A Microsoft Portable Gaming System [Archive]

bapenguin

03-20-2006, 05:28 AM

It didn't take long, but Microsoft is now going to jump into the portable gaming arena. At least, according to Dean Takahashi (http://blogs.mercurynews.com/aei/2006/03/microsofts_plan.html).

In a bid to capture the huge audience for handheld entertainment gadgets, Microsoft is designing a product that combines video games, music and video in one handheld device, according to sources familiar with the project.

The Microsoft product would compete with Sony, Nintendo and Apple Computer's products, including the iPod. And Microsoft has some of its most seasoned talent from the division that created its popular Xbox 360 working on it. Game executive J Allard leads the project, and its director is Greg Gibson, who was the system designer on the Xbox 360 video game console. Bryan Lee, the finance chief on the Xbox business, is leading the business side of the project.
Here's something that would be sweet. What if the portable system allowed you to copy those Live Arcade titles to it and bring it on the go? If it doesn't do something like this to distinguish itself from the PSP, or come up with something unique to compete with the DS, what's the point?

GunnyMo

03-20-2006, 05:30 AM

That's an excellent idea, ba. If you can transfer live arcade games back and forth on their system I would get it. Compatability between the 360 would be fantastic.

KamaItachi

03-20-2006, 05:32 AM

Make it a portable 360 Hard Drive that plays Live arcade games and I'm sold. As long as it's not too expensive.

MasterEvilAce

03-20-2006, 05:42 AM

XPod, maybe?

AniAko

03-20-2006, 05:44 AM

Personally I love my iPod and I've never used my PSP for watching videos, so I'm not interested in the "All-in-wonder" solution of a Portable media system. However portable LIVE arcade will sell me fast. Something tells me sleek design will be an afterthought. It'll probably start off as big as the Atari Lynx ;)

bean19

03-20-2006, 05:51 AM

Make it also work as a PDA and a cellphone and I might be sold. Right now I find myself lugging around too many expensive electronics already.

AniAko

03-20-2006, 06:00 AM

Make it also work as a PDA and a cellphone and I might be sold. Right now I find myself lugging around too many expensive electronics already.

Cellphone functionality would be nice, but I think it would make the gadget really expensive or not very portable. Functionality always takes precednece. So you'll have a 2lbs cellphone, looking much like a 360 controller that you turn on it's side to talk as a phone with a 5 inch WUXGA screen where the dashboard button used to be

fitbabits

03-20-2006, 06:03 AM

Please, Microsoft, unless you're going to bring something new and innovative to the table, do not enter the handheld market. It's already dominated by Nintendo (and Sony to a lesser extent) - focus on the Xbox 360 while you have the window of opportunity caused by the PS3 delay.

Balthasar

03-20-2006, 06:04 AM

Here's something that would be sweet. What if the portable system allowed you to copy those Live Arcade titles to it and bring it on the go? If it doesn't do something like this to distinguish itself from the PSP, or come up with something unique to compete with the DS, what's the point?
That actually would not distinguish it from the PSP at all, as Sony will be rolling out some sort of download service to get old PS1 titles to play on the PSP. I am making the leap that if they're going to do something like that, they would likely look to have other titles not previously released on the PS1 available for download as well. I'm still not on board the PSP bandwaggon yet, but something like this makes it a lot more enticing. Playing Final Fantasy Tactics on a handheld screen like that would be heaven.

Also, I want to hear all the people that bashed the PSP on the grounds of it being a convergent device do the same to this supposed offering by Microsoft.

bone_matrix

03-20-2006, 06:06 AM

Cellphone + game system = Crap. Trust me, after owning an N-gage, its nice to be able to play games, but its sorta like a PSP, not many games are worth it. Actually, its even worse for the N-gage.

I do like your idea BAP, and if it could play downloadable Xbox games? (Probably a stretch), and have a decent music player? I'd drop cash on it. Cash I don't have.

bean19

03-20-2006, 06:10 AM

Cellphone functionality would be nice, but I think it would make the gadget really expensive or not very portable. Functionality always takes precednece. So you'll have a 2lbs cellphone, looking much like a 360 controller that you turn on it's side to talk as a phone with a 5 inch WUXGA screen where the dashboard button used to be

I was thinking I'd hook up an earpiece/headset like other people do on their PDA-phones.

Still, I don't really NEED this at all. I just would like to only carry around one electronic device. . . but that ain't going to happen anyway. The DS is really good.

AniAko

03-20-2006, 06:16 AM

I was thinking I'd hook up an earpiece/headset like other people do on their PDA-phones.

:D Indeed, just a jab at the old Taco phone days.......

I think *** can pull off a good cellphone + game system. It would run Windows Mobile, which already includes audio and video support (and camera). Then with the XNA project, they can port games designed for windows, and the 360 directly to the portable system. Hell you might buy a copy of software once and play it on all three. *** isn't done shrinking the world yet....

