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Dr.Finger
06-26-2007, 06:18 PM
An interesting discussion with Horror legend Clive Barker, currently working on his newest game Jericho for Electronic Arts. He has some very intersting things to say about whether or not games are art. From Gamasutra (http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=14478). Next, Barker addressed the intriguing question - does making a game mean you give up some control over it's narrative since there is interaction involved?

He noted: “I think that Roger Ebert’s problem is that he thinks you can’t have art if there is that amount of malleability in the narrative. Shakespeare couldn’t have written Romeo and Juliet as a game, because it could’ve had a happy ending. If only she hadn’t taken the damn poison! And I think Ebert’s problem is, if something is so malleable, so full of possibilities that aren’t under the artist’s control, then it can’t be art."

Not so much: "And that’s where he’s wrong. Because the artists have put all those options in. Shakespeare might very well have written Romeo and Juliet, and maybe Romeo is gay, runs off to Venice, has a nice civil wedding…anything’s possible! I’m saying we should be looking at stretching the imaginations of our players, but also ourselves, and saying ‘let’s try to make everything possible'." And a little bit on the upcoming Jericho But what about the story of Jericho made it suitable for games? Barker noted: “The concept of Jericho? is that there’s this evil f*ck that lives in the Sahara... [the plot involves] an assassination attempt upon a creature that gives the devil the shivers.”

He grinned: “It would make a f*cking terrible novel. It really would, it doesn’t work! It screams out to be something other. Maybe if games hadn’t existed, I would’ve made it a movie. But I much prefer the idea of having twenty hours to play this world, to enter this labyrinth than the two hours or the way movies are going now. I don’t know what it is with people, my bum gets sore! I like pirates and all, but jeez!” It's refreshing to see someone with so much mainstream influence approach gaming as a real medium and not just another way to get a royalty check. And to see someone smackdown the Roger Ebert for his ignorant comments about gaming.

violentp
06-26-2007, 06:20 PM
Barker is an amazing writer. Apparently he excels in many other mediums as well. I applaud him.

digitalErich
06-26-2007, 06:38 PM
That's an interesting read, thanks for posting it. His description of his game had put it on my radar.

DaXIthR
06-26-2007, 06:38 PM
It's refreshing to see someone with so much mainstream influence approach gaming as a real medium and not just another way to get a royalty check. And to see someone smackdown the Roger Ebert for his ignorant comments about gaming.

As much as I disagree with how Ebert feels about games as art, I wouldn't say he's ignorant about gaming. While not an avid gamer, Ebert wrote a pretty decent (read: better than most) review for a game (for Wired, I believe).

I've only read one of Barker's books, and that was a long time ago. Hearing him talk as an individual has piqued my curiosity in this writing.

violentp
06-26-2007, 07:03 PM
I've only read one of Barker's books, and that was a long time ago. Hearing him talk as an individual has piqued my curiosity in this writing.

Books of Blood. That is all.

Dag Nasty Evil
06-26-2007, 07:06 PM
Great interview..I kinda feel like watching Hellraiser now, but that shit scares me too much. :D

devi ran away
06-26-2007, 07:31 PM
Undying still remains on my favorite story-driven FPS's ever.

WastelandDan
06-26-2007, 08:47 PM
Clive Barker's Undying was one of the best games I've ever played, hands down. Definitely looking forward to any other games he's involved with.

Swick
06-26-2007, 09:04 PM
Barker's Weaveworld remains one of my favorite novels. Undying was a badass game, and this has me looking forward to Jericho as well.

Pretzel
06-26-2007, 10:00 PM
We definitely need more folks outside the game industry commenting (intelligently) on games.

I also think that much of the change in thinking on games will come from the older generations simply dying out. There's a number of issues that have come up over the years that people's attitudes towards are directly matched against their age.

Tyrant
06-26-2007, 10:57 PM
Just tossing in a correction as I haven't read the [article] yet, but Jericho is being developed [by Mercury Steam] and published by Codemasters.

Edit: I just read the article and he makes a really good point about how games can be used to convey a large range of emotions along with how our imaginations can be used to shape the game. Respect up!

Kolreth
06-26-2007, 10:58 PM
If you can get past the first really really boring 200 pages of Imagica, it is one of the best books you'll ever read.

LikeTheRazor
06-27-2007, 02:25 AM
UNDYING

Undying

UN_FUCKING_DYING

This game never got enough press. Seriously, one of the best games I've ever played. I hope Clive can put his magic touch on Jericho too.

Majster Wichajster
06-27-2007, 04:19 AM
Oh yes, Undying was awesome, especially in the beginning when I was scared shitless by the Howlers. A solid game and a must-have.

GunnyMo
06-27-2007, 05:37 AM
He capped this passage off by explaining: "We can debate what art is, we can debate it forever. But if the experience moves you, some way or another, even if it just moves your bowels, I think it’s worthy of some serious study... Games mean something to a lot of people.” He added: "Games aren’t about reviewers, they’re about players."
Best quote in that article.

Undying is truly at the top of the FPS list. I believe the latest issue of Play has a great article on Jericho.

Rune_74
06-27-2007, 08:04 AM
Really enjoyed imajica and the great and secret show...this guys is just awesome. Books of the blood is incredible as well...The sad thing about barker is the movies do little justice to his works ie nightbreed, candyman and hell raiser...oh and note the new hell raisers have nothing to do with him.

Khash
06-27-2007, 12:19 PM
Roger Ebert has really bad cancer. The poor dude can't even talk. Can we please just give him a pass on this one?

GunnyMo
06-27-2007, 12:23 PM
Roger Ebert has really bad cancer. The poor dude can't even talk. Can we please just give him a pass on this one?

But it hasn't stopped him from reviewing movies so I'll say, no, he gets no pass for what he's said in the past. :)

Oblivion
06-27-2007, 12:58 PM
But it hasn't stopped him from reviewing movies so I'll say, no, he gets no pass for what he's said in the past. :)

He wouldn't want that either, probably.

Dr.Finger
06-27-2007, 02:20 PM
Roger Ebert has really bad cancer. The poor dude can't even talk. Can we please just give him a pass on this one?I don't think calling someone ignorant is that bad, personally. I could have said stupid or idiotic or any of a dozen synonyms, but went with the leas perjorative.

SteveE
06-28-2007, 02:04 AM
Candyman movie was way better than the short story in Books of Blood,I forget what volume.