GameSpot Twilight Princess Review [Archive]

MaiXu

11-17-2006, 06:03 PM

GameSpot has reviewed The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess, giving it a score of 8.8 ("Great"). From the review: (http://www.gamespot.com/events/wiilaunch/story.html?sid=6161993&pid=928519&tag=topslot;action;1&om_act=convert&click=topslot&page=1)

Twilight Princess is a lengthy adventure packed with many well-designed puzzles and some interesting characters. But once you get over the rush of excitement from a big, new Zelda game having finally arrived, it's hard not to feel a tinge of disappointment--there's a very noticeable lack of evolution here, which makes aspects of the game seem more dated than classic.

Personally, I think it's nice to see a review that isn't afraid to leverage some legitimate criticisms against this title, simply because "it's Zelda." 8.8 is still a very strong score. Still, I can't tell if the Wii features are tacked on (as Gerstmann says) or if they are really a fun and revolutionary step forward (as other, higher-scoring reviews seem to suggest).

Edit: D'oh! Link added.

parallels

11-17-2006, 06:47 PM

No link for us?

Troggles

11-17-2006, 06:52 PM

Seems like the only reason it didn't get a 9 or higher was due to sound. That's why I only look at the gameplay and tilt scores at GameSpot.

disc

11-17-2006, 06:56 PM

:) Gamespot the guys who give Perfect Dark Zero 9.0

KarmaGhost

11-17-2006, 07:02 PM

I don't think that Zelda is going to be a good example of the Wii's potential. Being a GameCube port, it's going to inherently have some problems in certain areas. Let's reserve judgment on the system until we start playing some of the other titles.

Blade

11-17-2006, 07:02 PM

Oh Jeff Gerstmann. Always trying to stand out from the crowd.

Odyzen

11-17-2006, 07:03 PM

Linkage here. (http://www.gamespot.com/events/wiilaunch/story.html?sid=6161993&pid=928519&tag=topslot;action;1&om_act=convert&click=topslot)

Averic

11-17-2006, 07:05 PM

I used to really trust gamespot ratings but as time went on their scores made less and less sense.

I have not played TP yet but a lot of the time it seems they just try to be different so people think they are more critical.

Ultima Thulian

11-17-2006, 07:06 PM

IGN, Gamespot, and Gamebrink reviews are ones I tend to ignore. I do like how the reviewer tries to not come off as fanboyish, but some of his criticsisms seem unwarranted.

parallels

11-17-2006, 07:08 PM

Thanks, Odyzen.

MajSheppard

11-17-2006, 07:09 PM

8.8 is awfully low, especally for a game Links creator calls the greatest Zelda game ever.

Reminds me never to listen to anyone other then me.

EvilBob46

11-17-2006, 07:10 PM

I don't doubt this game is excellent. Both GameSpy and 1UP have given it perfect scores. But still...if the reviewers main problems with the game involve the imprecise motion controls and poor use of the wiimote speakers, I think it's possible the game will get a higher score in the review of the Gamecube version a few weeks from now (an 8.9, or potentially a 9.0). If that were to happen, the GC version outscoring the Wii one wouldn't exactly look good.

EDIT: And I am going to go ahead and say that an 8.8 for a game of this caliber is disappointing. It's a great score for any other game, but...this isn't any other game. I will wait a couple of days until the majority of reviews are in and see if Gerstmann's opinions are valid and shared by others as well, or if these are just one reviewer's gripes.

EDIT2: Heh. The Zelda TP board on GameFAQs is ABLAZE.
http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/gentopic.php?board=928519
The personal attacks against Gerstmann....photoshopped Jabba the Hutt images of him...goodness. People need to calm down.

EDIT3: Ok, the GameFAQs board is just insane now. Here are some thread titles:

OMG he gave Chuck Norris a 1.9
Real reason why Girthman gave it an 8.8
hes fat
Jeff Broke My Heart
Offically boycotting Gamespot indefinitly
I Lost All Respect For Gamespot.com!
Jeff was abused as a Child
lol jeff lol gamespot
This board is the HINDENBURG!
I hear that Jeff has links to the 9/11 hijackers
shut up about the review!!!!!!!!!!
Jeff FAT Gerstmann is FAT!!!!
Wow...This board is all Wahhhh...Gamespot gave Zelda an 8.8!!!
Protest: never read Jeff's reviews again!
Jeff's not fat
thank God for Jeff Gerstmann
I demand a riot!
NO! Jeff's review has runied the gameranking!
My Heart is lost, my pain.......real.
WTF!? 8.8!?? Are you ****ing kidding me!!!!!!? BS!
etc.etc.etc.

Doctor Setebos

11-17-2006, 07:20 PM

So, 4 perfects...and an 8.8 (http://www.gamerankings.com/htmlpages2/928519.asp). You know, statistically speaking, that 8.8 is such an aberration, it should be removed from the average. :D

Ultima Thulian

11-17-2006, 07:20 PM

I love how the game would've hit the nine spot if the sound didn't get a seven, because taking each individual score and combining them to make the overall average is such a great idea.:rolleyes:

CapnBob

11-17-2006, 07:21 PM

So... apparently it's just as good of a game as Burnout Revenge and Dead or Alive 4?

Troggles

11-17-2006, 07:22 PM

Yes, because of the sound.

Opty

11-17-2006, 07:23 PM

I like how one of his major arguments boils down to "The game follows the classic Zelda formula for dungeons/items and THAT'S BAD! Why didn't Nintendo completely change how Zelda worked!?!?!? Minus points for unoriginality!"

Switcher

11-17-2006, 07:27 PM

Well since Gerstmann has been negative about the Wii in every single Gamespot podcast, and refused to play any of the games standing up....

I'm going to assume he wasn't the one to review the game.

EvilBob46

11-17-2006, 07:27 PM

IGN Review!

http://wii.ign.com/articles/746/746691p1.html

9.5

The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess is, in my opinion, the greatest Zelda game ever created and one of the best launch titles in the history of launch titles – second only, perhaps, to the at-the-time ground-breaking Super Mario 64. It is also one of the finest games I have ever played.

KingGorilla

11-17-2006, 07:33 PM

So, 4 perfects...and an 8.8 (http://www.gamerankings.com/htmlpages2/928519.asp). You know, statistically speaking, that 8.8 is such an aberration, it should be removed from the average. :D
GOD FUCKING FORBID YOU READ THE REVIEW!

And now back to the show.

Zeal

11-17-2006, 07:34 PM

Ohhhhhh shiiit.........lol.

John Mirra

11-17-2006, 07:35 PM

I am personally insulted by this low score of 8.8! It is a tiny fraction lower than 9 and that is inexcusable!

I mean I've never played the game. No one has, really. But even though I've never played the game and shouldn't know what I'm talking about, I somehow do! I know that it cannot be less than a perfect 10 because this is just wrong!

I know reviews are subjective or whatever, but come on! In the gaming world, one man's opinion is TRUTH set in stone!

I shall continue to be outraged until I recieve a public apology from this waste of human flesh I have never and will never meet!

Blade

11-17-2006, 07:48 PM

I'm only perturbed because if you read the Wind Waker reviews (by Gerstmann or IGN) they're scored higher and individual sub-scores are higher. For example, IGN gave Wind Waker a 10 for lasting appeal where as TP got a 9.5 in that category. Despite being well over twice as long, and more polished.

Wind Waker was a disappointment in terms of length!

Megalith

11-17-2006, 07:52 PM

Twilight Flop.

Ph00p

11-17-2006, 07:56 PM

WTF so GOW with framerate issues and actual bugs gets a MUCH higher score while Zelda TP eats shit? WTF.

EternalGamer

11-17-2006, 07:58 PM

I don't think I agree with Jeff's criteria for what is considered "innovation." Innovation, to me is bound by practicality and it is only an attribute when it improves the overall experience. Jeff seems to think that it is valuable in and of itself and therefore wags his finger at Zelda for not being a martyr for the cause of "change."

But automatically assuming that things could be better using a "different" method from previous Zeldas without having any concrete conception of what you actually mean by "different" seems a pretty poor way to judge a particular game's merits.

Rakael

11-17-2006, 08:03 PM

I like playing games with something as seemingly unintuitive as a mouse and keyboard. These are things designed for productivity alone. Designed to make it easier to navigate an OS that may dong at you if you do something stupid, but otherwise is lifeless and boring. I have grown to love it as well, even more than so called "game controllers" that are supposed to be designed from the ground up to be intuitive. Looking at things in this light, I am confident the Wii-mote thing will be fun enough to justify its own existence. Playing Secret of Mana on my TV rather than a PC screen, now that is what makes my heart go all a-twitter.

Opty

11-17-2006, 08:05 PM

Zeal

11-17-2006, 08:07 PM

I love how Gamespot's review eloquently summed it up by saying:

"Same old shit"

cp#

11-17-2006, 08:08 PM

:) Gamespot the guys who give Perfect Dark Zero 9.0

LOL OWNED. I am not a Gamespot goer so I can't say much of their reviews so I'll take 2 margaritas with this one and plenty o' salt

F3nyx

11-17-2006, 08:08 PM

I love how the game would've hit the nine spot if the sound didn't get a seven, because taking each individual score and combining them to make the overall average is such a great idea.:rolleyes:It's not an average (http://www.gamespot.com/misc/reviewguidelines.html)

edit: and for god's sake, add Odyzen's link to the post.

Captain Awesome

11-17-2006, 08:09 PM

:) Gamespot the guys who give Perfect Dark Zero 9.0

Please tell me they have really good weed at gamespot.

