Girl Gamers: Gaming From A Different Point Of View

[TomO]

Pro-G (http://www.pro-g.co.uk) has posted a feature looking at women and video games (http://www.pro-g.co.uk/features/article/26-05-2006-93.html). The article includes comments from Aleks Krotoski, die-hard female gamer, academic and author of the white paper Chicks and Joysticks, plus Robin McShaffry, female co-founder of the game industry recruiter Mary-Margaret.com and Robin Harper, senior vice president of community and support at Linden Lab, the company behind Second Life.
"Women are very busy," says McShaffry. "When they do take the free time to play a game, they want it to serve some purpose. Maybe they're playing Soduku, and they feel like they're making themselves smarter, like playing Tetris. Sitting and playing a brainless game for hours on end is not something a lot of women have time for."
Full article (http://www.pro-g.co.uk/features/article/26-05-2006-93.html)

[PacoTaco]

First of all, "crap" is entirely subjective... and there's no basis for why women are somehow magically more busy than men are. Maybe they're just not as exausted from an ass-numbing day at the office as we men are and therefore aren't interested in unwinding on a "mindless" first person shooter.

Oh, and if the game industry turns into a steaming pile of "gender neutral" karaoke games I'm going to kill myself.

[absolut taco]

"Gaming From A Different Point Of View"

What view is that? From the kitchen? Sorry everyone, couldn't help it. Pathetic attempt at humor.

[Rirath]

First of all, "crap" is entirely subjective... and there's no basis for why women are somehow magically more busy than men are. Maybe they're just not as exausted from an ass-numbing day at the office as we men are and therefore aren't interested in unwinding on a "mindless" first person shooter.

Oh, and if the game industry turns into a steaming pile of "gender neutral" karaoke games I'm going to kill myself.

Amen to that whole post. Thankfully, it won't happen. The whole concept of Second Life bores me to tears. If that's what they consider good gaming, they can have it. I'll stick with my FPS. Playing Sodoku (not soduku) or Tetris isn't going to make anyone smarter no more than playing Doom 3 is going to make me react quicker. The 'training' is minute.

[DevDict]

I am sorry but this article is stupid.
It's laughable. On one side we got the Frag Dolls which are synthetic mannequins created from the ideals of gullible and naive nerds. On the other hand, we get Lady "games-are-beneath-my-contempt" McShaffry. This article is one huge stereotype based on one or two observations.

[Serapth]

"Gaming From A Different Point Of View"

What view is that? From the kitchen? Sorry everyone, couldn't help it. Pathetic attempt at humor.


No... either from on their backs, or on bended knee's. Atleast, those are the positions I prefer my girl gamers in.

Yeah, im going to hell... oh well, nothing new.

[Serapth]

Oh, and to anyone that says "Oh don't say that, we need more women gamers"

I reply... do we, do we really? I think not. Women that want to accept gaming as gaming is, hey, all the power to you. If there is a signifigant enough market segment to make women oriented games... heh, all the power to you aswell. If you want to change what I enjoy to be more accomidating to "the gentler sex", frankly... go fuck yourself.

That is all. (http://www.bitchmakemeasandwich.com/)

[Returner]

Has anybody gone up against the fag dolls? I always hear that they suck no pun intended. I was just curious if they are actualy any good.

[Sensei-X]

Very worthless article, the whole stupid thing is just flame-bait at best. I forwarded the article to a few women I know who play games and one of them replied "Sounds like a guy wrote it to start some controversy, oh and Second Life sucks unless you're some pervert who wants to cyber and look at polygon boobs all day."

[Returner]

"As the Frag Dolls pout, the game industry continues to struggle. Most game designers simply cannot understand why blood, guts, dragons and spells do not appeal to a female audience."

It's not that we don't understand its we don't give a shit. When the most people who buys games are males why should we cater to females.

[Hemloco]

I really have never cared about women in video games.

I'm primarily interested in HOT women who like video games and would spend time with me. I'm currently in the process of building an ability to attract them consistently. They're such a rare find though, so I practice on non-gaming girls.

