[GOOFS] - Gran Turismo HD to feature PGR3!

[bapenguin]

Do you think Project Gotham Racing 3 looks good? Do you think Gran Turismo HD looks good? Which looks better? Looking at Sony's PSP Connect (http://psp.connect.com/) site, I'd say the folks at Sony think PGR3 looks better.

Notice the top banner? Now look at this (http://www.bizarrecreations.com/games_img/pgr3/pgr313_full.jpg).

Editor's Note: Sony Updated the site, but you can see what it looked like below

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/175/369072675_4dbb943002.jpg

[bapenguin]

Screengrab above now....

[DangerousDaze]

Could I quickly get in an understated LOL in before all the shouting starts?

[Atorak]

LOL! Holy sweet Jesus is that funny.

McLaren F1 for teh win!

[Kem0sabe]

The irony... it overwhelming :)

[Xaerin]

HAHA!
/nelson

[score]

That's hilarious. Heads should roll for shit like that...

[Lodin]

Another day, another fuckup by Sony.

[cannedpasta]

LOL... oh man, that is some great stuff right there!

[fitbabits]

You Sony-hating moron! :)

Now that that's out of the way, I wonder if Bizarre could sue Sony for using their image without permission?

[Reanimated]

LMAO. But to be clear, PGR3 does look better.

[LexeL]

maaan......

[Balthasar]

Notice the top banner? Now look at this (http://www.bizarrecreations.com/games_img/pgr3/pgr313_full.jpg).
I can't see a top-banner on EA for comparison (I'm not even using Firefox), but I'm guessing the banner is for PGR3? Otherwise, I've missed the humor here.

[EternalGamer]

I don't get it.

[fitbabits]

Oh, and before I forget, why is this even news?

[chazio]

I can't see a top-banner on EA for comparison (I'm not even using Firefox), but I'm guessing the banner is for PGR3? Otherwise, I've missed the humor here.

the top banner on the PSP.Connect site, not EA.


Oh man this is awesome.

[fitbabits]

I don't get it.
The picture of the gold McLaren F1 is a from the press packet for PGR3. So, Sony is using a PGR3 promo shot to sell it's own products! See the irony?

[UnderHero5]

I can't see a top-banner on EA for comparison (I'm not even using Firefox), but I'm guessing the banner is for PGR3? Otherwise, I've missed the humor here.
The top banner on the linked site, not on EvAv.

[Zaro]

good find :)

[Kamalot]

Oh snap!

Heads are gonna roll!

http://www.iplayalot.com/gifs/OhSnapSmall.gif

And yes, PGR looks better, but perhaps Gran Turismo will look as good in a few years when it finally comes out.

[YoungAlCapone]

That is really quite ridiculous. I am glad I got to see it.

Seems to me that would hurt the morale of a few PS3 owners, but I digress, as I recently decided that owning a PS3 is something I am interested in.

[TheEpicOfTyler]

Someone just lost their job.

[CaptStu]

Again, I state my claim from many weeks ago that Sony is indeed the best in reality television.

[Kamalot]

I think that it is painfully clear that Microsoft has been using screen caps for Gran Turismo HD in order to promote Project Gotham Racing on the 360.

[Balthasar]

The picture of the gold McLaren F1 is a from the press packet for PGR3. So, Sony is using a PGR3 promo shot to sell it's own products! See the irony?
That's not ironic. It is bizarre, though.

[Nodus]

Unless they were amassing some kinda PGR/GT comparison, i dont know how the art work for PGR found its way under text advertising it as GT:HD, i mean, thats a bit of a "whoops".

Funny though

[Psykoboy2]

That's not ironic. It is bizarre, though.

*rim-shot*

Good one.

[Kamalot]

To: PSPTalkBack@sonyconnect.com

Dear Sony:

I noticed that your Gran Turismo HD on the PSP Connect site (http://psp.connect.com/) actually utilizes artwork that comes from the Xbox 360 game, Project Gotham Racing as seen in this promotional graphic for the title that is hosted live on the developer's web site ( http://www.bizarrecreations.com/games_img/pgr3/pgr313_full.jpg). This makes your company look really bad ( http://www.evilavatar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24403) , as it appears that your own racing game isn't as good-looking as the games available from the competition.

Please pardon the entire world as we point and laugh.

P.S. You may want to be on the lookout for Microsoft's/Bizarre Creation's lawyers as they may pay you a visit for plagiarizing their imagery.

[Dirty Harry]

Oh, and before I forget, why is this even news?
yeah, was thinking the same here fitba. I understand the LOLness but really, this isnt news worthy.

[CaptStu]

To: PSPTalkBack@sonyconnect.com

Dear Sony:

I noticed that your Gran Turismo HD on the PSP Connect site (http://psp.connect.com/) actually utilizes artwork that comes from the Xbox 360 game, Project Gotham Racing as seen in this promotional graphic for the title that is hosted live on the developer's web site ( http://www.bizarrecreations.com/games_img/pgr3/pgr313_full.jpg). This makes your company look really bad ( http://www.evilavatar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24403) , as it appears that your own racing game isn't as good-looking as the games available from the competition.

Please pardon the entire world as we point and laugh.

P.S. You may want to be on the lookout for Microsoft's/Bizarre Creation's lawyers as they may pay you a visit for plagiarizing their imagery.

You, sir, are my new hero.

[KNOTE]

LOLZ Sony's Gothamgate 2007.

It's news because Evil Avatar has attitude and it's always good to laugh when someone falls down.

[Johan]

That's not ironic. It is bizarre, though.

Nice try! It IS IRONIC!

i·ron·ic /aɪˈrɒnɪk/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[ahy-ron-ik] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–adjective
1. containing or exemplifying irony: an ironic novel; an ironic remark.
2. ironical.
3. coincidental; unexpected: It was ironic that I was seated next to my ex-husband at the dinner.

From Dictionary.com (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/ironic)

Come on now...even the SDF should appreciate the irony (unexpectedness!!!) here. :D This is absolutely hilarious as well...

To: PSPTalkBack@sonyconnect.com

Dear Sony:

I noticed that your Gran Turismo HD on the PSP Connect site (http://psp.connect.com/) actually utilizes artwork that comes from the Xbox 360 game, Project Gotham Racing as seen in this promotional graphic for the title that is hosted live on the developer's web site ( http://www.bizarrecreations.com/games_img/pgr3/pgr313_full.jpg). This makes your company look really bad ( http://www.evilavatar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24403) , as it appears that your own racing game isn't as good-looking as the games available from the competition.

Please pardon the entire world as we point and laugh.

P.S. You may want to be on the lookout for Microsoft's/Bizarre Creation's lawyers as they may pay you a visit for plagiarizing their imagery.

If I could sig. this entire damn thing, I would! :D

You, sir, are hilarious!!

[Goronmon]

yeah, was thinking the same here fitba. I understand the LOLness but really, this isnt news worthy.Meh, you can argue that 90% of the stuff on any site like this isn't really "news worthy". As long as it doesn't become the norm, I don't mind seeing the occasional blunder on the front page. Plus you have to admit, thats a pretty big mistake to make.

[TheEpicOfTyler]

Nice try! It IS IRONIC!

i·ron·ic /aɪˈrɒnɪk/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[ahy-ron-ik] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–adjective
1. containing or exemplifying irony: an ironic novel; an ironic remark.
2. ironical.
3. coincidental; unexpected: It was ironic that I was seated next to my ex-husband at the dinner.

From Dictionary.com (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/ironic)

Come on now...even the SDF should appreciate the irony here. :D This is absolutely hilarious as well...

Right over your head.

[Johan]

Right over your head.

Right under my feet. If he was being humorous or sarcastic, a ;) would be a good clue...otherwise, he's being stupid; a knee-jerk defense of Sony, perhaps? Or a sarcastic comment devoid of context to indicate sarcasm? :rolleyes:

[Dirty Harry]

Meh, you can argue that 90% of the stuff on any site like this isn't really "news worthy". As long as it doesn't become the norm, I don't mind seeing the occasional blunder on the front page. Plus you have to admit, thats a pretty big mistake to make.
No i agree, this pretty damn amusing, but i will say is its sensationalist news items like this that make us just as bad as O-word place.