KingGorilla

11-17-2006, 08:11 PM

Troggles

11-17-2006, 08:12 PM

It also says this in the review guidelines:
"We Consider Games On Their Own Merits
First and foremost, our reviews are an assessment of one particular game at a time. We approach each review assignment without assuming anything about the quality of the game, irrespective of prerelease preview coverage, the history of any previous games in the series, any perceptions about the developer's or publisher's track records, and so forth. That is, every game we review gets a fair shake, and is treated with the same level of care and attention with which we approach every review assignment."

So all the comparisons to the other games should NOT be taken into account.

Blade

11-17-2006, 08:13 PM

KingGorilla: 1UP also said that the Wii version is the definitive version, and he was referring to the controls.

...?

Jenga

11-17-2006, 08:13 PM

Personally, I think it's nice to see a review that isn't afraid to leverage some legitimate criticisms against this title, simply because "it's Zelda.
I was thinking that too when I first heard the score. Then I found out it was Gerstmann who reviewed it and I just laughed.

jonat3

11-17-2006, 08:15 PM

Apparently the reviewer hates the wiimote. And the sound. In fact, he probably hates the wii itself. I wonder why they let him review any wii games at all.

I can live with the score if it was primarily the wiimote that annoyed him. Heck, not everybody will like it. But if the GC score is around the same as the wii score, his review will be really suspect.

KingGorilla

11-17-2006, 08:16 PM

KingGorilla: 1UP also said that the Wii version is the definitive version, and he was referring to the controls.

...?
Didn't Bettenhousen, the man who masturbates to screens of Link and Gannon, review it?

I was talking about the show where 4 people talked about it.

Jenga

11-17-2006, 08:17 PM

I see this not so much as an indication of what this Zelda game lacks, more of what the Wii lacks. As the layers are getting peeled away, and people get their hands on the controller, it is hard not to notice the man behind the screen, so to speak. What we dreamed of as revolutionary, is rather average. So far the gyro and all the bells and whistles are little more than buttons by a different name, a flick of the wrist, so subtle is more than enough to play, the speaker is horrid as well(and so many of Link's weapons use the damn thing I hear). I think 1 Up summed it up rather well, it would play better with a gamepad.
Um, really? Out of the majority of the impressions from people who got their hands on the Wii, most of them usually say they're impressed and are looking forward to what developers will bring out.

I think 1 Up summed it up rather well, it would play better with a gamepad Because you had a chance to play Twilight Princess and aren't just bashing the Wii based on the impressions of a rather pathetic review? :rolleyes:

EternalGamer

11-17-2006, 08:17 PM

Here's a quote from the IGN review which pretty much sums up the Gamespot review: "The complaint could be made that Twilight Princess is too similar to Ocarina of Time because the basic play style is familiar and because some faces and places return. However, we think such criticisms are unfounded because they seem to suggest that Zelda's masterful control mechanics should be changed simply for the sake of being different." Gamespot made that complaint while no one else did.

Yeah, that review pretty much sums up how I feel about it too. I don't need to play the game to realize that Gerstman's point isn't one that resonates with me. I don't believe that things need to change without being able to actually concieve of how they should change.

What is likely also is that he is ignoring all the real "innovative" changes because they involve things that would seem make sense to him and thus are subtle in their integration.

Ultima Thulian

11-17-2006, 08:19 PM

It's not an average (http://www.gamespot.com/misc/reviewguidelines.html)

edit: and for god's sake, add Odyzen's link to the post.

Reviewer's Tilt (Tilt)
While this component is not intended to be directly representative of our overall experience with a game, we use it to influence the overall rating one way or another, based on our overall experience. For instance, a technically impressive game that's highly unoriginal may be tilted low, while a game with a truly outstanding story but an unremarkable presentation may be tilted high.

In other words, they take all the individual scores (graphics, sound, etc.) and use the Tilt (which isn't meant to be a fun factor score) to "tilt" the score one way or the other, because all the scores are lumped together and used to get the average.

I'm sorry if I'm sounding dumb, but I must be missing something...:(

KingGorilla

11-17-2006, 08:20 PM

Um, really? Out of the majority of the impressions from people who got their hands on the Wii, most of them usually say they're impressed and are looking forward to what developers will bring out.

Because you had a chance to play Twilight Princess and aren't just bashing the Wii based on the impressions of a rather pathetic review? :rolleyes:
Actually I have tried it(the controller), and dissapointment was the order of the day. And I cannot believe that nintendo, in good conscience, actually shows use of the controller that is so obviously false. Maybe it was my false hope at the concept of the Wiimote, and what is actually delivered, but what there is now...is nowhere near what was promised.

And by your logic of me not playing it, you should not automatically think it is good, because you have not played it either.

Megalith

11-17-2006, 08:20 PM

Face it...the game got an 8.8 because it looks like ass and runs in 480p.

Graphics matter more than ever this generation, whether anyone wants to admit it or not.

Troggles

11-17-2006, 08:22 PM

jonat3

11-17-2006, 08:23 PM

Face it...the game got an 8.8 because it looks like ass and runs in 480p.

Graphics matter more than ever this generation, whether anyone wants to admit it or not.

Actually, the graphics got a 9. It's the gameplay and the sound that gave it an 8.8.

Gameplay got an 8 and sound a 7.

KingGorilla

11-17-2006, 08:23 PM

Face it...the game got an 8.8 because it looks like ass and runs in 480p.

Graphics matter more than ever this generation, whether anyone wants to admit it or not.
I bet that has a lot to do with it. I have to say, it really must.

Ultima Thulian

11-17-2006, 08:25 PM

It's not an average score because the different categories are weighted differently.

Ahh..ok I see now. Thanks...man I feel dumb.

Jenga

11-17-2006, 08:25 PM

Face it...the game got an 8.8 because it looks like ass and runs in 480p.

Graphics matter more than ever this generation, whether anyone wants to admit it or not.You're right. I mean comparing the Wii, a system that puts its focus on its controller rather than its graphics, to two systems that rely on graphical overhaul is COMPLETELY fair. Right?

Captain Awesome

11-17-2006, 08:25 PM

Actually, the graphics got a 9.

haha, you beat me to it.

jonat3

11-17-2006, 08:26 PM

It's not the graphics that gave it a low score. Read the reviews for crying out loud.

F3nyx

11-17-2006, 08:26 PM

In other words, they take all the individual scores (graphics, sound, etc.) and use the Tilt (which isn't meant to be a fun factor score) to "tilt" the score one way or the other, because all the scores are lumped together and used to get the average.

I'm sorry if I'm sounding dumb, but I must be missing something...:(The tilt doesn't do that, exactly... and no, you're not being dumb, their system is just arcane.

Our ratings are generated from the component scores that our reviewers assign. That means the overall rating is not a pure average of five component scores--some components are weighted more heavily than others.Tilt is one of the five component scores. So they throw in the tilt factor, and then give certain components more weight anyway. Makes no sense to me, but that's what they claim.

edit: threads are movin' kinda fast tonight :)

Troggles

11-17-2006, 08:27 PM

You're right. I mean comparing the Wii, a system that puts its focus on it's controller rather than it's graphics, to two systems that rely on graphical overhaul is COMPLETELY fair. Right?

According to the review guidelines, they aren't supposed to do that either.

I wonder if they wrote those for a reason? The don't seem to be following them.

Ultima Thulian

11-17-2006, 08:27 PM

The tilt doesn't do that, exactly... and no, you're not being dumb, their system is just arcane.

Tilt is one of the five component scores. So they throw in the tilt factor, and then give certain components more weight anyway. Makes no sense to me, but that's what they claim.

Thanks, Troggles explained it to me too. I still feel pretty dumb.

dena miscreant

11-17-2006, 08:29 PM

Please tell me they have really good weed at gamespot.

For all you non-inhalers, I can tell you, from vast experience, that the BEST weed in America will not allow you to enjoy PDZ co-op.

If only because we could not figure out how to get beyond this point in the very first friggin' mission (not the training one...).

I could add to that, but it's pointless.

I think that particular review of PDZ was a fluke. I usually find GameSpot to be much more realistic in their reviews than the other big guys. I still use gamerankings a lot, but I trust GameSpot over IGN or just about any other mainstream website. Though, that's still not saying much.

Try to remember that the points you see out of 10 are purely subjective.

Add or subtract anywhere from 1-3 points to a review if you don't feel like your thoughts mesh with a reviewer's.

This is the point where actually READING the review instead of just taking the surface score as set in stone will pay off for the gamer looking for the best interactive experience available for their preferences.

Deadend

11-17-2006, 08:31 PM

From what I can tell, the guy thinks it's a really great game... but wishes that it was it was more than just Zelda More Of The Same. Or possibly he gave it a low score from having to plow through a 40 hour game by swinging his arms around in less than a week, that would make me bitter as well.

Feltoar

11-17-2006, 08:33 PM

I tend to not mind GameSpots reviews... no no, wait, hear me out!

When I read that 8.8, instead of reading 8.8 I see 'read the bloody review and see whats going on'. Normally I would but Im very cautious of any Zelda info.

I bet if I was to read the review it would:
a) Make sense and give me a good idea of what I am in for.
b) Show to me all the reviewers problems with the game have nothing to do with me and my own personal preferences. Like his complaints wont 'apply' to me. Thats normally how things go for me.

I do feel rather insulted by the score though. It does seem like some of it may be just to be 'different' to appear like a critic, which shouldnt be allowed to reflect on the games reputation. Although, what can we do? It isnt very important.

Jenga

11-17-2006, 08:34 PM

Honestly, what makes me hate this review is the fact that he tosses out game spoilers left and right. You'd think that as a gaming journalist he would know better.

EternalGamer

11-17-2006, 08:36 PM

Jenga, what is ironic is that he does that except when it comes to the one factor he puts the most emphasis on--the game's lack of innovation. There you get no specifics as to what he would like to see innovated.

