Understanding Xbox Live Anywhere

[bean19]

At this year's E3, Microsoft's biggest surprise was arguably their upcoming Xbox Live Anywhere service that will allow users to connect and interact through Xbox Live using their 360, cell phones, or even their PCs.

Microsoft employee, Ozymandias (http://ozymandias.com/default.aspx), gives insight on how this integration might actually be used by gamers in his most recent blog entry (http://ozymandias.com/archive/2006/07/25/Live-Anywhere-and-Everywhere-_2800_Even-There_3F002900_.aspx). He reiterates and explains features like transporting game saves, Xbox Live Arcade games, and acheivments between various devices and the benefits of being able to communicate with your friends who are using these different devices, but what I found to be the most gamer-friendly features were also the ones that I did not hear discussed at this year's E3 press conference:

Think about the challenges you often face when trying to get a PC game online session going. First you need to make sure your game is up to date, and often have to hunt down patches and apply them. Sometimes you need to upgrade video or sound drivers. Your router can block connections, forcing you to open ports and occasionally sacrifice a chicken (be really afraid if you want to try and host a game!) Once you’re in the game, you might want to communicate with other players – but everyone’s using a different voice solution. It’s hard to find people of the appropriate level to play against, and even when you find people on a server you don’t have any context to see what sort of player they are, or what sort of reputation they have. The list goes on and on, but the point I’m trying to make is it’s not as simple as the “tray and play” model Xbox Live has been able to enable. Live Anywhere aims to solve all of the above, and enable cross-platform gaming and communication to boot. All this across what could be the largest online gaming community in the world. Pretty amazing, no?
Having a common voice solution for online gaming would be really helpful. The other features are neat, but not as impactful, and I think we all know that they are designed to get Microsoft's customers to actively discuss Microsoft's products (ingenious). So what do you guys think? Are the Live Anywhere features mere novelties or a connectivity revolution?

[Lord Nerdious]

Great idea, damn near impossible to implement.

[Mr_Snuffle]

If it was combined with an xbox subscription... maybe

I also don't like this trend of 'peer hosting' that the service seems to mainly use

[CannibalKid]

This is a mixed blessing. I'm often bothered by the lack of communication systems, or the substandard quality of communication systems that are shipped with games that require a community to actually play the content as it's intended to be played. MMOs are a huge culprit with even the most popular ones either have poorly impemented solutions, or require 3rd party ones (spamming global channels with player info and desired playes to group, or necessary use of 3rd party VOIP tools). FPS are only recently catching up, but for a long time they required external tools to monitor and rank players, or used mod tools to build server management tools.

While live everywhere might be handling some of this, it still won't be specific enough to actually blend it into the game and meet the specific context of the data that would be helpful to see presented to players. To me, it just seems like it's bringing Microsoft's XBL! features to PC games, which are little more than a glorified X-Fire client.

But before i go speculating too much, what exactally do developers have control over, especially game developers? XFire-like game detection? Ingame access to messages/data? From the sound of the article they're just adding the exterior layer of communication, which while it worked well for XBL, is really only an assimilation of a dozen or so programs that are already in existance on the PC, and MS wants to package them in their OS like they did with browsers.

[Yeti2005]

The fact that even when I'm not playing games (ie watching a movie or playing some music on the 360) I'm still aware if my friends come online is amazing. Now imagine that same "connectiveness" tied into PC games and maybe even phones.

[aversion2k]

Its not that hard to play pc games online.
I guess a unified voice system would be handy, although I dont use voice systems that much anyway, ....because people are tards.

[Nameback]

Well just think about it, their pushing side by side 360 and PC development so it only makes sense. Since the developer is already making the game for both and is making it work with XBL, the code would work just as well on the PC because theres XBL in Vista as well.

[digitalErich]

I think this sounds cool and all, but I just have to say that is a fantastic Straw Man you have in quotes there.