[Johan]

No i agree, this pretty damn amusing, but i will say is its sensationalist news items like this that make us just as bad as O-word place.

It's newsworthy when one company uses a competitor's IP to advertise their own product...copyright infringement and false advertising/misrepresentation, at least.

Would it make you feel better if nobody acknowledged the humor in it? Would a stale, dry, dull-as-bones response to the potential for copyright infringement make it more newsworthy?

All this "why is this on the front page" whining is fucking old...

[Kamalot]

Nice try! It IS IRONIC!
Heh. I think he was making a reference to Bizarre Creations, the developer of Project Gotham.

[CaptStu]

Hey Kamalot, did you CC your message to PSP Connect to Bizarre Creations?

[Dirty Harry]

It's newsworthy when one company uses a competitor's IP to advertise their own product...copyright infringement and false advertising/misrepresentation, at least.

Would it make you feel better if nobody acknowledged the humor in it? Would a stale, dry, dull-as-bones response to the potential for copyright infringement make it more newsworthy?

All this "why is this on the front page" whining is fucking old...
pfft, ur uld, stop having children, breeder.

[Deadend]

It does give me the roffles from being funny.

I was wondering where out bad Sony news was after all the good. Glad to see we are back on track.

[Adam Blue]

I can't wait to hear if somethings comes out of this.

[Kamalot]

Hey Kamalot, did you CC your message to PSP Connect to Bizarre Creations?Nope, but I should have.

Everyone, feel free to contact Sony connect. Their email address is PSPTalkBack@sonyconnect.com

Public Relations for Bizarre Creations (developer of Project Gotham) is pr@bizarrecreations.com

Power to the people! :D

[Dirty Harry]

Nope, but I should have.

Everyone, feel free to contact Sony connect. Their email address is PSPTalkBack@sonyconnect.com

Public Relations for Bizarre Creations (developer of Project Gotham) is pr@bizarrecreations.com

Power to the people! :D
methinks thou doth protest to much methinks.

[Salesmunn]

Frank: "Hey Bob, where's that GT4 media I asked you for last week?"

Bob: "Oh uh, yeah. That...It's on the server....you didn't see it?"

Frank: "Ah no, didn't notice it. I'll go check."

Bob: "Doh!" [Googles GT4, Copies and pastes first decent image he sees into Frank's server folder.] "Woo! Close one, now back to writing for K****u."

[CaptStu]

methinks thou doth protest to much methinks.

Oh, come on. Sony is the corporate equivalent of a village idiot. Sure, everyone has a certain amount of love for the poor guy, but his moronic ramblings and crazy stunts are reasons to wake up in morning, simply to observe the good humor.

[bapenguin]

P.S. You may want to be on the lookout for Microsoft's/Bizarre Creation's lawyers as they may pay you a visit for plagiarizing their imagery.

Word is, they've already been served a Cease and Desist.

[Doctor Setebos]

Looks like it got dugg (http://digg.com/gaming_news/Another_Sony_blunder_Gran_Turismo_HD_to_feature_PG R3) already!

C'mon, fellow diggers -- let's get this front paged! :D

[CaptStu]

Word is, they've already been served a Cease and Desist.

Microsoft's lawyers must be locked in cages, malnourished and abused, attacking any one that dares open the cage doors.

Man, that was quick if true.

[Ozymandias]

I think that it is painfully clear that Microsoft has been using screen caps for Gran Turismo HD in order to promote Project Gotham Racing on the 360.

Ok. That made me laugh - kudos. ;)

This is obviously just an artist taking a shortcut. One who just lost their job, BTW. Sony Corporate would never do this knowingly.

[Kamalot]

This is obviously just an artist taking a shortcut. One who just lost their job, BTW. Sony Corporate would never do this knowingly.
Looks like Sony can't force its artists do be PS3 fans. Web developers at Sony prefer 360s. :D

[CaptStu]

Ok. That made me laugh - kudos. ;)

This is obviously just an artist taking a shortcut. One who just lost their job, BTW. Sony Corporate would never do this knowingly.

Or maybe Sony is using that old adage -- bad press is good press. I mean, really. Would anyone be talking about GTHD otherwise? :D

[Balthasar]

Nice try! It IS IRONIC!
3. coincidental; unexpected: It was ironic that I was seated next to my ex-husband at the dinner.

From Dictionary.com (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/ironic)
As an english teacher, you should know that is not the proper usage of irony. All that is coincidental or unexpected is not ironic. Irony is one of those terms you can't just get by looking it up in the dictionary.

[CaptStu]

Hey Oz, does MS have PS3 screenshots laying around? I'm there is a purpose for doing so.

[J Arcane]

This is just pure awesome.

And as a side note, thanks to this thread I'm now aware that PSP Connect has episodes of Caddilacs and Dinosaurs for free download. Which is also awesome.

Now if only they weren't in some dumbass wierd codec that I can't play.

[Balthasar]

Right under my feet. If he was being humorous or sarcastic, a ;) would be a good clue...otherwise, he's being stupid; a knee-jerk defense of Sony, perhaps?
How am I being stupid? I most certainly wasn't defending Sony, and I don't need a smiley to show that.

[Ozymandias]

Hey Oz, does MS have PS3 screenshots laying around? I'm there is a purpose for doing so.

Not sure I understand your question?

I am naturally blond. Please speak slowly. ;)

[Steele Johnson]

The picture of the gold McLaren F1 is a from the press packet for PGR3. So, Sony is using a PGR3 promo shot to sell it's own products! See the irony?

I still don't get it. Why can't Sony use the screenshot of a game that runs on their platform? Or is that only a 360 title??

[SuperMonkeyFighter2]

I still don't get it. Why can't Sony use the screenshot of a game that runs on their platform? Or is that only a 360 title??

Well, it's a 360 only game, which in itself makes this funny.

However, even if it was on a Sony platform, you can't pass off another dev's work as your own

[Balthasar]

Heh. I think he was making a reference to Bizarre Creations, the developer of Project Gotham.
I really don't think this is ironic. You are quick-witted on the joke there, though.

[CaptStu]

Not sure I understand your question?

I am naturally blond. Please speak slowly. ;)

Why would Sony have screenshots of a 360 game? What is their purpose for having them? Inversely, does Microsoft do the same thing with regard to Sony and Nintendo?

[silv]

It's 360 only.

Even if it wasn't, branding it as GTHD would also be a mistake.

[Johan]

pfft, ur uld, stop having children, breeder.

When I can't afford to support them! :p

As an english teacher, you should know that is not the proper usage of irony. All that is coincidental or unexpected is not ironic. Irony is one of those terms you can't just get by looking it up in the dictionary.

EEEEEEEnglish...

Literary irony is a different animal. If you'd like to talk about situational, verbal, or dramatic irony in literature, I'm all for it!

This is definitely irony, though not literary irony (though I could make a case for situational irony here..."an event that violates the expectations of the reader or the characters within a story."

...and your crack about Bizarre did go over my head as well, to my own shame. :o I must be getting "uld" after all. I'm not as quick as I never used to be! :D

[SuperMonkeyFighter2]

I think that it is painfully clear that Microsoft has been using screen caps for Gran Turismo HD in order to promote Project Gotham Racing on the 360.

LOL!!! Dude, you had me laughing my ass of at work with that comment

[Boris]

Thank you Sony for making everyone's day brighter with another dumm kopf move.

[CaptStu]

Joystiq just picked this up.

[MrChaz]

wtf, thats special O_o

[King Drewsky]

Nelson'd

http://www.majornelson.com/archive/2007/01/25/psp-connect-using-pgr3-screenshot.aspx

[Ozymandias]

Why would Sony have screenshots of a 360 game? What is their purpose for having them? Inversely, does Microsoft do the same thing with regard to Sony and Nintendo?

I doubt there's any collection of screenshots per-se. This was probably an artist under pressure, needed a car, and took a look around the web. I don't personally have any collection of PS3 screenshots. Why would I? Plenty on th web if needed, and I have a box to look at in person which is much more useful.

[rein]

Why would Sony have screenshots of a 360 game? What is their purpose for having them? Inversely, does Microsoft do the same thing with regard to Sony and Nintendo?

