Nintendo talks Revolution

[Hellstorm]

Looks as if Nintendo is starting to get in the act (http://www.nintendo.com/newsarticle?articleid=9594f668-5342-4b38-8eb1-d6bf479c4139&page=newsmain) as they give more info on the Revolution:

"Thanks to Nintendo's hardware development partners IBM and ATI, the small system will be packed with power that will enable it to wow players with its graphics. Nintendo's legions of loyal fans will be happy to learn that Revolution will be backward compatible, playing both Nintendo GameCube 3-inch disks along with its own standard, double-layered DVD disks in the same self-loading media drive.

In the next generation, the addition of the Internet will be important to all consoles and particularly important to Nintendo. Revolution will be wireless Internet ready out of the box. "

Dual layer DVD, backward compatability, SELF-LOADING media drive, and wireless internet READY from the get go. Nintendo means buisness.

[PotatoNinja]

Teh doomed?
Lots of exciting news on the Nintendo and XBox fronts, where's the info on the PS3? I guess E3 will be where everyone lays their cards on the table.

[Rakael]

Would be a little funny if Sony ends up in 3rd place this gen.

[Thumper]

mmm, Nintendo is sexy.
Can't wait for e3, do we have ANY info on the PS3?

[TheEpicOfTyler]

*dance x's 3 for the sake of character limit*

[bgivnin]

Okay, that snip was nice, but this was what got me:

"In its final form, Revolution will be about the thickness of three standard DVD cases and only slightly longer. The versatile Revolution will play either horizontally or vertically, allowing the user total flexibility in setting up a gaming session wherever they have a television. "

Now THAT is tiny. I like it.

[Talanvor]

Backwards compatible huh? I might pick one of these up, since there are some GC games I'd like but not enough to justify buying the console. Eh, unless they drop it to $50, then I might just go nuts.

[kizke]

Would be a little funny if Sony ends up in 3rd place this gen.

It'd make me very happy. In my opinion Sony is a wretched hive of scum and villainy, and Nintendo's all about the ingenuity of games. I think Microsoft's even got a more genuine approach than Sony in some ways, but...I don't know.

I've been a Nintendo fan all my life, but I love the other consoles too. I just remember all the fun I had on my SNES and gameboy and know that Nintendo can keep it up.

Back to facts, though; I'm glad to see that Nintendo is pushing to draw in the typical American gamer - the kind who wants functionality, power, and multiplayer support like woah.

[Triprotic]

This generation I'd like to see MS on top, Nintendo second, and Sony way last.

On topic... sounds nice. I'm glad I'm going to E3 next week :)

[Varsity]

I'm liking the size. Getting into the living room is a big thing with this generation, and something that small has a whole lot more of a chance!

But perhaps the best thing is that this press release shows that they haven't been completely overwhelmed by the 360.

[Reanimated]

*tree falls in the forest*

[Loganrapp]

The Revolution!

/prince

I'm glad to see Nintendo finally figured out what's up. Here's to hoping they get back into it. The more competition, the better.

[hideouslywrinkled]

*tree falls in the forest*

Umm... I don't think you understand that metaphor.

[Varsity]

I think he means nobody is listening to them.

[bapenguin]

I don't really care who is "on top" as long as Sony falls to the bottom.

[Klade]

Since its backwards compatible its probably pretty safe to say it will not be able to be turned on its side like the PS2 or the Xbox 360.

[Sinistar]

Would be a little funny if Sony ends up in 3rd place this gen.


That's too funny. Coming from me, an Xbox fan who knows too many people who are in the know, it's being said that PS3 will dominate everyone. I'm hearing that our socks are going to be rocked right off come next week.

I don't like to play sides, I simply buy them all.

[PotatoNinja]

I'll probably own all three next gen consoles, but I'm most excited about what Microsoft and Nintendo are offering. Maybe Sony is just keeping quiet, but I have a feeling the PS3 is just going to be the PS2 + better graphics. Sony survives thanks to their fantastic third party support, I much prefer Nintendo and Microsoft's hardware approach.

[sTubbs]

I don't really care who is "on top" as long as Sony falls to the bottom.

Perfectly stated. They have enjoyed their time at the top far too comfortably, so I am glad to see that this time they will probably be last to the show. While I would not be surprised if the PS3 ends up being the most powerful as far as numbers are concerned, I can not help but hear the words 'emotion engine' every time 'CELL processor' is mentioned. So, while the specs of the PS3 may be highest, it is being built on largely experimental, untested technology. Maybe they can pull it off, maybe not. But in any case, I think it would be good for the industry as a whole if they slipped a bit, maybe even to third place. They have been allowed to slip past with shoddy hardware and half assed online support for far too long.