It makes me think of those commercials that try to sell electric can openers by showing a labotamized lab monkey trying to use a traditional opener with Crisco on its hands.

Again, I like the idea of Live Anywhere - sounds super, but don't insult my intelligence when you're trying to sell it to me.

[mightbe]

I know I can't wait to give it a shot. It would be quite cool if we could have a calender function integrated as well that would allow a group of gamers like us to coordinate our game nights.

[*Legion*]

Live Everywhere may resemble Xfire, but Live stuff (presumably, as it is on the Xbox) is integrated into the games, while Xfire is an external client. I'd love to be able to see my friends stuff from inside the game, as Alt-Tabbing out of a fullscreen 3D accelerated game is... unwieldy, at best.

So, if Live is getting integrated into PC games the way it is on the Xbox console games, then there's a major improvement right there.

[oneway23]

If implemented correctly, it has the potential to be more sustainable than a mere
novelty...Realistically, it appears from the outside to be a logistical nightmare...What do I know?

[Nameback]

If implemented correctly, it has the potential to be more sustainable than a mere
novelty...Realistically, it appears from the outside to be a logistical nightmare...What do I know?

Well it is already implemented on the 360, and from what I understand their similar as far as programming goes so I don't see their being a big issue.

[markster3000]

Wait...

Is it "Everywhere", or "Anywhere"?

???? (http://news.com.com/1606-2_3-6070559.html)

[CannibalKid]

Live Everywhere may resemble Xfire, but Live stuff (presumably, as it is on the Xbox) is integrated into the games, while Xfire is an external client. I'd love to be able to see my friends stuff from inside the game, as Alt-Tabbing out of a fullscreen 3D accelerated game is... unwieldy, at best.

So, if Live is getting integrated into PC games the way it is on the Xbox console games, then there's a major improvement right there.

Wrong. XFire can display chat in the game, and has a specific keybinding to enable responses in game. All Live Everywhere will provide is the implementation to the features of Live Everywhere, with which they might be able to shape their game's features to work more intuitively with Live Everywhere's features, but so far, that's what? MSN, VOIP, Achievements? Those are handy, sure, but are they really clever solutions, or a strategy that just combines the actions that people had to previously use to get around crappy communication that previously existed.

[trip1eX]

Just another tool to tie you into MS products and keep you there. Pretty much worthless.

[ldi222]

HALO2 on Xbox Live is the most exploited online experience Ive dealt with since Diablo 1. If Live anywhere on PC emulates that then Ill pass although I have a suspicion its going to be force fed.

[baz]

I'd be keen for live on the PC, sounds like a great idea. The PC is still my main gaming platform, and probably will be until at least the next round of consoles.

[thecrazyd]

I think the real question is whether or not MS is gonna try to charge me to play multiplayer games on my PC. If so, they can go fuck themselves.

[Hemalin]

So is it going to be an xfire ripoff or are games going to be integrated into Live Anywhere forcing developers to pay some sort of royalty to get their game in there?

[vash]

I think the real question is whether or not MS is gonna try to charge me to play multiplayer games on my PC. If so, they can go fuck themselves.

qft!
charging for xbox live online play is the stupidest thing ever, i could handle that they charge for the services beside the mere ability to play online, but i wont pay anyone for online play, as long as it doesnt involve massive multiplayer games

also what hes saying in the quote, i didnt read the blog, is a lot of hot air
i never have problems with the stuff he mentions like patches or the router or drivers :rolleyes:
i dont think there are that many people out there playing pc games who cant manage that

besides, i dont want to communicate with most people in games and i dont care what some stupid tag says about them.
i want to talk to people i know, and we know how and what solution to use...

[Feltoar]

Hot air indeed. Installing a PC game patch is much more straight forward than linking gamertags with MSN and lord knows what will be involved with the mobiles. GPRS and the like is far more confusing than choosing a download mirror.

