Three Great Game Design Evils

[Doctor Setebos]

Next Generation pulled some great quotes (http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=3415&Itemid=2) from a round-table discussion amongst top game designers in England. The designers discussed bad game design, and had some interesting things to say about what they want to see disappear from current generation games.

Peter Molyneux - Lionhead Studios

“The whole notion of cut-scenes smacks to me of commercial breaks on TV. They are pointless and usually done very badly."

Simon Byron - Author on Games History

“For me it's stealth. I can't stand it. It's all about patiently lurking and avoiding detection. It's so sinister and creepy; like the sort of thing a pervert does."

[Varsity]

Garrett is a pervert. I knew it.

As it happens, I think each of them was wrong in different ways (colours for readability):
Games don't have to be about being "easy" or "hard" in this day and age. Did it matter how hard Shadow of the Colossus was or wasn't? HL2 maybe? If we want to move towards becoming an artform, we have to end our obsession with mechanics. Not that mechanical games can't be fun, of course.

I don't remember the bit where I sat quietly in a dark room, but I do remember the bit when I was cornered by a guard carrying a torch and another with a large sword and had to use every fibre of my wit to escape. Does Mr. Byron remember the bit when he walked down the corridor? Also, see #1.

Actually, I agree with Molyneux. But I do find it amusing that he uses HL2 as an example of a game without cutscenes, when it in fact has quite a few.

[absolut taco]

“The whole notion of cut-scenes smacks to me of commercial breaks on TV. They are pointless and usually done very badly."

Since TV sucks 98% of the time, and the commercials are sometime more entertaining, I say there is nothing wrong with cut scenes. They sure beat loading screens.

[TheKeck]

Simon Byron can suck it. I happen to LOVE stealth games. If he doesn't like that stuff, then let him not play or make such games; but screw him for saying that it should be scrapped by everyone.

[The Continental]

Current Detriments to Gaming
Cut scenes
Stealth games in their entirety

I'm going to go ahead and throw "user input" out there as hurting games, as it seems to be as logical as eliminating stealth as a gameplay aspect.

[TheKeck]

Since TV sucks 98% of the time, and the commercials are sometime more entertaining, I say there is nothing wrong with cut scenes. They sure beat loading screens.
Yeah, I'm a fan of cut scenes as long as they are quality and not too long/often. He talks about cutscenes getting in the way of a "reward" in the game. I have always felt that a good cutscene is a pretty decent reward. (Blizzard games come to mind.)

[EvilBob46]

Peter Molyneux on cutscenes:

"What is the point of these scenes if players are using them to go make a cup of coffee or are just skipping forward?"

What kinds of shitty games is he playing to make such a statement?

[Hellstorm]

Peter Molyneux on cutscenes:

"What is the point of these scenes if players are using them to go make a cup of coffee or are just skipping forward?"

What kinds of shitty games is he playing


Probably his own. I wonder which one is the greater evil...Raph Koster or Peter Molneuxdlkajfaksjdlfjasudfoias. Yeah, I wne there.

[screwtape]

Molyneux's comment is ironic, considering the first 3-4 hours of Black & White 2 were about 50% unskippable cutscenes of those two morons talking.

I'm tired of artificially padding a game by backtracking through areas. In Halo, after making it all the way through the Library (one of the most repetitive and boring levels I've ever played in a game) I have to go back through the fucking library? I quit playing the game right there.

[NonSoft]

What the hell are these guys talking about?

[t3kl3r]

Actually, I agree with Molyneux. But I do find it amusing that he uses HL2 as an example of a game without cutscenes, when it in fact has quite a few.[/list]

I think he made this statement because HL2's cutscenes involve the player still being there since you can still move around and it's from your perspective. It's not really a cut scene in the same way because it doesn't take you out of the game.

[bait]

Hilarious. Byron and Molyneux know something's wrong in the games industry, but if this is what they pin the blame on we're in trouble.

Cutscenes are good for the intro to a game and sprinkled here and there as a reward. A few games do go overboard, though. They've been around since at least King's Quest 4 (1988) and I don't think they are the reason for the malaise in the games industry.

