First Major WoW Duping Bug

[Kefkataran]

Slashdot has word (http://games.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/07/19/1644250&from=rss) that a major bug has hit World of Warcraft allowing the duplication of items. This is a common problem in MMORPGs but this is the first time it's happened in WoW (as far as I've heard). The Slashdot post includes links to pictures showing the bug at work.

Hope Bliz gets this fixed before the economy becomes messed beyond belief.

[ttoastt]

Speaking of WoW, what's all this talk of a potential rollback I keep hearing about on the WoW forums?

[Roc Ingersol]

people on battle.net are teh stoopids. 'Rollback' is the only corrective action their primative hindbrains can grasp.

[Kefkataran]

Speaking of WoW, what's all this talk of a potential rollback I keep hearing about on the WoW forums?

Hrm... haven't been keeping up too much since I cancelled my account a couple weeks ago. But I might warrant a guess -- could it be because of the bug?

[DeadPixel]

Someone posted on slashdot:


Based on the screenshots:
DELETE FROM user WHERE username LIKE "Gu%en";

LOL!!!

[agentgray]

Nice. It also helps that all the major news sites are posting about it. Looks like if some people are on top the the game, they're gonna end up with some uber stuff.

[Cupelix]

Having all the major game sites post about this sort of thing, some of them posting relatively explicit instructions on how to manage the bug is incredibly detrimental to the game, in my opinion. That just gives tons of people who probably wouldn't have tried to dupe items the knowledge how. Just doesn't seem like knowledge that should get spread around, to me.

[Mister Pie]

Sounds like maybe the ban stick is gonna get taken out.

Though, it would be a bad idea for Blizzard to ban EVERYONE who's duped as I'd imagine that it'd be quite a lot of players.

[Mrbunchypants]

I'm not sure but i think they can't fix the bug. as it seem to stem from player data being saved every five min. to fix the dup bug you would have to save player data every time someone entered an instance. that might take huge cpu time that better spent on makeing Lagfordge less laggy.

[Kefkataran]

I'm not sure but i think they can't fix the bug. as it seem to stem from player data being saved every five min. to fix the dup bug you would have to save player data every time someone entered an instance. that might take huge cpu time that better spent on makeing Lagfordge less laggy.

That's pretty horrible news if it's true. I'll wait until something official is said though.

[Cupelix]

I'm not sure but i think they can't fix the bug. as it seem to stem from player data being saved every five min. to fix the dup bug you would have to save player data every time someone entered an instance. that might take huge cpu time that better spent on makeing Lagfordge less laggy. All bugs can be fixed. Its just an issue of what trade off or concession you have to make in exchange. If saving player data is that tough, the game would already be screwed, because it obviously does that every time you log off. Turn over on the servers is probably pretty high, in comparison, the number of people entering instances at any one point in time is probably comparatively low. Regardless, it is fixable, there just might be other consequences.

[51|RandoM]

You can't fix it by having it save the player data before entering the instance---it already tries to do that, or did last time I played. Problem is, if the database tier is busy, you're not only not going to get into that busy instance, you're not going to get your data checkpointed, and you're going to be rolled-back to to the last checkpoint, which is what is causing the dupe in the first place.

Player trades need to commit both records immediately, or if a commit fails, roll BOTH commits back. That clears up your dupe right there, and is what most games already do. I wouldn't be amazed to find out that Blizzard originally coded it to do that, but pulled it out when they were having the bad database overloads just to keep things running.

Eh, I canceled my account last night anyways for non-related reasons, so is just a point of curiosity for me.

[netcraazzy]

Today is server maintenance day so I bet they will come up with some sort of quick fix and put it into effect today.

[Heretic Machine]

I'm probably going back to CoH soon... Haven't played WoW in weeks. Good game, but god the grind sucks...