I see this whole scheme as a complete waste of effort. The example given at E3 was Forza 2. Ill save you a lot of time and money Microsoft and tell you right now, people dont care about tuning their video game cars on their mobile phones.

[bapenguin]

If MS can bring the unified feel of online gaming and the same tools to the PC...sign me up. As long as there isn't an ADDITIONAL fee for it over the Live subscription, sign me up.

[bapenguin]

Oh...and THIS is just fucking awesome:One of the really cool scenarios described at E3 was the ability to continue a game no matter where you are. Let’s say you download a trial of Zuma on your 360 at home, play it, and decide to purchase it. Later on you have to go to work, and find yourself on the bus with a half-hour to kill. Remembering Zuma, you log into Live Anywhere with your cell phone and download it – but since you’ve already purchased it with your Live Anywhere account, the service recognizes this and allows you to download the unlocked version. You play for a while and receive an Achievement. You see your stop coming up, so you quickly save your game. That game save (and the fact that you unlocked the Achievement) is stored on the Live Anywhere service, so that when you get to your desk and log in to My Xbox (god forbid you do any real work, after all) you can see your new Achievement (and maybe even continue playing on a Windows version of Zuma).

[Yeti2005]

So is it going to be an xfire ripoff or are games going to be integrated into Live Anywhere forcing developers to pay some sort of royalty to get their game in there?

I think I've seen about a dozen "it's just like xfire" comments. Why is everyone still thinking little picture ("It's just voice chat on my PC games")when the article gives you a glimpse of what Live Anywhere could be? I think it might be cool to play an Xbox Live arcade game on my cell phone or initiate downloads on my PC or 360 from phone, or get notifications when my friends are online. On my PC I think it would be cool to know if my friends were playing other PC games or 360 games while I'm browsing the web, etc. The concept of achievements would work well for PC games as well. It's a lot easier to look at my friends achievements when we're playing the same game and see how far he is in the game. If I'm stuck I can ask him for help because I know he's gotten past a certain point (and earned the achievement). Anyway, I still think this is a great idea but many will "hate" on it because it's MS or they're too stuck in their ways (ie The way I do things today must be the best way because it's all I've ever done).

[vash]

there are possibly many things which would be cool, but i guess only very few which will be really useful or even necessary. this is all about binding you to ms, datamining, and shoving many (for most people) unneeded things down your throat along with the useful ones to justify a (potential) fee.
ms trys to get the sheep used to pay for things which where free before.
if its free, which i doubt, it could be a nice albeit, to edged, gimmick.

*this is an opinion based on common sense, with no claim on statistics or real life ;)*

[goc_sin]

sign me up. As long as there isn't an ADDITIONAL fee for it over the Live subscription, sign me up.

I don't think it will float very well with PC gamers if they have to pay anything for this service, unless they are already own a 360 with live. I personally wouldn't pay when I already have x-fire and belong to a large guild.

[agentgray]

...reference to Zuma quote snipped...
I can't wait to play Zuma on my Zune.

:D

I like this idea. It's kind of funny. The first thing I do when booting up the 360 is check what friends are online. If they are playing something I'd like to play, I give them a ring.

However, there was a comic somewhere (PA maybe?) where one of the characters was obsessed with other players achivement points...and he was checking them on his cell all day.

[Jack B]

This will add value to my world. If I play with just one PC gamer across platforms, it will have added value. It just expands the community.

Giving us an option to be more connected to the PC and Cell Phone/PDA world is a good thing. If anyone wants to say "they" don't want it or use it fine for "them", but it's a good thing for "many millions" of PC and Cell/PDA users and I am one.

[bapenguin]

I don't think it will float very well with PC gamers if they have to pay anything for this service, unless they are already own a 360 with live. I personally wouldn't pay when I already have x-fire and belong to a large guild.

The trick is Microsoft needs to show WHY you should pay for their service. Of course nobody is going to want to right away. But have it free for 2 months, let people build their contact lists and whatnot. It just might happen.