I am sure this was some web-monkeys mistake and not a descision by Sony corporate to purposely use art work from a Xbox 360 exclusive game.

[CaptStu]

I doubt there's any collection of screenshots per-se. This was probably an artist under pressure, needed a car, and took a look around the web. I don't personally have any collection of PS3 screenshots. Why would I? Plenty on th web if needed, and I have a box to look at in person which is much more useful.

Gotcha. Makes sense. Thank you.

[Kamalot]

What an awesome find Bap! You are my hero. :D

I can't believe Joystiq and the Major aren't giving you credit. :(

[Pigeon]

Oh, and before I forget, why is this even news?
Because bap says it's news! Haven't you answered this question enough to know that by now? ;)

[Doctor Setebos]

Looks like this hit the digg front page.

http://nathaniel.payne.googlepages.com/ScreenShot163.jpg

Too bad the link itself doesn't go to Evil Avatar -- it goes to the PSP Connect site. But EvAv does appear to get a credit mention. :D

[Doctor Setebos]

Oops! There goes the PSP Connect site! :D

[Psykoboy2]

Wow...I'm amazed at how fast this is spreading and how it is STILL up on their site.

[CaptStu]

It's gone now. The site is down.

[Kamalot]

Oops! There goes the PSP Connect site! :D
yup. It is down.


A problem has occured with the page or file you were attempting to access.
We apologize for the inconvenience.


Return to browse our free video downloads.
Whoops! They did it again. :)

[Psykoboy2]

Damn...that was quick. I clicked before I posted and it was there. Got done posting, saw the other comment, checked and poof...gone.

[Johan]

How am I being stupid?

Call it stupid. Call it ignorant. Call it wrong. Whatever.

It IS irony, by definition.

[CaptStu]

Call it stupid. Call it ignorant. Call it wrong. Whatever.

It IS irony, by definition.

Y'all need to get over it. My God. You're ruining a perfectly good Sony-hate thread.

[Johan]

Y'all need to get over it. My God. You're ruining a perfectly good Sony-hate thread.

I'm an English teacher, for goodness sake. I can't let the definition of irony go! :D

That is definitely NOT ironic, as it should be expected from an English teacher!

And I think we're being fairly cordial and reasonable...I've seen a helluva lot worse! :)

/back to your Sony hate!!!

[Kamalot]

I'm sure the folks at SonyConnect are going to have their highest traffic month ever with this. Just like the AllIWantForXmasIsAPSP site, the team will manage to turn this around as a positive.

From: Sony Connect Bigwig
To: Drones

Congratulations on closing out January 2007 with a bang! Our site traffic has gone through the roof with unprecedented buzz about the new Gran Turismo HD videos. Thanks for everyone's hard work on reinforcing just what the PayStation brand really means to our endless supply of disposable fans.

In other news, we have a new opening in the web graphics department. Experienced candidates should be well versed with the rights usage of stock photography.

-Bigwig

[CaptStu]

I'm an English teacher, for goodness sake. I can't let the definition of irony go! :D

That is definitely NOT ironic, as it should be expected from an English teacher!

And I think we're being fairly cordial and reasonable...I've seen a helluva lot worse! :)

/back to your Sony hate!!!

Why don't you two debate whether "y'all" is a real word?

[Grimmjow]

Og Sony :( you shot your self in th foot all the time.

[beefyjr]

I don't know, I just hit the site after reading the first post and it's still there. I even just refreshed it five pages into this thread and it's still there. Nice work, Sony!

[Doctor Setebos]

Looks like it's a banner traffic day at EvAv today!

http://nathaniel.payne.googlepages.com/ScreenShot164.jpg

[CaptStu]

Looks like it's a banner traffic day at EvAv today!

http://nathaniel.payne.googlepages.com/ScreenShot164.jpg

Hey, that's pretty cool.

[Balthasar]

EEEEEEEnglish...
See, that is irony. Anyway...

Literary irony is a different animal. If you'd like to talk about situational, verbal, or dramatic irony in literature, I'm all for it!

This is definitely irony, though not literary irony (though I could make a case for situational irony here..."an event that violates the expectations of the reader or the characters within a story."
I'm not the one that thought this was ironic, so I'm not sure which category of irony you think this falls under. It's definitely not in any way "verbal irony," which I tend to think doesn't really exist as it is defined. Verbal irony always sounds sarcastic, and sarcasm is not always used as a tool to belittle or demean, so the differentiation, to me, is non-existant. An event "violat[ing] expectations" is definitely an important aspect of irony, but does not make something ironic in and of itself. If a basketball player that averages 30 points a game goes scoreless one night, that is not ironic, even though it violates expectations.

This situation might be ironic if Sony had used that picture in an ad campaign to trash PGR3's graphics. By the way, has the involvement of hackers been ruled out?

...and your crack about Bizarre did go over my head as well, to my own shame. :o I must be getting "uld" after all. I'm not as quick as I never used to be! :D
*Shakes head in disapproval*

[wintermute010]

The page is down, but the banner image is still available HERE:

http://psp.connect.com/images/hdr_hp_grandturismo_hd.jpg

LOL - they are COMPLETE f'ing morons!!1

[Johan]

*Shakes head in disapproval*

I throw out an olive branch, and that's what I get? Oh brother... :p :D

[DaedalusFolly]

Why don't you two debate whether "y'all" is a real word?
Considering its a contraction, it would actually be two words. Whether its proper or not, thats another conversation.

[fitbabits]

I throw out an olive branch, and that's what I get? Oh brother... :p :D
Balthasar and Johan - why don't you let the absolute authority in irony settle this disagreement? I give you the answer (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_DgPxbQP4Y).

[Tinderbox]

It's a spiderman 3 promo now, funny start to the day though!

[Psykoboy2]

It's now a banner of Spider-Man 3

[CaptStu]

Balthasar and Johan - why don't you let the absolute authority in irony settle this disagreement? I give you the answer (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_DgPxbQP4Y).

She's hot! And, I mean that. Alanis is pretty wrapped in gorgeous.

[Norse]

From the NeoGAF forums (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=139671&page=3):

http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/6392/image14tr.jpg

:D

[CaptStu]

Y'all should do a Photoshop contest a la Fark.

[Balthasar]

Balthasar and Johan - why don't you let the absolute authority in irony settle this disagreement? I give you the answer (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_DgPxbQP4Y).
I'm going to make my dog chase a cat when I get home, just for that. The urge to slam my head against a wall hasn't faded since clicking on that link.

[Kamalot]

Balthasar and Johan - why don't you let the absolute authority in irony settle this disagreement? I give you the answer (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_DgPxbQP4Y).
You have a deep chasm of a cruel streak in your heart. :(

[sol740]

I hate to say this but IRONY, form, usage, and definition were changed out of the "everymans" inability to use the term correctly. So in the court of public opinion, and the 3rd and more recently added Dictionary.com definition, it is correct. However to anyone with an actual grasp of the word, it is grossly overused.

[gzsfrk]

From the NeoGAF forums (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=139671&page=3):

http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/6392/image14tr.jpg

:D

Geez, those guys are quick. That's awesome--kudos to the artist. :)

[Shadowstorm]

Wow. What a blatent rip-off.

[Johan]

I'm going to make my dog chase a cat when I get home, just for that. The urge to slam my head against a wall hasn't faded since clicking on that link.

Finally...we agree on something!!! :D

And Norse, that was damned funny!

...However to anyone with an actual grasp of the word, it is grossly overused.

Translation: I think Johan's students are learning from an idiot! :D

Well :p to that! ;)

[Mortis]

LOL at that Gears pic, fucking nice.

[flinxz]

Very funny (gears image).

[roboninja]

I hate to say this but IRONY, form, usage, and definition were changed out of the "everymans" inability to use the term correctly. So in the court of public opinion, and the 3rd and more recently added Dictionary.com definition, it is correct. However to anyone with an actual grasp of the word, it is grossly overused.
Words are to communicate meaning to other people. They are not decided on by pseudo-intellectuals that like to make themsleves seem smarter; they are decided upon by their usage. Google has become a word, and other words have changed their meaning (gay, anyone?). So, the "everyman" gets to use irony now in a much less restricted way. Ironic, isn't it :p

As to the OP, I will say it yet again; can Sony do anything right?
The Gears pic is brilliant, and very quick coming.