As for Nintendo and MS, I could not care less who comes out on top. I think that comparing the two consoles side by side will be ultimately meaningless, as Nintendo obviously appears to be hell bent on taking their next gen system in a completely different direction. I sincerely hope that they are fully successful in whatever they are planning. I just hope that they are not setting themselves up to be the laughing stock of the industry.

This new information sounds very promising, but I find it hard to believe even though it is coming from an official source. If that is truly the genuine size, how are they not going to run into major overheating problems? I thought the XBOX 360 was too small, even with its water cooling system, but this Nintendo claim is just ridiculous. How do they plan on releasing a technologically comparable system without providing a meat locker to play it in?

[lowlevel]

Since its backwards compatible its probably pretty safe to say it will not be able to be turned on its side like the PS2 or the Xbox 360.

What are you talking about? Did you read the release?

In its final form, Revolution will be about the thickness of three standard DVD cases and only slightly longer. The versatile Revolution will play either horizontally or vertically, allowing the user total flexibility in setting up a gaming session wherever they have a television.

[Dirty Harry]

for being a sony fan boy, i often just shut my mouth and only open it when things are being misrepresented. Its you other fanboys who make us decent human beings with a love of a certain brand look as bad as you.

[gracenote]

That's too funny. Coming from me, an Xbox fan who knows too many people who are in the know, it's being said that PS3 will dominate everyone. I'm hearing that our socks are going to be rocked right off come next week.

I don't like to play sides, I simply buy them all.

I am definitely not in the know, but I just have this feeling that Sony for once taking a low key approach in the hopes of just blowing everybody away. I think Nintendo was taking that approach as well, at least until now. Good to see a good three-company race this generation. Should make for some amazine games!

[Dirty Harry]

All sony needs to do is this, get a console with great graphics, great audio support, and easy to work with online support, hell sony runs many massive mmorpgs as it is. So its not like they dont' know how to make communities and gamespy-esque software. All the current comments about sony and its current hardware are absolute crap. The current xbox is essentially a mini barebones pc, with standard "gamespy-esque" ranking and game lobbys and the such. Its completely unfair for you people to compare the machines because of the design and launch time.

Now the cell vs. emotion engine,

I find that last time sony did PR for its new game engine, i was particularly impressed. When i purchased the system, i noticed that the current graphics were above and beyond what the dreamcast was capable of. Now because its almost 5 years since the launch of the ps2, its hardware is very old in the technology world, this means less companys are attracted to the console as a dev platform because it makes no sense to develope for an old and busted console when you got the xbox with its new hotness. So in the next round of consoles, sony will not have the game dev weakness like it previously had. More acceptance equals more games. Once another companys does something aswell as xbox live, then people will finally start to see the shine fade from the oh so fabled (pun ;)) xbox

So fanboys, just shut the fuck up untill things are clearer.

[Draft]

I'm anxious to see how Nintendo crammed a modern GPU into a case no bigger than 3 DVD boxes.

[01010]

I was never impressed with the PS2, even at launch, I thought the Dreamcast was a far superior machine. Sega never ever really got to grips with marketing, that's what killed them. That's not to say the PS2 didn't have any good games, I just thought the hardware itself was poor. Still bought one eventually when San Andeas came out, I cracked. :)

I think it's unfair to call the X-Box little more than a barebones PC though, there is a bit more to it than that. Truth be told, I enjoy playing on xbox live far more than playing online on my PC (though I'm really enjoying Guild Wars at the moment) because I find it more fun. Universal microphones, good messaging and friend list, simple to use (not really a problem for me but easier for, say a casual gamer) and the most important thing for me, it means my friends can afford it when they can't afford a home PC, so I can use it to play my friends IRL. Which is a good thing for me.

I'm interested in what Sony and Nintendo have to offer though. I hope Nintendo come up with something interesting but I wish Sega were still in the game too.

[Balthasar]

I don't really care who is "on top" as long as Sony falls to the bottom.

Why would you root for a company's console to do poorly? As a true gamer, wouldn't you just want "the best console" or "the best games?" Or are you holding onto this notion that X company is more "evil" than Y?

[Furious Wang]

Well, considering many people's (myself included) PS2 purchase turned out to be $300 down the drain thanks to Disk Read Errors we have a pretty good reason not to trust Sony this time out and even root for them to fail miserably. I'm a "true gamer", but any company that basically steals from me by selling me a poorly made product that doesn't work one year after purchase won't get my business in the future. Whether its the best or not.

[Steve_Erhardt]

Wow... all cool news. I can dig this.