[Megalith]

Women are lazy and stupid.

[Dag-Sabot]

Women are lazy and stupid.
-But they make up for it in the snuggling dept.

[Zurik]

This sounds like one of those "We want equality" when they really mean that they want special treatment and attention.

[nonchalance]

Sitting and playing a brainless game for hours on end is not something a lot of women have time for.
The Sims? It's probably the most successful gender-neutral game yet, and it's pretty fucking brainless.

I'm all for more gender-neutral games, and I'm all for girls playing games - but this article is a piece of shit.

[Grifter]

This site is so much better when everyone agrees to hate.
Sometimes I wonder why I keep coming back to EvAv then I read threads like this and it all comes Rolling back.

EvAv, don't ever change.

[serion]

"All I really have to do is get to the next room," says Krotoski, "kill that bad guy; if I don't kill the bad guy then I die, and I don't have the time or the patience. I don't like games that slap you on the back of the hand and say, "no sorry you're not good enough." I have enough going on in my life. I can go elsewhere and be told I'm rubbish."

Warning-----Misogynistic Viewpoint-------Warning

Women don't like being slapped on the back of the hand for not strictly following the game's "script?" How do guys feel when they are bitched out or given the silent treatment for a whole weekend because they did the laundry before they started the dishes?? Maybe its just that men would rather be told that they are rubbish by a game they can eventually beat than by a woman they can't escape.

...Don't have the time? Sorry, hunny, more women than men are stay-at-homes, and I can get everything that needs to be done around the house done in about 2 hours. That leaves what, like 6 more hours that the man is still at work? Get gaming!

[F3nyx]

This site is so much better when everyone agrees to hate.
Sometimes I wonder why I keep coming back to EvAv then I read threads like this and it all comes Rolling back.

EvAv, don't ever change.Yeah I love hypermasculine circlejerks too, oh wait

[becks]

most of these articles about how to get girls/women more interested in gaming are pretty shallow. A lot of it starts with stereotypes & assumptions that people have about girls going back to childhood- when i was growing up girls were not seen as being good at or interested in electronics in general, and so were not encouraged to participate- girls who expressed an interest in video games (like myself) were made fun of and seen as nerds or tomboys. so it really takes a unique and independent personality to not go along with the peer pressure & images that the media, parents, & other adults encourage for girls.

And i don't buy the whole "don't have time" argument, i know several women who play MMO's including myself and those take a ton of time... also how do people have enough time to watch tv or read a book?

[nonchalance]

And i don't buy the whole "don't have time" argument, i know several women who play MMO's including myself and those take a ton of time... also how do people have enough time to watch tv or read a book?

Absolutely. And doesn't WOW have one of the highest rates of female subscribers? Dragons, blood, sorcery and all?

[Wedge]

I am currently at the end of writing my master paper about women and games. I have interviewed a total of 12 gaming females; 6 between the age of 13-18, and 6 over 18. My guess is that neither of them would have liked this article. It is just another article that makes girls who like games the way they are feel bad, and "ungirly".

I'll write some more on the topic tomorrow. It is 03:35 AM here, I've had 4 fucking clanmatches in a row in GRAW, and my brain is fried.

[Zeal]

Girls don't play games, ok.

[Rook34]

I guess I'm lucky. My wife likes games. Granted a lot of her games she likes is stuff like Harvest Moon, Jurrassic park, but then she also loves Diablo, Baldurs Gate, etc. Spells, Dragons, blood and all. Games like God of War she feels almost crosses the line with the whole violence thing, but she understands why I like them and doesn't criticize me for them or turn her nose up at them if I'm playing.
Then my nephews girlfriend plays WOW, and is just as good, they often fight over the computer. Girls love a good waste of time just like we do.

[f1sh3r]

my mom sits and plays solitaire for hours on end so i'm not sure where that whole 'no time for brainless games' thing comes from.