Then again, CoH's grind sucks worse, but at least there I get to be a super hero <.<

[Roc Ingersol]

I wouldn't be amazed to find out that Blizzard originally coded it to do that, but pulled it out when they were having the bad database overloads just to keep things running.
wink, wink, nudge, nudge.

[GrinR]

*shrug* I'll wait for the inevitable "50,000 WoW Accounts BANNED!" post.

[Plac1d]

Do you think this bug will work in unison with my bot?

[Mrbunchypants]

Player trades need to commit both records immediately, or if a commit fails, roll BOTH commits back. That clears up your dupe right there, and is what most games already do. I wouldn't be amazed to find out that Blizzard originally coded it to do that, but pulled it out when they were having the bad database overloads just to keep things running.


ouch that would suck. let say you just lvled and you friend got this cool new item for you and some gold for the mount. now they go off to lvl some more in Razor fen downs or maurdon or what ever. you go by your spells/skills and your mount. now you have to roll back cuz your friends instance crashed????
thats not going to work too good.

I know it trys to save your data at the begining of the instance. the problem is that you never make in to the instance so you toons data is not on that server. So the world server calls the last saved data and uses that. thus you get your gold/item back. what needs to be done is your toons data to be saved befor you load into the instace. that way your not suffering any roll back.

[TrackZero]

Having all the major game sites post about this sort of thing, some of them posting relatively explicit instructions on how to manage the bug is incredibly detrimental to the game, in my opinion. That just gives tons of people who probably wouldn't have tried to dupe items the knowledge how. Just doesn't seem like knowledge that should get spread around, to me.

This just in: Make homemade Napalm by mixing styrofoam and gasoline in a bucket, stir and let sit for 24 hours! Nice work kids!

[Ernst_Jager]

For a game that has been out as long as WoW and made as much money you would think the weekly freaking 'maintanance' downtimes would be a thing of the past.

Every patch they fix balance issues with classes. The last patch totally changed Warriors and Warlocks. Almost feels like the game is in beta still to me. I was in beta and lvl'd a toon to 60 after it. After that I left because of the lack of high end content. The game was fun but all the problems they don't address or issues with the game are getting old. Good idea, but poorly executed in my opinion. So many parts of the game were kick ass, but at the same time so many half assed parts as well. Most of the really high end stuff is dropped and bind on pickup anyway so really this effects those not in uber guilds or lower than 60's.

[kwillhan]

but can they make soj?

[scryber]

Hmm, there's a chance that screenshot could be fake.

I can't confirm what the AH trade window looks like from this computer, but in the screenshot each row of the Kroll Blade has an identical background. I don't recall if there is any transparancy to the AH window or what the background looks like, but having the SAME background texture in each row smacks of a copy/paste job.

And if so, somebody obviously meant to frame this player as a duper.

[Kefkataran]

For a game that has been out as long as WoW and made as much money you would think the weekly freaking 'maintanance' downtimes would be a thing of the past.

Almost every MMORPG I've ever played has weekly downtime for maintenance. Hell, if I remember right for CoH it used to be daily (although that's quite likely changed). It seems pretty standard, and makes sense -- they need to take a little time out each week to make sure the servers are running at top condition and all. The only difference with WoW is that it usually lasts longer than it should, often cutting into gametime for people playing Tuesday afternoon. But last I noticed, that had been happening less and less, minus the patch weeks.

[scryber]

OK here's more evidence. Here's the screenshot:
http://www.tokyo-web.org/duppe1qa.gif
Note how the texture repeats on each row. You can blow it up in Photoshop and see it clearly.

Now here's an empty AH window:
http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/screenshots/images/basics/auctionhouses/ss0003.jpg
The background is obviously not repeating.

Now I'd still need to see a real window populated with items for absolute proof, but this does appear to be fake.

Not that I doubt the duping thing to be false, though. I think people are duping gold, not items. This guy just appears to be being framed.

[Kefkataran]

I dunno why they'd blur out his name if they were going to frame him, but I guess it's a possibility.

