Mario 128 on Revolution

[bapenguin]

It looks like the ill-fated and non existant Mario 128 has gone from the Gamecube to the Revolution.

According to Gamespot (http://www.gamespot.com/news/2005/06/16/news_6127632.html): Miyamoto says, "We think we want [Mario 128] on Revolution... The Mario team can't create too many games at the same time, so they're concentrating on the Revolution."

Miyamoto also talks about the controller's being Nintendo's "big gun", but because of the secrecy, he can't reveal too much detail on the game's gameplay.

Hmm...I'm begining to feel a lot hype on the controllers....lets hope they really do have something magical up their sleeve. A large chunk of the gaming population feels Nintendo has lost touch with the "average" gamer, it'll be interesting to see what they have in store to bring them back.

[Klade]

The rumor mill has said the controller will have a touch sensative pad... Really I don't see that as being revolutionary. So I hope they having something else in mind for the controllers or the console itself.

I personally can't think of anything too big that they could do to a controller... maybe make it sensitive to where its being positioned so by moving your arm you could tell your character walk forward etc.

[Phades]

This actually annoys me. Nintendo had been saying for a while that the new Mario would definitely be on the Cube. Guess Nintendo is good at breaking promises just like the rest of them.

[DriveALW]

Hey, you know what controller would have worked great for a new Mario game? THE GAMECUBE ONE. Hey, I already have one, hooked up to my F*cking Gamecube no less! Now, why can't I play Mario on that?

[womp]

A large chunk of the gaming population feels Nintendo has lost touch with the "average" gamer,

how does the large chunk of the gaming population, ie people who'll more likely claim to be above average/hardcore gamers, claim to know what is appealing to the average gamer? most people here pan the sims and nintendogs, two games clearly appealing to the average gamer. perhaps it is the vocal gaming population who is out of touch with the average gamer.

[Heretic Machine]

how does the large chunk of the gaming population, ie people who'll more likely claim to be above average/hardcore gamers, claim to know what is appealing to the average gamer? most people here pan the sims and nintendogs, two games clearly appealing to the average gamer. perhaps it is the vocal gaming population who is out of touch with the average gamer.

Or maybe it is you who are out of touch with the people on this site. Also, you might want to give your old english teacher a call, ask about capitalization.

[Rakael]

Hey, you know what controller would have worked great for a new Mario game? THE GAMECUBE ONE. Hey, I already have one, hooked up to my F*cking Gamecube no less! Now, why can't I play Mario on that?

Wow man, ease up on the crank. It'll all be ok in the end.

All joking aside though, I do see your point. I really like the GC controller and really dislike Sunshine. Tried three seperate times to play the game and just could not get into it. This new controller had better have a sex toy of some sort built in for it to be as revolutionary as they are hyping it up to be. I hope its really, monstrously badass, but I can't help but have my doubts.

[if76]

how does the large chunk of the gaming population, ie people who'll more likely claim to be above average/hardcore gamers, claim to know what is appealing to the average gamer? most people here pan the sims and nintendogs, two games clearly appealing to the average gamer. perhaps it is the vocal gaming population who is out of touch with the average gamer.

Just because Nintendogs is a hit with the "average" gamer in japan doesn't mean it's gonna be a hit with the average gamer here. I really doubt too many americans are gonna go out and buy a DS for Nintendogs. In Japan dogs are a lot more valued than here in the states because no one has enough space to keep them. There are actually places where you can rent dogs there.

If you put a picture of a dog on a billboard in japan it's gonna get peoples' attention while if you do that here, no one will care.

[Abednigo]

I think we can all agree that it will please a great number of people. But it will be very disappointing to just as many, regardless of what it is. As long as fanboys and haters exist, someone will be upset (or thrilled to death). Get over it.

[kokyunage]

Or maybe it is you who are out of touch with the people on this site

The people on this site are hardly "average" gamers. Just look at any Top20 post and watch the complaining. Like womp said, the average gamer enjoys and buys The Sims, Nintendo Dogs (or whatever it's called), etc... I think it's just plain silly to think that the EvilAvatar community represents the average gamer.