Stealth games are good if for no other reason than it's a break from run n' gun. They, too, have been around since at least Castle Wolfenstein (1983)...so again, probably not the problem.

[Savok]

If you leave the room when a cutscene is playing, there's something very wrong with you or the game. If you do it all the time, it's really you.

And stealth levels in non-stealth games completely suck, like that Hulk game which had Banner stealth missions, it was moronic. Stealth in stealth games however is kinda the point and really cool.

[BigJonno]

Varsity, I think you're taking the comments about game difficulty the wrong way, as it seems like you're saying the same thing that he is. The obsession with game difficulty is ridiculous. Oblivion is a good example of balance being a bad thing.

As for stealth, I can see where he's coming from. Games should be about what you can do, not what you can't. Too many stealth games revolve around avoiding enemies because you're too weak to take them on. Stealth should be empowering; using a bit of forethought and skill to take out your enemies without them even knowing you're there. I have high hopes for Assassin's Creed because of what Ubisoft did with Prince of Persia. The PoP games have had a very "can do" feel. You look at an area, you come up with an almost ridiculously acrobatic way of traversing it and, nine times out of ten, you can pull it off. If they do the same with AC, it'll be amazing.

[Eran Hawke]

I have to agree with getting rid of stealth. Stealth games mean I spend my valuable game time sitting around waiting for guards, which is not fun. Fun is the main reason for playing.

[Ted Huge]

Yep, I think Pete took the brown acid, here. While some games DO throw pointless / poorly voiced / poorly shot / poorly written / etc. cutscenes at us, these are usually games where the cutscenes are not the only problem. Giving it at least three seconds thought, I can't think of a game which was otherwise solid but had pointless cutscenes. It's really the choice of word: "pointless" that I take issue with. Cutscenes, more often than not, are exposition on a story element that the avatar might not be able to see, but that the human player needs to. Maybe Molyneux is the kinda dude who just arbitrarily decides to NOT read certain chapters in novels. If he's a fan of George R Martin, I bet he's never even heard of the Red Wedding.

Oh, ya, and stealth kicks ass. Guess that's why Byron is an author, and not a dev.

[Savok]

I can't think of a game which was otherwise solid but had pointless cutscenes.
I can, MGS2, that you weren't able to shoot Rose was a crime. That's an exception though.

[BigJonno]

I do have one pet hate when it comes to cutscenes. Intro movies are evil. When I get a new game, I want to play the damn game, not watch a movie. I'll either get frustrated if it's unskippable or feel like I've missed something if I do skip it. Gimme 15 minutes of actual gameplay before you start the exposition, m'kay?

[Deadend]

I can, MGS2, that you weren't able to shoot Rose was a crime. That's an exception though.

But that did have a point, to make you hate Rose and be annoyed by her constant droning about relationships. Thus making Raiden seem somewhat inhuman and only caring about his murder-spree.

[Heretic Machine]

Isn't Molyneux, himself, a great game design evil?

[YoungAlCapone]

I have always seen a good cutscene as a reward myself, but I do hate when cutscenes come on every five minutes. It is what keeps me from playing a lot of the more recent jrpgs, and those used to be a staple for me, I always had one going. Molyneux either phrased that wrong or is wrong, can't be entirely sure. I like the HL2 style cutscenes in FPS, they make alot of sense there, but they do not always work. Getting rid of them all together is just stupid.

Byron on the other hand can eat it. Either he has never played the Thief and Metal Gear games, he hates video games or he is an idiot. I guess there is the outside chance that he doesn't like stealth, but that is just wierd in its own right. Plus an empowering stealth game example could be Riddick. He was tough as nails but it was so much more satisfying to sneak up on a guy, snap his neck and push him over a hand rail.

[cppcrusader]

I can understand the stealth game thing, but that issue is kind of past now. I'll agree I was annoyed with it as well after the success of MGS and Splinter Cell. For a couple years there the stealth game was real big and it just got annoying to see out of place stealth levels crammed into games that didn't need them just to capitalize on it.