[scryber]

I dunno why they'd blur out his name if they were going to frame him, but I guess it's a possibility.Well, they didn't really. They conveniently left the beginning and end characters unblurred, AND on some rows the 2nd-from-the-end characters aren't fully blurred, giving a total of 4 known characters. That whittles the possible names down significantly.

If it was MY account, I'd be damn sure to blur EVERYTHING. This to me looks like someone meant to show as much of the name as possible without making it totally obvious.

[Kefkataran]

That might be. I did a little more digging and found out that you're right: The duping procedure is definitely about duping gold. But, from the sounds of it, in theory it could work with items too. So I'm not really positive. Good eye though.

[XenonCJ]

ugg if they do a rollback ill be seriously upset... this last week was the 1st week i've played a lot in a few months....

[Orphiuchus]

If they do a rollback I think that would mean I cancel my account, I just reactivated 2 days ago and the leveling I've done since then has been great. I hate people sometimes.

[51|RandoM]

ouch that would suck. let say you just lvled and you friend got this cool new item for you and some gold for the mount. now they go off to lvl some more in Razor fen downs or maurdon or what ever. you go by your spells/skills and your mount. now you have to roll back cuz your friends instance crashed????
thats not going to work too good.

Nah, wouldn't work like that. Gotta remember, I'm talking about the commits that are from the player to player transaction. They gotta commit immediately, instead of off in the future when it is convenient from a resource standpoint.

Your trade would be fine and commited, or it wouldn't be fine and be rolled back immediately. You'd both be standing there and probably get a little error bubble that said, "please try your trade again" or some such.

Is rather insane to not by committing player data before they hand off your character from a world server to an instance server, especially when they *know* those handoffs fail regularly.

[51|RandoM]

That might be. I did a little more digging and found out that you're right: The duping procedure is definitely about duping gold. But, from the sounds of it, in theory it could work with items too. So I'm not really positive. Good eye though.

There has been talk about items having unique IDs. Those IDs would help them recover gracefully from this kind of dupe attempt when it was an item, but wouldn't do anything for money transactions.

Interesting stuff, gotta be some heavy database coders working on any of the large MMORPGs.

[CylonLord]

OK here's more evidence. Here's the screenshot:
http://www.tokyo-web.org/duppe1qa.gif
Note how the texture repeats on each row. You can blow it up in Photoshop and see it clearly.

Now here's an empty AH window:
http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/screenshots/images/basics/auctionhouses/ss0003.jpg
The background is obviously not repeating.

Now I'd still need to see a real window populated with items for absolute proof, but this does appear to be fake.

Not that I doubt the duping thing to be false, though. I think people are duping gold, not items. This guy just appears to be being framed.

I agree, it's a totally faked picture. You can see the lines where they pasted on the right edge of the frame plus the repeating background like you mentioned.

[Rommel]

There is a similar known dupe using the teleportation system. This isn't very reliable, yet. Still, I may be handing off my gold to my girlfriend next time we hit Maraudon.

[agentgray]

This just in: Make homemade Napalm by mixing styrofoam and gasoline in a bucket, stir and let sit for 24 hours! Nice work kids!
You can do that?!?! :)

[agentgray]

Almost every MMORPG I've ever played has weekly downtime for maintenance. Hell, if I remember right for CoH it used to be daily (although that's quite likely changed). It seems pretty standard, and makes sense -- they need to take a little time out each week to make sure the servers are running at top condition and all. The only difference with WoW is that it usually lasts longer than it should, often cutting into gametime for people playing Tuesday afternoon. But last I noticed, that had been happening less and less, minus the patch weeks.
I can think of one that has not been down. Well, if you want to classify it as a MMORPG. :rolleyes:

[Kefkataran]

I can think of one that has not been down. Well, if you want to classify it as a MMORPG.

GW has no maintenance? And has had none since it started? I find that hard to believe, but if so, that's pretty impressive. For as much as the game tends to not draw me, I gotta say that I'm very pleased with its technical structure.