[Thenetcase]

So does that mean my best friend's girlfriend is really a guy? She LOVES to sit and play story mode for **HOURS** in DOA4... And she absolutely loves any RTS on the market PLUS she loves to play all racing games.
Then of course.. she's a stay at home mom, which is probably something those sluts who wrote the article know virtually nothing about.

-TNC-

[mightbe]

Sometimes I have trouble seeing over my vagina.

[Pinku!]

Dammit I'm sick of these "female gamer" articles.

You know what? I'm a female, and I game. I don't feel I deserve special treatment. I'm ok with big-breasted heroines since I'm stacked and as long as the guys are hawt too. I understand fully that gaming is a majority male hobby and I'm most definitely in the minority. And let's face it, most, if not all female-oriented games are insulting (I'm looking at you, Barbie Horse Adventure).

From my perspective as a female the sole reason most women don't game is because to be honest most females are vapid and vain and care WAY too much about what others think of them. Think they'll want to participate in something with a geeky stigma? I think not. Me? I embrace my geekiness. I wish more women would quit giving a crap what others think and embrace theirs too. Embrace it, but not throw it in people's faces (insert any "I am woman hear me roar" group) because that doesn't help either.

Dammit dammit dammit. This is exactly why most of my friends are guys. >_< That and I like to pad myself in big protective guys who'd beat the shit out of anyone that messes with me..hehe.

/rant off

[Thenetcase]

Dammit I'm sick of these "female gamer" articles.

You know what? I'm a female, and I game. I don't feel I deserve special treatment. I'm ok with big-breasted heroines since I'm stacked and as long as the guys are hawt too. I understand fully that gaming is a majority male hobby and I'm most definitely in the minority. And let's face it, most, if not all female-oriented games are insulting (I'm looking at you, Barbie Horse Adventure).

From my perspective as a female the sole reason most women don't game is because to be honest most females are vapid and vain and care WAY too much about what others think of them. Think they'll want to participate in something with a geeky stigma? I think not. Me? I embrace my geekiness. I wish more women would quit giving a crap what others think and embrace theirs too. Embrace it, but not throw it in people's faces (insert any "I am woman hear me roar" group) because that doesn't help either.

Dammit dammit dammit. This is exactly why most of my friends are guys. >_< That and I like to pad myself in big protective guys who'd beat the shit out of anyone that messes with me..hehe.

/rant off

I am a big protective guy. Do I count? LOL

/troll

[Wedge]

Dammit I'm sick of these "female gamer" articles.

You know what? I'm a female, and I game. I don't feel I deserve special treatment. I'm ok with big-breasted heroines since I'm stacked and as long as the guys are hawt too. I understand fully that gaming is a majority male hobby and I'm most definitely in the minority. And let's face it, most, if not all female-oriented games are insulting (I'm looking at you, Barbie Horse Adventure).

From my perspective as a female the sole reason most women don't game is because to be honest most females are vapid and vain and care WAY too much about what others think of them. Think they'll want to participate in something with a geeky stigma? I think not. Me? I embrace my geekiness. I wish more women would quit giving a crap what others think and embrace theirs too. Embrace it, but not throw it in people's faces (insert any "I am woman hear me roar" group) because that doesn't help either.

Dammit dammit dammit. This is exactly why most of my friends are guys. >_< That and I like to pad myself in big protective guys who'd beat the shit out of anyone that messes with me..hehe.

/rant off


This is basically what the majority of my interviewies said as well.

[Serapth]

I am a big protective guy. Do I count? LOL

/troll


You realize she said Pad herself with big guys... not sleep with!

She did hit on the biggest reason I see of girls hating the gaming thing. Women (atleast western world ) are BRUTAL with pack mentality. Yeah, guys have peer pressure that drives us to do stupid shit, but for some reason women simply define themselves by their peers. Nothing can be worse then not comforming with your peer group.

Sadly, unlike with males, it seems to continue past school to a much worse degree then it does with men. Its odd, watching women in the work force they are both best of friends and worst of enemies. I have seen ( countless ) good female friends in a work environment both boost each other up when they are down, then stab each other in the back. God im glad im not a professional woman, doesnt look like a nice life.