[Disgustipated]

Quick, EvAv admins, flood the website with ads so we can afford beer for Amanda to get drunk on the EvAv Radio!

[vherub]

the problem isn't that people misuse irony so much as there was no good word in english for what it now (also) represents- a sweet error on a poetic justice level.
a similar language void in english is having a masculine, feminine and neuter declension, but no gender vague declension so we have to say nonsense like "he or she" instead of just one word. stupid english.

[Norse]

Wait....why are we having a language discussion here?

[wyeast]

The page is down, but the banner image is still available HERE:

http://psp.connect.com/images/hdr_hp_grandturismo_hd.jpg

LOL - they are COMPLETE f'ing morons!!1
Looks like that's been changed, too.

Man, this is just fucking rich. Is there nobody checking each other's work over there? Especially after the little Apple Logo furor? :D

[Dr.Finger]

Quick, EvAv admins, flood the website with ads so we can afford beer for Amanda to get drunk on the EvAv Radio!I'll mail you a $5. That'll buy 4 Steel Reserves.

[sol740]

Words are to communicate meaning to other people. They are not decided on by pseudo-intellectuals that like to make themsleves seem smarter; they are decided upon by their usage. Google has become a word, and other words have changed their meaning (gay, anyone?). So, the "everyman" gets to use irony now in a much less restricted way. Ironic, isn't it :p

As to the OP, I will say it yet again; can Sony do anything right?
The Gears pic is brilliant, and very quick coming.

No ... words are communications between people. Language and grammar are a set of rules applied to words. Variances outside of these rules yet accepted by the public (or sect of public) are called SLANG. So no, you are incorrect.

So, the "everyman" gets to use irony now in a much less restricted way. Ironic, isn't it :p

Actually, it isn't.

[Jart]

Haha, some web designer is in hot water today. Hopefully he is forgiven his screw up and doesn't lose his job over it.

[J Arcane]

I'll mail you a $5. That'll buy 4 Steel Reserves.
Man, that's just cruel.

[fitbabits]

Man, that's just cruel.
Yep, cruel that he didn't think of me first. And he calls himself a doctor.

[Psykoboy2]

back on track fellas...we're here to bash sony, not debate on the proper way of doing so.

[J Arcane]

Yep, cruel that he didn't think of me first. And he calls himself a doctor.
Oh come now. What self-respecting Scotsman would willingly drink Steel Reserve? ;)

[Psykoboy2]

Haha, some web designer is in hot water today. Hopefully he is forgiven his screw up and doesn't lose his job over it.

Oh I'm quite sure his job is gone. This made the rounds of way too many sites to just get a warning. In fact...MS should hire the poor guy.

[fitbabits]

Oh come now. What self-respecting Scotsman would willingly drink Steel Reserve? ;)
True story - I drank six of the fuckers at my hotel room after day two of Quake Con 2007. Steel Reserve and cheese pizza... Yummy.

[fitbabits]

Oh I'm quite sure his job is gone. This made the rounds of way too many sites to just get a warning. In fact...MS should hire the poor guy.
Maybe he'd already been accepted for a position at Microsoft and this was his parting gift? I'm just speculating is all.

[Kamalot]

Oh I'm quite sure his job is gone. This made the rounds of way too many sites to just get a warning. In fact...MS should hire the poor guy.
The poor designed that used the PGR screen cap either:

Knew the screen was from Project Gotham (bad)
Was fooled into thinking the image was that of a REAL CAR, thus highlighting how realistic PGR looks.

[J Arcane]

True story - I drank six of the fuckers at my hotel room after day two of Quake Con 2007. Steel Reserve and cheese pizza... Yummy.
Goddamnit, I'm trying to eat here!

[Dr.Finger]

True story - I drank six of the fuckers at my hotel room after day two of Quake Con 2007. Steel Reserve and cheese pizza... Yummy.Then I'm going to have to send you a 40oz of Side Pocket one of these days. Or maybe King Cobra.

[fitbabits]

Goddamnit, I'm trying to eat here!
Mmm, mmm, mmm. Delicious Steel Reserve and cheese pizza. It's calling your name. It's saying "make me feel loved like never before, J Arcane".

[fitbabits]

Then I'm going to have to send you a 40oz of Side Pocket one of these days. Or maybe King Cobra.
Hell, Doc. BOTH!

[Crimson]

Hah, did you see in the link to the pic that used to be at the website? Who ever labelled the pic didn't even spell the name of the game correctly. It's "gran" not "grand" turismo. I suppose whoever it was is just a web designer, you don't really need to know all the details of the items that are on it... but still!

http://psp.connect.com/images/hdr_hp_grandturismo_hd.jpg

[Psykoboy2]

40oz of Side Pocket

Heh...That was one of my first NES games I ever bought.

[J Arcane]

Mmm, mmm, mmm. Delicious Steel Reserve and cheese pizza. It's calling your name. It's saying "make me feel loved like never before, J Arcane".
Fuck that, I'm going for some Black Butte Porter and chili burritos.

[fitbabits]

Fuck that, I'm going for some Black Butte Porter and chili burritos.
You just broke my heart! You hear me, you mean bastard... :p

[J Arcane]

You just broke my heart! You hear me, you mean bastard... :p
Random side question: Do you get Deschutes Brewery beer where you are?

[Kamalot]

Aside from PGR / Gran Turismo and the Gears / Resistance mashups, what other mashups would work? Is there anything else on the PS3 worth mashing up?

[fitbabits]

Random side question: Do you get Deschutes Brewery beer where you are?
Bless you. Now, what was your question? Oh yes, no - I don't. I do, however, get Odell's 90 Shilling.

[J Arcane]

Bless you. Now, what was your question? Oh yes, no - I don't. I do, however, get Odell's 90 Shilling.
Oooh. That sounds awesome.

[fitbabits]

Oooh. That sounds awesome.
It is awesome! Thick, dark, heavy, and delicious. Especially on tap.

[Balthasar]

Words are to communicate meaning to other people. They are not decided on by pseudo-intellectuals that like to make themsleves seem smarter; they are decided upon by their usage.
Sure, but there needs to be agreed upon, consistent usage. Words don't just change meaning simply because the plebs didn't go to school. Words absoultely morph over time, but I'm not going to accept a new definition of a word just because the people using it don't know any better.

A really great essay on this very subject was writen by David Foster Wallace not too long ago, an author I pimp on these boards every now and then. I doubt anyone here reads him, but if anyone is curious, the essay is called "Authority and the American Usage." Very much worth the time if these sorts of subjects interest you. And in case you were wondering, it is the farthest thing from boring and pedantic. Trust me.

Google has become a word...
A neologism is not the same as a misunderstanding of a concept.

...and other words have changed their meaning (gay, anyone?). So, the "everyman" gets to use irony now in a much less restricted way. Ironic, isn't it :p

1) That's a good example of a word being used in a way that is not agreed upon. Your usage of "gay" is not seen by many as appropriate at all.

2) That is not irony! That doesn't fit any concievable definition of irony! The dictionary definition of irony isn't incorrect at all. The problem is that irony is too suble and complex to be adequetly defined in a reference work that relies on concision. That would be like trying to understand String Theory with dictionary.com. Not gonna happen.

[Balthasar]

True story - I drank six of the fuckers at my hotel room after day two of Quake Con 2007. Steel Reserve and cheese pizza... Yummy.
Steel Reserve...sounds like what my stomach would have to be to tolerate whatever swill you're downing at that price.

[Goronmon]

Goddamnit, I'm trying to eat here!How ironic.

hehehe

[J Arcane]

How ironic.

hehehe
I'm listening to a surf-rock song by Reverend Horton Heat called "I Can't Surf".

[Balthasar]

How ironic.

hehehe
Goddamit, I am going to slaughter you all...slaughter you like animals!

[Balthasar]

I'm listening to a surf-rock song by Reverend Horton Heat called "I Can't Surf".
Okay, see? That's ironic. This is progress.