[Dirty Harry]

Just because Nintendogs is a hit with the "average" gamer in japan doesn't mean it's gonna be a hit with the average gamer here. I really doubt too many americans are gonna go out and buy a DS for Nintendogs. In Japan dogs are a lot more valued than here in the states because no one has enough space to keep them. There are actually places where you can rent dogs there.

If you put a picture of a dog on a billboard in japan it's gonna get peoples' attention while if you do that here, no one will care.
Thats a very good point, imagine living in a bladerunner-ish world, and i mean the fucking novel. Not that god awful pile that was produced.

[Kamalot]

Or maybe it is you who are out of touch with the people on this site. Also, you might want to give your old english teacher a call, ask about capitalization.
Bringing people to task about their English or grammar abilities is the an awful low form of comeback for an Internet message board. Just because one has a grasp of capitalization does not make their idea any more valid than others.

I agree that the Evil Avatar audience is not your average gamer audience.

The vocal gaming population is out of touch with the average gamer.

[Steele Johnson]

If you put a picture of a dog on a billboard in japan it's gonna get peoples' attention while if you do that here, no one will care.

That's because it looks like a big bucket of fried chicken to them. :D

Just kidding.

[Cha-Ka]

This is terribly terribly terribly terribly terribly funny - I mean I mean tragic.

Nintendo continues their proud tradition of walking their prancing thier proud franchises across the showroom floor once or twice per console. I'm no fan of Mariowares but I think the folks that are deserved at least one "traditional" mario for their GC.

[blademonkey]

Bringing people to task about their English or grammar abilities is the an awful low form of comeback for an Internet message board. Just because one has a grasp of capitalization does not make their idea any more valid than others.

Yes but it's a good way for him to get his "post" number up(clearly some people love to get their numbers up, makes them look more "postish"). I care about punctuation an awful lot, capitalization is not as important as it doesn't really change the message. Bad punctuation has ability, your message could get misinterpreted, but I dont see how capitalization would have such detrimental effect to the point.

I agree that the Evil Avatar audience is not your average gamer audience.

The vocal gaming population is out of touch with the average gamer.

I couldn't agree more, but then that statement can spark a counter that would sound a bit like "well then most websites are out of touch with the average gamer".

Being a gamer, I would love to find out what constitutes a Average Gamer in people's eyes? Is it the frequency of play? Is is the knowledge about a particular game's intricaties? Is it the postishness of the person?

I have a very limited perspective on this, as I am not able to rise above flame baiting and annoying posts. So of course I will share.

I dont think the average gamer posts on game forums.
I do think the average gamer plays games because they are fun.
I dont think the average gamer cares about being called an average gamer.
I dont think that one can fully argue about a term that has not been properly defined (at least to me).

But who are we to judge, what makes one person's point more valid than the next?

enlighten me.

-Monkey

[Zanzibar]

Hey, you know what controller would have worked great for a new Mario game? THE GAMECUBE ONE. Hey, I already have one, hooked up to my F*cking Gamecube no less! Now, why can't I play Mario on that?

I laughed my ass off when I read this.

[XxSATANxX]

WeLl i Coul d ' nt aGREE more Bout ThE Punkuasion tHing.

Tits iMpotent to ME ASS well!

[fitbabits]

Well, color me surprised. Mario 128 on Revolution, not on GameCube. And the Nintendo collective are surprised because of.... what? That their everloving and reliable Shigeru Miyamoto told a wee fib? Or could it be because they are finally being forced to deal with the fact that Nintendo are scrambling to make any sort of meaningful impact against Sony and Microsoft's next gen plans?

This whole 'revolution' thing has got to such a point now that it's going to be a huge letdown no matter what it is.

[Kefkataran]

So, uh... did anyone else catch this Mario thing when it was first announced a month ago at E3? And wasn't there a story just a week or two ago about Miyamoto admitting that the controller design that he's claiming to be revolutionary in this interview isn't even done yet?

Am I seriously getting videogame news events beamed to my head before they happen or what?

[Kamalot]

I do think the average gamer plays games because they are fun.
Why then do non-average (some would say 'above-average') gamers play games?