Gpig

11-17-2006, 08:36 PM

Guys I'm trying to decide between getting zelda and getting this (http://www.gamespot.com/xbox/action/marceckosgettingup/review.html) . On the one hand the latter is .1 worse, but on the other hand it has better sound (I know it has a few minor audiovisual glitches, but it's still a 9 so it should be great).

Any advice?

Zeal

11-17-2006, 08:38 PM

Captain Awesome

11-17-2006, 08:41 PM

Guys I'm trying to decide between getting zelda and getting http://www.gamespot.com/xbox/action/marceckosgettingup/review.html

I was given "Getting Up" as a birthday gift. Worst gift ever, terrible game. I gave it to my nephew who dropped it the instant he got Kingdom Hearts :p

Gpig

11-17-2006, 08:41 PM

Gamespot has always been rather fair, to be honest. I can't say that about many of these videogame sites.

They were one of the first sites with the balls to score Halo 2 lower than the original. That being said, I've read their TP review and it sounds completely unbiased and fair.

Didn't they give Halo 2 like a 9.4 or something and say that it's matchmaking system was actually good?

edit:

I was given "Getting Up" as a birthday gift. Worst gift ever, terrible game. I gave it to my nephew who dropped it the instant he got Kingdom Hearts :p

Hmmm, if it's so bad I'm not sure if I should pick up Zelda since they're pretty similarly scored.

Megalith

11-17-2006, 08:42 PM

Of course Gamespot gave the graphics a 9. If they actually gave a realistic score (6~7), then they'd get all of the inevitable "It's da gameplay dat matters, not da graphix" from the elite super real gamer club.

The truth is that all Wii graphics scores will be skewed because the system can't match the bar that has been set by 360, and the PS3. It has to be reviewed in its own little world, otherwise, they would be an average of 5 in every review.

jonat3

11-17-2006, 08:44 PM

Wether it is truly unbiased will depend on the GC review.

I believe this guy scored OOT a 10 and Majora's mask an 8.3. So he seems abit eccentric. Especially because Tony Hawk 3 got a 10 from him.

From my impressions of this guy, he hates the wii, which is why zelda suffered because of it. Well, not everybody can like the wiimote, so he's entitled to his opinion. But the GC score better not be close to the wii score. Otherwise the worth of his opinion goes entirely down the drain.

Captain Awesome

11-17-2006, 08:45 PM

Hmmm, if it's so bad I'm not sure if I should pick up Zelda since they're pretty similarly scored.

It's really up to you, maybe rent it before buying? The more I played it the more I began to really dislike it.

Jenga

11-17-2006, 08:45 PM

KingGorilla

11-17-2006, 08:47 PM

Originally Posted by Gpig
Guys I'm trying to decide between getting zelda and getting http://www.gamespot.com/xbox/action...gup/review.html
Any person who buys gettign up deserves to be neutered, with a blow torch and lemon juice.

Zeal

11-17-2006, 08:48 PM

Yeah, you're going on my ignore list.
Go fuck yourself if you can't take the heat. This is EvilAvatar.

Anyway, Gamespot's review pretty much cements the fact that I will be getting the Gamecube version. They admit right off the bat that the games are the same.

KingGorilla

11-17-2006, 08:49 PM

Zeal, given the length of the game though, I think it may end up being on like 10 GC discs. The game apparently is living up to the promise of 80 hours of gameplay.

Megalith

11-17-2006, 08:49 PM

LoL!!!

I can't stop laughing at the guy's face in the Video Review box.

http://www.gamespot.com/events/wiilaunch/story.html?sid=6161993&pid=928519&tag=topslot;action;1

"Find out how the most anticipated title for the Wii has turned out."

::dissapointed::

Jenga

11-17-2006, 08:49 PM

Go fuck yourself if you can't take the heat. This is EvilAvatar.
I had no idea these forums were XTREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEM

Zeal

11-17-2006, 08:50 PM

Zeal, given the length of the game though, I think it may end up being on like 10 GC discs. The game apparently is living up to the promise of 80 hours of gameplay.
Oh c'mon, man. It'll probably just be on one; two at most.

Kamalot

11-17-2006, 08:54 PM

:) Gamespot the guys who give Perfect Dark Zero 9.0
I remember that. Damn. What a waste of $60! :mad:

Savok

11-17-2006, 09:00 PM

I keep thinking back to Wind Waker coming out. Half the Internet thought "this is incredible", the other half said "this is kiddie bullshit, where's OoT?".

Well, by the looks of things we all got OoT again. Just remember, this is what people wanted, Nintendo simply complied with your demands. So thanks assholes.

Captain Awesome

11-17-2006, 09:00 PM

I remember that. Damn. What a waste of $60! :mad:

One of the few titles I really regret purchasing. Luckily I was able to trade it in and get some of the money back.

Which then went to my "New Pants Fund".

grimjoe

11-17-2006, 09:01 PM

omg ppl, its just a review by one person. You shouldn't care what he thinks, its not like your not picking it up anyway and enjoying it and all the other's 9.8 and up reviews it recieved

whats next? we're gonna see an EGM article make the front page :\

Zeal

11-17-2006, 09:02 PM

I got an idea. How about a next-generation Zelda.

You know, kinda like the one Nintendo showed long ago at Spaceworld and then disappeared off the face of the earth.

Jenga

11-17-2006, 09:05 PM

I got an idea. How about a next-generation Zelda.

You know, kinda like the one Nintendo showed long ago at Spaceworld and then disappeared of the face of the earth.
This post coming from the guy who has a heart attack whenever someone says that Halo has a generic plot, is simply hilarious.

Exodus

11-17-2006, 09:07 PM

Remember what that EA guy said about GoW? Not innovative?
Now, remember all those people who agreed with him?
If this gamespot guy is saying the same thing, all those who agreed with the EA guy should be nodding their heads in approval about this as well.

Everything should be looked at in the same light. I completely agree that GoW isn't exactly innovative. If TP is much the same way, I also agree. No exceptions. I think windwaker was the bravest and most kick ass thing I ever played on the GC.

Jenga

11-17-2006, 09:08 PM

Remember what that EA guy said about GoW? Not innovative?
Now, remember all those people who agreed with him?I don't. Most people just went and bashed EA.

Captain Awesome

11-17-2006, 09:10 PM

Remember what that EA guy said about GoW? Not innovative?

That's not a very fair comparison. Since the EA guy admits to not even playing GoW at all in the same article. And all he was doing was throwing fuel into the fire so people would pay him mind, since they have that "Army Of One" game coming out soon. While this review is from an actual game critic who played it.

I think people in here are just arguing that they have a problem with the reviewers record and some things just not lining up.

But yes, I sort of look at most of these reviews in the same light. I only go into them to read about certain features and additions. I already know what I plan to play whether it gets a good review or not.

cp#

11-17-2006, 09:12 PM

I got an idea. How about a next-generation Zelda.

You know, kinda like the one Nintendo showed long ago at Spaceworld and then disappeared off the face of the earth.

That is what this Zelda game is.

How about Bungie gives us a good Halo game? BURN

Seriously though there are some idiots who aren't going to think this Zelda game is perfect (Gamestop) while most other will. Then of course there are the Zelda haters who have never played one in their lives pshh.

From what I have heard so far this is Zelda at its finest and I can't wait to play it, I don't give a fuck about the reviews

(P.S the game is on one GameCube disc.. this is Nintendo we are talking here people)

Also this game is a GameCube game through and through, the graphics of the next Zelda will probably be significantly better because they will be built specifically for the Wii. :)

Zeal

11-17-2006, 09:19 PM

How is it a next-generation Zelda if it was developed on Gamecube.

cp#

11-17-2006, 09:24 PM

How is it a next-generation Zelda if it was developed on Gamecube.

Because it was started on the GameCube after Wind Waker, Nintendo ditched the GameCube a year ago, kept the almost finished game and adapted it/updated it for the Wii's controls. They aren't going to throw away a great game because of a new system (lets not forget this new system is basically the same as the old system)

TP looks better than this crap anyways, http://media.cube.ign.com/media/014/014914/imgs_1.html

KingGorilla

11-17-2006, 09:25 PM

How is it a next-generation Zelda if it was developed on Gamecube.
Well...there is Kameo and Perfect Dark Zero. But jibs aside, compared to what the 360 and PS3 have now and down the pipe, Twilight Princess is looking like so much more of a satisfying experience than anything else.

What is the dungeon count?

Megalith

11-17-2006, 09:29 PM

Does anyone know who composed the score.

Wait, this game is in Pro-Logic II...pathetic...

Nessus

11-17-2006, 09:31 PM

GOD FUCKING FORBID YOU READ THE REVIEW!

Except his review contains late game spoilers.

I love how Gamespot's review eloquently summed it up by saying:

"Same old shit"

And we all know Halo 3 will be COMPLETELY DIFFERENT from the first two games, just like how Halo 2 revolutionized first person shooters.

And y'know, I agree. I would have rather Nintendo built a Zelda game from the ground up for Wii. But the reviews coming in, and with the single exception of this GameSpot review, are all saying that the new controls work, and in some areas (particularly aiming the bow and arrow) are far superior to an analog stick.

The game has an average score of 96% for crying out loud. And that's the Wii version.

Nessus

11-17-2006, 09:34 PM

What is the dungeon count?

9 officially, with some short pseudo-dungeons spread throughout. And apparently lots of overworld gameplay in the range of 2 to 3 hours between each dungeon.

cp#

11-17-2006, 09:36 PM

Does anyone know who composed the score.

Wait, this game is in Pro-Logic II...pathetic...

Wii only outputs PLII numbnuts.. pathetic attempt to.. ?

Jack B

11-17-2006, 09:43 PM

One of the few titles I really regret purchasing. Luckily I was able to trade it in and get some of the money back.

Which then went to my "New Pants Fund".

Well, regardless of the score, if you like Zelda, you'll probably love TP, because it's already gotten some extremely high reviews.