Balthasar

03-20-2006, 06:20 AM

I do like your idea BAP, and if it could play downloadable Xbox games? (Probably a stretch), and have a decent music player? I'd drop cash on it. Cash I don't have.
If the 360 can't play many XBox games, how could you reasonably expect a portable to do so?

kizke

03-20-2006, 06:20 AM

Better not be a piece of shit, misconstrued idea like Origami.

GigaFuzz

03-20-2006, 06:29 AM

What if the portable system allowed you to copy those Live Arcade titles to it and bring it on the go?

Geometry Wars on a handheld? If that happened, that would tempt me into the handheld market, something I've normally stayed away from.

bapenguin

03-20-2006, 06:29 AM

That actually would not distinguish it from the PSP at all, as Sony will be rolling out some sort of download service to get old PS1 titles to play on the PSP.

This would be different because you buy the title once on your 360, and then you can play it on your 360 or on your portable system. Granted, Sony MAY offer this on their online service with PS1 titles so you can play them on either system, we simply don't know the details.

Roc Ingersol

03-20-2006, 06:32 AM

Phone functionality's easy: throw in bluetooth. With a wireless headset, the 'brick' just stays in your pocket.

The perfect geek device would be effectively a general purpose computer + cellphone. Big screen, PDA functionality, games, music, movies, 802.11g & data storage. And while that would kick fucking ass, I don't see it happening.

They're gonna make a PSP knockoff.
What they should do, is make a DS-meets-ipod knockoff.
games, games, games - with music and movies as an afterthought.

AniAko

03-20-2006, 06:36 AM

Doctor Setebos

03-20-2006, 06:55 AM

That's funny. This sounds just like something Microsoft already announced weeks ago (http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/umpc/default.mspx).

AniAko

03-20-2006, 07:00 AM

That's funny. This sounds just like something Microsoft already announced weeks ago.

The mobile PC is cool, but I don't think *** would be foolish enough to try and market that as a portable gaming system. Even a slimmed down version. Of course whatever they build will be built on Windows Mobile technology, probably with Media Center built in, or at least the Media Center Xpander.

NoName

03-20-2006, 07:02 AM

That's funny. This sounds just like something Microsoft already announced weeks ago (http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/umpc/default.mspx).
That's what it sounds like to me. Just change the marketing spin you can go from portable computer to portable game device. Hopefully any hand held gaming device wouldn't have such a large price tag though.

bapenguin

03-20-2006, 07:10 AM

That's funny. This sounds just like something Microsoft already announced weeks ago (http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/umpc/default.mspx).

That's a PC. This is a gaming device.

see colon

03-20-2006, 08:14 AM

Geometry Wars on a handheld? If that happened, that would tempt me into the handheld market, something I've normally stayed away from.
i've never understood the massive draw to geometry wars. i kept hearing how innovative, fresh, and retro it was (can something be all 3), but when i played it it ended up just being robotron/smashTV with shinier graphics. is it fun? yep. would i buy a system for it? nope.

That's a PC. This is a gaming device.
is there a difference? who here doesn't use their PC as a gaming device? hell, even my mom does.

RevGored

03-20-2006, 08:15 AM

You know, I saw the headline, and I was like 'oh wow, a new handheld go Microsoft bring some competition to the table' then I looked at my PSP collection with 2 games in it and I made a sad face and realized that, on a very realistic scale, this may bring a small bit of competition to the 'WE NEED CONSOLE PORTS' crowd, but I don't think MS is going to be able to get it right inasmuch as a portable gaming device goes.

Roc Ingersol

03-20-2006, 08:30 AM

They don't need to concentrate on the media side. *** already has that part done.
That's why I said afterthought. Point is, they should hype games and gaming. Preferably with full-on XBLive functionality.

That it could play video and music is a given. I was talking about what they hype, and what they spend cash on pushing to the consumer. E.g. don't tie the thing to their iTunes competitor and try to sell it as somewhere to watch the Sopranos and listen to generic pop music.

UnderHero5

03-20-2006, 08:53 AM

Sounds like a different spin on "The Ultra-Mobile PC" to me too.

"A new way to play
Enjoy PC and Internet games in new ways with touch, stylus, or hardware controls."

