Guitar Hero Tracks Cost Comparison.

[Tricky Thumb]

Gaming Bits has a good article that puts todays Marketplace release into perspective. It'll make GH2 360 owners a little mad, methinks.

If you break it down, there are 47 tracks in the Guitar Hero 1 release for the PS2, which retails for about $40 currently. That's about .85 cents a track. Each Track Pack is available for 500 Microsoft Points ($6.25) on the Xbox 360, which includes three tracks. That's about $2.08 a track on the Xbox 360. And to put it into perspective, if it keeps at this rate, that means Guitar Hero 1 on the Xbox 360 will cost you $97.76. While future track releases and pricing has yet to be announced, it will surely be judged according to the response on these purchases. Put your MS points where your mouth is, 360 gamers.

Gaming Bits Link (http://www.gamingbits.com/content/view/1945/2/)

Now I'm all for paying a bit extra, but I really do hope these packs come down in price as people pay for them. I'm not paying THAT MUCH for a game worth 40 right now.

[CaptStu]

I wonder if this has anything to do with song licensing. Since the popularity of the game has gone up tremendously, maybe the costs associated with each song has also gone up accordingly.

[Shjinta]

I hope not all the DLC for GH 2 is going to be limited to GH 1 shit. I have my PS2 hooked up for a reason.

[lockwoodx]

I wonder if this has anything to do with song licensing. Since the popularity of the game has gone up tremendously, maybe the costs associated with each song has also gone up accordingly.


Was going to say somthing along these lines as well. Just because the game is old doesn't mean the songs lost thier value at all, infact quite the opposite as it becomes more popular.

[The Continental]

I'd have no problem paying $2.00 a song if I could pick my songs à la carte, but each of the current three packs have one if not two songs I really don't want to buy just to get the one or two I do.

[CaptStu]

From Wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Music_Licensing).

How do they figure out who gets paid, and how much?

The easiest way to look at this issue is by examining the day-to-day operations of the average music radio station. At various points throughout the year an audit of the music being played is carried out. This is submitted to the relevant body for that territory. This information is used to calculate the average number of plays each artist has received. There is a fairly complex series of calculations involved. First, the total number of songs played is tabulated. Then the total amount of license income is calculated. The second number, divided by the first, represents a single 'share' - a value equaling the percentage of cash that a single play of a single song amounts to (this is, of course, a minuscule number). This 'share' is then multiplied by the number of times a given song is played to arrive at the total value of that song's license royalties during that quarter.

For instance:

Let's say that in Q12005, 100 songs were played (this is, of course, a very, VERY small fraction of the total number of songs played in a quarter, but we're going for ease of calculation here). Let's further say that the total amount of royalties collected in that quarter was $200. Therefore, each song played is worth two dollars. So, if Aerosmith's "Dream On" was played 3 times, Aerosmith gets six dollars as their share for that quarter.

This constitutes a dramatic oversimplification of the process, and the processes for each PRO are slightly different, as are the percentages, but in a nutshell, this is how it's figured.

I know the above example is for radio, but maybe it has some merit for the at-hand conversation.

[Arphahat]

I'd have no problem paying $2.00 a song if I could pick my songs à la carte, but each of the current three packs have one if not two songs I really don't want to buy just to get the one or two I do.

Heh... just like the "good old days" of buying music on CD. At least you don't have to buy the whole album for one song. :)

[Goronmon]

We are getting the worst of both worlds. They are forcing us to buy packs where they group popular songs with ones that are less so. Then they are fucking us over on the price too.

I'm just pissed because I was really looking forward to picking up some GH1 songs, but if this is the way they want to do it, fuck them.

[Ph00p]

Wow guess I'm not missing out on alot with the PS2 version then.

[roboninja]

Seems to me like another example of MS raping users with microtransactions. I am sure I am overreacting, but this type of thing (along with the refusal to put up Gears maps for free) has me rethinking my purchase of a 360.

[MrChaz]

I'd like to coin the phrase 'Horse music'

[Food Nipple]

I wonder if this has anything to do with song licensing. Since the popularity of the game has gone up tremendously, maybe the costs associated with each song has also gone up accordingly.

There was no separate licensing agreement for the DLC, so the costs haven't changed, and from what I've heard those costs are extremely minimal and in some cases non-existant. There's really no excuse for the high price on this stuff, it's just a cash grab by RedOctane/Activision.

[Arphahat]

This could be a matter of them charging what they feel they can get for the songs for those desperate enough to buy them at this ridiculous price. Maybe, like GoW, they will drop the prices (make them free? Don't hold your breath) for the songs after the initial rush.

[bskeillor]

I'm not sure Song Licensing plays too much into this equation. There may be some portion that goes back to the artist, but it can't be much, otherwise they would use the artist's versions of the songs instead of using the "Made famous by" tag.