[bean19]

The trick is Microsoft needs to show WHY you should pay for their service. Of course nobody is going to want to right away. But have it free for 2 months, let people build their contact lists and whatnot. It just might happen.

What happened to adding 30 days free as a standard add-on to all Xbox Live enabled games? That really was a motivator to me for purchasing games as oppossed to simply renting them. . . dumb and I wasted more money that way, but it worked.

Now that this isn't offered, I have yet another reason to be more guarded about my purchases.

[Ozymandias]

Great idea, damn near impossible to implement.

I read this as cautious optimism. Or in other words, "Love the idea... if you can do it."

It's fair to be skeptical. All I ask is you guys all try it out as it releases and evolves. If we can deliver what we believe we're on track to, I think this sort of healthy skepticism will all evaporate (as it did when we first announced Xbox, and Xbox Live, and Xbox 360). :)

[thecrazyd]

The trick is Microsoft needs to show WHY you should pay for their service. Of course nobody is going to want to right away. But have it free for 2 months, let people build their contact lists and whatnot. It just might happen.
I can guarantee you that none of the known features will convince me to pay to play multiplayer. There are just too many free alternatives, that may be less convenient, but have the advantage of being free.

[Ozymandias]

I can guarantee you that none of the known features will convince me to pay to play multiplayer. There are just too many free alternatives, that may be less convenient, but have the advantage of being free.

I'm assuming cross-platform gaming between the Xbox 360 and Windows isn't of interest to you, then? Not being combatitive - just trying to verify. :)

[thecrazyd]

I'm assuming cross-platform gaming between the Xbox 360 and Windows isn't of interest to you, then? Not being combatitive - just trying to verify. :)
Doesn't interest me nearly enough to pay for it.

[bapenguin]

I can guarantee you that none of the known features will convince me to pay to play multiplayer. There are just too many free alternatives, that may be less convenient, but have the advantage of being free.

I think 3 years ago I would have said the same thing. But as I grow up and time is more important than money I don't mind dropping $4.50 a month on Live than worrying about setting this program up and that program up.

When you truly get to see the whole experience working together (cross game invites with voice invitations,etc etc) and then you go back to a PC and have to tinker with this or that for 20-25 minutes to get it to work. Whether that's organizing a Ventrillo server, or just finding the same server to play on or whatever.

Free is FREE but $4.50 a month is pretty damn fucking close.

[thecrazyd]

I think 3 years ago I would have said the same thing. But as I grow up and time is more important than money I don't mind dropping $4.50 a month on Live than worrying about setting this program up and that program up.

When you truly get to see the whole experience working together (cross game invites with voice invitations,etc etc) and then you go back to a PC and have to tinker with this or that for 20-25 minutes to get it to work. Whether that's organizing a Ventrillo server, or just finding the same server to play on or whatever.

Free is FREE but $4.50 a month is pretty damn fucking close.
I can see paying for it on the XBox, because there are no other options available, but if their is a free alternative, you can be damned sure me, and most other PC gamers will go for it. Also, I do not know how retarded you have to be for it to take 25 minutes to get in a game. Maybe you should give xfire a shot.

[digitalErich]

As long as developers keep offering it, I'll stick with the game specific browers. I'm not narcissistic enough to care if I have the same nick in every game or that someone knows that the digitalerich they played against in BF2 is the same digitalerich they are playing against in DoD or that anyone cares either way.

I've been playing online PC games since before QW and I find that server communities and playing with server regulars is really what's great about PC gaming. Sure, playing with friends is all good, but most of the games I play are 20+ person games, so for me, I'd rather play in a server full of regulers than jump on some random server because one of my friends is there.

If this turns out to be free, the above is all mute...I'll be there day 1. However, with standard voice chat, I can't see this being a free service. And with the adoption rate of Vista not being 100% for a while for gamers, I think developers will have to continue to offer the free in-game server browsing, alternate VOIP, etc. for a few years.