The PDZ comments in this thread do go to show how different we all are. I thought PDZ single player was uninspiring, but the multiplayer took about 2 months worth of 5 nights a week of my time. I absolutely had a blast playing PDZ online.

To each his own, I guess. Jeff G, at Gamespot just wasn't as impressed as others have been. It happens. It could be worse. Gears is getting a 9.5 average and Eurogamer gave it an 8.0. The only site included in Gamerankings.com's consensus that was below 9... Looking at it that way, 8.8 is pretty good. Zelda may finish up at 9.4 to 9.7 in the end, so 8.8 is not nearly as far off the median as an 8.0.

Carry on.

Phanto

11-17-2006, 09:49 PM

OrangePulp

11-17-2006, 10:26 PM

I was going to suggest that maybe he didn't find Zelda gameplay in general as spectacular as everyone seems to think it is (like me; they're not bad, but they're probably the most overrated games in existence), but I guess not, since at the start he says OoT is one of the greatest games of all time.

It's funny how fanboy-ish people are about this game, though, without even having played it.

Rook34

11-17-2006, 10:28 PM

Does anyone know who composed the score.

Wait, this game is in Pro-Logic II...pathetic...

This is like the third negative comment you've thrown out in this thread.

Did you go to Troll School?

Ultima Thulian

11-17-2006, 10:33 PM

We need some banhammer action.

H.Bogard

11-17-2006, 10:39 PM

Gamespot, the site that rated Halo 2 higher than Half Life 2... what do you expect?

Rook34

11-17-2006, 10:40 PM

We need some banhammer action.

You can smell it in the air. It's coming.

Maybe EVAV should host a contest for other funny BANHAMMER pics. What do you think,Reds?

Ultima Thulian

11-17-2006, 10:43 PM

You can smell it in the air. It's coming.

Maybe EVAV should host a contest for other funny BANHAMMER pics. What do you think,Reds?

I hope so. As for pics...I swear to god this reminds me so much of fits...

http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o110/ultima13/banhammer15gq9.jpg

jadkins555

11-17-2006, 10:56 PM

I remember that. Damn. What a waste of $60! :mad:

I just played through PDZ for the first time and thoroughly enjoyed it. 9.0 doesn't seem illogical to me.

jadkins555

11-17-2006, 11:00 PM

And we all know Halo 3 will be COMPLETELY DIFFERENT from the first two games, just like how Halo 2 revolutionized first person shooters.

But what Zelda is this? Zelda number 20? Nintendo even had to create the excuse that each Link is a different person that all happened to be named Link because they keep redoing the same basic story all the time.

Exodus

11-17-2006, 11:23 PM

*shrugs* the people that want zelda well get zelda, it's been like that since the beginning of time.

Kagger

11-17-2006, 11:28 PM

But what Zelda is this? Zelda number 20? Nintendo even had to create the excuse that each Link is a different person that all happened to be named Link because they keep redoing the same basic story all the time.

Try 11

And maybe they talked about them being different Link's, because the games are actually different? The landscape of each Hyrule is a tad different (things change over time), and guess what? Wind Waker directly uses Ocarina as a way of telling the story, talking about the story as Myth and Tradition.

And SPOILER

You even go to the bottom of the Sea to Ocarina's world (from what I heard).

The series has improved in pretty much every incarnation. the original Legend of Zelda, to A Link to the Past, to Ocarina, are all huge leaps over each other.

jamaicanrage

11-17-2006, 11:36 PM

i don't think anybody who read that review who has played any zelda game in the past will base their buy/don't buy decission on a single review. i'm not a nintendo guy, so i don't really care either way, but zelda is one of the strongest franchises out there and a large percentage of their demographic will play it regardless of whether the reviewers issues with the game are genuine or not.

Wolvie

11-17-2006, 11:46 PM

Oh shit! The fanboys are gonna go apeshit!!!

*hides under desk till riot clams down*

Skyelan

11-18-2006, 12:06 AM

I'm sorry, redoing the same story in time? Yeah, cause Minish Cap, the Oracle games, Link's Awakening, and Majora's Mask didn't deviate from the (Ganon kidnapped Zelda, rescue her!) plotline.

Even TP is doing that to a large extent, putting a much larger focus on secondary characters (To which Link barely interacted with in past games).

Savok

11-18-2006, 12:15 AM

To this day I maintain that Majora's Mask should of never been a Zelda game, it held the game back. Not only could they have gone nuts with the art design (moreso then they did) but people would see it as the brilliant piece of design it is rather then as a "weird" Zelda game.

If they made a Majora's Mask type game today, with the LSD induced design they seem to have picked up for stuff like WariorWare and the more dialog intensive Marios (I HAVE FURY!!!!), I would easily call it the best game ever.

Zeal

11-18-2006, 12:25 AM

The Twilight King is Miyamoto.

Wolvie

11-18-2006, 12:26 AM

To this day I maintain that Majora's Mask should of never been a Zelda game, it held the game back.

Mojora's Mask was ok by me in the weird department. I just got sick of the time warping "Groundhogs Day" gameplay. Not the worst Zelda ever, but it comes in at third in my book, after the gawd awful Phillips CDi games.

Watership

11-18-2006, 12:28 AM

I'm chiming in very late on this, but the web reaction the Gamespot's score has made me embarassed to be a video gaming enthusiast. The amount of personal attacks against Gerstmann is beyond insane, and people are attacking him with everything from insults to death threats. What in the name of GOD are these people doing? Wanna know why no one takes gamers seriously. I give you Zelda Zealots.

Disgusting.

Savok

11-18-2006, 12:31 AM

Mojora's Mask was ok by me in the weird department. I just got sick of the time warping "Groundhogs Day" gameplay. Not the worst Zelda ever, but it comes in at third in my book, after the gawd awful Phillips CDi games.
Exactly my point, you played it as a Zelda game. It should be played as a brilliant piece of experimental game design, but the whole Zelda thing just keeps getting in the way by being Zelda, such is the power of the intellectual property.

Zeal

11-18-2006, 12:35 AM

The greatest Zelda ever made is Zelda II: The Aventure of Link. Do not even attempt to disagree.

http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/8801/returnofganonau1.jpg

SuperMonkeyFighter2

11-18-2006, 12:37 AM

A bit off topic (sort of) ... I am the proud owner of a pre-release Wii (although I'm not terribly exclusive in that dept), and a selection of games today. After reading a lot of the positive and negative press on Zelda, I was curious to have a go. Now, I really did not make it too far. To be honest, I only played until the end of the first day (which I'll explain).
Quick 1st impressions: I see what Joystiq was bitching about to a degree. After a year of quality PC and 360 titles, it's hard to look at an enhanced Gamecube title in a graphically positive way.
Now, I play on a big screen Samsung LCD, complete with the component cables ... so perhaps more flaws then usual stand out. However, many of the background textures (grass and such) looked very muddy (the character models looked fine for the most part), and the overall geometry for the landscapes was rather crude. However, once again, this was very early in the game ... maybe it gets better later.
My early tasks in the game consisted of naming my horse, playing music for it, and riding around collecting sheep and jumping fences. So, safe to say I did not get into the meat of the game yet. Hopefully by tomorrow I would have made much more significant progress ...
On another note, I played a bit of Red Steel today as well ... much like 1st gen PS2 titles, this game has severe AA problems. I'm sure this will get fixed over time, but this is something else that was a bit distracting to me while I played.
Honestly, despite my graphical bitching though, I had fun playing for the most part. Red Steel surprised me, as once I got used to that bounding box control (which I wish they game a real, fixed perspective mouselook), I did have fun with the game. The same holds true for Wii Sports, Monkey Ball, and Excite Truck. All fun games that make me happy to own the system. However, part of me really wishes Nintendo gave this system just a tad more under the hood.

Norse

11-18-2006, 01:31 AM

Did people get this upset when Gears only got an 8/10 @ Eurogamer?

I like Zelda games, loved WW, but the lack of high-res gfx and true surround sound hurts TP IMHO.

Exodus

11-18-2006, 01:36 AM

Did people get this upset when Gears only got an 8/10 @ Eurogamer?

I like Zelda games, loved WW, but the lack of high-res gfx and true surround sound hurts TP IMHO.

Gears of War does not have brand name recognition, nor a fanbase nearly as big(yet theoretically speaking, covering my ass), as much history, I mean honestly, a 100yrs from now, link/zelda, mario will more than likely still be around in some shape or form, GoW? It will be as dust.

Then again we'll all have holodecks and I'll be luxoring with female alien girls with tentacles for hair, diana troy and dr. crusher.

Wolvie

11-18-2006, 01:37 AM

The greatest Zelda ever made is Zelda II: The Aventure of Link. Do not even attempt to disagree.

http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/8801/returnofganonau1.jpg

DISAGRESS STRONGLY! Just kidding! Just kidding! I couldn't resist! Please don't hurt my beautiful face!

Vandenh

11-18-2006, 01:38 AM

I don't know what is wrong with most of the complainers. 8.8 is good and I usually base my decision on the text of the review to see if the game is what I want. I tend to like Gamespot and EG reviews nowadays for being most in line with what I expect as a gamer. The number at the end doesn't really matter that much to me anyway.
I hate reviews that are 100% praise and no substance.

Captain Awesome

11-18-2006, 01:39 AM

words...

That's what im curious about. I do not own a high-end tv like that. I just have a digital combo television. So im curious if those limitations in graphics are "that" noticeable. I still play my Dreamcast and other consoles and the games no matter what style or graphical hierarchy, still look really good to me. From what I've seen in terms of trailers and gameplay videos. I really love the art style found in TP. People gave the same grief to WW, after playing it the artstyle for that game was really solid and packed such a punch due to its attention to details.