[Johan]

Okay, see? That's ironic. This is progress.

This thread has totally left its Sony hate...and it is ironic that a supposedly Sony-hating site would spend so little time in this thread hating on Sony!!!

Quit the group hugging and get back to hating on Sony! :D

[Trazzlo the Magnificant]

Talking about irony, and I am just interested here in trying to understand why this wouldn't be irony.

We have a company who owns content, is a member of the RIAA, and spends all kinds of money on protecting its interests with DRM on products like Bluray players for the PS3, as well as lawsuits against old people, dead people, and children because they might be listening to music without having paid for it. They really do not hide their hatred for pirates, and all things potentially piratical.

As a matter of business, they advertise on one of their sites using cropped (modified) versions of pictures that they must have obtained from the internet, since they are certainly not from in-house products. They add their own name to that image, and then post that on their own site.

Not only that, but the image they (accidentally) took from the internet happens to be owned by a direct competitor.

They have all manner of content, from movies to TVs to computers to ... well, you name it. They probably own more pictures and images of things as anyone on the planet. Yet, they seem to have randomly picked a picture off of the internet without a second thought. And, the odds of selecting one at random that happens to be owned by a competitor are astonishingly small.

Maybe a picture by accident of some hi res image from one of their slickest hidef movies ... sure I can see how an in-house mistake can be made. "It came from Grand Touristmo, one of our Italian tourist promo's". Yes, I could see the mistake. But they didn't do that, they took it from a competitors website ... by accident. And nobody noticed. Too busy cropping and fitting it to their Mac screen or something. Does Sony use Mac's?

If any normal person walked up, took an image of a Sony movie, cropped and modified it, and presented it to all the world as their own work ... is it not everyone's assumption that Sony would not be amused?

There is no irony here?

Its almost a garden of irony! Or a buffet of irony! Fine dining at it's best (ooops, more irony!).

I really don't understand why it isn't irony ... in any sense of the word. I even made up me first post here and registered, just to ask :)

Edit: Added a few more (and more) thoughts!

[Kamalot]

Talking about irony, and I am just interested here in trying to understand why this wouldn't be irony.

We have a company who owns content, is a member of the RIAA, and spends all kinds of money on protecting its interests with DRM on products like Bluray players for the PS3, as well as lawsuits against old people, dead people, and children because they might be listening to music without having paid for it.

As a matter of business, they advertise on one of their sites using cropped (modified) versions of pictures that they must have obtained from the internet, since they are certainly not from in-house products. They add their own name to that image, and then post that on their own site.

Not only that, but the image they (accidentally) took from the internet happens to be owned by a direct competitor.

If any normal person walked up, took an image of a Sony movie, cropped and modified it, and presented it to all the world as their own work ... is it not everyone's assumption that Sony would not be amused?

There is no irony here?

I really don't understand why it isn't irony ... in any sense of the word. I even made up me first post here and registered, just to ask :)
Welcome!

I like your approach; sign up, just to question authority. You're gonna fit right in. :cool:

[Trazzlo the Magnificant]

Thanks for the welcome! I can't really post much here though, since I see that my title is currently "Trazzlo, the Magnificant Peon". It's catchy and accurate, but I am a bit afraid to outgrow such an ironicly suitable title.

[Johan]

I really don't understand why it isn't irony ... in any sense of the word. I even made up me first post here and registered, just to ask :)

Perhaps because a teacher said it was irony (me...though after others had initially done so), and people like to argue with teachers? Or just plain like to argue?

Thanks for so eloquently pointing out the facts on that one, though...:)

Post more often!!! Good to have you on board!

[Trazzlo the Magnificant]

Bah, it's not that. I used to teach too. Copyright Infringement 101. Just kidding, it was Computing Science and nobody ever confused me with English teachers. Ever.

[Psykoboy2]

That's probably one of the best first posts I've seen in a while. Also, almost 11k views for a news post, that's gotta mean something, eh?

And by the way, is EvAv the originator of the story?

EDIT: Each week I DON'T do a radio show, there's some great talking points that come up. You watch, next week when I actually DO go on the air, there won't be shit for that week to talk about.

[Trazzlo the Magnificant]

Thank god Sony never said publicly that Microsoft copies all their ideas.

Oops, wait a sec.

I think Sony is beating itself senseless with the big squeaky-hammer of Irony (and they are using the +35 enhanced version from the next patch). Its a dev perk.

[Stryfe01]

Classic :)

[mattcoz]

Take a lesson from Matt Groening.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqRRvxIQ7DM

[DaXIthR]

Its almost a garden of irony! Or a buffet of irony! Fine dining at it's best (ooops, more irony!).

Mr. Trazzlo, Sir....

Is it also ironic that Sony couldn't go a single day without bad news?

They had good news earlier with the European launch details, and the same day, they do something certifiably retarded like this....

Well, the European launch details wasn't really chock full of goodness....$835 much?

I guess I answered my own question....

[Hellbug]

Sony! Bad boy!

Go sit in your corner and try to think about what you have done.

Fuckups.

[beefyjr]

Is it also ironic that Sony couldn't go a single day without bad news?
No, just business as usual.

[TDiddy]

I find it ironic that an english teacher doesn't understand the modern use of the word ironic.

[Balthasar]

Talking about irony, and I am just interested here in trying to understand why this wouldn't be irony.
It's a very hard thing to nail down. It's not a whole lot easier than trying to define what makes a joke "funny." I'll just go through a couple of your points here, and maybe that will make it a little clearer.

We have a company who owns content, is a member of the RIAA, and spends all kinds of money on protecting its interests with DRM on products like Bluray players for the PS3, as well as lawsuits against old people, dead people, and children because they might be listening to music without having paid for it. They really do not hide their hatred for pirates, and all things potentially piratical.
None of that is relevant, because use of the image on a website does not in and of itself constitute any sort of copyright infringement.

As a matter of business, they advertise on one of their sites using cropped (modified) versions of pictures that they must have obtained from the internet, since they are certainly not from in-house products. They add their own name to that image, and then post that on their own site.
You're actually pretty close to understanding this, but because of the nature of that picture and the method of its acquisition, there's really nothing ironic about it. That picture should represent something ostensibly antithetical to Sony's stated beliefs or desires. As I said before, this would be great irony if, for example, Sony hyped up GTHD by trashing the graphics of PGR3 publicly. What makes that ironic is that for all the hype the would have put into the graphics of their game, they couldn't tell the difference between it and the game they trashed when it came time to advertise it. What's important here and in most (but not all) irony is the strong presence of paradox.

What happened here with the Sony Connect site is merely unfortunate, perhaps laughable and embarrassing. I'm sure that's not clear enough, but it's the best I can do for you right now. Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irony) actually has a decent article that attempts to define irony, along with several excellent examples of irony.

Edit: Like this:
For example, in June, 2005, the State of Virginia Employment Agency, which handles unemployment compensation, announced that they would lay off 400 employees for lack of work because unemployment is so low in the state.

[fitbabits]

Holyjesusfuckingchrististhisargumentoverironyeverg oingtoendorwillibeforcedtotypelikethisforever?

[H.Bogard]

As an english teacher, you should know that is not the proper usage of irony. All that is coincidental or unexpected is not ironic. Irony is one of those terms you can't just get by looking it up in the dictionary.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wlSYekcLuWM

[Balthasar]

Holyjesusfuckingchrististhisargumentoverironyeverg oingtoendorwillibeforcedtotypelikethisforever?
Personally, I'd like to see that. I would enjoy that very, very much.

[fitbabits]

Personally, I'd like to see that. I would enjoy that very, very much.
Okayiwillcedetoyourrequestandtypelikethisforayetto bedeterminedperiodoftimeafterwhichyouwillbeforcedt owacthalanismorrissettesingingironyfortwentfourhou rsstraight.

[Scramble]

Can't wait to hear the results of this blunder. Is it possible MS has planted moles inside Sony to sabotage their chances this generation? :P

[Balthasar]

Okayiwillcedetoyourrequestandtypelikethisforayetto bedeterminedperiodoftimeafterwhichyouwillbeforcedt owacthalanismorrissettesingingironyfortwentfourhou rsstraight.
And that would be when I pull out the sawed-off shotgun and turn her on her master.