[bean19]

I'm assuming cross-platform gaming between the Xbox 360 and Windows isn't of interest to you, then? Not being combatitive - just trying to verify. :)

I wouldn't pay to use the Xbox Live service on my PC. Honestly, I'd live with 3rd party programs if I could get it for free on my 360. The good work done on Xbox Live should be paid for by increased sells and ads - not by my paying $50/year for the service.

It's nice. I enjoy playing on it when there are games that I play on it, but I don't think I'll keep it active every year as I've only dabbled with the mulitplayer of games except in PDZ. . . and a lot of my play-time there was because it was a launch title.

At some point I can imagine there being a multiplayer game that will be cool enough that I want to pay for the service, but when my current year subscription runs out, I won't be renewing it until that game materializes.

[bapenguin]

I can see paying for it on the XBox, because there are no other options available, but if their is a free alternative, you can be damned sure me, and most other PC gamers will go for it. Also, I do not know how retarded you have to be for it to take 25 minutes to get in a game. Maybe you should give xfire a shot.

I'm not saying it takes 25 minutes to get into a game. But you can't deny when you are trying to get a specific group of people together to play a game there's alway 1 or 2 people who don't have X program to chat, or Y person needs to set up this server to chat, or they need this or that etc.

That is what I'm talking about. Not just gaming in general, but specific, concise group gaming. That's what makes Live so awesome.

[thecrazyd]

I'm not saying it takes 25 minutes to get into a game. But you can't deny when you are trying to get a specific group of people together to play a game there's alway 1 or 2 people who don't have X program to chat, or Y person needs to set up this server to chat, or they need this or that etc.
And Live on the PC would be yet another program that your friends would need to get set up, and, worse then that, one you have to pay for, meaning none of my friends will use it. Pass.

If it was a one time fee, I might consider it. MAYBE. But I will never pay a recurring fee for something I can get for free.

[vash]

I'm assuming cross-platform gaming between the Xbox 360 and Windows isn't of interest to you, then? Not being combatitive - just trying to verify. :)

whats the difference? only that pc fps players would own console fps players
concerning playing with friends who dont have a pc or the other way: i got 1 rl friend who owns a xbox360 besides my roommate... also my friends dont like to play with me cause i PWN them ^^

[Mephistopheles]

So awesome.

[bapenguin]

And Live on the PC would be yet another program that your friends would need to get set up, and, worse then that, one you have to pay for, meaning none of my friends will use it. Pass.

If it was a one time fee, I might consider it. MAYBE. But I will never pay a recurring fee for something I can get for free.

My understanding of it is it would be integrated into the game itself, not as a program.

The program itself would be (I hope would be) web based.

[thecrazyd]

My understanding of it is it would be integrated into the game itself, not as a program.

The program itself would be (I hope would be) web based.
What do you mean by integrated into the game itself? Would this mean that I would only be able to play multiplayer using Live anywhere? I would hope so, as that would mean it would fail very early, as any game requiring it would bomb, and PC gaming would be back to normal.

[Codicier]

http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2006/06/19

^ because someone mentioned it. Because it's funny and because it's relevant to the topic. Now stop bothering me about how you've already seen it. :D

[Hemalin]

What do you mean by integrated into the game itself? Would this mean that I would only be able to play multiplayer using Live anywhere? I would hope so, as that would mean it would fail very early, as any game requiring it would bomb, and PC gaming would be back to normal.
That's what I was originally wondering. If it was intergrated into games, wouldn't there be licensing fees and such? If Live Anywhere did catch on then would any developer that didn't incorperate it then get shunned by the gaming community?

[thecrazyd]

That's what I was originally wondering. If it was intergrated into games, wouldn't there be licensing fees and such? If Live Anywhere did catch on then would any developer that didn't incorperate it then get shunned by the gaming community?
Don't worry, it will never catch on if they try to charge for it.