The art direction in TP is sort of like the artstyle found in WoW, just on one locked resolution. As for the sound? That's not even a factor to me since I have such a basic speaker setup for my tv anyway. I guess time will tell if it really affects the game. Which I can probably bet it wont.

Classic NES/SNES/Genesis/DS games still thrill the shit out of me. Even with their so-called limitations. While graphics can and do wow me depending how they're presented on most of these systems. It really comes down to how the graphics are used in the sense of style and how the gameplay turns out really.

Heretic Machine

11-18-2006, 01:58 AM

From what the little blurb in the OP said, it sounds like the issue here is that it is the same gameplay we have had since OoT. Which is exactly what I was afraid of. Still buying it, but damn... I'm a little tired of playing OoT.

Zeal

11-18-2006, 02:02 AM

Can any of y'all help me identify the artist who did the pieces below. I scanned them from some of my old Zelda books...back in the day.

http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/2623/linkbattlesgannonfk1.jpg
http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/396/imprisonedjg7.jpg
http://img293.imageshack.us/img293/4931/agahnimnk8.jpg
http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/5714/enchantedda0.jpg
http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/7104/finalduelgv1.jpg
http://img293.imageshack.us/img293/7039/homeoftriforceep5.jpg

I like the style and wanna see what else he/she worked on.

Captain Awesome

11-18-2006, 02:14 AM

blackzc

11-18-2006, 02:20 AM

Oh god its the same ol shit!!! Years of development, polished gameplay and improved on in every way from previsous zelda games.!!! 8.8 Bitch please. Its zelda..if Big N changed to much they would be shitting kittens, fuck em.

P.S. im drunk.

Zeal

11-18-2006, 02:24 AM

From the looks of it, that looks like the work of Moebius (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean_Giraud). One of my fav illustrators. He also did work for the first Panzer Dragoon title.

He's actually my single favorite artist. I got a couple of pieces signed from him when he came to an art exhibit at the University of Georgia.

Even signed my first edition of ARZACH...

The art isn't his though.

Borys

11-18-2006, 02:34 AM

Wow, Nintendo fans are now officially worse than Xbox fans.

I applaud GameSpot for not caving in to the hype and not falling for the old "it's from Nintendo! it's Zelda! it's perfect!" mantra.

Now if they could only apply the same logic to Halo 3 review... I'd love to see a cage match between Ntards and Xbots then.

I knew this game would dissapoint all along. I knew it deep inside me, I knew it after the huge Wind Waker backslash that was totally uncalled for because WW tried something new in Zelda universe. I knew too many people simply wanted a OoT2 (which Twilight Princess really is) and not a new Zelda game.

So to sum up the amusing overreactions:

HAY GUYS, SUMPLACE GAVE MY FAVRITE GAME OF AL TIME THAT I HAVENT EVN PLAYED YET A BAD SCORE. WTF THEY SUX IM NEVER RAEDING THEIR STUFF AGAIN.

Norse

11-18-2006, 02:44 AM

Now if they could only apply the same logic to Halo 3 review...

Or the next Final Fantasy, MGS or Super Mario game....

Zeal

11-18-2006, 02:44 AM

Like I've been saying all along, all the smart people will just drop $50 on the Gamecube version.

Captain Awesome

11-18-2006, 02:57 AM

I knew this game would dissapoint all along. I knew it deep inside me, I knew it after the huge Wind Waker backslash that was totally uncalled for because WW tried something new in Zelda universe...

Woah, calm down there cowboy. Gamespot still gave it a good score. You need to get back on that saddle and not run so far ahead with the flag. While GS did give is its own score, its still a good one.

Take a breath or two.

Heretic Machine

11-18-2006, 03:02 AM

Like I've been saying all along, all the smart people will just drop $50 on the Gamecube version.

How will that fix anything? Especially if you're still buying a Wii.

Zeal

11-18-2006, 03:06 AM

Saves you $200 bucks on a console with no games.

What the hell are people gonna play, Wii bowling and Excite Truck.

Royal Fool

11-18-2006, 03:19 AM

Saves you $200 bucks on a console with no games.

What the hell are people gonna play, Wii bowling and Excite Truck.
Oh god, you're such a fucking troll. You and Megalith really need to get banhammered again.

Zeal

11-18-2006, 03:22 AM

Hey buddy, you can call me whatever you want. I just speak what I think is true.

The thing has no games.

Oh and they have my permission to ban me anytime they want.

EDIT: And what do you mean "again", retard. I wasn't banned before.

Royal Fool

11-18-2006, 03:28 AM

Hey buddy, you can call me whatever you want. I just speak what I think is true.

The thing has no games.

Oh and they have my permission to ban me anytime they want.
Most of your comments here are nothing but hateful one-liners or you spewing trollish flamebait. You never contribute anything of value.

Zeal

11-18-2006, 03:33 AM

"Trollish flamebait" huh. Well, I don't even acknowledge the internet idea of a 'troll', so whatever. I always just say whatever is on my mind.

Sounds to me like you're just pissed about the review.

Royal Fool

11-18-2006, 03:34 AM

"Trollish flamebait" huh. Well, I don't even acknowledge the internet idea of a 'troll', so whatever. I always just say whatever is on my mind.

Sounds to me like you're just pissed about the review.
No, not pissed at all, I don't really give a shit about review scores.

Keep on being all edgy and stuff.

Norse

11-18-2006, 03:37 AM

Without people like Zeal, these forums would be less entertaining...

Headcase

11-18-2006, 03:57 AM

Why did it have to be Gerstmann to review this one? I would have believed 8.8, hell, 7.8 from any other reviewer on the site, but IMO Jeff has some very weird and random scoring methods and opinions.

8.8's a very high score, but lower than your average Zelda, and this was supposed to be the "best" one. It is refreshing for a site to admit this isn't the greatest Zelda, but I have no way of knowing if that's true until tomorrow when I play it.

If Kasavin or Navarro or any of those people reviewed it I would have felt more firm "oh, it got a 9.5, awesome" or "aw, it got an 8.2, I'll probably like it but not as much as I was hoping", but with Gerstmann it's hard for me to judge how much I'll like it.

Edit:

Case in point: Gamespot gave Red Steel (http://www.gamespot.com/events/wiilaunch/story.html?sid=6162018&pid=932528&tag=topslot;action;3&om_act=convert&click=topslot&page=1) a 5.5. I believe it because Kasavin reviewed it. It's that simple.

I figured high 6, looks like it's even shoddier than I expected it to be (though of course reviews aren't final proof, even if they're not written by Gerstmann).

I must emphasize that I'm not trying to defend Zelda here, though obviously some people are going to have that impression. If Kasavin gave Zelda an 8.8 and Gerstmann Red Steel a 5.5, I'd figure Zelda was reviewed properly (very good game but a little weak to Zelda standards), and wouldn't be quite sure about Red Steel but figure it's not worth my time (Gerstmann is a little random, but 5.5 usually means not worth my time regardless).

Bydo_Empire

11-18-2006, 04:03 AM

Like I've been saying all along, all the smart people will just drop $50 on the Gamecube version.Not according to every other review out there: http://www.gamerankings.com/htmlpages2/928519.asp
Either way, 8.8 is still "great." If all the reviewers gave games the same scores, then why even bother?

[Edit]
I don't know what is wrong with most of the complainers. 8.8 is good and I usually base my decision on the text of the review to see if the game is what I want. I tend to like Gamespot and EG reviews nowadays for being most in line with what I expect as a gamer. The number at the end doesn't really matter that much to me anyway.
I hate reviews that are 100% praise and no substance.I absolutely agree with the sentiment, although personally I don't usually agree with Gamestop's reviews. That's why there's Game Rankings and Metacritic. Although, the EXPECTATION for a Zelda game - based on the history of the franches - is that it will be an A+, *****, 10/10 game. Anything less will seem unsatisfactory because expectations are so ridiculously high.

Headcase

11-18-2006, 04:09 AM

Like I've been saying all along, all the smart people will just drop $50 on the Gamecube version.

The Wii controls are tacked on, sure, but they still probably improve the game slightly.

If you don't want to get a Wii right away, I can understand that, but for those who are getting a Wii anyway, it seems the smart decision would be to buy the Wii version (if nothing else, to start getting used to the controls).

Heretic Machine

11-18-2006, 04:13 AM

Saves you $200 bucks on a console with no games.

What the hell are people gonna play, Wii bowling and Excite Truck.

The new Zelda, which I would be buying anyway, Wii sports, Elebits, Metal Slug Anthology, and possibly Excite Truck... Early next year: Super Mario Galaxy, and next Fall should be SSBB. Add to the that the possibility of a new Mario Kart and Animal Crossing (hopefully playable with Miis), and you have a pretty solid system.

Nintendo isn't perfect, but they rarely disapoint.

Headcase

11-18-2006, 04:28 AM

Saves you $200 bucks on a console with no games.

What the hell are people gonna play, Wii bowling and Excite Truck.

Zelda is the only one I'm buying at launch (along with Sports), but I'm renting Money Ball, Rayman, Excite Truck, and probably Elebits. Then early next year I'll either rent or buy Warioware Smooth Moves, Metroid Prime Corruption, and a few others, probably before a price drop happens; might as well buy now.

And if a price drop does happen early next year *shrug* it's worth the extra possible $20 to check out the wii-mote now for me.

I am, however, disappointed in the lack of channels and browser at launch. Had to wait right to launch to release that info, eh, Nintendo?

Heretic Machine

11-18-2006, 04:35 AM

Zelda is the only one I'm buying at launch (along with Sports), but I'm renting Money Ball, Rayman, Excite Truck, and probably Elebits. Then early next year I'll either rent or buy Warioware Smooth Moves, Metroid Prime Corruption, and a few others, probably before a price drop happens; might as well buy now.

