Atari Responds To Neverwinter Nights Non-Support Rumors

[JCalCGM]

FiringSquad (http://www.firingsquad.com/) contacted Atari's PR represenative to get their side of rumors that the publisher has ordered developer BioWare not offer any more premimum modules for their hit RPG Neverwinter Nights. As you can read in the official response (http://www.firingsquad.com/news/newsarticle.asp?searchid=10472), Atari somewhat evades the question and instead hypes the mod support for the upcoming sequel Neverwinter Nights 2.

Here is a snip:

Atari understands the importance and popularity of the mod community, which has supported the Neverwinter Nights franchise for years. Atari remains as committed to the franchise and the growing members of the community as ever and we’ve still got quite a bit more news in-store for everyone between now and September. Our goal is to make Neverwinter Nights 2 one of the most compelling RPG experiences seen in years by also making it one of the most mod-friendly games ever.

[Heretic Machine]

It is a damn shame I won't be buying NWN2 after this.

[Citizen Philip]

Scumbaggery. Well then Infogrames, I think you've consumed much of whatever value of the Atari facade you have taken over the last few years. I guess it's time to purchase a new name to disassoicate the same stupid people from the same stupid decisions.

Maybe you can convince Vivendi to give up Sierra for you.

[codswallop]

After four years of continued official support and a lot of free (and cheap) content, "Atari" are now not giving you stuff for free because they're finally releasing a new version of the game (which won't stop you from playing on private servers with the old version)?

Gee, those bastards.

[Heretic Machine]

After four years of continued official support and a lot of free (and cheap) content, "Atari" are now not giving you stuff for free because they're finally releasing a new version of the game (which won't stop you from playing on private servers with the old version)?

Gee, those bastards.

They cut off the content when it was still being made. More packs were nearing release.

[Leaving Hope]

After four years of continued official support and a lot of free (and cheap) content, "Atari" are now not giving you stuff for free because they're finally releasing a new version of the game (which won't stop you from playing on private servers with the old version)?

Gee, those bastards.

The issue isn't that Atari wants to phase out support on an older product, or even that they want to promote their new product. It's how they handled the issue. Instead of slowly ending support on NWN1 and no longer approving future premium modules, Atari took a knife to the people and developers that already had content in the pipeline.

The premium module for DragonLance Adventures (DLA) has been in development for quite some time. According to the developers the module was in quality assurance and almost ready for release. The people behind it deserve the opportunity to sell their hard work. But instead, Atari has screwed those people by saying that the premium modules project must end, and that no one else can sell the modules they've worked to develop.

Sure, it's Atari's perogative to decide if they want to end the program. However, screwing over the fans and developers that made NWN1 so successful is not a way to inspire loyalty, trust, or respect. How, as developers of modules for NWN1 and NWN2, can we trust that Atari will support us and our content when they're obviously only concerned about themselves?

I don't want some PR spin, Atari; answer the damn question. If you're going to screw over DLA atleast have the balls to admit it. Or maybe it really was the Janitor who wrote the press release because everyone else in the company is jumping ship--hell, can you blame them?

[Savok]

After four years of continued official support and a lot of free (and cheap) content, "Atari" are now not giving you stuff for free because they're finally releasing a new version of the game (which won't stop you from playing on private servers with the old version)?

Gee, those bastards.
All done by Bioware, who weren't done with their own modules.

They made the game, they supported the game, I think they deserve to have at least a little control over when it ends.

[DigiWiz]

Typical PR spin

>"Atari remains as committed to the franchise"
You bet. But not NWN1

>"Obsidian has spent painstaking time both improving and adding to the functionality of the Neverwinter Nights 2 toolset"
And that's why you prevent BioWare from releasing the modules that were nearly done when you cancelled them, screwing over the people from the community who worked on them and, by extension, also screwing over the community who would have gotten the mod content as free upgrade.

>"Our goal is to make Neverwinter Nights 2 one of the most compelling..."
Yeah, that's nice, but wasn't the question why you stopped BioWare from continuing NWN1 support? No answer to that one

The headline to this newsitem should be "Atari PR tries to distract...".