[Stiffler]

Okayiwillcedetoyourrequestandtypelikethisforayetto bedeterminedperiodoftimeafterwhichyouwillbeforcedt owacthalanismorrissettesingingironyfortwentfourhou rsstraight.

It would have made more sense if you hadn't typo'd "watch"

;) :D

[Trazzlo the Magnificant]

It's a very hard thing to nail down. It's not a whole lot easier than trying to define what makes a joke "funny."

...

None of that is relevant, because use of the image on a website does not in and of itself constitute any sort of copyright infringement.

...

You're actually pretty close to understanding this, but because of the nature of that picture and the method of its acquisition, there's really nothing ironic about it. That picture should represent something ostensibly antithetical to Sony's stated beliefs or desires.

It comes down to what people think is funny, and ironic. They are linked as far as I can tell. Its subjective.

You say "because use of the image on a website does not in and of itself constitute any sort of copyright infringement."

I say tell that to Sony's lawyers and see if they agree. That's irony at work.

You say "That picture should represent something ostensibly antithetical to Sony's stated beliefs or desires."

I say piracy of someone else's intellectual property, and putting your own logo on a picture that has been used on the internet to promote a competitors product for well over a year, will very likely receive a legal (and strongly worded) response. In this case from Microsoft, who is no stranger to the legalities of intellectual property.

The irony is that Sony didn't pick on Mrs. Mary Rugtutle from Fishtank, Nebraska, who doesn't fully understand her legal rights and has no proof that the image was hers. They took it from ... ummmm ... Microsoft.

That's both funny, and ironic in my books.

This situation meets all of my needs for using the word irony in daily conversation. I don't know of any other word that meets the criteria better, nor do you seem to offer one. As such, I feel completely free to use it.

[Balthasar]

It comes down to what people think is funny, and ironic. They are linked as far as I can tell. Its subjective.
No, it's not. Irony tends to be very humorous, but it certainly does not have to be.

I say tell that to Sony's lawyers and see if they agree. That's irony at work.
If there was a situation wherein Sony turned around and accused someone else of using their images inappropriately, that has the potential to be ironic, but that is not the situation here. The situation here is that someone lazily grabbed a picture of a game he thought was GTHD because the games (GTHD and PGR3) looked similar enough to his eyes that he didn't notice the difference. This is not ironic.

You say "That picture should represent something ostensibly antithetical to Sony's stated beliefs or desires."

I say piracy of someone else's intellectual property, and putting your own logo on a picture that has been used on the internet to promote a competitors product for well over a year, will very likely receive a legal (and strongly worded) response. In this case from Microsoft, who is no stranger to the legalities of intellectual property.
Ostensibly antithetical. Sony did not use that image on purpose, so it still doesn't fit (you should understand what "ostensibly" means).

This situation meets all of my needs for using the word irony in daily conversation. I don't know of any other word that meets the criteria better, nor do you seem to offer one. As such, I feel completely free to use it.
I feel completely free to say my monitor has 32-byte color depth. Doesn't make me right, though. Seriously, though, look at the Wikipedia entry on irony, including "usage controversy."

[Trazzlo the Magnificant]

The situation here is that someone lazily grabbed a picture of a game he thought was GTHD because the games (GTHD and PGR3) looked similar enough to his eyes that he didn't notice the difference. This is not ironic.

It certainly is ironic when Sony steadfastly maintains that their system is the "only true HiDef" one, and they themselves are not able to see the difference between their supreme system and a competitors offering from over a year earlier.

I feel completely free to say my monitor has 32-byte color depth. Doesn't make me right, though.

But, then you would be lying. That is not what I am saying. I am saying that I need to use the English language to convey a concept. "Irony" is the closest word I currently have that conveys the concept clearly enough that other people who are also reasonably familiar with the English language and its usage will know what I mean.

It goes far beyond "funny". Its about the self contradiction. Its about having a formal business position and spending lavishly on legal defenses of property and then mistakenly using your biggest competitor's content.

This whole event is like watching pots and kettles beating the crap out of each other. Except, the pots and kettles are titans in the world of international business and one of the pots is consistently bashing itself silly, while the other titanic pot is feeding it content.

For example, I could see Microsoft sending in its legal team and tearing Sony a few more outlets. I could also see them licensing them the use of that picture, and then making a HUGE joke of it in the industry about how their creative content is simply more fun to market than what is on the PS3.

This is beyond "funny". I need a word to use, and so far irony is the best match word.

If you disagree, sell me on a single word that conveys all this meaning as well as the word "irony" does. I completely grant that it is not the perfect use of the word, but I do not grant you that it isn't the closest match either.

but then again, I don't know every word in the English language. Perhaps you, or someone else does.

[fitbabits]

It would have made more sense if you hadn't typo'd "watch"

;) :D
I was drunk, you bugger! :(

[Balthasar]

It certainly is ironic when Sony steadfastly maintains that their system is the "only true HiDef" one, and they themselves are not able to see the difference between their supreme system and a competitors offering from over a year earlier.
Ugh. No it isn't. There's absoultely nothing ironic about that. I feel like I'm talking to a brick wall now. Besides the fact that your example in no way matches the definition of irony, you seem to forget that GTHD isn't a new GT game, but a higher-res version of the last GT game, so it's actually older than PGR3. And Sony's comments about the so-called "HD-Era" was multi-pronged, aimed in part at the 360's lack of a hi-def optical drive. Whether a resolution display below 1080p should not be considered "true HD" is a matter of debate, but in sum, there is no irony here.

But, then you would be lying. That is not what I am saying. I am saying that I need to use the English language to convey a concept.
So do I. I don't see a difference between a "bit" and a "byte," so by your standards its pefectly okay to use them interchangably, regardless of definition.

"Irony" is the closest word I currently have that conveys the concept clearly enough that other people who are also reasonably familiar with the English language and its usage will know what I mean.
Ignorance is no excuse. You have perfectly acceptable words at your disposal that a middle-schooler could understand. You could say this represents an "unfortunate coincidence," a "laughable error," or you can look to the title of this thread and call it a "goof." You can call it many other things as well. You cannot call it irony.

P.S. I am now officially tired of this discussion. Irony may be one of those things you either get or you don't. Unlike Johan, I have little patience to teach.

[J Arcane]

Ugh. No it isn't. There's absoultely nothing ironic about that.

Guess what?

NO ONE FUCKING CARES.

You're an anal retentive asshole. Just shut the goddamn hell up already.

[Balthasar]

You're an anal retentive asshole. Just shut the goddamn hell up already.
Love you too, pal.

P.S. since when is it anal retentive to respond to a post directed at you?

[J Arcane]

Love you too, pal.

P.S. since when is it anal retentive to respond to a post directed at you?
So long as you keep your love to yourself, instead of wanking all over the thread like you've been doing.

You started this shit, you can end it. You've just got to get the fuck over yourself.

[DangerousDaze]

Shock news! C&VG (http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=156263) actually linked to EvAv with this story, rather than pretending they'd discovered it for themselves like so many other sites...

[DreamSlider]

Can we all agree that while the current situation is not totally ironic, the fact that Sony used a Microsoft product's image is odd in an unexpected way, that defies our normal circumstances. Is everyone happy with that?

I'd like to step in here and say this is one of my favorite EvAv threads lately. It's not often that I laugh regularly while reading this page. There have been so many choice quotes. My hat's off to everyone here. :)

[Balthasar]

You've just got to get the fuck over yourself.
When did you become the moderator of this thread? If you're upset the furor over the Sony flub is over, there are plenty of other threads around here for you to shit on Sony with. You don't need to read my posts. I won't cry.

[Kamalot]

Shock news! C&VG (http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=156263) actually linked to EvAv with this story, rather than pretending they'd discovered it for themselves like so many other sites...
Yea!
Score one for EvAv! :D

[J Arcane]

When did you become the moderator of this thread? If you're upset the furor over the Sony flub is over, there are plenty of other threads around here for you to shit on Sony with. You don't need to read my posts. I won't cry.
I don't recall anyone appointing you to be the resident grammar police either, so where does that leave us?