[Dirty Harry]

Well, considering many people's (myself included) PS2 purchase turned out to be $300 down the drain thanks to Disk Read Errors we have a pretty good reason not to trust Sony this time out and even root for them to fail miserably. I'm a "true gamer", but any company that basically steals from me by selling me a poorly made product that doesn't work one year after purchase won't get my business in the future. Whether its the best or not.
Well, I'm a victim of what you claim (disc read errors and whatnot), but its never been a problem for me. When i purchased the ps2, it was almost 600 dollars for me, then another 50 dollar memory card and then a 85 dollar ps2 game. Yeah, even still, i've had a large amount of good times with the ps2. I can understand how you can feel betrayed because your ps2 is dying.


About the hardware: yes, they did decide to use cheaper quality hardware which was a bad move on their part. I think people complain way to much over trivial things. If you think the PS2 has only had a few good games, obviously you havent played many games. There are over a 100 ps2 games that i consider classics just like i consider (i.e. castlevania:sotn) for each console. You also have to consider that hardware doesnt last forever, my first generation ps2 still runs, wont touch the dvds but hey that isnt to big of a problem when you own 4 dvd players.

[CrysDark]

Well, considering many people's (myself included) PS2 purchase turned out to be $300 down the drain thanks to Disk Read Errors we have a pretty good reason not to trust Sony this time out and even root for them to fail miserably. I'm a "true gamer", but any company that basically steals from me by selling me a poorly made product that doesn't work one year after purchase won't get my business in the future. Whether its the best or not.

There were ways of getting your maching replaced, and even if you didn't want to deal with tech support, there was always Wal-Mart.

Yes, the hardware had some failings at the begining, but the corrected that mistake, and are now the raining champ of the industry.

As for my take on this "news" I will always be where Square-Enix is, what ever platform they choose is what I will buy. In the end it's all about how much fun the games are.

Although if *** would turn that Detachable harddrive into an mp3 player I would so be sold on it.

[if76]

It'd make me very happy. In my opinion Sony is a wretched hive of scum and villainy, and Nintendo's all about the ingenuity of games.

You might want to check out Nintendo's history before you make statements like these. During the cartridge era they were involved in some of the most unethical practices this side of Enron. Basically they ruled all third parties with an iron fist and punished stores that carried their competitor's products. It can be argued that they held gaming back as much as they advanced it.

[Kelegacy]

Why would you root for a company's console to do poorly? As a true gamer, wouldn't you just want "the best console" or "the best games?" Or are you holding onto this notion that X company is more "evil" than Y?

I too wonder this. Have none of you fanboys enjoyed the PS2 and the games it has given us? Fuck, I've enjoyed it's inferior hardware 10 times more than my Xbox! I'm going where the games are...and this round it was the PS2. Next round, I am not sure yet.

But anyone who would like to see a company that produces a great console that spits out a handful of great games every month or so sink to the bottom needs to be fuckin' smacked. Hard.

[Syrinx]

About the hardware: yes, they did decide to use cheaper quality hardware which was a bad move on their part. I think people complain way to much over trivial things.

Having your console fail to read discs is hardly a trivial thing.

[ghost]

Since its backwards compatible its probably pretty safe to say it will not be able to be turned on its side like the PS2 or the Xbox 360.

How does that make sense? The ability to turn on its side has no effect on backwards compatibility at all. Example - PS2 and PS1, perhaps?

On topic, this makes me happy. In truth, I've always been an Nintendo fanboy, and finally getting some real info on Revolution, whether it's detailed or not, makes me happy. Between this and the 360, the next generation could be pretty.... I still want to see some info on PS3, though. Here comes E3...

[ezzkmo]

what exactly is a self-loading media drive? a tray like the ps2/xbox have? or a slit that sucks in the disc (like most car cd players?)

[*Legion*]

Sony may not end up in third, but one thing is absolutely certain:

NO console will be as "dominant" as the PS2 was this generation. No one is going to build up a massive installed base before everyone else comes along. It's just not going to happen.

It's not hard to imagine something approaching an even split for the three. Microsoft's market is going up, no question. Nintendo could make up a lot of ground if they learn to stop releasing interesting hardware with no software. Revolution needs games, and not just Nintendo games. Sony has built a big audience from two major console successes, and will not be forgotten easily.

It's going to be much more of a slugfest than this past generation.

[ldi222]

I dont really care for Sony because Im a former self admitted PC Gaming elitist who turned xbox fanboy. Its the western developers that did it for me, games like HALO and Morrowind are why I have an affinity for that little green globe. I just thought games for the PS2 were loaded with bad camera third person button mash fests. There are a few good ones I probably missed like Ico and God of War and I might just get both next time around although I have too many games as it is and the only one I play is HALO2.