[Speed_D]

There has been talk about items having unique IDs. Those IDs would help them recover gracefully from this kind of dupe attempt when it was an item, but wouldn't do anything for money transactions.

The sad thing is that Diablo went through the exact same revelation. When it first hit the market, there was no dupe detection whatsoever. People learned the stupid click-the-potion-as-you're-picking-up-the-item trick and whee dupes galore. Then somewhere along the line, Blizzard introduced a patch with unique item IDs. You could still own dupes but only in separate inventories. If two items with the same ID ever went in the game (say, on the ground), one of them would poof. I'm surprised they didn't keep using a similar unique ID system in WoW.

[Lexicon]

There was a previous dupe when WOW was first released and the servers were going down daily for maintanence. They never banned for that dupe mainly because it was kept relatively quiet, kinda like what happened with the COH dupe about 4 or 5 months ago except Cryptic banned most people.

[Kefkataran]

There was a previous dupe when WOW was first released and the servers were going down daily for maintanence. They never banned for that dupe mainly because it was kept relatively quiet, kinda like what happened with the COH dupe about 4 or 5 months ago except Cryptic banned most people.

I'm curious as to how both of those worked.

[Lexicon]

The old WOW dupe was opening up a trade window with another player and putting in the amount of gold you wanted to dupe, as the server was going down for maintanence, which in the early days was every night, it would get extremely laggy right before the server would go offline both players agree to the trade. About 50% off the time after server reboot both players would have the money. Worked for about 2 weeks or so before it was fixed. From what I saw no one was banned for this dupe.

The COH dupe I was on the receiving end of so I dont know exactly how it worked. The person trading with you would be able to enter in larger amounts of influence then 99999 which was the new limit at the time, they would be able to trade millions of influence at a time even though they didnt have that much on their character. Dupe worked for about 10 days before Cryptic brought down the ban hammer. They also did a very good job of keeping this quiet.

I know about both of these since I used to work in a large MMORPG related business. I didnt dupe but needed to be aware of dupes as part of my work.
Most games have dupes SWG has had tons, Lineage 2, EQ lots, WOW, COH, Guild Wars only 1 so far for items (few exploits for cash), EQ2 a couple, etc.

[feeble]

Shit, this happened to me the other day and i wasnt even trying to do anything illegal.

the world server crashed just as i handed in a quest, and when logged back in, there was a bit of roll back, so i got to hand in the quest again.

then when i went to check out my bags, i had somehow aquired two swords instead of one from that quest.

shame they were just vendor trash or i would have been a little bit happier

[steve]

I agree, it's a totally faked picture. You can see the lines where they pasted on the right edge of the frame plus the repeating background like you mentioned.

Yep. Invert the image for better contrast. And you can see a clearly visible horizontal mismatch seam below the last item, too:

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a181/steve55555/proof.gif

As someone already mentioned, duping probably only works with gold, not items.

[miah]

OK here's more evidence. Here's the screenshot:
http://www.tokyo-web.org/duppe1qa.gif
Note how the texture repeats on each row. You can blow it up in Photoshop and see it clearly.

Now here's an empty AH window:
http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/screenshots/images/basics/auctionhouses/ss0003.jpg
The background is obviously not repeating.

Now I'd still need to see a real window populated with items for absolute proof, but this does appear to be fake.

Not that I doubt the duping thing to be false, though. I think people are duping gold, not items. This guy just appears to be being framed.

You're comparing two different windows, take note of the tabs at the bottom of the window. The first window is a Auction Browse window where you can search for items to bid on, the second window is Auctions which displays items you are bidding on.

Why do you people find it so hard to believe that a duping bug exists in the game? Almost every MMORPG has had a duping bug discovered. I'm sure Blizzard will have a way to determine whos used the bug to their advantage and take them out back for some punishment.

-miah