But the flipside is, most women I know that are into gaming, hang out with men mostly. ( Is this the definition of tom-boy? ). Suddenly, that pressure to conform gets lifted and lo and behold, they like the same shit we do.

[Wedge]

This article (http://girlstech.douglass.rutgers.edu/PDF/GirlsAndGaming.pdf) collects many findings from research about girls and gaming.

[mister_slim]

You know, guys, if you're so threatened by women maybe you should date men?

[ProfPuppet]

We gave you Barbie Horse Adventures and this is how you thank us? Women...

I kid, I kid. "Women are more interested in good games," says McShaffry. "And women are less interested in crap." Really. Maybe the teenage male market is pushing crap games because they have disposable income, a lot of free time, and they aren't busy being as social, or they use games as social events. I don't know any guy that goes "This game is shit, I can't wait to play it for 20 more hours."

The article was one big 'You don't understand us. Your penis makes you like stupid, stupid things. It's all your fault.' Well, hell, make your own gaming company and make a game you think girls would like. I don't like a lot of the games that come out, but I don't blame it on gender, I blame it on market forces and how tough it is for the industry to make more original content that doesn't wither and die.

The 'I can't see over my vagina' comment made me laugh.

[Wasson_]

I've been called a "sexist" because I told some people they were retarded for wanting female skins for....Battlefield 1942.

[niakori]

This article sucks, that chick sucks and anyone related to the online whoring sim, aka Second Life sucks. Oh and you guys suck too.
Fuck you all.

I'm angsty.

Really, So what? I play games, I started with FPS and moved on to RTS and RPG's. My best friend defines the stereotype of girly but she hates the gender neutral games I sometime endure and would rather have a decent RPG or MUD anyday. This isn't new, and its offending to women gamers who would rather blend in with the woodwork and PLAY.
Reason why? All of the above.

[Wasson_]

Awww....don't get mad.

Look, Puppies!
http://www.owt.com/hillview/puppies.jpg

[niakori]

I'm not mad :)
I'm seething with hate. But it's not unusual.

oh.
/kicks puppies

[H.Bogard]

I'm not mad :)
I'm seething with hate. But it's not unusual.

oh.
/kicks puppies


uhm... (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oekLGRXTD4Y&search=kicks%20dog)
omgmsg2shrtlol!

[mightbe]

I have serious medical issues here and Bogard makes fun of me.

This is why I love Evil Avatar.

[Chameleo]

what you're niakori?

[superherotaco]

You know, guys, if you're so threatened by women maybe you should date men?

I dunno, gay men over all (not all) usally have all the annoying female qualities, without the endearing ones to balance them out. Plus when you get to know gay guys, usually they turn out to be fags.

But in all seriousness, it's not that people are pissed off about women, it's these kind of articles that presume that all gaming should change to apeal to a broader demographic. If the demand is there, the supply will grow. And it's also stupid to imply games need to be different for women, I know a few female gamers who are happy with their adventure games, their first person shooters, if these games arn't "appealing to women" then what does that say about current female gamers?

[mister_slim]

But in all seriousness, it's not that people are pissed off about women, it's these kind of articles that presume that all gaming should change to apeal to a broader demographic. If the demand is there, the supply will grow.
So maybe you can show me where in the article that assumption is made? All I see are some very common sense generalizations, confirmed by market research, that women and men find different things interesting. Some women are going to be attracted by Gears of War. Some men are going to be attracted by a pink GBA. In the aggregate, we know that mainstream console gaming is not that attractive to women. Notice how MS is pushing Live Arcade and Nintendo is pushing Touch Generations? They can read the survey results.
And it's also stupid to imply games need to be different for women, I know a few female gamers who are happy with their adventure games, their first person shooters, if these games arn't "appealing to women" then what does that say about current female gamers?
And there are men who enjoy having a penis in their rectum. Anecdotal evidence can't be generalized to the whole female population.

[niakori]

what you're niakori?

No but he likes to sneak into my head.