I find Jonathan Smith's comment about too much balance in a game being the most perplexing and odd.

[Wonka]

I personally disagree about stealth games. But I know a few people who simply DO NOT like them. So the idea that it might be a bad move to mix stealth in with other games might be onto something. This opionion may not be THAT unusual.

I generally agree with the comments about the cutscenes. And HL2 does NOT count as a game with cut scenes IMO, since the camera never leaves your body. Hence the immersion is never disrupted. It's the whole "time to take a break" cutscenes that I think Peter objects to. I for one agree with him about that. Games are NOT about storytelling so much as about providing universes to explore. And the cutscene is really a throwback to other earlier mediums... Its like in the early days of TV, when they would borrow a lot of what had worked in radio. Early TV was filled with people talking about stuff that was right there ON THE SCREEN. There was no need to mention it, but they did it anyways because they were used to radio, and did not trust their audience to "get it". The art of communicating with the viewers in an elegant way instead of a ham fisted one took decades to master. Cutscenes are really a manifestation of the same kinds of issues just plaguing a new generation of media. How will we make the player notice these new things and know what their new goals are? I know, we can just fall back on the tricks that worked for the LAST GEN of media!

The unskipable cutscenes that I hate the most usually play before a big boss fight that takes many tries to win. They are usually there to introduce the boss and to indicate something important like big vulnerable eyeballs or whatnot.

Want to try that fight again? Ok, watch the cutscene again as payment! Oh yeah, thats a lot of fun...

[danhoo]

But that did have a point, to make you hate Rose and be annoyed by her constant droning about relationships.

Well that worked. Man, was she annoying.

Anyway, cutscenes are generally fine by me too. In general, pre-rendered or in-game, it feels like cutscenes have gotten a _lot_ better over the years -- even just five years ago most cutscenes would make me wince. They do need to be skippable however (and not _accidentally_ skippable either) for those repeated attempts to kill a boss with a long intro cutscene.

[Metal Jesus]

I happen to LOVE and BUY most stealth games that come out. Getting rid of those types of games would be a sad day indeed. Why can't we have action games for trigger happy folks and stealth games for those who like a bit more strategy and patience?!?!

[Trenchspike]

I generally agree with the comments about the cutscenes. And HL2 does NOT count as a game with cut scenes IMO, since the camera never leaves your body. Hence the immersion is never disrupted. It's the whole "time to take a break" cutscenes that I think Peter objects to.

Those "cutscenes" are annoying when you've played through the game and are going through it a second or third time. Due to their nature, i.e. you can still move about in a limited space, they're unskippable. At least HL2 didn't have too many, the only really annoying ones are the start and the bit just before getting your crowbar.

“What is the point of these scenes if players are using them to go make a cup of coffee or are just skipping forward?

I guess Peter learned that from the first Black & White.... I heard he didn't learn that lesson with B&W 2.

I somewhat agree with Mr. Byron, stealth is annoying and useless when it's forced on you. Although I do remember stealth levels from games... and so do my friends.... as being the most annoying part of the game. Some games are just not designed to have a stealth mission shoved in there for good measure. Pure stealth games are a different matter, if he whinges about them he can go make his own games.

[dotbomb]

Cutscenes can be used well if they are sparse. However an over abundance of cut scenes, ala Psychonauts, really ruins a game (and yes it ruined Psychonauts for me quite a bit).

[DeadScreenSky]

In the larger context of the article all three of the complaints seem reasonable. I happen to usually enjoy stealth games, but I have to admit I'm not convinced it's actually good game design in most cases. It feels sort of backwards in its thinking, especially in titles where you have you to be stealthy. When it's integrated into the gameplay in an organic manner (Halo's a good example, so is Deus Ex IMO) it's not really something to complain about, much like 'integrated cinematics' a la HL2 aren't an issue. But the "oops, got caught, time to retry" mechanics in some games are pretty awful design.