Personally, I could care less when the next 3D Mario game comes out. I'm much more interested in the 2D one for the DS.

http://www.evilavatar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2865

[SaintArnold]

Read this: IGN's Miyamoto interview (http://cube.ign.com/articles/617/617000p1.html)

He admits that Mario 128 doesn't even exist. People are still talking about the demo of 128 marios running around that was shown a few E3s ago as if it was a game.

Maybe we will get a proper sequel to Mario 64 eventually. I hope so.

[falak]

Bringing people to task about their English or grammar abilities is the an awful low form of comeback for an Internet message board. Just because one has a grasp of capitalization does not make their idea any more valid than others.I hate to say it, but if you can't be bothered to hit the shift key once in a while, you really shouldn't be participating in an online discussion of any kind. The other posters are right, it makes you look ignorant and right off the bat your post - no matter how well thought out or worded - seems like it is coming from an ignorant fool.Interesting post, womp. It was well thought out. Wait, no capitalization? Well, you're clearly an ignorant fool. That's right. It's official. You are:

1. Lacking education or knowledge.
2. Unaware or uninformed.

In addition to this, Evil no longer wants you here. You shouldn't be participating in an online discussion of any kind.

Sorry. :D :rolleyes:

[Adam Blue]

No that pretty much says that the game 'Mario 128' doesn't exist. He does say however that the team is doing 'tests', as in trying to make a new game.

What's up with this? It is annoying just to wait for a good Nintendo game and then it being a piece of crap when released. I love Ninty and all of its kiddy fun, but what's the excuse for lack of good games, or just games in general? Hell, effin Metroid Prime was made by Americans...and it was good!

It has been obvious from the start that there was no Mario 128. Sunshine was the Mario title for the Cube and then....I guess Nintendo decided to take a nap and have monkeys publish games for the console like Charlie's Angels and Army Men.

[bapenguin]

The average gamer is someone who games on a regular basis, but doesn't necessarily extensivly look around online for information on upcoming games. The average gamer is someone that goes into EB Games or whatever, looks at a box and buys the game based on that. The average gamer has no idea who Miyamoto, Molyneoux, or Meier are.

[Furious Wang]

how does the large chunk of the gaming population, ie people who'll more likely claim to be above average/hardcore gamers, claim to know what is appealing to the average gamer? most people here pan the sims and nintendogs, two games clearly appealing to the average gamer. perhaps it is the vocal gaming population who is out of touch with the average gamer.

I won't comment on Nintendogs, for its success in America has yet to be determined.

However, the Sims is not appealing to the "average" gamer. It is appealing (primarily) to the "non" gamer. People who play games on occasions when they generally don't have anything else to do. Down time from the rest of their life. The games they own are limited to titles like Pinball, Texas hold 'em 'extreme, Cabrera Deer Hunter 18: The Great White Hunt, and Solitaire.

Your average gamer thinks of gaming as a hobby and plays games regularly. They play 5-10 hours a week, play through about 1 game a month, and reads through an EGM every now and then.

Your hardcore gamer plays through a title a week, knows every detail about the next gen consoles, has posters of Mario or Aeris on his wall, and owns the soundtrack to Castlevania: SotN.

Note: All three may play the Sim, however, the majority of the Sims players come from Category number 1.

You guys also realize that this means there won't be a Mario game available at launch for Revolution. The Mario team is working on other things.

How dissappointing.

[Adam Blue]

Your hardcore gamer plays through a title a week, knows every detail about the next gen consoles, has posters of Mario or Aeris on his wall, and owns the soundtrack to Castlevania: SotN.

Haha so true. I have a Ninja Gaiden wall scroll and the Soundtrack to SotN. Could that be why I can't hold on to a girl after a few nights over at my house?


You guys also realize that this means there won't be a Mario game available at launch for Revolution. The Mario team is working on other things.

How dissappointing.

So true unfortunatley. You can say Mario 128 exists all you want, but the Mario team is just doing tests and obviously plan on releasing a Mario game. Just not the Mario 128 we all had in mind.

[petedog]

you might want to give your old english teacher a call, ask about capitalization.