[torrefaction]

The premium module for DragonLance Adventures (DLA) has been in development for quite some time. According to the developers the module was in quality assurance and almost ready for release. The people behind it deserve the opportunity to sell their hard work. But instead, Atari has screwed those people by saying that the premium modules project must end, and that no one else can sell the modules they've worked to develop.


oh my god.

There was going to be a Dragonlance module?

You just ruined me. I had no idea, and at this point, I was better off.

[nonchalance]

The premium module for DragonLance Adventures (DLA) has been in development for quite some time. According to the developers the module was in quality assurance and almost ready for release. The people behind it deserve the opportunity to sell their hard work. But instead, Atari has screwed those people by saying that the premium modules project must end, and that no one else can sell the modules they've worked to develop.

It's also worth noting that DLA was originally a community mod, and Atari or Bioware paid them to enter the premium module program.
How would you feel if you spent a year or two building the perfect mod, were pumped up by the developer, and the developer actually asked you to do your mod on a professional basis, and then cancelled it a year and a half later when you were into QA?

[donkeydrop]

It is a damn shame I won't be buying NWN2 after this.
I will promise to buy 3 copies if Bioware has some cojones and uses Steam or some other online distribution service to screw Atari.

[nonchalance]

I will promise to buy 3 copies if Bioware has some cojones and uses Steam or some other online distribution service to screw Atari.

They can't. Atari owns any video game that includes the D&D system. To release any NWN stuff, they would have to not only remove any reference to D&D stuff from the game, but actually rewrite the entire character and monster system.

And their Premium Modules are already sold through digital distribution, in the Bioware store.

[Heretic Machine]

Also keep in mind that Bioware isn't doing NWN2, Obsidian is. The guys who do nothing but pick up projects that Bioware passes on.

[Thenetcase]

Wow you guys seriously need to stop sucking on pacifiers and cease with the whinery.

-tnc-

[Heretic Machine]

Wow you guys seriously need to stop sucking on pacifiers and cease with the whinery.

-tnc-

Ya, next thing you know we'll post nothing but complaints about other people's posts! :rolleyes:

[reimomo]

WOtC D&D isn't even D&D anymore... its magic the gathering with dice. In DDO there was a "vendor" that sold a gajillion different +skill items of different qualities, and another vendor for magic swords, and another for magic bows, ad nauseum. Gary Gygax would gnaw his own hand off before playing that kind of D&D campaign. Let it die. I hope NWN2 is a flop and the entire franchise gets sucked into a +5 Vorpal Black Hole of Suck.

[Heretic Machine]

WOtC D&D isn't even D&D anymore... its magic the gathering with dice. In DDO there was a "vendor" that sold a gajillion different +skill items of different qualities, and another vendor for magic swords, and another for magic bows, ad nauseum. Gary Gygax would gnaw his own hand off before playing that kind of D&D campaign. Let it die. I hope NWN2 is a flop and the entire franchise gets sucked into a +5 Vorpal Black Hole of Suck.

Dude, are you actually complaining about D&D 3.5 because of the video games based on it? Blame the developers for that, not the system, which is about a million times better than anything that crackpot Gygax could ever come up with.

[reimomo]

Dude, are you actually complaining about D&D 3.5 because of the video games based on it? Blame the developers for that, not the system, which is about a million times better than anything that crackpot Gygax could ever come up with.

DND 3+ is about what you can do, not who you are. From a CRPG standpoint, the mechanics are still revoltingly bad. From a PnP standpoint, there are dozens of games out there with settings that are actually interesting and/or compelling, as opposed to the "oh look a beholder, let me kill it with my drow fighter/rogue" yawn fest DND has become. Feats + a consistent "negative=bad positive=good" stat system doesn't make DND3.5 "good" by any means. Hell, go read your epic level handbook, or roll up your mind-flayer character with the monster handbook-whatever if you want to... the lengths to which the entire system goes to add "variety" to races/classes/prestige classes is just proof to me even WOtC knows how shallow and uninteresting the actual game is.

/rantoff

If you love it, go to town. But my criticisms are far from based on the CRPG's... DDO is just a good example of what happens when WOtC touches anything.