In Halo, after making it all the way through the Library (one of the most repetitive and boring levels I've ever played in a game) I have to go back through the fucking library? I quit playing the game right there.
Ummm, you don't go back through the library in Halo. Sounds like you quit too soon, maybe a cutscene confused you. ;)

Though I'm one of the few people on the planet that enjoyed the Library and all its old school Doom-style charm, I still probably wouldn't have wanted to go through it twice. There are some levels in Halo 1 you do have to go back through, but they are far more interesting and dynamic in their design than the Library is. The introduction of the Flood really changes things up, and I'm pretty sure you also go through areas of them you didn't visit the first time.

[Rook34]

Here's my view. Stealth games are great. You have to be careful, sneaky, and the thrill of getting caught is always fun, but probably more so to perverts. Anyway, I love games like Thief and MGS. They are done well and the reward from those games in gameplay are that the enemies react pretty funny to when you rip things off from them or sneak up on them. May they never go away.
Speaking of MGS, the cutscenes rocked, especially in Twin Snakes. However, cutscenes where it's just them on the talkie EVERY 25 FEET interrupting absolutlely made me want to break the game in two. When everyone else loved the first game on PS1 I still attacked the crappy talking scenes. Hideo Kojima needs to figure out how to tell a story without so much god dammned talking. You'd think he'd have figured that out by now, but I guess he's too busy pretending he's a bad ass.

[easi]

I think of a cutscene as a reward, as well as a nice break where you can take stock of what you've accomplished, reflect on the story, whatever. I probably enjoyed D2 and WC3 much more because of them.

[Flatpicker]

I'm not too keen on that "Stealth game" comment.
That seems more like a genre bias, akin to I don't like FPS' or MMO's
It's fine not to like them, but diversity is what is going to move the industry forward. Not sticking to MOTS.

[Xerxes]

Yeah Fable didn't have any pesky cutscenes...

The push the story along simple as that...

[bapenguin]

I wonder if the stealth comment had to do with stealth missions in action/fps games. I can think of quite a few games that had those in it. They simply ruined the entire game.

Side note...it's amazing how far Peter has fallen in the eyes of gamers. When he was with Bullfrog every game released was a gem. From Magic Carpet to Syndicate to Populous. The games were fan-friggin-tastic. I hope he can get over this little "good vs. evil" kick he's so fixated on and get back to making great games.

[Rafer]

Half-Life 2 (and especially HL2: Episode 1) does a remarkable job of having moments that feel like you're "inside a cut scene". It's really neat to be in a game and see characters do stuff like climb up walls and talk to eachother, stuff that isn't the same animation routines over and over.

Molyneux had said he wanted to get rid of cut scenes in Fable, but I think that by the time they realised that games should be moving away from cut scenes Fable was already years into production.

And the criticism of stealth is good in that I've played quite a few games (Beyond Good and Evil, Indigo Prophecy, Rise to Honor) that aren't stealth games but have stealth sections just thrown in. But is the guy complaining about the Hitman series? The Hitman series is second only to Deus Ex in how to allow really creative, sandbox-esque gameplay.

[cppcrusader]

I wonder if the stealth comment had to do with stealth missions in action/fps games. I can think of quite a few games that had those in it. They simply ruined the entire game.

I think that's the way he meant. Like I said earlier that's the way I see it. I think its just that the success of a few games that did it really well and actually made it fun caused a lot of people to cram stealth stuff into games where it didn't belong.

Like WindWaker, I loved WindWaker, but we did not need that bullshit stealth mission. Oh, let's not forget the one worst offenders, Metroid: Zero Mission. Its great that they extend the game a little farther after the original end, but that stealth bullshit was uneeded and uncalled for. I almost quit playing the game entirely at that point.

[danhoo]

It's true, there do seem to be a fair amount of games that add a "stealth mission" for no good reason (example: there's actually one in Steambot Chronicles, which was silly, and basically impossible to fail, so I don't see why they bothered).

But some action games that throw in stealth missions work wonderfully. Beyond Good and Evil had a lot of stealth, and yet I felt they did a great job on those, and they were fun.