[Trazzlo the Magnificant]

Ignorance is no excuse. You have perfectly acceptable words at your disposal that a middle-schooler could understand. You could say this represents an "unfortunate coincidence," a "laughable error," or you can look to the title of this thread and call it a "goof." You can call it many other things as well. You cannot call it irony.

Hmmm, I asked for a single word that fits the situation better, to which you give me groups of words.

The problem with all of your words, is they don't convey the situation as robustly. For example, I could probably sell the Sony lawyers on an ironic twist of events where they are talking to a competitor about their having stolen the property of an artist. Sony is more than happy to trumpet the old "The artists must be paid!" card, so Microsoft will probably ask the simple question "At what point in time did you ask if the artist was paid for your use of this image".

"Funny", "unfortunate coincidence," a "laughable error," are probably not their first words to describe the events they now face. Ironic just might be though. Many of these lawyers know each other from various battles and friendships, and I can certainly see them say "Ironic that we are here under these circumstances today, given the last time we saw each other in court".

I don't see this at all as a coincidence. It was an error, but not a laughable one for everyone. If someone lost their job over this, they are most certainly not laughing up pop through their nose right now. But they might see the irony of having used the perfectly wrong image on that website, of all images to use. One that Microsoft quickly recognized, and took advantage of.

Ignorance is no excuse.
This was completely uncalled for, and is the reason I am posting now at all. You knew VERY well that I wasn't not saying I was a moron, stupid, vacant, illegitimate (or was that illiterate?), nor ignorant.

It was an invitation to you to provide me with a single better word that conveyed the meaning as well, to as large a group of people as possible. I was listening, and quite frankly open to the concept that a better word existed. You failed to do so, you failed miserably. You did NOT convey back my argument to me more clearly using your hodgepodge of wordage.

I have lived on this Earth for half a century, English is not my first language, and I am dyslexic, but I still don't see a SINGLE better word to describe the Sony situation than Ironic.

All in all, I don't feel I came across as ignorant.

I assume you carry other baggage with your emotions, and simply point out that they are your limitations and not mine.

Good day.

[Balthasar]

Hmmm, I asked for a single word that fits the situation better, to which you give me groups of words.
Coincidence.

Gaffe.

Blunder.

Oversight.

Goof.

Hypocracy (that one is a bit of a stretch).

I've given you 6, in addition to what I already gave you. Hope that helps.

[Balthasar]

I don't recall anyone appointing you to be the resident grammar police either, so where does that leave us?
That leaves you going about your day as merry as before, and me responding to posts directed at me.

[Kamalot]

Coincidence.

Gaffe.

Blunder.

Oversight.

Goof.

Hypocracy (that one is a bit of a stretch).Are the two mutually exclusive? Can't it be an ironic blunder or an ironic goof?

The image should be ostensibly antithetical to Sony's stated beliefs? Lets take a look at Sony's stated beliefs.

"With the power of the PS3 technology, the world of Gran Turismo is refined by its full HD visual presentation and unique interactive experience, resulting in an even more realistic and true driving simulator."

His [Kazunori Yamauchi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kazunori_Yamauchi)] offerings provide the gamer with the most true-to-life driving simulation within the industry-source (http://www.us.playstation.com/News/PressReleases/371)-

So, utilizing an image from an old game, from a competitor, for a cheaper system to showcase your 'more realistic, true-to-life' game that requires the power of a PS3 is not antithetical to Sony's stated beliefs? I'd state that it IS.

Sure, it is a blunder. An ironic one.

[BlackPete]

There is indeed irony in the fact that Sony is referencing a competitor's product to promote their own "Power of the PS3" product.

Balthasar: Here's a couple words for you... "obtusely pedantic".

[Balthasar]

So, utilizing an image from an old game, from a competitor, for a cheaper system to showcase your 'more realistic, true-to-life' game that requires the power of a PS3 is not antithetical to Sony's stated beliefs? I'd state that it IS.
First off, if people are going to keep asking about this, I don't want to hear any bitching when I try to explain. You all keep asking for it.

*Ahem*

You are forgetting my complete statement, which is that (in this specific case) it should be ostensibly antithetical. In case my statement wasn't clear, what I mean by that is that it should seemingly go against their purpose/what they believe in/what they espouse. That is, that tension should be somewhat superficial. The problem here, as I said before, is that Sony didn't do this intentionally, so they are not knowlingly violating their own principles when it comes to piracy/DRM. The quote you used could have lead one to see this event as ironic IF that quote said "even more realistic than the competition." However, if you read it, the speaker is clearly saying the PS3 will make the game look even more realistic than the game itself originally did. So there's nothing ironic about confusing it with another next-gen product of similar/higher caliber. It's stupid. But not ironic.

A good example of this kind of irony, as I pointed out before, is used in a wiki article that attempts to explain the concept, and goes as follows: "In June, 2005, the State of Virginia Employment Agency, which handles unemployment compensation, announced that they would lay off 400 employees for lack of work because unemployment is so low in the state." Not all irony operates in precisely this way, but in this case, that is the only way I can really see this story being ironic. Sony didn't intentionally post someone else's game on their site, nor did they make grandiose claims that GTHD was visually superior to PGR3.

Here's another semi-decent example of irony: BlackPete tries to insult me by calling me "obtusely pedantic," which is itself a fairly complex, prolix way of saying "confusing" or "anal."

[DangerousDaze]

Fuck me but this thread has been assassinated, buried, dug up, and then pissed on repeatedly. Can an admin please add the word "irony" to the censored word list? Yep, right up there with ******, ******, and surprisingly, ******* (who'd a thunk that that one would have made the list?) TIA.

/edit - can't spell.

[Kamalot]

You are forgetting my complete statement, which is that (in this specific case) it should be ostensibly antithetical. In case my statement wasn't clear, what I mean by that is that it should seemingly go against their purpose/what they believe in/what they espouse.
I'm not forgetting your complete statement.

The entire situation 'seemingly' goes against the purpose of advertising their own product.

I want to sell you an apple, so I put up a sign that says, "Get your apples today" that contains a photo of an orange. That 'seemingly' goes against the purpose of the advertisement.

Come check out the video for our racing game.
(Here's a picture of a competitor's racing game to get you excited.)

It does not matter if the photo was chosen intentionally, randomly, or accidentally. the end result is ironic. Calling it a blunder, oversight or a goof, does not prevent the end result from appearing to go against the intents and purposes of advertising for Gran Turismo HD.

Sony's intent is to promote their own product. It is situational irony that they end up promoting a competitor's product. Promoting the competition goes against Sony's intents and purposes.

[Kamalot]

Fuck me but this thread has been assassinated, burried, dug up, and then pissed on repeatedly. Can an admin please add the word "irony" to the censored word list? Yep, right up there with ******, ******, and surprisingly, ******* (who'd a thunk that that one would have made the list?) TIA.
This thread has evolved.
I'd hate to see you in a position of administrative power. You'd apparently censor any word or person on a whim. :(

[Balthasar]

I'm not forgetting your complete statement.

The entire situation 'seemingly' goes against the purpose of advertising their own product...

Sony's intent is to promote their own product. It is situational irony that they end up promoting a competitor's product. Promoting the competition goes against Sony's intents and purposes.
Right, their intent is to sell their own product, but their intent was not to use that picture. In irony, the act should be intentional and knowing, and the result unintentional and ignorant. That's what makes irony funny to us, the viewer, more often than not; that the party or parties do something consciously without being aware of the big picture/end result of that knowing action. That's where the paradox arises. Situational irony occurs when forces outside of the control of the subject place the subject in that unknowing position. As another example, if Microsoft, on their Zune web page, posted a picture of an iPod but referred to it as a Zune, that act in and of itself would not constitute as irony. If, however, there were multiple versions of the Zune, hypothetically, and these models were advertised as "the iPod alternative" or somesuch, and the highest-end version of the Zune was pictured as an iPod, that might be ironic. If you can't tell already, it's impossible to really encapsulate all of what makes something ironic with one concise definition.