[mister_slim]

I'll probably own all three next gen consoles, but I'm most excited about what Microsoft and Nintendo are offering. Maybe Sony is just keeping quiet, but I have a feeling the PS3 is just going to be the PS2 + better graphics. Sony survives thanks to their fantastic third party support, I much prefer Nintendo and Microsoft's hardware approach.
I was unhappy with MS's hardware approach with the Xbox. Hopefully the 360 will be better. The Xbox was poorly engineered. Considering the loss MS takes per console, the large size and minimal performance edge is not acceptable. Throwing money at the console may help us as gamers now, but it isn't good for us later. If Nintendo goes down, it should be because they fucked up, not because MS threw more money around. Yeah, I'm idealistic, but the Xbox was successful because of software (Halo, Kotor), not hardware.

Well, considering many people's (myself included) PS2 purchase turned out to be $300 down the drain thanks to Disk Read Errors we have a pretty good reason not to trust Sony this time out and even root for them to fail miserably. I'm a "true gamer", but any company that basically steals from me by selling me a poorly made product that doesn't work one year after purchase won't get my business in the future. Whether its the best or not.
Well, my Xbox has DRE's and my PS2 doesn't. And my PS2 isn't a fire hazard. Try not to oversimplify.

[Okamura_Takashi]

If you are wondering how Nintendo can fit a GPU, high-performance system with a self-loading DVD drive into something the size of about 3 DVD cases, I give you example A: http://www.apple.com/macmini.

[mkelehan]

Apple makes the G4 Cube, Nintendo makes the Gamecube. Apple makes the Mac Mini, Nintendo makes the Revolution. I'm no Mac fan, but if you're going to get your inspiration from someone's hardware design, that's certainly not the worst place.

[Draft]

If you are wondering how Nintendo can fit a GPU, high-performance system with a self-loading DVD drive into something the size of about 3 DVD cases, I give you example A: http://www.apple.com/macmini.
If I'm not mistaken, the Mac Mini has no GPU, it has integrated video. It also has a relatively slow processor.

[bapenguin]

Why would you root for a company's console to do poorly? As a true gamer, wouldn't you just want "the best console" or "the best games?" Or are you holding onto this notion that X company is more "evil" than Y?

It's not that I want them to fail, I just want them at the bottom of the pack. This generation, while they were the most popular, I feel their hardware quality (and a lot of software quality) was the most mediocre out there. It's time for Nintendo or Microsoft to shine, I feel both these companies bring something unique to the table, Sony IMO offers nothing above and beyond. They merely deliver what they have to....because they are on top.

[mister_slim]

If I'm not mistaken, the Mac Mini has no GPU, it has integrated video. It also has a relatively slow processor.
It's got an ATI Radeon 9200. Only 32 megs of ram. But it also has a harddrive, airport card, and a lot of other stuff taking up space. And Nintendo has some very good engineers.

[kokyunage]

(and a lot of software quality)

How can you argue that the PS2 didn't have the best software this generation? I'm a fan of the Xbox but it seems like Sony has AAA titles coming out every month. I love my Xbox, especially after I got it mod'ed to become a media center but I won't ever argue that the software is better or more plentiful than the PS2. Nintendo on the other hand...

[dead_parrot]

Sony IMO offers nothing above and beyond. They merely deliver what they have to....because they are on top.

I agree. It's not good for any company to have as much of an edge as Sony did this gen. Good competition will make it necessary for all three big players to push themselves to the limit. I want Sony to struggle, not because I want to see them fall, but because I think that they need a little pressure and incentive to be constantly raising the bar. That goes for Microsoft and Nintendo, too, of course, but they weren't on top this gen.

[*Legion*]

How can you argue that the PS2 didn't have the best software this generation? I'm a fan of the Xbox but it seems like Sony has AAA titles coming out every month.

If you're not a fan of Japanese RPGs, the PS2 lineup becomes much less "dominant".

Not to mention that games like MGS and GTA made the move to Xbox too.

And there are certain games on all consoles that are far and away "best" on Xbox (though certainly not EVERY multiplatform game - some games benefit more than others).

[TrackZero]

It's got an ATI Radeon 9200. Only 32 megs of ram. But it also has a harddrive, airport card, and a lot of other stuff taking up space. And Nintendo has some very good engineers.

Let's not forget this is a game console, not a computer as well. It's hardware is made for one thing, gaming. It's designed for that in mind, they can cut corners that PCs can't for compatibility reasons.

[mister_slim]

Let's not forget this is a game console, not a computer as well. It's hardware is made for one thing, gaming. It's designed for that in mind, they can cut corners that PCs can't for compatibility reasons.
I wonder if Nintendo will again be able to produce a console approximately as powerful but 1/4th the size and 2/3rds the price of the Microsoft competitor?