[YoungAlCapone]

But some action games that throw in stealth missions work wonderfully. Beyond Good and Evil had a lot of stealth, and yet I felt they did a great job on those, and they were fun.

I agree, the stealth in Beyond Good and Evil was pretty well done.

I also agree that many games just throw in stealth and those sections are usually the worst part of the game. I happen to love completely stealthy games, but am not a fan of tacked on stealth missions that suck.

[kid cabelgo]

I can understand the argument against cutscenes when I play a game like HL2, but then I play Halo 2 and remember how amazing they can be if done right. HL2 is awesome for not having them, and Halo 2 is awesome for having them. It's just a different style.

As for stealth, it's just another gametype that some people like and some people don't. If the industry stopped making sports games, I would be happy, but that's just me.

[Spigot]

Simon Byron can suck it. I happen to LOVE stealth games. If he doesn't like that stuff, then let him not play or make such games; but screw him for saying that it should be scrapped by everyone.
Amen brother! Stealth games are probably my favourite genre after RPG's as they tend to actually have a story tacked onto them to explain why you're sneaking around rather than just running and gunning everything. Not to mention that the Thief series (which Byron mentions specifically) is probably in my top 3 favourite game series of all time.

I agree that just tossing a stealth mission into an otherwise action-oriented game can really drive me nuts though. They tend to be done very haphazardly and end up being either impossible to fail or nigh-impossible to pass, at least not without ripping out massive chunks of your own hair in frustration. Like most things, if they're done well, there shouldn't be a problem with them. Unfortunately, most aren't unless it's a game that has embraced the stealth missions as a primary game mechanic.

Like jumping in a FPS, stealth should only be in there if it has been well planned and is fair for the player.

Yeah, I'm a fan of cut scenes as long as they are quality and not too long/often. He talks about cutscenes getting in the way of a "reward" in the game. I have always felt that a good cutscene is a pretty decent reward. (Blizzard games come to mind.)
I'm with you on this one too. I'm a sucker for a good cutscene unless it is just drawn out and boring. People usually point to the Final Fantasy series as a major offender in this regard but I look forward to cutscenes in these game as a chance to sit back and watch the story unfold in what tends to be some pretty spectacular CG.

Badly animated, badly voiced and plain boring cutscenes are a bane on the industry and should be eradicated, but that doesn't mean all cutscenes should be abolished. It drives me nuts when I'm watching someone else game and they don't take the time to watch the cutscenes. Sure, if it's the 8th time through a game, that makes sense, but if you're seeing it for the first time, spend that 10 minutes out of the 3 hours you'll likely be playing the game in that sitting and watch the stupid cutscenes!
As for stealth, it's just another gametype that some people like and some people don't. If the industry stopped making sports games, I would be happy, but that's just me.
They can do this as long as they keep making wierd sport hybrid games like SSX, Bloodbowl and the like. Unrealistic sports are fine. Realism is for sissies who can't afford tickets or cable TV :)

[Varsity]

It's not really a cut scene in the same way because it doesn't take you out of the game.
It does take you out of the game. Not the interactivity, but certainly the game.

Varsity, I think you're taking the comments about game difficulty the wrong way, as it seems like you're saying the same thing that he is. The obsession with game difficulty is ridiculous. Oblivion is a good example of balance being a bad thing.I don't know what you mean by suggesting that I'm agreeing with the guy while disagreeing with him, but I do know that a game with disinteresting difficulty that doesn't keep player interest in another way doesn't affect my argument. :)

Stealth games are great. You have to be careful, sneaky, and the thrill of getting caught is always fun, but probably more so to perverts.:D

[Liquidize105]

Simon Byron doesn't get it, stealth offers players a medium-slow pace that some prefer over the "reaction time test" of conventional FPS. And if you look at it in terms of risk-n-reward, you'll see that Thief is probably the only true stealth game where the goal is to STEAL valuables; being stealthy just happens to be means of getting to it. It's a more versatile system.

