Congress set to issue virtual taxation report in August.

[Goronmon]

Looks like things may soon heat up in the debate concerning the taxation of virtual goods according to this article (http://news.com.com/8301-10784_3-9733848-7.html) on Cnet News (http://news.com.com/).

Dan Miller, a senior economist with the Congress' Joint Economic Committee, told CNET News.com on Friday that he expects the committee to issue its report during the upcoming Congressional recess next month.
I have yet to hear a reason why taxation would be a good idea, other than more money for the government.

[Acidpoptart]

I have yet to hear a reason why taxation would be a good idea, other than more money for the government.
But isn't that the whole point of a tax? I know that every now and then a new tax is designed to be a deterrent, but this may just be about finding additional funds.

[torrefaction]

Goronmon...that quote is solid gold. I think most people who'd like to see an end to the IRS feel exactly the same way.

[[Jez]]

I'm sorry but I cant see how the government can tax a non existent item that belongs to a company who you have already payed. Hell even goldfarmers state that they are charging you for the time it took them to acquire the gold.

[torrefaction]

']I'm sorry but I cant see how the government can tax a non existent item that belongs to a company who you have already payed. Hell even goldfarmers state that they are charging you for the time it took them to acquire the gold.

I'm of two minds here. Taxing virtual goods the same as real goods lends more credence to a virtual word.

But I don't like taxing, so fuck that noise.

[[Jez]]

I'm of two minds here. Taxing virtual goods the same as real goods lends more credence to a virtual word.

But I don't like taxing, so fuck that noise.
But then wouldn't the tax be in gold coins? :D

[Johan]

IRS: "We've got what it takes, to take what you've got."

Fix the damn AMT. Freaking politicians.

[torrefaction]

IRS: "We've got what it takes, to take what you've got."

Fix the damn AMT. Freaking politicians.

Vote Ron Paul.

[Johan]

Vote Ron Paul.

You know...this is depressing, but I can't just throw my vote away.

Look what happened when Floridians voted Nader...

[torrefaction]

You know...this is depressing, but I can't just throw my vote away.

Look what happened when Floridians voted Nader...

I used to have that attitude...and you know what?

I realized that the lack of change in the country would be my fault. Hopefully you realize that too.

[Darkon]

Wouldn't this in a way be taxation without representation? I'm no lawyer or all that acquainted with laws of this sort, but wouldn't we need to appoint online representatives and such? How many do you think that are in the political world want to be a senator, congressman, etc... of the different territories of WOW.

I wish stupid stuff like this never sees the light of day but greed always finds a way to mess up everything.

[tombofsoldier]

Giving the government more money is the reason the government does just about anything at all. Their solution to anything, whether it be pollution, overcrowded roads, or "obscene presentations" somehow ends up getting them more $.

[rubbishfoo]

This will only work properly if they tax the virtual monies.

More farmin....

[Goronmon]

Goronmon...that quote is solid gold. I think most people who'd like to see an end to the IRS feel exactly the same way.Well, I was talking in this context. I know why taxes in general are needed, but in this case it just doesn't make sense.

I mean, to me, it sounds like either the IRS is incapable or too lazy to deal with people not reporting their RMT earnings at tax time. So, instead of doing their job, they are just going to force the publishers to do it for them.

Edit: If people are reporting their RMT earnings as income, then the government is getting their taxes, without having to resort to ridiculous measures like taxing virtual goods. Why don't they just go after people for tax evasion?

[torrefaction]

Well, I was talking in this context. I know why taxes in general are needed, but in this case it just doesn't make sense.

I mean, to me, it sounds like either the IRS is incapable or too lazy to deal with people not reporting their RMT earnings at tax time. So, instead of doing their job, they are just going to force the publishers to do it for them.

Oh, I know it was in context.

But it was no less hilarious.

[mkelehan]

This won't fly. You can't tax someone for something they don't own.

[Klade]

How I decide on this issue depends on how the government handles it. If they decide that items once sold for real world money should be taxed then I don't really care about that. There are sales taxes on everything so why not this?