[Opty]

Hey everybody, head back to Nintendo's site, they changed what was quoted in the EA article:Nintendo's legions of loyal fans will be happy to learn that Revolution will be backward compatible, playing both Nintendo GameCube 8cm disks along with its own 12cm optical disks in the same self-loading media drive. (emphasis mine)

[51|RandoM]

Funny to watch people bash Sony. What is it that makes people not like the concern in 1st place? They automatically lay the blame for everything on that doorstep. Is rather entertaining.

Let me ask you this, if Sony, and by extension the playstation, playstation 2, and eventually playstation 3 didn't exist, do you really think you'd be seeing consoles with as much power as xbox360 on the horizon?

Me, I don't care who is in 1st, 2nd, or 3rd, I don't care how uber this piece of hardware is or that piece of hardware is, all I care about is the games. Produce a great game and I'll buy the platform to play it on.

[Pumped'Up]

If all of this is true about rev, i will finally own another Nintendo product since the SNES. But the truth about the ranking of next gen consoles, the 360 is gauranteed to fall in last place.

1. PS3
2. Rev
3. 360

that will be the official ranking.

[mister_slim]

If all of this is true about rev, i will finally own another Nintendo product since the SNES. But the truth about the ranking of next gen consoles, the 360 is gauranteed to fall in last place.

1. PS3
2. Rev
3. 360

that will be the official ranking.
I think you should rank the current gen. You'd be guaranteed to be wrong, and I'd enjoy watching a lynching.

[Balthasar]

It's not that I want them to fail, I just want them at the bottom of the pack. This generation, while they were the most popular, I feel their hardware quality (and a lot of software quality) was the most mediocre out there. It's time for Nintendo or Microsoft to shine, I feel both these companies bring something unique to the table, Sony IMO offers nothing above and beyond. They merely deliver what they have to....because they are on top.

I think it is two entirely different things to say "I would like to see Microsoft and Nintendo give Sony significant competition to put Sony's feet to the fire," as opposed to "I would like to see Sony not perform well this time around." I don't see how rooting for Sony to put out a mediocre product is in anyone but Microsoft and Nintendo's best interests.

And, this is not a response specifically to you, Bapenguin, but one or two others on this thread have claimed that they root against Sony because they feel as though they have been bamboozled for buying a flawed product. That probably makes even less sense. You bought a bad product from a company, so you're hoping they put out an even worse product? What?

[Balthasar]

I agree. It's not good for any company to have as much of an edge as Sony did this gen. Good competition will make it necessary for all three big players to push themselves to the limit. I want Sony to struggle, not because I want to see them fall, but because I think that they need a little pressure and incentive to be constantly raising the bar. That goes for Microsoft and Nintendo, too, of course, but they weren't on top this gen.

When did Microsoft become this great underdog? I know they're relatively new in the console gaming arena, but this is "we dominate the OS market and do everything in our power to keep alternatives off the market" Microsoft. Who the fuck has a bigger edge than Microsoft? There's a big reason why they can just release a console with as big a loss as they do without (visibly) sweating about it. They bleed money. Your money, I might add (for the PC users out there).

[KDups]

I want Sony to struggle, not because I want to see them fall, but because I think that they need a little pressure and incentive to be constantly raising the bar.

What the hell....what does this mean? They just released God of War, one of the best games on the system. They're pushing hardware everyone knows is showing its age to new heights. And they're publishing sequels to weak performing yet unique games like Mark of Kri and Ico. Overall their 1st party stuff (except for 989, though they're getting better) has gotten significantly better over the years, not worse.

It's classic human behavior - build them up, tear them down. It's just sad when you call for the demise of a company that did as much for pushing gaming forward as Atari and Nintendo. And that's saying a lot.

[01010]

And, this is not a response specifically to you, Bapenguin, but one or two others on this thread have claimed that they root against Sony because they feel as though they have been bamboozled for buying a flawed product. That probably makes even less sense. You bought a bad product from a company, so you're hoping they put out an even worse product? What?

It's more a case that Sony continue to put out shoddy hardware (not just the PS2, almost every Sony product I've ever had has failed well inside the warranty) and people do not want to see a company that continues to do this fare so well, as it gives them no incentive to get their ass in gear and sort their tech out.

[jeffool]

When i purchased the system, i noticed that the current graphics were above and beyond what the dreamcast was capable of.

Dude, don't you remember "Bleemcast!"? Y'know, the way to play PS2 games on your Dreamcast with better graphics? Shame Bleemcast went out of business. Did they ever sell any of the planned volumes?