And if a price drop does happen early next year *shrug* it's worth the extra possible $20 to check out the wii-mote now for me.

I am, however, disappointed in the lack of channels and browser at launch. Had to wait right to launch to release that info, eh, Nintendo?

I believe the browser and most of the channels are in. It is just the news channel, and online play that aren't.

Sl1pstream

11-18-2006, 04:41 AM

The thing has no games.

QFT.

Since when did 8,8 become a bad score? It's still a great game, according to that number. It just seems like a bad score to Zelda fanboys because Zelda, for whatever reason, is entitled to a 9+ score.

Jenga

11-18-2006, 04:56 AM

QFT.

Since when did 8,8 become a bad score? It's still a great game, according to that number. It just seems like a bad score to Zelda fanboys because Zelda, for whatever reason, is entitled to a 9+ score.
Maybe because Jeff Gerstmann gave it a 8.8 without a really good explanation? Like it's been said before, he keeps bashing the game for not being "innovative" and dosen't really elaborate on what he would have liked to see or have something done differently. You just KNOW that Gamespot wanted attention by standing out from the other reviews. Attention Whoring at its worse.

Headcase

11-18-2006, 04:59 AM

I believe the browser and most of the channels are in. It is just the news channel, and online play that aren't.

Nope (http://www.gamespot.com/news/6161926.html?q=Wii%20Channels). Sorry for being the bearer of bad news.

bapenguin

11-18-2006, 05:02 AM

My god the DOH (Defenders of Hyrule) are just as bad as the SDF.

Sl1pstream

11-18-2006, 05:09 AM

Maybe because Jeff Gerstmann gave it a 8.8 without a really good explanation? Like it's been said before, he keeps bashing the game for not being "innovative" and dosen't really elaborate on what he would have liked to see or have something done differently. You just KNOW that Gamespot wanted attention by standing out from the other reviews. Attention Whoring at its worse.

But 8.8 is still a great score. If he would've given the game a score under 8, he should've given a good reason to score it that 'low'. Why should he explain himself to the horde of raving Zelda fanboys about giving the game a great score just because it isn't as high as they all hoped. The only reason his review stands out is because most of the other sites have given in to the hype surrounding every fucking Zelda game.

Jenga

11-18-2006, 05:10 AM

But 8.8 is still a great score. If he would've given the game a score under 8, he should've given a good reason to score it that 'low'.
ALL reviews should give a clear explanation for it's score. Whether it's 4.6 or 9.5.
The majority of the review was negative...hell I was surprised it got a 8.8 from how bitter he sounded.

Sl1pstream

11-18-2006, 05:19 AM

Have you watched or read the review. I just did that and he does explain himself.

The majority of the review was negative...hell I was surprised it got a 8.8 from how bitter he sounded.
So how far does he have to explain himself? The review sounded fair and the game got a decent score from it. It's still a Zelda game and Link still has the same attacks and the same annoying attack sound. The treasure chests still seem to make the same sounds when you open them etc.

But no, Zelda is entitled to at least a 9,5. :rolleyes:

Heretic Machine

11-18-2006, 05:22 AM

Nope (http://www.gamespot.com/news/6161926.html?q=Wii%20Channels). Sorry for being the bearer of bad news.

Not really particurally bad news... I have no interest in the browser. I will literally be sitting right at my PC when I'm playing the Wii 90% of the time.

Jenga

11-18-2006, 05:24 AM

But no, Zelda is entitled to at least a 10. :rolleyes:
Fixed. FUCKING ZELDA JEFF GERSTMANN I WILL MURDER YOU IN YOUR SLEEP FUCKING ZELDA OMFG WTFUX AASDASASD.

JimmyDanger

11-18-2006, 05:26 AM

You're right. I mean comparing the Wii, a system that puts its focus on its controller rather than its graphics, to two systems that rely on graphical overhaul is COMPLETELY fair. Right?

That's what I liked to say about the Virtual Boy.

So an EyeToy game should be rated higher than a regular sports game?
And maybe they were being too harsh on TotemTennis.

Seriously.

Sega Activator 4TW!

Innovation is great - but gameplay is the king.

"The slowdown and collision detection was awful"

"but you waved the controller to cast the spell!"

Lets compare cars. One of them goes faster. One has music inside! Which one do you want?

Sl1pstream

11-18-2006, 05:28 AM

I'm not even going to try to figure out if that was sarcasm or not. After reading those gamefaqs topics, it could be both although I'm guessing it's not.

Jenga

11-18-2006, 05:36 AM

I'm not even going to try to figure out if that was sarcasm or not. After reading those gamefaqs topics, it could be both although I'm guessing it's not.
Your sarcasm meter must be broken.

That's what I liked to say about the Virtual Boy.

So an EyeToy game should be rated higher than a regular sports game?
And maybe they were being too harsh on TotemTennis.

Seriously.

Sega Activator 4TW!

Innovation is great - but gameplay is the king.

"The slowdown and collision detection was awful"

"but you waved the controller to cast the spell!"

Lets compare cars. One of them goes faster. One has music inside! Which one do you want?Maybe...just MAYBE I was trying to say we should compare the graphics to what the hardware is capable of? NO SHIT its not going to give out PS3 or 360 graphics. That's like playing Metal Gear on MSX and bashing it because it uses sprites. It's running on a overclocked Gamecube for fuck's sake.

Sl1pstream

11-18-2006, 05:39 AM

Your sarcasm meter must be broken.

It doesn't react well to fanboy overloads.

Jenga

11-18-2006, 05:43 AM

It doesn't react well to fanboy overloads.Then it must be broken since it detects sarcasm and not fanboy overloads. (EL OH EL INTERNETS=SERIOUS BUSINESS SRSLY)

EternalGamer

11-18-2006, 05:52 AM

I am annoyed that 150 comments and nobody is willing to discuss the philosophy behind the reason he claims to have rated it poorly. Instead people are talking about how "refreshing" it is that he didn't use the same arbitrary numbers and someone else. Or how his numbers should be ignored, or how they vindicate someone's preconception of what the numbers should be. Can we please get past the stupid numbers and talk about the actual content of the review?

The main beef I have is this: should a game be rated poorly just because it isn't different enough in concept? Gerstman seems to be upset because it does the "new dungeon, new item" type thing. But I don't think you should criticize the format of the game unless you can concieve of how it would be better if done differently. This does not mean the game lacks originality. We can almost be assured the puzzles and level design will be brilliant. You will get lots of new play mechanics and clever puzzles. What he is complaining about is the very structure of the way Zelda plays. Is that really a valid complaint?

jonat3

11-18-2006, 05:59 AM

The score took a hit, because of mainly three things:

1. Same old game as previous games
2. the wiimote feels tacked on
3. the sound sucked

What i'm interested in is the GC score. This will give insight in which of the above was taken more heavily to get the 8.8 score.

Jenga

11-18-2006, 06:08 AM

The score took a hit, because of mainly three things:

1. Same old game as previous games
2. the wiimote feels tacked on
3. the sound suckedThe sound sucking is probably the most reasonable complaint. As for number 2...well just let the gif do the talking.

http://content.ytmnd.com/content/2/d/f/2df5657786365fafeaeb8e1d8dd13f20.gif

Did anyone else watch the On the spot feature or whatever? As soon as I saw that I decided I could never take these guys seriously when it comes to Wii reviews.

Heretic Machine

11-18-2006, 06:22 AM

The sound sucking is probably the most reasonable complaint. As for number 2...well just let the gif do the talking.

http://content.ytmnd.com/content/2/d/f/2df5657786365fafeaeb8e1d8dd13f20.gif

Did anyone else watch the On the spot feature or whatever? As soon as I saw that I decided I could never take these guys seriously when it comes to Wii reviews.

...This just in, retarded monkeys are confused by the Wii. That is seriously the stupidest thing I've ever seen.

Jenga

11-18-2006, 06:27 AM

Sad thing is, I honestly wouldn't be surprised if Gerstmann actually tried to play TP with full arm swings.

trip1eX

11-18-2006, 06:29 AM

IT's official. GAmespot recommends PDZ over Zelda:TP.

Yeah I'll get right on that one. :rolleyes:

Borys

11-18-2006, 06:35 AM

Jenga

11-18-2006, 06:38 AM

Did any of you Nintendo fans thought that this is the same guy that reviewed OoT, Majora's Mask, some GBA Zelda game and probably Wind Waker IIRC?

He knows his Zeldas. He gave OoT a perfect 10. Same guy.

He wasn't your enemy then.

Silly N-fans, how feelings change...
He was the guy who gave Majora's Mask a 8.3. Which is sorta funny because MM actually tried to break that formula trend that he so despises in TP.

trip1eX

11-18-2006, 06:40 AM

8.8 on the Zelda scale actually translates to 11 on the normal grading scale. ;)

EvilBob46

11-18-2006, 06:47 AM

I knew this game would dissapoint all along.

Did you think Wind Waker disappointed? A number of reviews for that game were in the 70 range. As for Gerstmann, he might like Zelda, but he has been indifferent to downright hostile to the Wii from the GameSpot videos they've shown. I want a reviewer's opinion on the game...not his opinion on the specifics of the console. For example, he thinks the controls are imprecise when other reviewers have had no issues with them.

Either way, I won't be buying a Wii but I will play TP eventually and make up my own mind. It'll be interesting to see how the Gamecube review will turn out, especially if someone else reviews that version.

menage

11-18-2006, 08:12 AM

The main beef I have is this: should a game be rated poorly just because it isn't different enough in concept? Gerstman seems to be upset because it does the "new dungeon, new item" type thing. But I don't think you should criticize the format of the game unless you can concieve of how it would be better if done differently. This does not mean the game lacks originality. We can almost be assured the puzzles and level design will be brilliant. You will get lots of new play mechanics and clever puzzles. What he is complaining about is the very structure of the way Zelda plays. Is that really a valid complaint?