If they are talking about taxing the money your character has or the items they obtain before you ever sell them (even if you never do sell them) then its a law so bad it would completely destroy the online gaming market. I mean the grubby 13 year old who plays MMOs non-stop is suddenly responsible for hundreds, perhaps even thousands of dollars in taxes and he never even had cash in his pocket.

[Bobbystringer22]

Starting in 2008, Freedom: now with 14.8% tax.

[Johan]

I realized that the lack of change in the country would be my fault. Hopefully you realize that too.

There are several thousand Nader-voting Democrats in Florida who realize that they are to blame for Gore losing Florida by a few hundred votes (or whatever number it turned out to be...pretty slim).

Bush would not have picked up Nader's supporters. They not only threw their vote away, the threw the election.

[Esquilax1138]

I think it might mainly relate to real life monies earned from a on line world. Mainly something like Second Life where you can sell your in game credits for real cash, it's basically a real currency of it's own, and I suspect valued at more than some real countries currency. Last I checked it was $4.08 USD for 1000 SL dollars. So if you cash out, and make a nice haul, I'm pretty sure the IRS wants it's cut.

But then it should be fine to write off your MMO fee's as a deduction/investment net loss.

As for in game items, if you have no legal way of turning those items into real world cash, then it's a much tougher issue I would think.

[doubtingthomas]

There are several thousand Nader-voting Democrats in Florida who realize that they are to blame for Gore losing Florida by a few hundred votes (or whatever number it turned out to be...pretty slim).

Bush would not have picked up Nader's supporters. They not only threw their vote away, the threw the election.

As a Nader voter, I resent that. And I don't understand why Democrats felt they were entitled to my vote then, or now. Lastly, that second sentence just isn't true. While polling indicates that some Nader voters would have voted for Gore, some also would have voted for Bush and even more would have not voted at all. And if you want to blame someone for Bush being in office, blame people who ACTUALLY VOTED FOR BUSH, not those who voted for Nader.

[Johan]

Thread derail!

As a Nader voter, I resent that.

Well, you're in Nashville. Unless you were in Florida then, you're taking up someone else's offense.

And I don't understand why Democrats felt they were entitled to my vote then, or now.

I never said that. They may have.

Lastly, that second sentence just isn't true. While polling indicates that some Nader voters would have voted for Gore, some also would have voted for Bush and even more would have not voted at all.

Baloney. Nader supporters are much more in line with Democratic ideals and platforms/positions than Republican ones. As close as Florida was, if Nader had not been in the race, Gore would have won.

And if you want to blame someone for Bush being in office, blame people who ACTUALLY VOTED FOR BUSH, not those who voted for Nader.

Okay! Plus Foridian Nader voters! :D

[inscribed]

Vote Ron Paul.

This is the correct answer to every question, ever.

And comparing Ron Paul to Nader doesn't even make sense. Nader was running independent. Ron Paul is running for the Republican nomination. Huge difference.

[torrefaction]

There are several thousand Nader-voting Democrats in Florida who realize that they are to blame for Gore losing Florida by a few hundred votes (or whatever number it turned out to be...pretty slim).

Bush would not have picked up Nader's supporters. They not only threw their vote away, the threw the election.

Yeah, okay. Then fall into the same two-party trap that's caused all the corruption, and issues with out government that we have in the first place.

But stop saying freaking politicians, because obviously they have your vote.

[doubtingthomas]

Well, you're in Nashville. Unless you were in Florida then, you're taking up someone else's offense.

I think you should be allowed to vote for whomever you want wherever you are. We could get in another argument about the electoral college, but I'll just leave it at defending a Floridian's right to vote for whom they choose.

Baloney. Nader supporters are much more in line with Democratic ideals and platforms/positions than Republican ones. As close as Florida was, if Nader had not been in the race, Gore would have won.

I'd dispute that. Or that must be why all of the Democrats in the House and Senate voted against the Iraq war. Democrats and Republicans have far more in common with each other than Ralph Nader.

Okay! Plus Foridian Nader voters! :D

Again, you're assuming Gore was entitled to Nader votes, and he wasn't.

[Loganrapp]

I used to have that attitude...and you know what?

I realized that the lack of change in the country would be my fault. Hopefully you realize that too.