While you're at it, you might wanna ask that English teacher how he/she would define irony.

[Kelegacy]

Nintendogs will be a huge hit here, too. You people who are skeptical should know better by now. It'll be absolutely huge. It seems that it was well designed and when games are fun it doesnt matter WHAT country they come from.

I probably wont run out to get it, but i think it'll be a hit with most mainstream and a large portion of hardcore gamers.

[Kefkataran]

And another big problem is advertising, which NOA is horrible at. Not as many people will hear about it here.

Mostly true, except when it comes to handhelds, for some reason. Their ad campaigns for GBA and DS in the past couple years have been pretty slick.

[EternalGamer]

I suspect both the DS and games like Warioware Twisted and Yoshi Topsy Turvy are giving us hints as to where the new Revolution controller is going. Nintendo seems to be testing the market with these unorthodoxed methods of control. I expect both of these technologies to play some part in the Revolution controller. It will be fascinating, even if they are just "additional" features to an otherwise standard controller. However, I am not sure that they will be "more intuitive" or non-alienating to mainstream audiences the way Nintendo is pitching them. If a lot of ways, I think playing a game in these ways techniques will be perhaps just one more barrier, but we'll see.

At the very least, I expect Nintendo to keep doing what it has been doing for a long time in being the first to bring new controller evolution to the market (D-pad, shoulder buttons, analogue, rumble feature, wireless...) whether or not this new design is "revolutionary" remains to be seen.

[bapenguin]

Nintendogs will be a huge hit here, too. You people who are skeptical should know better by now. It'll be absolutely huge. It seems that it was well designed and when games are fun it doesnt matter WHAT country they come from.

I probably wont run out to get it, but i think it'll be a hit with most mainstream and a large portion of hardcore gamers.

I think the kids will just eat it up. Remember those tamagatchi (sp?) things from a few years ago. They were friggin in happy meals for god sakes. This is a glorified version of that.

[Achilles]

First of all, a lot of mainstream gamers only want games that are "mature", because playing games that don't have lots of violence is for little kids. That’s not the market that will buy this game. Who will buy this game are women, girls, and non-gamers. It’ll be like the Sims all over again where a lot of hardcore and casual male gamers bash/ignore it day in and day out but the thing still sells 12 million copies. Personally I like these kinds of games, but I like most any kind of game.

[Babbster]

On Nintendogs:
1. To the "why not play with a real dog" folks:
a. Many people don't have dogs because they take a lot of work.
b. As a corollary to the above, the game will appeal to people because it will take a lot LESS work to train and take care of a game dog.
2. "Catz" and "Dogz" have sold VERY well on the PC, and to the same sort of people who buy "The Sims" (like me, though I enjoy a rollicking cop-killing festival in GTA as much as anyone).
3. Bottom line is that virtual pets rock. Like the best non-pet games, they combine elements of control (choices leading to consequences, good and bad), development (think levels in RPGs) and interactivity (making the pet happy can provide pleasure to the player) that gamers enjoy. Some may THINK that it's just silly fluff, but it's no more so than spending hours and hours breeding chocobos in order to get an item/weapon that you don't really need to play the game.

On "Revolution"ary controls:
1. I don't think even Nintendo knows exactly where this is going to end up. The fact that they haven't even shown some people a video demonstrating how cool it is seems to indicate that they have a long way to go.
2. It's going to be far less revolutionary than the hype (no surprise). That's probably a good thing since they're still going to want third parties to be able to port things to their machine - it may not be the primary reason people buy Nintendo consoles but it surely helps folks decide to make it their first choice.
3. Whatever they end up with will be fun but it will probably once again be utilized mostly by Nintendo games with other developers sticking with the tried-and-true sticks and buttons.
4. It's got to be better than Gamecube<->GBA connectivity since, hopefully, it won't require people to blow an extra $80 or more to enable the "extras."

[mister_slim]

I suspect both the DS and games like Warioware Twisted and Yoshi Topsy Turvy are giving us hints as to where the new Revolution controller is going. Nintendo seems to be testing the market with these unorthodoxed methods of control. I expect both of these technologies to play some part in the Revolution controller.
I'm not sure, personally. The Twisted rotation sensor has some calibration problems and the Yoshi tilt sensor is just a simple orientation sensor (just three positions, for example).