But I'm one of those people who think that XBox had a higher signal to noise ratio this generation, and lots of games. Nintendo did damn fine in their own right. I'm not going to jump on the anti-PS2 bit, though. I own an XBox and PS2, but not GC. Rewind time back years. PS2 is the VHS, and XBox is the DVD. DVDs were less prevalent, but the ones released were usually of high quality movies and high quality production. But you found a huge amount of movies on VHS that weren't out on DVD. GameCube is, I don't know, laserdisc? No... Damn, I ruined my own analogy.

Does that first part make any sense though?

[BigJonno]

I'm not bothered who ends up in what rank or any of that crap but I want to see success go to the deserving. Sony ended up in the top spot this time because of brand-name recognition, widespread cynicism towards Microsoft and a few key exclusives. I was working in retail at the time and whether the messy launch was down to stupidity or intentional mis-management I don't know. I worked for a large chain that got one of the largest PS2 allocations in the world due to their strong PS1 sales. Even when it had been declared by the gaming press that there were no PS2's left in Europe, we couldn't give our pre-orders away. We had to keep taking them a week after deadline to use them all. I found the hardware itself to be irritating in so many minor ways, with that stupid reset/power button and the cynically money-driven decision to only have two controller ports being my main greivances. The countless hours I spent dealing with the fallout of their terrible cutomer service only increased my anger at Sony. May I also point out the generally forgotten fact that the PS2 had an abominable launch line-up whose highlight's were a couple of barely-improved rehashes of games that everyone who cared already had at least one version of already. The first game that actually got people flocking to buy the thing was Gran Turisimo 3 and that was several months after the launch.

Microsoft, on the other hand, approached the whole thing with surprising humility. The Xbox was full of clever little touches like the long controller leads with the quick-release section. The inclusion of a hard drive was genius (of the 'really quite obvious when you think about it' kind,) and Live has been a joy. As both a customer and a retail professional I've found them easy to deal with. They've been quick to admit and rectify whatever mistakes they've made, even down to heavily compensating those who bought the Xbox for 300 quid after they dropped the price.

I'm not saying that MS are perfect, or the good guys, or that everyone should rush out and buy an X360. I'm not saying that they aren't simply in it for the money. Being in it for the money is pretty much the definition of any large company, I don't have a problem with that. I just like seeing companies making money by providing a great product. I'm hoping that Sony aren't so complacent this time round and produce a great machine. I'm now earning enough money to purchase all the consoles I want and being the complete gaming slut that I am, that means all of them. I just don't want to have to grudgingly buy one I don't like because of a few key titles. I want to love each and every console under my TV and not think 'damn you, Devil May Cry, damn you' whenever I see a PS3.

[Visitor Q]

Man, bleemcast was meant to play PS1 games!
I have to say, I was really pissed when PS2 sank the dreamcast so swiftly, especially with such CRAP launch titles (I mean, come on, The Dreamcast launched with f-ing Soul Calibur). But in the end PS2 had a lock on the software this generation. Halo be damned.
Also, the XBOX360 launch was totally snorefest.

[Visitor Q]

and by launch I mean unveiling

[Achilles]

The size means its chips will produce very little heat. Little heat means that they most likely will only have one core and one thread which will make them pretty weak in comparison to the PS3 and the X360. Not a problem as long as they make games people want to play though, but it’s why I’m not digging on the tiny size much.

The rest of the stuff sounds good, I’m glad they’re taking such an interest in on-line.

Considering the loss MS takes per console, the large size and minimal performance edge is not acceptable.First of all I can’t argue that it was poorly engineered, but it certainly doesn’t have a minimal performance edge. Take Halo 2 and see how well it can be ported to a Cube or PS2 and what needs to be cut out. I guess if you're not used to looking at the technical side of things it might not seem like a lot, but it really is.

Throwing money at the console may help us as gamers now, but it isn't good for us later. How about this: you can pay the extra cost to a company that tries to maximize its profits and leave me my system that’s trying to provide me as much as they can for my money. Your company will stay in business because of your generous donations and mine will stay in business because more people like getting more for their money and we'll both be happy.

[Fonz]

Why are you surprised at dual layer dvd and wireless connectivity? this should be standard, dont act surprised and impressed. Dual layer dvds are nothing special either. PS2 and XBOX use dual layer dvds. Way to cater your bias.

[Furious Wang]

Funny to watch people bash Sony. What is it that makes people not like the concern in 1st place? They automatically lay the blame for everything on that doorstep. Is rather entertaining.

We live in a market society and we love competition. Competition forces the people in first place to innovate and improve quality so their competitors don't take their market share.