Vote Bloomberg. Like him or not, when (he says no, but he will) he runs he'll be the best independent candidate since Teddy Roosevelt (meaning: Roosevelt was better, but Bloomberg's better than Perot). He's got the money to do it - billionaire, yo - and he won't be a Republican or a Democrat.

So, even if you don't agree with his policies, vote for him as a vote against the way both parties are going. Having a third-party candidate become president will really fuck up Washington's party and that will be much more beneficial in the long run for both sides of the aisle and a growing moderate majority that's pissed at the both of them.

[gawaintheblind]

Im ok with taxing fake things. Now, do you think they want my fake taxes in DAoC gold pieces, or would they prefer it in CoV invention parts?



Edit: Rupees?

[MJBuddy]

The gov't taxes capitalism; it's why capitalism works, and it's why the government has such lax economic policies.

As dumb as it seems, this all makes absurd sense and it's being taken care of way before we see the reason why (SOE probably doesn't report sales from their in-game-item store, etc. due to the loophole, when they are in fact making transactions for profit, obviously).

I doubt the tax will be harsh, if it's any consolation :P.


And about third-party voting and what not. If you really focus on an issue you want, find the candidate that represents that and vote for him - it's the only way one of the major two parties will incorporate it. Most likely the Democrats since they tend to attack voting markets more deliberately.


As sick as it may sound to you, you need to think universally and globally on a 50 year scale when it comes to politics, not who benefits you tommorrow. If you really feel like your third party vote is neccessary to prove your point, you do have to realize that a vote for X Independant is NOT a vote and should not be a vote for that person, but for what he stands for (that's why the Anyone But X votes are IDIOTS. I've seen it with Bush and Hillary now, and it's by far the dumbest thing to enter politics since Bush...).


And ffs, take some damn Civics classes in HS people.

[torrefaction]

Vote Bloomberg. Like him or not, when (he says no, but he will) he runs he'll be the best independent candidate since Teddy Roosevelt (meaning: Roosevelt was better, but Bloomberg's better than Perot). He's got the money to do it - billionaire, yo - and he won't be a Republican or a Democrat.

So, even if you don't agree with his policies, vote for him as a vote against the way both parties are going. Having a third-party candidate become president will really fuck up Washington's party and that will be much more beneficial in the long run for both sides of the aisle and a growing moderate majority that's pissed at the both of them.

No. I'm not voting for another guy like that. I'm voting for a man who can back up his words with his voting policy. No one has a leg to stand on in comparison with Ron Paul on his consistent voting record, and what I'm voting for is honesty and protection of the constitution.

I don't even give a damn about his war policy. To some extent, I disagree. But I can at least say he's stood his ground. That's more than I can say for just about any politicians.

[Shifter]

Actually I look forward to seeing how this is going to pan out. For example, you buy the latest +10 Stamina Chestpiece on the Auction House. 6% of the purchase price automatically goes for state tax, plust another 5% held for annual for federal property tax on the land occupied by Ironforge. State governments are now charged with policing activities in the various zones of Azeroth, as well as providing road maintenance and park services. The Dwarves refuse to pay Federal property tax for years, culminating in a barricade standoff outside the mountain.

[Phades]

Vote Bloomberg. Like him or not, when (he says no, but he will) he runs he'll be the best independent candidate since Teddy Roosevelt (meaning: Roosevelt was better, but Bloomberg's better than Perot). He's got the money to do it - billionaire, yo - and he won't be a Republican or a Democrat.

So, even if you don't agree with his policies, vote for him as a vote against the way both parties are going. Having a third-party candidate become president will really fuck up Washington's party and that will be much more beneficial in the long run for both sides of the aisle and a growing moderate majority that's pissed at the both of them.

You mean the Democrat.... oh wait now he's a Republican.... oh wait now he's an Independent? Yeah, let's vote for the guy who can't make up his mind.

[laggerific]

There are several thousand Nader-voting Democrats in Florida who realize that they are to blame for Gore losing Florida by a few hundred votes (or whatever number it turned out to be...pretty slim).

Bush would not have picked up Nader's supporters. They not only threw their vote away, the threw the election.

Well, to a certain degree...there of course is the well documented voter suppression that went on there with the aid of Katherine Harris and various other hooligans.