Doctor Setebos

03-20-2006, 08:58 AM

That's a PC. This is a gaming device.
I agree with See Colon -- how is that different? You don't play games on your PC? Like NoName said, it's all in the marketing. I can just about guarantee Microsoft will create multiple versions of those Mobile PCs, for different 'flavors' of users. Home media types, business people, and--more than likely--gamers. Recall the multiple 'flavors' of Windows Vista? You just watch. :D

AniAko

03-20-2006, 09:12 AM

In the past, all of Microsoft's efforts to compete have fallen short. The company considered making an ""Xboy'' game player a few years ago but shelved the idea. It considered making a game handheld at the same time it devised plans for the Xbox 360 in 2002 and 2003, but it again decided to delay its entry.
Meanwhile, Microsoft's efforts in PocketPC handhelds and Portable Media Players have fallen short in competition with the iPod. Last week, Microsoft unveiled Project Origami, a handheld Windows computer. But that device isn't targeted on pure entertainment as the Xplayer is. The existence of these other projects suggests that there is still some infighting within Microsoft about its best approach to portable gadgets.

I really think they mean to MAKE a brand new product, not re-hash the Origami

TrackZero

03-20-2006, 09:26 AM

That's a PC. This is a gaming device.

Origami has Halo running on it. So it's ANOTHER portable device they're talking about? Somehow I think someones getting their wires crossed here.

bapenguin

03-20-2006, 09:47 AM

Origami has Halo running on it. So it's ANOTHER portable device they're talking about? Somehow I think someones getting their wires crossed here.

No, Origami doesn't have Halo running on it. In fact, they've confirmed it WON'T run Halo.

This is a gaming device first, everything else second device.
Oragami is a mini pc first, and a gaming device WAY down the line.

see colon

03-20-2006, 10:04 AM

No, Origami doesn't have Halo running on it. In fact, they've confirmed it WON'T run Halo.

This is a gaming device first, everything else second device.
Oragami is a mini pc first, and a gaming device WAY down the line.
a change in markitecture does not mean a change in architecture.

bapenguin

03-20-2006, 10:07 AM

is there a difference? who here doesn't use their PC as a gaming device? hell, even my mom does.

When i say the word Cellphone to you, what do you think of? Do you think of it as a gaming device?

When I say the words shiny toaster to you, do you think of a machine that makes toast, or do you think of a mirror?

When I said the word automobile to you, do you think of driving or do you think of listening to a killer audio system?

see colon

03-20-2006, 10:21 AM

When i say the word Cellphone to you, what do you think of? Do you think of it as a gaming device?

When I say the words shiny toaster to you, do you think of a machine that makes toast, or do you think of a mirror?

When I said the word automobile to you, do you think of driving or do you think of listening to a killer audio system?
and that's exactly the point, but you are missing it. how you market something and what something is capable of are 2 entirely different things. you could easily use said shiney toaster as a mirror. a company could try to sell it as a mirror, just like microsoft could try to sell project origami as a gaming device.

the examples you give are barely relevant. PC gaming is a large portion of the PC market. i don't know a single person (not buisness) who owns a PC and hasn't played a game on it. if you bought a portable PC would you expect it to not have any gaming abilities? not even solitaire and freecell?

Roc Ingersol

03-20-2006, 10:30 AM

just like microsoft could try to sell project origami as a gaming device.
If Microsoft tried to sell Origami as a portable consumer gaming machine they'd get laughed out of the fucking room.
Absurd size + 4 hour battery life = failure.

They would have to change the guts substantially.

bapenguin

03-20-2006, 10:34 AM

the examples you give are barely relevant. PC gaming is a large portion of the PC market. i don't know a single person (not business) who owns a PC and hasn't played a game on it. if you bought a portable PC would you expect it to not have any gaming abilities? not even solitaire and freecell?

Just because something can do it, doesn't make it it. That was my point. Origami, isn't and never was designed to play games. It was designed to be a productivity piece of hardware.

The device in question in this article, (the device doesn't even officially exist yet), is designed to be a gaming machine. Which means, aesthetics, functionality, battery life, marketing, etc will be geared towards gaming.

On this same token, we might as well have been saying Microsoft has been in portable gaming for years with the PocketPC.

Magnanimous Gnome

03-20-2006, 10:51 AM

Ugh, this is totally unnecessary. We don't need yet ANOTHER portable gadget on the market. I'm already sick of seeing stacks and stacks of PSP movies on the shelves. iPod accessories. DS. GBA. PDA. Cellphone. We don't need any more! Nintendo was doing a great job in the portable gaming market, and suddenly Sony and MS want it to go all "high tech" - ie everything with gaming as an afterthought and absurd battery life. No thanks.

MS' history with hardware devices is littered with dead ends.

see colon

03-20-2006, 11:24 AM

Just because something can do it, doesn't make it it. That was my point. Origami, isn't and never was designed to play games. It was designed to be a productivity piece of hardware.
and all of this time i thought your point was "when i say toaster do you think mirrior". you effectivly stated that the PC isn't a gaming platform. i said i don't know a single person (including my mom) who owns a PC and hasn't played a game on it. don't try to muck up this disagreement by chaning what you said or putting words into my mouth. i never said that this device was origami, only that if microsoft marketed origami as a gaming device that's what it would be. design would have little to do with it.

for example, the PS3 was designed with a blue ray drive to help sony win the high def format wars. does that mean PS3 isn't a gaming device?

we know little to nothing about how this product was designed (well i guess you do, bap, since you constantly remind us) or what hardware is under the hood. do you think microsoft is working on 2 seperate pieces of handheld hardware without the teams sharing some technology?