Maybe. I don''t think Zelda fans want more innovation and difference. They just want more Zelda. I absolutely loved WindWaker for instance because it looked different. And the whole water theme was very nice. But a lot of complaints about that gamne we're based on tinkering with the style and formula.

A new Zelda would be nice, but it;'s not something I would buy a Wii over. The tacked on argument seems pretty valid ro me, mostly because it was a GC game to begin with. Graphics don't make a game but they sure help (look at GoW). Who wouldn't want Zelda to be as pretty as possible. Sound design equally important.

I think there are a lot of stupid responses to this. It's an opinion. Comments like "he's an ass because I know it's gonna rock even if I haven't got a clue about the actual game" seem to prove that fanboys could play Zelda pong and still think it's the best game ever.

KingGorilla

11-18-2006, 08:31 AM

Did any of you Nintendo fans thought that this is the same guy that reviewed OoT, Majora's Mask, some GBA Zelda game and probably Wind Waker IIRC?

He knows his Zeldas. He gave OoT a perfect 10. Same guy.

He wasn't your enemy then.

Silly N-fans, how feelings change...
Their very existence, nay the balance of the universe depends on Jeff giving this game a 9 or higer. It is that important, that vital to the very cosmos.

Mason

11-18-2006, 08:44 AM

I am annoyed that 150 comments and nobody is willing to discuss the philosophy behind the reason he claims to have rated it poorly.
I will!
The main beef I have is this: should a game be rated poorly just because it isn't different enough in concept? Gerstman seems to be upset because it does the "new dungeon, new item" type thing. But I don't think you should criticize the format of the game unless you can concieve of how it would be better if done differently. This does not mean the game lacks originality. We can almost be assured the puzzles and level design will be brilliant. You will get lots of new play mechanics and clever puzzles. What he is complaining about is the very structure of the way Zelda plays. Is that really a valid complaint?
So you can't criticize a game unless you personally can do better? Nonsense, and his basic thesis isn't remotely controversial: every other review has had the conclusion "It's Zelda!!", while Gerstman's take was "It's Zelda." The content really isn't very different, just the inflection.

And let's recall that Nintendo has been sniping at the rest of the gaming industry for a year now for supposedly lacking innovation. They insisted that it was positively criminal that most game companies would only issue graphically-enhanced remakes of older games, rather than completely new experiences. Almost all of the Wii marketing has involved hammering this criticism home, and it's been a wildly successful meme among gamers.

Nintendo doesn't get to have it both ways. They can't try and galvanize gamer communities against their competitors' consoles by waving the banner of Innovation Over Graphics, and then expect to avoid criticism when their biggest launch title is a rigidly formulaic graphical update.

I mean, the whole thing reeks of projection.

SexualChoc

11-18-2006, 09:18 AM

Responses to the Red Steel Review on Gamespot Forums: 34

Responses to the Twilight Princess Review on Gamespot Forums: 944

Jeff, welcome to the world of the fanboys. Reading the review, he did nit pick on some points, and giving the sound a 7? I'm not saying it deserves a perfect, especially having never played it, but come on. Jeff is pretty much the last guy you want to review a Wii title. They should of had Greg do it.

jadkins555

11-18-2006, 09:21 AM

Wow, Nintendo fans are now officially worse than Xbox fans.

I applaud GameSpot for not caving in to the hype and not falling for the old "it's from Nintendo! it's Zelda! it's perfect!" mantra.

You mean like IGN (http://wii.ign.com/articles/746/746691p1.html)?

The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess is, in my opinion, the greatest Zelda game ever created and one of the best launch titles in the history of launch titles – second only, perhaps, to the at-the-time ground-breaking Super Mario 64. It is also one of the finest games I have ever played. The experience is made better and not worse on Wii. The Wii remote and nunchuk add accuracy and speed to exploration and combat for a heightened sense of immersion.

The Zelda franchise is equally exclusive to the machine and Twilight Princess is must-see, must-play and must-own entry into the series that proves over and over again why Nintendo is the best developer in the world.

H.Bogard

11-18-2006, 09:55 AM

The only reason his review stands out is because most of the other sites have given in to the hype surrounding every fucking Zelda game.

Or maybe, you know, they just thought it was a... how do you say... good game?

Chameleo

11-18-2006, 10:04 AM

Or maybe, you know, they just thought it was a... how do you say... good game?

to play devil's advocate, this review did say it was great.....

but the comments in this thread seem to indicate that the reception of this review means that Zelda: TP is a complete waste of time, and not worth the new system.

TheBrainKills

11-18-2006, 11:14 AM

The guy who reviewed this is probably getting tired of playing games right now. I also think that not everone will like the Wii controllers, face it, some people just suck at hand- eye coordination and dexterity skills.
He also gave Excite Truck a low score because it was a chore for him to unlock the harder skilled tracks, go figure.

Grave

11-18-2006, 11:47 AM

I routinely hope that games are bad so that I might limit my ability to play good games to a choice few.

Headcase

11-18-2006, 11:54 AM

He also gave Excite Truck a low score because it was a chore for him to unlock the harder skilled tracks, go figure.

In Gerstmann's defense, he said it was too repetitive, not too hard. I think I see where he's coming from, but since this is Jeff, I won't know until I rent it.

Watership

11-18-2006, 11:55 AM

Your sarcasm meter must be broken.

Maybe...just MAYBE I was trying to say we should compare the graphics to what the hardware is capable of? NO SHIT its not going to give out PS3 or 360 graphics. That's like playing Metal Gear on MSX and bashing it because it uses sprites. It's running on a overclocked Gamecube for fuck's sake.

Then why doesn't Zelda look better than Resident Evil?

Watership

11-18-2006, 11:56 AM

He was the guy who gave Majora's Mask a 8.3. Which is sorta funny because MM actually tried to break that formula trend that he so despises in TP.

Despises? HE GAVE THE GAME AN 8.8 out of 10.

Jenga

11-18-2006, 12:09 PM

Despises? HE GAVE THE GAME AN 8.8 out of 10.
Maybe I should have put dislikes? Oh well.

Watership

11-18-2006, 12:19 PM

Maybe I should have put dislikes? Oh well.

Shrug. All this is really silly when you step back and look at it. Zelda isn't just a game to some, its an emotional connection to what great gaming is about. He called out that the game was pretty much the same game as before without much innovation and frankly has said something about the Zelda series that many journalists are afraid to say. Why? Because the fanbase loses their minds, and with Jeff's review, they did.

I posted on GAF this week asking about Zelda's repetitive elements, and I was HUNG for it. Viciously. They wouldn't even debate, it was just attack attack attack. That sort of response gives gaming a bad name.

KingGorilla

11-18-2006, 12:47 PM

18 pages about a fucking number? People, for the sake of your sanity, go downtown, hire a prostitute you need it, trust me.

Adam Blue

11-18-2006, 01:03 PM

18 pages about a fucking number? People, for the sake of your sanity, go downtown, hire a prostitute you need it, trust me.

18 pages? Man, for the sake of sanity, change the posts per page.

To be on topic, it all started with Wind Waker. That game didn't do it for me and it looks like the same with this....I just wish they didn't gimp the GCN version, or let us use a gamepad on the Wii!

Rirath

11-18-2006, 04:28 PM

And let's recall that Nintendo has been sniping at the rest of the gaming industry for a year now for supposedly lacking innovation. They insisted that it was positively criminal that most game companies would only issue graphically-enhanced remakes of older games, rather than completely new experiences. Almost all of the Wii marketing has involved hammering this criticism home, and it's been a wildly successful meme among gamers.

Wildly successful, amongst Nintendo fans... who, already loved them anyway.

The rest of us are looking forward to the latest versions of Mario / Metroid / Zelda, whether they're little more than graphical updates or not. The new controls possibilities are little more than an added bonus. Like the DS is a graphical update to the GBA SP, but the stylus just provides a bit of extra value. To the Nintendo fan, it's a REVOLUTION NEVER SEEN BEFORE! (Pocket PC's / PDA's?) To everyone else, it's just a neat option.

Nintendo doesn't get to have it both ways. They can't try and galvanize gamer communities against their competitors' consoles by waving the banner of Innovation Over Graphics, and then expect to avoid criticism when their biggest launch title is a rigidly formulaic graphical update.

I mean, the whole thing reeks of projection.

Sure they do, have you SEEN their fan base? They can pretty much do anything they please, including launching the console for much more than implied, having next to no launch lineup, and doing the exact opposite of their mantra for the first 6 months... and still be popular.

Like the DS, I expect the Wii to be a slow starter, supported mainly by the unyielding devotion of their fan base. The rest of us will buy in when it actually has something to offer. TP is still a GAMECUBE title in my eyes, and that's where I'll be playing it... if they haven't already ruined that version. I still say we could have all been playing this ZOMG game last year, if Nintendo didn't INSIST it be a Wii launch title... for which fans also endlessly praised them.

Feltoar

11-18-2006, 06:10 PM

Those idiots looking for 'innovation' should try looking at things in another way. Zelda is a franchise, based around firmilar features. You change it and you dont have a Zelda game anymore. You want innovation, go play a different game! There is nothing inherently wrong with wanting innovation in your favourite franchises, but there are careful steps taken by developers to deliver the game wanted by most and not by one damn person.

My point: If the game doesnt do anything new, make note of that important fact and then score the game on how well it does the old stuff. Once your review is done and you dont like the fact it doesnt do anything new, play a different game which does do something new.

There are other things I would call attention to. Such as the fact Nintendo promised this would be the LAST Zelda like this. Implying Nintendo know exactly whats going on... and other comments from them show the whole point behind TP was to play homeage to OOT and other favourites before making a fully Wii enhanced game. HOW CAN YOU BLAME A GAME FOR DOING EXACTLY WHAT IT SET OUT TO DO?!