[Heretic Machine]

DND 3+ is about what you can do, not who you are. From a CRPG standpoint, the mechanics are still revoltingly bad. From a PnP standpoint, there are dozens of games out there with settings that are actually interesting and/or compelling, as opposed to the "oh look a beholder, let me kill it with my drow fighter/rogue" yawn fest DND has become. Feats + a consistent "negative=bad positive=good" stat system doesn't make DND3.5 "good" by any means. Hell, go read your epic level handbook, or roll up your mind-flayer character with the monster handbook-whatever if you want to... the lengths to which the entire system goes to add "variety" to races/classes/prestige classes is just proof to me even WOtC knows how shallow and uninteresting the actual game is.

/rantoff

If you love it, go to town. But my criticisms are far from based on the CRPG's... DDO is just a good example of what happens when WOtC touches anything.

What does setting have to do with the system itselft? You can apply whatever setting you want to it, or just slide into another D20 game since most have interchangable rules. I think it is pretty great, for a combat heavy RPG. Not my favorite, mind you, but it is a HUGE improvment over 2nd ED.

[donkeydrop]

Also keep in mind that Bioware isn't doing NWN2, Obsidian is. The guys who do nothing but pick up projects that Bioware passes on.

My understanding was that Obsidian was essentially a sub-contractor of Bioware as they were with KOTOR 2.

It was more hope than reality, but I'd love to see Bioware take on Atari the way Valve did with Vivendi and essentially force them to share the publishing profits. Atari is desperate for cash just the way Vivendi was, so Bioware would have some leverage.

[ProfPuppet]

oh my god.

There was going to be a Dragonlance module?

You just ruined me. I had no idea, and at this point, I was better off.

They were also adding horses to NWN1.

Hopefully, though I don't play NWN, someone puts the content out via bittorrent or something and they never catch the releaser. More than that though, I hope the people working on the official NWN1 mods find better jobs at a better company.

Atari's response sounds like they hired the White House Press Secretary. "I won't comment on what you asked about, so here's some bullshit to distract you until your attention fades and you forget about what we did."

[codswallop]

some stuff (http://www.evilavatar.com/forums/showpost.php?p=294742&postcount=5)
a lot more stuff (http://www.evilavatar.com/forums/showpost.php?p=294748&postcount=6)
I stand corrected, it does quite rude to shut down projects nearing completion; unless they will be integrated into NWN2, which I can then understand even though I see why people would be annoyed.

[DubiousQuality]

Well perhaps DLA should have released their mod 2+ years ago when at the time they kept repeting that it was "coming soon!" and rideable horse are "coming soon!" over and over. Personally I consider them overrated since most of their members released content was before they were even part of DLA, Lisa's downloads being a good example. Not that I agree with Infograms/Atari plug pulling an almost done PM, since hey more mods are always good in my eyes. But to whine and cry about being such victims seems par for the course for DLA.

Not to mention being outright slanderous towards Obsidien and the NWN2 project which imo is uncalled for when they haven't had any personal time with the toolset to say one way or the other.

Little background check too, Obsidien is made up of MANY former Black Isle employees, yes that same studio who produced all of Bio's original titles back in the Interplay days. To state that they take titles that Bioware passed on is a laughable statement. Both studios are buddy buddy which is why there is so many titles shared and offered to the other when one's got too many projects to take on new Sku's, Bioware just happened to have more on their plates at the time of Kotor2 and NWN2.

From every E3 report I read the NWN2 toolset is easier to use and just as robust as the first game which is a plus if you ask me. And really I don't blame a struggling Atari for not wanting to support a 4 year old game when they have a sequel in the pipe nearing ship.

[PIPBoy3000]

DLA (http://www.dladventures.com) will be releasing their module, with horses, for free this Summer. It's likely that horses were the sticking point here. Rideable horses were recently cut from NWN2, and having them show up in NWN wasn't something Atari wanted to see. It's sort of like older versions of Microsoft Word competing with newer ones.

I don't think anyone is particularly upset that support for NWN is going away. Everyone was aware that the next patch would be the last. What's troubling is that Atari, who holds the license, was unwilling to give permission for the premium modules in development to be released. It was done with horrible timing, the Friday before E3, perhaps in an attempt to distract folks with the E3 news. Now we get this press release that reads more like an advertisement than an answer.