Let me ask you this, if Sony, and by extension the playstation, playstation 2, and eventually playstation 3 didn't exist, do you really think you'd be seeing consoles with as much power as xbox360 on the horizon?

Actually, you have it backwards. If the Xbox and Revolution didn't exist, the playstation3 wouldn't have as much power as it does and it certainly wouldn't be coming out this soon. Learn a bit about economix before making statements like that.

[Furious Wang]

Funny how some of these Sony fanbois try to justify Sony's selling a defective product. I have a first run NES, SNES, Sega Genesis & Gameboy that all still work in perfect condition.

Sony was coming out of PS1 era with a huge lead in market share and put out a cheaply made product in the PS2. They didn't fix the problem until their competitors started to release their systems. Can you really trust Sony not to do the same thing with the PS3? A system that, by all accounts, is beyond bleeding edge untested technology?

[Kelegacy]

Funny how some of these Sony fanbois try to justify Sony's selling a defective product. I have a first run NES, SNES, Sega Genesis & Gameboy that all still work in perfect condition.

Sony was coming out of PS1 era with a huge lead in market share and put out a cheaply made product in the PS2. They didn't fix the problem until their competitors started to release their systems. Can you really trust Sony not to do the same thing with the PS3? A system that, by all accounts, is beyond bleeding edge untested technology?

Okay, so go buy a PS2 now and see if you are disappointed. They fixed the problem for free for any PS2's that had DRE problems. At least they didnt burn anyone's house down or hurt people. Jesus, the DRE arguement is valid but not at this point in time. The defective equipment was fixed AFAIK and now the only thing Sony has "wrong" with their system is that it's specs dont satiate Xbox fanatics.

I think we should start a couple Evil Avatar guilds, one titled GAMERS and the other labeled Fanboys/Haters. I bet a huge majority in this thread would fall into the second group.

[MosBen]

Sorry if this was mentioned earlier, but I don't understand the facination with teeny tiney consoles. Sure, the Xbox is on the big side, but how much does it really matter? Does it effect my game playing any? Not that I can tell. It's even more rediculous in this case. Ok, so the Revolution is smaller than the 360. Who cares? The 360 is smaller than the original PS2, is the difference really going to be a factor in someone's decision between consoles?

[Dirty Harry]

Learn a bit about economix before making statements like that.
This coming from a person who spells Economic with an X. I think your viewpoint is flawed.

[Nimos]

We are missing the big picture : 3 huge multinational companies are preparing to fight (economically) to the death... for us. Prices will drop, exclusive deals will be made, blinding launch titles for each consoles... and all to satisfy us, the gamers ! I say let the bloodshed begin ! Excuse me while I go sit on my couch, and start watching the carnage breaking loose.

[Chill]

Is the revolution going to have a multi-core CPU? Cause if it doesn't it might give them an edge for a lot of devs. From what I hear programming in parallel is really difficult, and requires more time planning. This is the most worrying thing about the next gen consoles. Console games might become so time consuming to develop that it could raise prices or lower their overall quality.

[evlg]

I too wonder this. Have none of you fanboys enjoyed the PS2 and the games it has given us?

Hard to enjoy PS2 games when they look like crap compared to the other consoles - terrible graphics ahoy!

[Balthasar]

It's more a case that Sony continue to put out shoddy hardware (not just the PS2, almost every Sony product I've ever had has failed well inside the warranty) and people do not want to see a company that continues to do this fare so well, as it gives them no incentive to get their ass in gear and sort their tech out.

Why should you be concerned about how much their consoles sell if they are put together poorly? If gamers don't think the system will work within a year, then they will not buy it. I swear, you guys treat these companies like sports teams.

[Balthasar]

Actually, you have it backwards. If the Xbox and Revolution didn't exist, the playstation3 wouldn't have as much power as it does and it certainly wouldn't be coming out this soon. Learn a bit about economix before making statements like that.

No, you definately have it backwards. Both companies publiclly stated that their approach to their next gen consoles would depend largely on Sony's strategy, especially as it concerns release date. Microsoft's next offering was propelled to a large extent by the effect the PS2 had on the market, from its marketing and eventual release to its dominance in the home console market. Hell, that system (along with the PS1) was almost single-handedly responsible for Sega dropping out of console development. Perhaps you need to review your "economix" a bit.