[Furious Wang]

While you're at it, you might wanna ask that English teacher how he/she would define irony.

Irony: It isn't what you think it is.

Example:

Student falls out of upperstory school window.

Onlooker says: "Man, that's one kid who shouldn't have dropped out of school."

Actually, that phrase is ironic when used either way.

[DriveALW]

Wow man, ease up on the crank. It'll all be ok in the end.

Not without crank it won't!

[Rommel]

While you're at it, you might wanna ask that English teacher how he/she would define irony.

And a blowjob. Yeah, ask for a blowjob too.

[El-Rodente]

wait, didnt they use the mario 128 engine for pikmin?

the engine with 128 marios at least

or maybe it's just mario 64 twice, the end cutscene goes "ohnoes! she has been stoeled again!" and you restart

[Teddeh]

Bringing people to task about their English or grammar abilities is the an awful low form of comeback for an Internet message board. Just because one has a grasp of capitalization does not make their idea any more valid than others.

<applause>

Well said. Please repost the above on Slashdot. :)

In the days of BBSes and private networks, even in the early days of the WWW, you would only correct spelling or grammar of another person if it confused the message they were trying to get across, if it was ambiguous, or if the person asked to be corrected because the language used was not their first language.

That particular piece of net etiquette has sadly been forgotten.

Now, we have Grammar/Spelling Nazis who take delight belittling people for whom English may be a third of fourth language and people who think that bad grammar or spelling means bad idea or opinion.

[51|RandoM]

They're going to have to try pretty hard to top the wavebird. The wavebird is the best console controller ever, imho.

[Kamalot]

wait, didnt they use the mario 128 engine for pikmin?

the engine with 128 marios at least

or maybe it's just mario 64 twice, the end cutscene goes "ohnoes! she has been stoeled again!" and you restart

That's funny! Maybe Mario wakes from a dream to find the princess is REALLY kidnapped! :eek:

[screwtape]

Irony: It isn't what you think it is.

Example:

Student falls out of upperstory school window.

Onlooker says: "Man, that's one kid who shouldn't have dropped out of school."

Actually, that phrase is ironic when used either way.
That's not irony. That's a pun - a play-on-words.

On-topic, I don't want to have to wait till next-gen to get my Mario fix. I bought a DS specifically for Mario DS. I need a new fix, dammit.

[Kefkataran]

Yeah, irony is when something is the opposite of what you'd expect. That phrase wasn't ironic, like Screwtape says.

Example of irony: a "grammar nazi" on a forum having a post (especially one where they're critiquing someone's grammar) with particularly bad sentence structure or missed capitalizations.

[Steamtron]

Whlie I dont care about grammar or the definition of irony, I do have a pretty big problem with what Nintendo is doing here. I'm not entirely sure, but I believe it was Iwata that said that Mario 128 was definetly coming to gamecube, but details could not be released because the game's innovations would be stolen by the competition. This gave me the impression the game was pretty far into development. Now not only is it not coming to cube, but it sounds like they dont have any idea what play mechanics/controls are going to be implemented into the game.
This is becoming more common with Nintendo. Earlier in the year, they said that the Revolution controller was done, but they couldn't show anything because the design would be copied. Now they just say they've put a lot of money into it, but theyre still tossing ideas around about what will make it revolutionairy.
I've never bought a system that wasn't Nintendo and Ive stuck with the company all these years, but they just seem to be scrambling around for ideas at this point.

[Kamalot]

I don't know how much is them scrambling for ideas and how much is development process. I know that great product development involves revisiting the same design again and again, tweaking it until it is perfect. This is evidenced in the GameCube controller, quite possibly the most usable console controller, which wasn't complete mere months before the launch of the GameCube.

Compare this to the Playstation 3 controller, affectionately referred to as the "dildorang (http://www.joystiq.com/entry/1234000687047096/#c299075)." Obviously, it was designed with looks in mind, not usability. Sony will likely keep this design as well, with minor tweaks to make the device function. The same process happened with the PSP. Early mockups very closely match the final product, keeping the same look while being tweaked to make it workable.