I'm not sure if I'm more dissapointed at the DLC pricing now or the fact that it is now approaching the 3rd week of my XBOX being out for the rings of death. GHII still sits in it's box mocking me!

[KingGorilla]

Well, considering that Microsoft charges for free content, this increase of almost 4 fold is not so much.

[Tricky Thumb]

There was no separate licensing agreement for the DLC, so the costs haven't changed, and from what I've heard those costs are extremely minimal and in some cases non-existant. There's really no excuse for the high price on this stuff, it's just a cash grab by RedOctane/Activision.

Exactly.

Especially when you consider than on iTunes you can grab one of these songs in their original format for ninety-nine cents! I'm gonna have to go with cash grab as well, I'm just not sure on whom the blame lies.

[Cupelix]

Ugh. I waited to get GH2 on 360 for the downloadables, and now I just feel like I waited to get bent over. Its going to cost me more to get GH1 on my 360 than I originally spent on GH1 in the first place? Here's a big Fuck You to whoever decided that one.

[PXG 360]

Dude, fuck that! I ain't paying 500 points for three songs. That is WAAAYYY too much money.

[DjinniMan]

I'm torn. I sold my GH2 and one controller to help fund the 360 version. We kept GH1 and one controller because my son is 2 songs away from passing all songs on expert. (The deal is if he can do that, I buy him a real guitar.) Anyway, we were all pumped about playing GH1 songs via co-op, etc. on the 360 version, but when you consider that we'd have to buy a $90 game, $30 (or so) for the extra controller, and then $90 more for the GH1 songlist... well, OUCH.

[Food Nipple]

This whole debacle has piqued my interest in Frets on Fire, I've got this USB guitar sitting right here, why not plug it into my PC?

[CrashCart]

Man am I glad I didn't wait for the 360 version. As others have said, I'm sure they're testing the DLC waters just like the horse armor pack. The pricing is way too high, but if enough people buy it, they won't start charging less. My guess is very few people have to purchase the packs to make them profitable, but they might drop the prices if they could get a lot more customers than they see at 500 points per three songs.

Also, bundling shitty songs with good ones just to increase the song count per pack while not giving the end users what they want is marketing genius. I'd hate them for it it if I owned this version, but since I don't, I can appreciate the decision for its milk the consumer for all their worth value.

[Reanimated]

I wouldn't have a big problem with the pricing here if the songs were not FUCKING COVERS.

[Norse]

If you don't like the price: DON'T BUY IT. This is how economy works. If they can get much money for it they will try, but if nobody buys it the price will drop. They aren't in this business to be nice and give away content. Do you go to work just to be nice to your employer??

[Itchyeyes]

I wouldn't hold my breath on a price reduction as I can't think of any other piece of content on Live that has dropped below it's original price. Even the infamous horse armor still sells at its original $2.50 IIRC. In my opinion, this is one of Microsoft's biggest flaws with their Live strategy.

Edit: A quick Google search shows that they did actually drop the price on the BFMEII content. However, that's the only one I could find. There may be a few more out there, but they're few and far between. I still wouldn't expect anything for GHII.

[KingGorilla]

COUGH!
http://www.evilavatar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28192

[Heretic Machine]

Just remember everyone, closed networks are awesome! So are microtransactions, in-game advertising, and this super-great generation as a whole!

[RUSKULL]

Hope it's not too long before they expire their GH1 songs and start putting in the bands they alway wanted.

[KarmaGhost]

Now I'm all for paying a bit extra, but I really do hope these packs come down in price as people pay for them. I'm not paying THAT MUCH for a game worth 40 right now.A little extra, maybe, but not for this game, which has been released in its full form on another console. I am amazed that they released an incomplete game and are charging people to complete it.

I'm updating my attitudinal disclosure. :p Grrrrr.

[spacemanspiff757]

Just last night I was playing GH2 on 360 and was thinking when they would get some downloadable content going if they had just announced GH3 for this fall. And with that, I was thinking that if they released GH1 on the Marketplace for its current value ($40, possibly a little more, wouldn't be a big deal) that it would be really cool. I get up this morning and find this fiasco...I have to say only two of the packs are appealing to me right now, but I think I can hold off at this price. Hopefully someone will eventually get a clue, see how angry some people are and drop the prices...Of course, the chances of this happening are about nil..but hey, we can hope, can't we?

[Royal Fool]

Bethesda never lowered the price for their horse armor crap; it's still 200 MS points on the marketplace. Hilarious...

[Dafizman]

Way to go Microsoft. Yesterday I was really seriously considering upgrading from the PS2 to the 360 version. Today, I'm so glad I didn't.

[NeoSuplex]

I used to be OK with the Marketplace method of DLC, but every day makes me more weary of it. Any system where you only have one choice as far as places to shop is broken.

