesting things about different cultures. Their morals grow and change based on the needs of their societies.

In the United States, the idea of forced abortion is terrible. We would rebel against it as inhumane and oppressive. However, in China, where the population is so high and living conditions are so low that starvation and disease from malnutrition are common causes of death, forced abortion for those who break the population control laws is an accepted practice. Certainly, it is most probably oppossed by very vocal groups both inside and outside of China, but that does not change the fact that it is accepted broadly.

With genetic engineering and cloning making rapid advances, the United States is probably going to have even more moral "crisis" coming it's way in the next decade. One of the interesting questions that I think will expose the hypocrisy of fundamentalists will be: "Should women impregnated with cloned DNA (creating a clone of a human) or genetically altered DNA (gene-splicing for "better" traits) be forced to abort if such genetic engineerig is made illegal?"

I think the more interesting question is going to become, "Will America be willing to jump on the bandwagon when other countries start gene-splicing superior humans in order to stay even?"

bean19

08-04-2005, 02:47 PM

Crabby - That is an interesting question, but I don't think it is anywhere near the topic. . . or even the tangent about Chinese culture. You are making a tangent of a tangent. :)

Babbster

08-04-2005, 03:47 PM

This is one of the most dumbfuck things I've ever heard.

The "one-child" law means that you have to pay a tax when you have more than one child.

Okay, I didn't quote the rest of your mess (for the sake of brevity, not in an attempt to stifle dissent), but you asked for some "goddamn research."

From public testimony:
"Once I found a woman who was nine-months pregnant, but did not have a birth-allowed certificate. According to the policy, she was forced to undergo an abortion surgery," Gao Xiaoduan, former family planning officer with the Chinese government, testified in tears before the U.S. House of Representatives. The baby was born alive, its lips sucking, its limbs stretching, Xiaoduan said. "A physician injected poison into its skull, and the child died, and it was thrown into the trash can."

You can find the complete statement of Mrs. Gao here (http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/7288/testimon.htm). A more complete transcript of these hearings is right here (http://commdocs.house.gov/committees/intlrel/hfa49740.000/hfa49740_0f.htm). Nice that we could give these folks "most favored nation" status, eh? Amnesty International seems to recognize that there's a problem (http://web.amnesty.org/library/Index/ENGASA170522004?open&of=ENG-376).

You can take a look back at my previous post to find my take on how valid I think China's population-control policies are. Suffice it to say that I consider forced abortions evil, and requirements to obtain permits before pregnancy to be disgusting examples of ultimate power gone mad. I'm also against capital punishment which the Chinese government has no problem applying to non-violent "offenders." If there was a way to do it without endangering billions of lives, I would personally support a multinational war of aggression against that government.

Orphiuchus

08-04-2005, 04:06 PM

I can find 20 stories on child molesting in America too. So Americans are all child-rapers and every child is raped? No.

The US government does not sanction child molesting, the chinese government does sanction forced abortion. There is the difference.

Butters66

08-05-2005, 01:54 PM

Not directly related to your quote, but I thought I'd add some fuel to the fire. Harsh punishments DO NOT prevent crime. There has NEVER been any proof or study that harsh punishments prevent crime. It's a conservative myth.

Wouldn't you have to implement the harsh penalties to find out? How do you study that?

Oh yeah... look at other countries that have lower crime rates.

You can lower crime rates in several ways:

1. Make everything legal.
2. Cane everyone who spits on the ground. Remember that one?
3. Try to convince everyone to be good. (Good luck with that one.)

Which one is better? Well, I guess it depends. 3 of course would be, but that goes against human nature. We enact laws for a reason. I guess we'll just have to keep muddling through it, trying to find a balance that is fair.