These guys prance around like their opinions are the be-all and end-all. That they should be guiding our game time and experience, as opposed to giving us the tools to figure out our own. When I read a review I like to be informed, not told something that I wont agree on when playing the game myself. It makes the review totally useless to me.

Ultima Thulian

11-18-2006, 06:13 PM

I'm a nice guy and have seen my fair share of launches. If you want the best Wii launch titles they're Rayman 4, Zelda, and Trauma Center. You don't need the rest, just rent them and save your cash for Super Smash Bros. Brawl and WarioWare Smooth Moves.

There, I saved ya some money. Thank me later.

Sl1pstream

11-18-2006, 06:13 PM

MaiXu

11-18-2006, 06:48 PM

The more I think of it, the more I think Gerstman's claims of this being the same old Zelda are unnecessarily harsh. As a franchise, Zelda is a known quantity. You don't slag Half-Life off for being first-person to a fault, and you don't slag Pokemon off for being a strategy RPG with those genre's conventions. So remarks about familiarity are not especially well-founded. This Zelda title appears to have both familiar aspects from the past 3D Zeldas (similar temples, characters, etc), but also manages to bring into 3D some older Zelda stuff (dual worlds, massive overworld, etc.) that can be effectively reinvented for 3D, as well as some new things (like the aforementioned "sky" dungeon and other items) that are, simply, brand new.

Really, the innovation in this title is clearly focused on the gameplay, not the game mechanics. For all his complaining about lack of innovation, he just seems to not enjoy the Wiimote, which is clearly this game's focus. Not to reinvent Zelda, but to reinvent the way we play Zelda. In short, to show that classic franchise like Zelda can be played (and hopefully improved) by the Wiimote's functionality.

So in the end, Gerstman simply fails to enjoy this game's innovation (the Wiimote), and in that, I think he also fails to recognize that this game is both immanently playable and unique because of this innovation; he just happens to dislike it. Perhaps he was looking for an evolution of content and not gameplay; perhaps that will come in the next Zelda.

And for my money, Majora's Mask is a fantastic game, and a fantastic Zelda game. That so many people went in expecting Ocarina of Time 2.0 and got a totally new gameplay experience speaks volumes of how great the game was. That so few people appreciated the game's merits speaks volumes of why Nintendo hasn't attempted a proper sequel. I mean, really, I wouldn't mind a "young Link" adventure that more or less refines the concepts found in Majora's Mask. Then we could all have our mature Zeldas and our experimental, quirky Zeldas. Best of both worlds.

Headcase

11-18-2006, 06:52 PM

Rayman 4, Zelda, and Trauma Center. You don't need the rest, just rent them and save your cash for Super Smash Bros. Brawl and WarioWare Smooth Moves.

There, I saved ya some money. Thank me later.

Saved me money? I'm not buying 3 games at launch :P

That's a primo list for the non-penny-pinchers in the crowd though.

Really, the innovation in this title is clearly focused on the gameplay, not the game mechanics. For all his complaining about lack of innovation, he just seems to not enjoy the Wiimote, which is clearly this game's focus. Not to reinvent Zelda, but to reinvent the way we play Zelda. In short, to show that classic franchise like Zelda can be played (and hopefully improved) by the Wiimote's functionality.

I'll have to call you on that one. This game's been in production for, what, 3 years? And the Wii-mote stuff, AFAIK has been in production for less than a year.

That said, complaining about lack of innovation is weak for the reasons you cited. I don't know if they'd criticize Source for being too much like old-school CS, for example.

And what innovations did THPS3 (a 10 from Gerstmann) have? The revert? Ohhh, I can connect my halfpipe tricks into combos, Activision must have been up all night figuring out that basic move that should have been in the series earlier.

Like anyone playing THPS1 couldn't say "hey you know what, how come I can connect my grinds and air tricks with manuals but any halfpipe trick means the end of a combo? That's a pretty stupid design decision that they should fix for THPS2 with some move that lets me connect a half-pipe landing to a manual" :mad:

jonat3

11-18-2006, 06:58 PM

Zelda games aren't pumped out that much. I don't mind if there isn't any innovation, as long as the game is good. Only a few things should be kept in mind when you release titles that don't have any innovation:

1. There should be some space between releases of sequals (preferrably 3-4 years)
2. The game should still have a different "feel" to it, even if not innovative
3. The gameplay should still have SOME improvements, even if these improvements can hardly be called innovative
4. Naturally, the game must be more complete and have equal or more fun than the game before it

If above criteria are followed, i have no problem if a game doesn't innovate that much. But when sequals with hardly no improvement get pumped out every year, i think some criticism is deserved.

NeoSuplex

11-18-2006, 08:14 PM

Then we could all have our mature Zeldas and our experimental, quirky Zeldas. Best of both worlds.
Links... Bastard...

Kagger

11-19-2006, 12:21 AM

Links... Bastard...

He was referring to the Mature themed Zelda game, and quirky Zelda game (Minish Cap, which I played in line today, would qualify there).

They already keep the experimental/odball stuff in their own world. In Minish Cap, there is no Ganon, Master Sword, Death Mountain (Mt.Creol instead).

TrackZero

11-19-2006, 02:42 AM

Oh Gerstmann, is there anything you can't do?

*swoon*

Edit: And I just watched the review, sounds like it was on the ball and "fair and balanced". Though I suppose anyone commenting against the game review sites "authorita!" suddenly becomes newsworthy. I suppose everyone has to tow the party line.

Mason

11-19-2006, 07:39 AM

Wildly successful, amongst Nintendo fans... who, already loved them anyway.

The rest of us are looking forward to the latest versions of Mario / Metroid / Zelda, whether they're little more than graphical updates or not. The new controls possibilities are little more than an added bonus. Like the DS is a graphical update to the GBA SP, but the stylus just provides a bit of extra value. To the Nintendo fan, it's a REVOLUTION NEVER SEEN BEFORE! (Pocket PC's / PDA's?) To everyone else, it's just a neat option.
Nah, I've seen plenty of people who weren't diehard N-fans start singing Nintendo's tune after last E3. Just imagined if the Wii was only hotly anticipated by the people who were perfectly satisified with their GC experience. The hype would've been nonexistent. Plenty of regular non-partisan gamers have been heavily influenced by the Wii innovation pitch, and so it's perfectly reasonable to point out when the marketing and reality suffer a head-on collision.
Sure they do, have you SEEN their fan base? They can pretty much do anything they please, including launching the console for much more than implied, having next to no launch lineup, and doing the exact opposite of their mantra for the first 6 months... and still be popular.

Like the DS, I expect the Wii to be a slow starter, supported mainly by the unyielding devotion of their fan base. The rest of us will buy in when it actually has something to offer. TP is still a GAMECUBE title in my eyes, and that's where I'll be playing it... if they haven't already ruined that version. I still say we could have all been playing this ZOMG game last year, if Nintendo didn't INSIST it be a Wii launch title... for which fans also endlessly praised them.
Again, I don't care about rabid Nintendo fans, they're entirely irrelevant to the point I was making. Nintendo's message, that refusing to innovate gameplay was a death spiral for the game industry from which they alone could escape, is in complete contradiction with how they actually treat their franchises.

Now, only the Nintendo fanboys can twist logic enough that they first applaud Nintendo's anti-graphics pro-innovation stance, but then go crazy if someone suggests that the latest Zelda would've been better had it been more innovative. That takes cognitive dissonance and the aforementioned projection. But that doesn't mean that fanboys are the only ones nodding along to Nintendo's marketing points, as those have been pretty broadly successful.

Tohoya

11-19-2006, 07:44 AM

It's about time someone exposed the mediocrity and lack of creativity that permeates the zelda series.

Ultima Thulian

11-19-2006, 12:57 PM

It's about time someone exposed the mediocrity and lack of creativity that permeates the zelda series.

Yeah, cause nothing screams mediocre more than an 8.8. Dumbass.

KingGorilla

11-19-2006, 01:45 PM

It does on the 7-9 scale that these trolls are used to.

Heretic Machine

11-20-2006, 12:57 AM

I'm not going to go into detail here, but from what I've played of the new Zelda, it is pretty god-damn different. It doesn't seem to suffer from OoT syndrome in the way that WW did. I'm not sure I'd call it highly innovative, but it is a damn good launch title.

Also: It looks find on my CRT HDTV going through composite. I'll get some component cables later, but it looks fine the way it is. Please stop playing games on LCDs outside of their native resolution.

xcalibur

11-20-2006, 10:33 AM

I suggest people play Zela for themselves, and not buy into the review score of one person... albeit it still got a 8.8, which most games would die for. Average review so far is 96%. Let me guess, EVERY other reviewer is brainwashed except for the "enlightened" Gamespot reviewer? I doubt it.

I am about 12 hours into Zelda, and I think it has had plenty of new gameplay experiences so far. In this first 12 hours alone, there has been 3X as many interesting gameplay elements as most games.

Is it perfect? No, there have been a couple minor points of frustration. But it is pretty damn solid, and easily deserving a score in the 90's.

-X

Genkobar

11-21-2006, 07:40 AM

From Gamespot's review philosophy declaration:
[We] take pride in the diversity and collective expertise of our editorial staff. Each individual who writes for GameSpot offers a different perspective and writing style, and we encourage each editor to bring his or her own experiences to bear with each new assignment... ...[However,] GameSpot's reviews all go through a rigorous screening process by our reviews team, so you can rest assured that we collectively stand behind and support the statements made in each new review we publish.

Since this review made it to be published, I trust the other Gamespot reviewers found Gerstmann's review to be well-founded. The review is Gerstmann's opinion after playing the game - just because he wasn't as impressed by it as by other Zelda games, doesn't mean the same will apply to us all.