I'd rather have people unveil the final controller design after months and months of hands-on testing and prototyping instead of having your design team whip up a dildorang as something to show at E3.

The same can be said for Mario 128. Mario game development starts with playable fundamentals and mechanics, without the graphics. When the first Super Mario game was in development, the team would use simple square graphics to play with, just to get the feel right for running and jumping. This is probably what they are doing for this supposed Mario 128 game, trying different mechanics to really hit it.

Now, would you rather the team went through this process the Nintendo way, tapping into the fundamental core of game and controller interface design, or would you rather them bang out another Mario 64 title with shiny graphics?

Check out the Controller Family Tree (http://www.axess.com/twilight/console/) to see where the controller innovation comes from. The Playstation series of controllers is nothing more than a Super Nintendo Pad with extra triggers and N64 analog sticks added to compete, a total hack-job.

Let Nintendo take their time with it. Only good things will happen for all gamers.

[Steamtron]

I'm not saying that they're scrambling because they're taking their time. I agree with you completly that the development cycle should allow them to take as long as possible to get things right. My problem is that they gave the impression that mario 128 was so close to being finished by guarenteeing something as high profile as a new mario game for a console with about a year left in its life span. It doesn't look great when you turn around and essentially make it sound like the game has barely begun development. Of course, thats the impression that i got from the comments made by Miyamoto. But you're right, it could just be tweaking at this point. i just wish they wouldn't put the horse before the carriage so to speak.

[bobbler]

...
Compare this to the Playstation 3 controller, affectionately referred to as the "dildorang (http://www.joystiq.com/entry/1234000687047096/#c299075)." Obviously, it was designed with looks in mind, not usability. Sony will likely keep this design as well, with minor tweaks to make the device function. The same process happened with the PSP. Early mockups very closely match the final product, keeping the same look while being tweaked to make it workable.


I would have to go with the other way around. It looks ugly as sin. It also looks very comfortable. There have been a few comfortable PS1/PS2 controllers shaped similarly -- they looked ugly but worked well.

[Kamalot]

I would have to go with the other way around. It looks ugly as sin. It also looks very comfortable. There have been a few comfortable PS1/PS2 controllers shaped similarly -- they looked ugly but worked well.
My beef with the design is the fact that Sony refuses to move the location of the controls to suit modern games.

When 3D games became commonplace, the analog joystick migrated to the primary left-thumb position for all controllers except the Playstation, which retains the 'd-pad' from its Super Nintendo roots.

Other companies, Nintendo, Microsoft and Sega, analyze the usage of the controls and then place them accordingly. Sony is more concerned with keeping the device symmetrical to maintain a pleasant appearance instead of visiting the controller as a user-interface.

To a non-gamer, the PS3 controller looks appealing: smooth contours, shiny surface, glossy buttons, and symmetrical design. The GameCube controller, in comparison, looks quite funky and unapproachable. However, when you explore the controller with your hands, not your eyes, the brilliance of the GameCube design shows through with great tactile feedback in terms of size, shape, placement and response. Unless you are very familiar with the Playstation controller, there is no way to tell which button is the 'triangle' and which button is the 'square', short of looking.

[bobbler]

My beef with the design is the fact that Sony refuses to move the location of the controls to suit modern games.

When 3D games became commonplace, the analog joystick migrated to the primary left-thumb position for all controllers except the Playstation, which retains the 'd-pad' from its Super Nintendo roots.

Other companies, Nintendo, Microsoft and Sega, analyze the usage of the controls and then place them accordingly. Sony is more concerned with keeping the device symmetrical to maintain a pleasant appearance instead of visiting the controller as a user-interface.

Touche. abcdefg

[mister_slim]

Now, would you rather the team went through this process the Nintendo way, tapping into the fundamental core of game and controller interface design, or would you rather them bang out another Mario 64 title with shiny graphics?
I would rather they came up with something new that was true to the spirit of Mario, rather than just going with something like the waterpack.