[mister_slim]

First of all I can’t argue that it was poorly engineered, but it certainly doesn’t have a minimal performance edge. Take Halo 2 and see how well it can be ported to a Cube or PS2 and what needs to be cut out. I guess if you're not used to looking at the technical side of things it might not seem like a lot, but it really is.
But the same can be said about Gran Turismo 4, God Of War, Metroid Prime 2, or Resident Evil 4. Any console exclusive is going to be optimized for the hardware. Considering the Xbox has a hard drive, why do so many games, especially Xbox exclusives from experienced PC developers, have smaller areas and long load times?
How about this: you can pay the extra cost to a company that tries to maximize its profits and leave me my system that’s trying to provide me as much as they can for my money. Your company will stay in business because of your generous donations and mine will stay in business because more people like getting more for their money and we'll both be happy.
They aren't giving you more for the money. Microsoft is just expecting to get into the same position Sony is now and Nintendo was after the SNES, where they can let the hardware stagnate and reap the third-party software profits. And because they fucked up the Xbox hardware, they are pushing to the next gen (MGS games still to come: Conker) and abandoning a still viable platform. I want MS to approach video games as a business and not just their entry to the living room and another platform to conquer. And keep in mind that MS is not where they are because they give you 'more for your money'.

Anyway, TANSTAAFL.

[bobbler]

Hard to enjoy PS2 games when they look like crap compared to the other consoles - terrible graphics ahoy!

And this is why the game industry is doomed to hell... People can't see the fun past the graphics.

The same view could be said about Xbox/GC vs PC.

If I want graphics, I head to the PC. (maybe not directly after the console comes out, since they are pretty comparable to PC for about the first year after release).

[Achilles]

I’ve got no idea what TANSTAAFAL means (sounds like something the machine gun guys in Wolf3d might say) but I’ll address your questions:

Considering the Xbox has a hard drive, why do so many games, especially Xbox exclusives from experienced PC developers, have smaller areas and long load times? Because PC developers are used to writing for a powerful CPU instead of taking full advantage of the GPU. When they come to the Xbox they do the same thing and the result is horrible performance. And if you want to compare the performance of games optimized for each platform, go ahead and compare Metroid Prime 2 to Halo 2 in terms of graphics, scale and AI.

And keep in mind that MS is not where they are because they give you 'more for your money'. I’m sorry, you can’t convince me that having a powerful system with a bunch of cool games and Sony not having an 85% market share is a bad thing. MS is even making a profit off their system now if that's so important to you.

[mister_slim]

There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch.
MS is even making a profit off their system now if that's so important to you.
Do you have a source for that?

I don't have a problem with MS competing with Sony and Nintendo. I just want the playing field to be fairly level. If MS continues to make a good game machine, cool. If they buy the majority of the market, I don't trust them to be focused on the gaming business over the set-top box business.

[Achilles]

Do you have a source for that?Would it be alright to use the source that you presented a few days ago in the Profit thread? source (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/01/27/microsoft_fy2005q2_earnings/), thread (http://www.evilavatar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1776).
Microsoft said that its home division - which includes Xbox - turned a profit for the first time, as did MSN. Home and Entertainment turned a $397m loss into a $84m profit in the past quarter, on revenues of $1.46bn, $140m higher than last year.

[Blue]

Funny how some of these Sony fanbois try to justify Sony's selling a defective product. I have a first run NES, SNES, Sega Genesis & Gameboy that all still work in perfect condition.


Interesting....My SNES and Genesis crapped out on me ages ago and I have a launch PS2 (and PS1 for that matter) that has yet to give me any problems. The only DRE I ever came across was when I rented something from Blockbuster but after swapping it out for a different version of the same title, everything was smooth sailing. Some people have problems with their chosen console and that means everyone has the exact same difficulty. Strange.


Hard to enjoy PS2 games when they look like crap compared to the other consoles - terrible graphics ahoy!

Funny how the original Super Mario Bros., Metroid, Castlevania, Mega Man, etc have crap graphics by today's standards but I would take those over Doom 3 any day. The idea that graphics make a game better is garbage.
Would I rather have a good game bundled with good graphics? Absolutely. But I cannot see how anyone can argue that they would rather have a pretty looking game with zero game-play to it. How does that even make sense? I realize this is my opinion, but I play my PS2 well more than I do my Box and Cube combined because their games (again, to me) are far superior. The gameplay is simply better and no amount of graphics pushed out from MS can make it automatically top-dog.

[mister_slim]

Would it be alright to use the source that you presented a few days ago in the Profit thread? source (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/01/27/microsoft_fy2005q2_earnings/), thread (http://www.evilavatar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1776).
That's not a good source. It takes the Home division of Microsoft, with no way of isolating the profitability of the Xbox hardware. Here is the best I've found:
The losses, according to the company, result from the Xbox console's continued 'negative gross margins', meaning, in effect, that the more consoles Microsoft sell, the more the company reduces its profits. Gamasutra (http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=5397) Basically, Halo 2 brought in a bunch of money all at once, making the division look better.