[BalekFekete]

*** priced itself out of a potential customer with this. I was all ready to fire up the 'ol credit card and get enough points for all the DLC ... until I saw the price.

100 points per song would equate out to (roughly) the iTunes download of a given song. Where the engine and programming is already done, it's just a matter of developing the track and breaking it down for the game - forget that most of these songs are and will be ports from earlier renditions of the game.

Meh...

/me tucks his wallet firmly in his back pocket and waits.

B.

[UnderHero5]

Guitar Hero 2 on PS2 is by far my favorite game. Period.
I was actually interested in GH2 for 360 because of the downloadable content. I no longer hold that interest.

[Camel]

Blah. I would have happily paid $50 bucks total for all the songs (cost of the original game + 360 markup). Good thing I already played all these songs before, even though I would have loved to turn GH2 into GH: Super Ultimate Awesome Edition by having all the songs from the first game. I think anyone who pays that much is crazy! You hear me? CRAZY!

Here's hoping that the tracks aren't that expensive when pricing info is released, although I won't hold my breath.

And to those who planned on upgrading to the 360 version and didn't...well, let's just hope that they never stop releasing Guitar Hero games for the PS2, right?

[Adam Blue]

Terrible, Terrible Bad Religion song... How about Fuck Armageddon This is Hell?

[Maskatron]

Now I'm all for paying a bit extra

What the hell's wrong with you?

[Wyrm]

1) They are covers, and even though most of them are good covers, the REAL SONG CAN BE BOUGHT FOR .99 FUCKING CENTS OFF OF ITUNES (most of them anyway).
2) They are WAY overcharging for content that should have shipped on the disc.
3) They're not letting us pick and choose exactly what songs we want.
4) There is nothing new up yet, and there probably won't be for a long time.
5) This will be the second time I've payed for the songs.

Ok, let's also consider that I've paid for both GH1 and GH2, and I've purchase a total of three controllers (two wired, one wireless). Guitar Hero is one of my favorite games, and I think I've spent more than enough money on their product to warrant them, at the very least, releasing the songs for cheaper than 2 bucks a fucking song.

[DoubleUranium]

I hope people can resist buying these song packs. With the exception of Arcade titles, I don't spend much time in Marketplace because it all seems to be a ripoff. I just buy the game and that's the end of my purchasing for that title. If the expansion/whatever isn't free, or at least super awesome, I'm not buying it.

Maybe someday MS will figure out some basic economics and lower the price to go for higher sales. You would think they'd have figured it out by now that it's in their best interest to earn the same overall amount of money by charging less per unit and selling more units. It serves their brand better to have more people actually making Marketplace purchases, not just a few big spenders.

[Arthen]

I don't know if the price was set by MS isn't this Red Octane and Activision?

.... and its WAY to expensive. I really don't know what they were thinking. $40 should have been the cost for all of GH1 AND they should have made the GH1 Expert the hard setting and made a new expert for the easier hammer on, pull off.

[Micasa]

Was Guitar Hero 1 $40 when it came out, because otherwise the cost comparison is kind of pointless.

In any case, it's like all DLC add-ons. If you think it's too expensive, don't buy it. They get the message.

[Lizard Dude]

a la carte is always more expensive. This is not surprising.

[Pluvious]

Seems to me like another example of MS raping users with microtransactions. I am sure I am overreacting, but this type of thing (along with the refusal to put up Gears maps for free) has me rethinking my purchase of a 360.

I agree, I knew when I bought my 360, I was skeptical about Microtran$action$..and it looks like I was right.. they are really sticking it to the consumer. Doesn't make sense to me, considering all the good will they would get back for taking care of customers who just spent $90 on a game. Explain again to me why I spend $60 a year for the GOLD membership?

Maybe someday MS will figure out some basic economics and lower the price to go for higher sales. You would think they'd have figured it out by now that it's in their best interest to earn the same overall amount of money by charging less per unit and selling more units. It serves their brand better to have more people actually making Marketplace purchases, not just a few big spenders.

I've been saying this all along.. if they would just stop being greedy for one second and consider the other option... sell stuff so cheap that its a no brainer to buy it and watch the WHOLE user base buy most everything they put out!! How long would it take you hit the buy button if each pack was $1? That's only $3 for all of them and $3 times however many units they sell equals more money then what they're going to get for this crazy price; $18.75. ($6.25x3) Over $110 for one game?? I think not.

[mister_slim]

Hey, Red Octane/Activision, I've already put $170 into your pockets on the PS2. Don't fucking try to screw me, since I know the real talents behind GH are currently working on Rock Band for this fall. I'm going to keep this in mind when I decide between Rock Band and GHIII this fall, and this is pushing Rock Band into the lead.