That being said, I'm very much planning on getting NWN2. The folks at Obsidian are great guys and I've been very much impressed with what's been shown of NWN2 so far. I think what we're seeing are desparate attempts by Atari to maximize cash flow by any means possible, even if it means making a bunch of people upset.

[nonchalance]

That being said, I'm very much planning on getting NWN2. The folks at Obsidian are great guys and I've been very much impressed with what's been shown of NWN2 so far. I think what we're seeing are desparate attempts by Atari to maximize cash flow by any means possible, even if it means making a bunch of people upset.

Interesting point - the people who will be most upset are the people who are hardcore fans, and who will buy the game regardless of this shit - this is shit, and it makes me lose that bit more respect for Atari.

Despite that, if people like you are still on the NWN2 bandwagon, and we see mods at the quality of Dreamcatchers in the new game, I'm in.

[Voodoo]

#1 Horses are already available and have been for quite a while for NWN 1
#2 Ships are also available for NWN 1
#3 World maps are available for NWN 1
#4 MySQL Support has been available for NWN 1 for years

Done by Bioware? NOPE. Done by the community. Can Atari stop the community support for NWN 1? NOPE.

For example, the recent premium module named Infinite Dungeons is the 10th version of a already popular COMMUNITY module series named Eldrin's Random Dungeon Generator (http://nwvault.ign.com/View.php?view=modules.Detail&id=3885). This premium module isn't some brand new ability for NWN 1. It is an ability that has been available in the game through the community regardless of funding by Atari or whomever.

NWN 2 will be great because it will have a much cleaner ability to mod than NWN 1. And just because Obsidian doesn't include something with NWN 2 (as with Bioware's NWN 1) doesn't mean it will not be available by the community which has a passion about making such things.

Yeah Atari sucks about all of this but they are a business. But one thing the CAN NOT STOP is the community who's efforts will always be full of passion and love for the game, something Atari or any other grand producer will never quite comprehend.

Finally, YES Obsidian cut rideable horses from NWN 2 but this does not mean they will not be made available by the community. NWN 2 is very mod friendly in comparison to NWN 1 and I can imagine some very interesting things showing up.

[PacerDawn]

Finally, YES Obsidian cut rideable horses from NWN 2...
To me, this reeks of future "micro transactions"...

"Oooh, that's a really cool feature! Lets cut it from the final release and sell it as an add-on later!"

This is why I have been wary of the micro-transaction system... IMHO, it is quite possible that developers will start looking at their games, deciding what the best features are, CUTTING THEM OUT, and then adding (selling) them back in later as premium micro expansions.

[Demo_Boy]

This is not new behaviour for "Atari". When UT2k4 came out they pulled the plug on teh master server for multiplayer Unreal 2 XMP. Reason? They wanted to condense players into UT2K4 and push more units. wtf for players that bought U2 just for XMP? The community was just starting to form.

XMP may have been a bit laggy, but in terms of mechanics it was the most evolved form of Team Fortress I've ever played. So good.

The rigamarole that ensued guaranteed that the XMP community shrank to the diehards and Legend was subsequently liquidated.

I bet its the same guy who axed the mods. Someone at "Atari" is thinking in a narrow, calculated way and it cuts a swath of destruction in gaming a mile wide.

[Leaving Hope]

I stand corrected ...

I really respect you for that. You've got the balls to admit you may have overlooked something, or maybe someone else's point is valid.

Grow some cajones like Codswallop, Atari. You screwed DLA, and it's time you took responsibility for it instead of dodging the issue.

[Tohoya]

I will promise to buy 3 copies if Bioware has some cojones and uses Steam or some other online distribution service to screw Atari.

Actually, Bioware isn't even making NWN2. That's obsidian. If you're looking forward to the spiritual successor of NWN, in the sense of an excellent mod engine with a dedicated community, look for Dragon Age instead.