Possibly every other stealth title is a simplied action game with shadows. Worse even, when it comes to action-stealth mixtures, stealth shouldn't be in the god forsakened middle of the game - either go stealth for the first half and then transition into action (slow pace to fast), or none at all. Stealth for its own sake CAN BE frustrating.

As for Molyneux, the man's trying (which is more than I can say for the rest of the industry). I'm sure he'll succeed at least once in the near future.

[jwbxx]

I think cut scenes are good and bad. They can be reward when it comes to MGS1 or MGS3. But they can be a punishment when it comes to MGS2.

[screwtape]

Ummm, you don't go back through the library in Halo. Sounds like you quit too soon, maybe a cutscene confused you. ;)
Perhaps I heard wrong - I was so frustrated at the thought of fighting through those hallways again. Maybe I missed a side path or something.

[OrangePulp]

I agree that the stealth comment was probably directed towards segments like the aforementioned bruce banner bits in that hulk game. It's like, I rented the game so I could play as the hulk and go smash stuff, not be banner and have to pussyfoot around.

Cutscenes are only bad if they're done wrong. Molyneux's remark is akin to someone watching a bunch of bad TV, and then saying TV should be abolished because the specific stuff he watched was bad. When done well, they add to the game's storytelling.

[Cyrano]

Here (http://www.gamasutra.com/features/20060710/adams_01.shtml) is a much better article about game design evils from Gamasutra (free registration required, I think).

[Thenetcase]

These guys are gamers??? Or do they just program SHIT and expect us to play it?

ASSHOLES!!

Cutscenes are not bad. Some people just don't know how to make good cutscenes that actually enhance and improve your gameplay. Oh yeah, and they really do help build up that thing called a "plot" or a "storyline". Sometimes it's important that people know WTF they are shooting aliens for or marching across a fucking desert for. Sometimes there has to be a point! If I don't want a point, I'll go jack off in Counter Strike with a bunch of adolesent punks!

As for stealth? Lemme see... I think that virtually *EVERY* stealth game released by someone who knows what the fuck they are doing has sold out the top-ten list for a long ass time. Just because your personal taste doesn't align with something doens't mean that it's one of the worst things in gaming. That's an IDIOTIC point of view. that's like me saying that I think that people with the name Simon Byron are the reasons humanity sucks so bad!

So anyways... these guys are so full of shit they MUST be assholes.

I'm going to go play Prey. Oh yeah and I'm gonna LOVE me some cutscenes tonight, baby!

-TNC-

[Magnanimous Gnome]

These guys are gamers??? Or do they just program SHIT and expect us to play it?

ASSHOLES!!

Cutscenes are not bad. Some people just don't know how to make good cutscenes that actually enhance and improve your gameplay. Oh yeah, and they really do help build up that thing called a "plot" or a "storyline". Sometimes it's important that people know WTF they are shooting aliens for or marching across a fucking desert for. Sometimes there has to be a point! If I don't want a point, I'll go jack off in Counter Strike with a bunch of adolesent punks!

As for stealth? Lemme see... I think that virtually *EVERY* stealth game released by someone who knows what the fuck they are doing has sold out the top-ten list for a long ass time. Just because your personal taste doesn't align with something doens't mean that it's one of the worst things in gaming. That's an IDIOTIC point of view. that's like me saying that I think that people with the name Simon Byron are the reasons humanity sucks so bad!

So anyways... these guys are so full of shit they MUST be assholes.

I'm going to go play Prey. Oh yeah and I'm gonna LOVE me some cutscenes tonight, baby!

-TNC-




Wow, you have some anger issues bud!

[Shodan2020]

I have to agree with getting rid of stealth. Stealth games mean I spend my valuable game time sitting around waiting for guards, which is not fun. Fun is the main reason for playing.

How about you just don't play a stealth game? Then you can spend your time playing a non-stealth game instead of waiting on a guard, not having fun.

Pretty much everything these guys had to say was lame. Cutscenes are usually used well and only make the game better. A lot of their comments are really telling and you can see why they haven't made a decent game in a decade.