[The Great Gatsby]

Hey, Red Octane/Activision, I've already put $170 into your pockets on the PS2. Don't fucking try to screw me, since I know the real talents behind GH are currently working on Rock Band for this fall. I'm going to keep this in mind when I decide between Rock Band and GHIII this fall, and this is pushing Rock Band into the lead.

ZOMG!! Activision/RO AM Boots Shakin'

Even if a small percentage of players think like you they'll still rake in the bucks. They don't care about you jumping ship. So start saving up for Rock Band and all those instruments, because THATS how Rock Band will rape you.

[Tel Prydain]

As I posted in the last thread:

Okay, a little feedback from someone who got song pack 3 (and will get song pack 2, because he must have Killer Queen and Frankenstein).
I am currently working on five stars for all songs in medium. I can’t quite yet handle the fifth button when playing hard.

The download was about 35mb, and took about 6-8min to download. The downloaded songs show up in their own category (titled 'Downloaded Songs') underneath the ‘Bonus Songs’ list. Like the bonus songs, there is no ‘pay’ reward for completing a downloaded track.

I have never owned a PS2, or player Guitar Hero 1, so I was going in blind.
I downloaded Pack 3, so I got Higher Ground, Infected and Stellar. I chose Pack 3 because I wanted Higher Ground and my wife wanted to play Stellar.

Ironically, I’m not overly fond of Higher Ground. There is a small spoken piece in the song, which totally ruins it for me. I’m not 100% sure if that same spoken part is in the original (I certainly don’t remember it), but it’s badly done and doesn’t fit the song at all. Ironically, I fell in love with Infected – the one song nether of us particularly wanted. Stellar was solid and, while I was not moved, my wife really liked it.

I liked the note lines of the new songs. All three songs are different to play then the other pre-packaged songs, and are great to play. I found that Stellar was quite difficult, Higher Ground was about average and Infected was really easy, but REALLY fun.

Over all I’m happy with the pack, and still plan of grabbing Pack 2 when I get a few more points. I do think they are over priced.
I think they should drop the packs to 400pts each, or offer songs as singles for about 130pts.

[shunoshi]

I don't have a problem buying seperate songs for something like 150 points each. I'm not a fan of having songs obviously bundled together to keep popular songs apart from one another (a la forcing people to buy them all). I probably wouldn't have an issue with the 3 packs if the were NEW. However, I've played all of these before and at the current price point, I'll pass.

[Arthen]

Agreed... new songs at about 3 for 4-5$, sure I get that. But this is the old GH1 content. You can't tell me you're not making it somewhat on the cheap.

[Tel Prydain]

Agreed... new songs at about 3 for 4-5$, sure I get that. But this is the old GH1 content. You can't tell me you're not making it somewhat on the cheap.
They would have had to make some changes.
Add Bass, remaster in 5.1, etc

[Camel]

Was Guitar Hero 1 $40 when it came out, because otherwise the cost comparison is kind of pointless.

In any case, it's like all DLC add-ons. If you think it's too expensive, don't buy it. They get the message.
Unless I am mistaken, I don't even know if you could buy the game by itself when it first came out...which made sense, since nobody had any controllers then and needed them too. The game never changed in price though, so if it is 40 bucks now it was the same price when it came out.

I'll be speaking with my wallet on this one, I hope others do the same.

[DeejayKnight]

I heard about this nonsense and wrote an article about it just earlier: Guitar Hero II DLC Available - At A Cost (http://www.gamingtruth.com/2007/04/11/guitar-hero-ii-dlc-available-at-a-cost/)

I have no problem with downloading things from the Marketplace, but this is a serious misuse of their install base. I'm pissed that they actually see this as "fair" pricing.

I suggest they release each track level (Axe-Grinders, Opening Licks, etc) at $5 or $6 along with 1-3 bonus tracks. That model would only charge $30 or $36 for all the content in the original Guitar Hero - guaranteeing them a lot more downloads than the $2 a track pricing they have in place now.

A happy userbase is more likely to download more content in the future, but at the price levels they've been using I'm slowly losing any motivation to download anything from the Marketplace.

MS needs to fix this, and fast.

[Wolvie]

Once again MS fucks up. They did it with Lumines, and now GHII. What they should have done is offered all new songs individually for $1 or even 1.99. That way you could download what you want, instead of choking down 2 other songs you most probably don't like.

Fuck, THIS shit is why people bag on XBL. MS does not need this kind of negative press over their online service. Stupid move MS, THINK next time!

[Magnanimous Gnome]

Yet another reason to push back that 360 purchase. Pretty soon I'll be buying one sometime in 2011. :p

I really do wish this kind of shit would stop, but instead it is happening more and more frequently.

[Tel Prydain]

Well, I'm enjoying the two packs I brought.