Sl1pstream

03-20-2006, 11:32 AM

But a lot of people have played games on their cellular phones, does that make them a gaming platform?

bapenguin

03-20-2006, 11:32 AM

and all of this time i thought your point was "when i say toaster do you think mirrior". you effectivly stated that the PC isn't a gaming platform.

I was never saying that.

we know little to nothing about how this product was designed (well i guess you do, bap, since you constantly remind us) or what hardware is under the hood. do you think microsoft is working on 2 seperate pieces of handheld hardware without the teams sharing some technology?

Did you even read the article? This is a new project from the ground up. Just because technology gets shared across divisions doesn't mean it becomes the same product. I'm not even sure what you are trying to argue anymore.

My point is simply this, Oragami is one thing. This is another. They are not the same device, at all. Sure they both have processors, screens, controls, etc etc, but they are not the same device. End of story.

Balthasar

03-20-2006, 01:02 PM

My point is simply this, Oragami is one thing. This is another. They are not the same device, at all. Sure they both have processors, screens, controls, etc etc, but they are not the same device. End of story.
Completely useless thread argument. Glad I'm not the one in the middle of it. ;)

see colon

03-20-2006, 01:15 PM

sigh...

yes i read the article. and there you go again, implying that i think these are the same device. i never said that. but the fact of the matter is we know little to nothing about both devices to say whats related to what.

But a lot of people have played games on their cellular phones, does that make them a gaming platform?
exactly!
NPD and other industry bookkeepers have looked at cellphone gaming with rosey eyes for a while now, but other than nokia noone has really stepped up to the plate and marketed their handsets as a gaming platform. the difference between an nGage (gaming device) and a standard symbian series 60 handset (a smartphone) has more to do with markitecture (including appearance) than architecture.

Atepsflame

03-20-2006, 01:17 PM

It would certainly invigorate the handheld market, maybe spur the developement of some more worthwhile titles for the PSP.

vivafletcher

03-20-2006, 01:18 PM

More options= good for the consumer. Bring it on and sell it at a loss so it's affordable.

Maybe that will kick Sony into high gear with the PSP, which is good for their owners. And Nintendo will have to fight harder to keep their market share. I see this news as being good for everyone.

motor

03-20-2006, 01:35 PM

I think there is a space for a microsoft device. As I see it, both the DS and the PSP have fatal flaws. For the PSP the disc drive is the flaw (you'll never have multiple day battery times with a mechanical component), and for the DS I think the pen interface makes it unusable for a truly on the go device (how do you use a pen and have good access to all of the buttons without putting it on the table?). To me the best hand-held device is still the GBA SP. But it is starting to look dated. If I were MS what I would build is a slightly larger and flater DS (the clamshell is a must for banging around), the has a big chunk of flash ram (a couple of gigs) and that has no cartridges. Make a combination recharging/ usb connector docking station. And sell all the games on-line. Then make a great portal / sync piece of software (like itunes, but better) that is intimately connected with the device. Be really generous about the "cut" you take and encourage home-brew through a great SDK and dev web-site (also make a way that you can play all of these games on your pc through some emulation). Make your game portal have two levels: Commercial games (that have been tested by Microsoft for a fee) and home-brew. Make a built-in flash (macromedia's flash that is) player so you can get all of those flash games with no porting and keep the price under $200. I think you'd do great in the market. You have to have some kind of 3d chip and a screen with about x2 the resolution of the GBA SP (maybe not twice the physical size, but at least little larger). Without a hard-drive or disc drive your cost will be cut somewhat and you can spend 90% of the cost on what is really important: Good cpu/3d chip, good screen.

bapenguin

03-20-2006, 01:53 PM

sigh...

yes i read the article. and there you go again, implying that i think these are the same device. i never said that. but the fact of the matter is we know little to nothing about both devices to say whats related to what.

exactly!
NPD and other industry bookkeepers have looked at cellphone gaming with rosey eyes for a while now, but other than nokia noone has really stepped up to the plate and marketed their handsets as a gaming platform. the difference between an nGage (gaming device) and a standard symbian series 60 handset (a smartphone) has more to do with markitecture (including appearance) than architecture.

I'm out of this argument because there is no argument, but I just wanted to point out we know tons about Origami, or should I say Ultra Mobile PC (http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/umpc/default.mspx)