[rubbishfoo]

HA! 3 design flaws huh? Im not certain I agree with all of them so... here I go!

1 - Balance - This is necessary. Life feeds on life.

Balance requires a specific type of game really... MMORPGS are a great example of where balance is required due to the enormity of your player base... achieving this is another issue. Great balance in a game? I really liked Pilot Wings for the snes... and really any game that you pick up and can play immediately and do ok... but takes forever to master (Katamari and Virtua Tennis are two that come to mind). Difficulty = Chess... hahaha

2 - Stealth - It's all about the Ninja ~ WACHOW!

I think these statements are obviously opionion based... there are some who like it and some who don't... good stealth games I can think of are the early Thief games... is there any others besides the Metal Gear series that still get your heart racing? Oh yeah there was the original Tenchu....
Difficulty = Polkadot Elephants.

C - Cut Scenes - Mostly... I have to agree with their statements. A great example of this isn't so much the cut scenes for me... if they are done well they can really add a lot to a game... I feel the downfall is the reliance on them heavily. I remember playing Thief 3 and getting to the first door and opening it... I was all ready to sneak in and check things out when I was confronted by the "LOADING" screen... talk about screwing up a game... Immediately I was disengaged from teh gameplay and that's a major problem when your strongest selling point is the immersiveness. A game that had awesome cutscenes? Fallout. "Chosen... the men came in the bellies of flying beasts... help us..." that was some good stuff... and it lent to the element of the game VERY well. Difficulty = Mech Commander. (yeah I know that's not REALLY cutscenes... but they were very good mission briefings).

I am so tired and full of food... ugh. Slow news day or just me? I had a HELL of a time finding a post I wanted to respond to!

~RubbishFoo

[Sensei-X]

I agree that the stealth comment was probably directed towards segments like the aforementioned bruce banner bits in that hulk game. It's like, I rented the game so I could play as the hulk and go smash stuff, not be banner and have to pussyfoot around.

Cutscenes are only bad if they're done wrong. Molyneux's remark is akin to someone watching a bunch of bad TV, and then saying TV should be abolished because the specific stuff he watched was bad. When done well, they add to the game's storytelling.

While the Bruce Banner segments were pretty annoying, the one thing that did the most to detach me from the game was, after having smashed pretty damn everything in my way, jumping down into an alleyway and running by a pristine Mountain Dew truck.

[Spigot]

C - Cut Scenes - I feel the downfall is the reliance on them heavily. I remember playing Thief 3 and getting to the first door and opening it... I was all ready to sneak in and check things out when I was confronted by the "LOADING" screen... talk about screwing up a game... Immediately I was disengaged from teh gameplay and that's a major problem when your strongest selling point is the immersiveness.
Hey, I'm someone's sig! Hooray!

I'll take you to task for this reference here because a) Thief 3 is the weakest of the series, gameplay-wise and b) you're referring to a load screen, not a cutscene. I'm sure that everyone will agree that load screens are annoying and the sooner we can abolish them, the better. Thief 3 had the added bonus of taking a series that never required load screens outside of the initial level load-up and cramming them into almost every nook and cranny.

People talk about the MGS series as having pointless and bad cutscenes. The actual cutscenes are almost all fantastic. It's the CODEC sequences that tend to piss people off. I wish there was a way for them to communicate the information that they want to communicate in those sequences and not have them be two talking heads.

[Thenetcase]

Wow, you have some anger issues bud!

Would have it helped if I had put little dancing bunny images in that post and used lots of exclamation points and 1's?

Lemme see... here... this'll help show my real character.

:D :o :) :rolleyes: :eek: :p :D :o ;) :rolleyes:



okay, does that make you feel more warm and fuzzy?

(Sorry, I don't like to candy coat my feelings about stupidity... not yours, obviously I seem angry to you and that's a legit concern... but people who write articles that are obviously slanted should be shot in the head repeatedly).

-TNC-

[theguido]

I like the second guy. Stealth games can all go die in a fire as far as I'm concerned.