Also, the way you are interpreting my words doesn't quite work, because Sony isn't "ostensibly" trying to sell their own products. They are actually trying to sell their goods. There is no false pretense/ulterior motive/ancillary benefit. There is nothing beyond the surface. If I am walking across the floor, trip, and then fall, it would not be correct to say "I was ostensibly walking across the floor," unless my tripping somehow looked like walking (which would be freakish). The humor in this picture situation is that Sony are seemingly and in fact not advertising what they want to advertise.

[DangerousDaze]

This thread has evolved.
I'd hate to see you in a position of administrative power. You'd apparently censor any word or person on a whim. :(
It was lighthearted, unlike the rest of this derailed to hell and back thread.

[Balthasar]

It was lighthearted, unlike the rest of this derailed to hell and back thread.
My comment that "sparked" this was light-hearted. Kamalot's response to me is at worse civil, as far as I can tell. But I'm not really sure how you can call a thread whose sole purpose was to point at Sony and do a Nelson impersonation "light-hearted."

By the way, I know one of those words that was censored (being the name of That Site Whose Name We Shall Not Speak). What the hell are the other two?

[DangerousDaze]

By the way, I know one of those words that was censored (being the name of That Site Whose Name We Shall Not Speak). What the hell are the other two?
They don't exist. I just typed the asterisks directly in an obviously misunderstood (and admittedly lame) attempt at humour, or possibly jury misdirection, who can tell. Why would anyone would take a request to censor the word "irony" seriously? You'd have to be a complete ******** to believe that.

[Johan]

Don't quit now, fellas! This is interesting!

[BlackPete]

Right, their intent is to sell their own product, but their intent was not to use that picture. In irony, the act should be intentional and knowing, and the result unintentional and ignorant.

Sony to webmaster: Make a GT:HD banner!
Result: Banner created using a competitor's screenshot.

Seems to fit by your own definition.

[Johan]

^^^Burrrrrrnnnnnn! :D

[Balthasar]

Sony to webmaster: Make a GT:HD banner!
Result: Banner created using a competitor's screenshot.

Seems to fit by your own definition.
No, again, because using the picture of the competitor in this particular case was unintentional. They did not do what they sought to do on any level.

[Balthasar]

They don't exist. I just typed the asterisks directly in an obviously misunderstood (and admittedly lame) attempt at humour, or possibly jury misdirection, who can tell. Why would anyone would take a request to censor the word "irony" seriously? You'd have to be a complete ******** to believe that.
You think so? Because I'm pretty sure if I type in ******, it will come up as a series of asterix, no joke. Anyway, I figured you were kidding about getting the word "irony" banned. I did not think, considering the fact that "that word" is censored 'round these parts, that you were joking about the other words you seemed to be typing.

[Kamalot]

No, again, because using the picture of the competitor in this particular case was unintentional. They did not do what they sought to do on any level.
The Wiki page on irony gives several examples of its use, and few of them show the irony as intentional. In fact their image showed a 'Dead End' sign at the end of the street, and the start of a cemetary. Sorry, I don't have the link. I'm on my phone.

Irony is often unintentional.

[Balthasar]

The Wiki page on irony gives several examples of its use, and few of them show the irony as intentional. In fact their image showed a 'Dead End' sign at the end of the street, and the start of a cemetary. Sorry, I don't have the link. I'm on my phone.
The sign itself was created intentionally. It was meant to identify a dead end. What makes it ironic is that it's unintentional placement shows a different kind of dead end. This, again, is different from the Sony thing.

[Kamalot]

The sign itself was created intentionally. It was meant to identify a dead end. What makes it ironic is that it's unintentional placement shows a different kind of dead end. This, again, is different from the Sony thing.
The banner advertisement was created intentionally. It was meant to advertise a product. What makes it ironic is that it's unintentional placement shows a competitor's product.

[Balthasar]

The banner advertisement was created intentionally. It was meant to advertise a product. What makes it ironic is that it's unintentional placement shows a competitor's product.
What? Now you're twisting the situation to try to fit the definition. The picture used was not intentional. The placement of the picture itself was not unintentional. You have it backwards. I understand why this might seem like irony, but there's no definition of irony (and there are many, as you've seen in the last few days) that this can fit this situation. This situation is no more ironic than going to a wedding to stop the girl of your dreams from marrying a scumbag and tripping and falling into their wedding cake instead.

[Trazzlo the Magnificant]

Apparently irony, like beauty, lives in the eyes of the beholder. Some of us see a picture of a car leading to the cemetery of a technological giant, while others see a reason to speed up.

Some of us see a cops and robbers movie, others see the Keystone cops.

It still meets the criteria of ironic to me, and it only seems that Balthasar elects not to see contradiction that is somewhat obvious to me. He wants to reduce the situation to a gaffe, coincidence, etc. I want to emphasize that the contradictions are richer and deeper.

His want is to reduce the situation to a simple error. Mine looks to what the error really means. I see more contradiction the deeper I look, he see's less.

That's fine with me.

Two people take a sailboat trip to Hawaii. When they arrive one says they hated every minute, it was dull, bumpy, cold, wet, exhausting, and would never go back. The other person says they found themselves, loved the journey, enjoyed all the different weather patterns, and want to keep going. Yet they took the same trip.

Mine was a trip of irony, his was a trip of errors. Everyone is really free to choose for themselves, are they not?

[Trazzlo the Magnificant]

Trazzlo the Magnificant Squire.

Yuck! Oh perhaps a kind admin could return me to my rightful state of Trazzlo the Magnificant Peon? 10 posts is too young to be promoted beyond what I am comfortable with. Its false advertising! Its ironic that the difference between being "peon-ic" and a country gentleman; a young man of noble birth who as an aspirant to knighthood served a knight; or a man who accompanies or escorts a woman comes down to your post count regarding irony.

Certainly this request is humorously sarcastic and mocking; "dry humor"; "an ironic remark often conveys an intended meaning obliquely" as per the definition of ironic at dictionary.com, yet it is also a very real request!

I WANNA BE A PEON!! Not just any peon, but a magnificent one!

[Balthasar]

Everyone is really free to choose for themselves, are they not?
No.

You should note nothing about your post count affecting your "status" reflects irony either. You're still not getting it.

[Trazzlo the Magnificant]

How ironic that you have that point of view. :)

[Balthasar]

How ironic that you have that point of view. :)
No, actually, it's not.

[Kamalot]

No, actually, it's not.
It is funny how everyone else can appreciate the irony of the GT:HD/PGR situation. Your definition of irony so iron-clad and rigid, that you can't even see real irony when it is directly in front of your face.

That's okay. We don't mind if you can't admit to being wrong. We'll enjoy the irony of the situation. When you come to terms with yourself, you can come back and admit your mistake any time. I won't hold a grudge.

[LexeL]

Balthasar, while you may be correct you've kinda killed any point w/your delivery.

Get in line with the people lamenting infer/imply and other instances of dumbing down.

[J Arcane]

Damn, that's ironic. Unlike "Raaaiaain on your wedding day". Which is merely a bummer.
Just because I'm an ass:

If one discounts cosmic irony, however, it is arguable that the song is ironic in and of itself - there is a fundamental incongruity in a song titled "Ironic" which ultimately contains no irony. During an appearance on Sessions@AOL, Morissette discussed "Ironic" and recounted an incident where "a woman came up to me in a bookstore bathroom and asked 'Is the ironic thing about "Ironic" that it's not actually filled with ironies?' I nodded and smiled."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ironic_(song)

[Dag-Sabot]

Just because im an ass, I re-read the whole thread and erased my post. I couldn't possibly coolify this thread anymore.

-That woman should have slapped Morissette right across her lying camel snout ; No way she's that deep.
She sang in malls, dated the "Joey" guy from Friends, and then wrote a super lame angst filled song about him.

Does: incongruity = irony ?

[Balthasar]

Does: incongruity = irony ?
Nope, though ironic situations are incongruous. Some people have trouble telling the difference between the two, sadly. BTW, when did Morrissette date Matt LeBlanc? I thought she dated Dave Coulier (from Full House)?

[Dag-Sabot]

BTW, when did Morrissette date Matt LeBlanc? I thought she dated Dave Coulier (from Full House)?Absolutely correct (if not even more odious). My apologies.