[Tohoya]

DND 3+ is about what you can do, not who you are. From a CRPG standpoint, the mechanics are still revoltingly bad. From a PnP standpoint, there are dozens of games out there with settings that are actually interesting and/or compelling, as opposed to the "oh look a beholder, let me kill it with my drow fighter/rogue" yawn fest DND has become.

If your game has become a hack-n-slash yawnfest, it's your own damn fault for running a cruddy campaign. No matter how good the system is, a cruddy DM will ruin it.

And secondly, "revoltingly bad from a CRPG standpoint?" I couldn't disagree with you more. D&D has the single most compelling character generator that I've ever seen; I enjoyed plotting out my characters' growth in D&D way more than I enjoyed it in FFT and Diablo 2, and that's saying something.

[reimomo]

If your game has become a hack-n-slash yawnfest, it's your own damn fault for running a cruddy campaign. No matter how good the system is, a cruddy DM will ruin it.

And secondly, "revoltingly bad from a CRPG standpoint?" I couldn't disagree with you more. D&D has the single most compelling character generator that I've ever seen; I enjoyed plotting out my characters' growth in D&D way more than I enjoyed it in FFT and Diablo 2, and that's saying something.

You lost me at CRPG -> D2. I've seen an interview where one of the original devs refers to D2 as a "loot pinata"... which can be fun as hell, but isn't exactly RPG.

[Roc Ingersol]

They cut off the content when it was still being made. More packs were nearing release.
Did they cut off the content? Or are they just gonna port it over to NWN2?

I'd much rather have premium modules ready to go when NWN2 drops, than have the same content drought NWN1's community struggled through.

[Planetbuster]

It is a damn shame I won't be buying NWN2 after this.

Ok so they make a new version of a game we all loved and your whining about it? They have to stop support at some point to make the next game. I re-installed NWN 1 a while back and I must say the graphics look like turd balls. Why you people wanna keep using that engine is beyond me. If upgrading the game makes you go away, well ive never heard sumthin so retarded....... :eek:

[torrefaction]

well ive never heard sumthin so retarded....... :eek:

This is the sound of a fool who didn't read the thread. For instance, read codswallop's post. The one where he said this is a bunch of crap. You should maybe pick up some reading comprehension skills before insulting people.

It's not about dropping support, it's about cutting off finished modules.

[torrefaction]

DLA (http://www.dladventures.com) will be releasing their module, with horses, for free this Summer.

Can you post where you got this info? I can't find anything from them saying this. Although now that I think about it, I think you posted on their forums saying you were going to continue mod development for Dark Waters? So maybe your more connected to the issue than I am.

[neblig]

Today there will be an Obsidian NWN2 IRC Chat (http://nwvault.ign.com/fullstory.php?id=17877). This is a great opportunity for anyone who would like to discuss this issue and learn more about Neverwinter Nights 2 and its Toolset straight from the developers at Obsidian Entertainment.

I'll see you there at 6pm PST! :)

Tony Evans
Senior Designer
Obsidian Entertainment

[PIPBoy3000]

This is a good start when reading about DLA's The Wyvern Crown of Cormyr module:
http://nwvault.ign.com/fullstory.php?id=17794
It even has pretty pictures. You can go over to DLA's site (http://dladventures.com/) for other goodies.

As an aside - Tony hangs out on EvilAvatar? Gee, they let anyone in. :)

Not sure if I'll make tonight's chat, but I'll do it if I can. It's usually a measure of how well I can distract the children after dinner.

[neblig]

As an aside - Tony hangs out on EvilAvatar? Gee, they let anyone in. :)

I don't post often, but I read EvilAvatar almost every day, as do several other Obsidianites. I actually heard about EA years ago from Erik Novales, the main programmer responsible for NWN2's awesome Toolset.

[Voodoo]

I don't post often, but I read EvilAvatar almost every day, as do several other Obsidianites. I actually heard about EA years ago from Erik Novales, the main programmer responsible for NWN2's awesome Toolset.
Awesome! Good to see you around. :) The Midgard Community can't wait for NWN 2.

[PIPBoy3000]

Ah, blame Erik. Come for the news, stay for the attitude.

I personally have been pleased at the number of developers who lurk around EA. On occasion I'll find tidbits of information or personal opinions that don't show up in press releases.