Sony Appeal Denied in Immersion Suit

[fitbabits]

Thanks to Next Generation (http://www.next-gen.biz/) for the news (http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2473&Itemid=2).

Sony's latest attempt to appeal a $91 million force feedback patent judgment has been denied by a U.S. District Court judge.

By now, many are familiar with the generalities of the lawsuit involving Sony and haptic technology company Immersion. The force feedback technology company sued Microsoft and Sony in 2003 for infringing on two patents which were allegedly incorporated into controller technology, including Sony's DualShock. Microsoft settled out of court -- Sony stuck around to fight.

Long story short, Sony lost, and a judge ordered $82 million to be paid to Immersion, plus interest, which brought the total to over $90 million. Sony had been working to appeal the decision.

Now, The Wall Street Journal reports that Judge Claudia Wilken has rejected said appeal, and sided with Immersion. Sony's defense had most recently rested on the shoulders of Craig Thorner, a former consultant with Immersion. Sony claimed that Immersion was concealing evidence regarding Thorner and his apparent involvement with force feedback inventions and development. It was an attempt to invalidate the patents, but it didn't work, because of a conflict of interest that was revealed.
(Fictional) Sony Exec: 'It's okay, we can just add a dollar on to every Memory Stick we sell for the PSP. That should cover the cost nicely. And pay for our next trip to Hawaii.'

I wonder what implication (if any) this will have on the PS3 controller's features.

[Wonka]

I don't see any implications here for the PS3 controller. Sony will just buy their way out of this.

[Suicidal ShiZuru]

Maybe they had the whacked out prototype controller look so different until this crap was over... Maybe theyll steal Microsofts design now.

[aversion2k]

They should have just sent assasins over to Immersion, it would have been much cheaper.

Wasnt the patent along the lines of "Using an electronic device to spin something off balance and cause a vibration" (obviously it sounded a bit more fancy then that).

[51|RandoM]

Sad thing is, the world would be a better place without rumble crap.

Just think about it, the rumble is a virus, it even tried to spread to mice, to joysticks, to headphones---hell, they even put it in wireless controllers so your batteries get sucked dry asap.

Instead of billing Sony, lets just bill the people who bought force feedback headphones thinking it would be cool.

[Phades]

Personally, I enjoy rumble. I think it adds just another touch of immersion. On the same note, I think it should be easy to turn off if you don't. Since most of the time it is, I don't see a problem.

[sonysyndicate]

I rather have electric diodes hooked up to my tits and get shocked when I hit a wall in Gran Turismo 3 than have the controller rumble.

I should patent that.

[lockwoodx]

Buuuurnnnnn sony buuuurnnnn!!!!!!!!!

[gzsfrk]

My initial gut reaction to these types of suits is to feel disgust towards the patent squatters who sit on these wide-reaching patents for years and then emerge to try and squeeze companies for a settlement or outrageous licensing claim.

I think that's still my reaction here, although I'm a bit unclear as to how specific the patent was and whether or not Sony (and Microsoft, who have already settled the case) outright copied the exact mechanism they designed.

However, if all the patent said was a non-symmetrical mass spinning on an electric motor to create a vibrating sensation, then I think the problem obviously lies with our patent office for granting such ridiculous patents for obvious mechanisms for which prior art can be found with minimal research.

I mean... how long have vibrators been around?

[gzsfrk]

I rather have electric diodes hooked up to my tits and get shocked when I hit a wall in Gran Turismo 3 than have the controller rumble.

I should patent that.

My money is on some Japanese sex-games developer already holding just such a patent. But hey--I'm sure there's a market for it. Shoot for the stars, man. =)

[LilBunnyFuFu]

My initial gut reaction to these types of suits is to feel disgust towards the patent squatters who sit on these wide-reaching patents for years and then emerge to try and squeeze companies for a settlement or outrageous licensing claim.

Hey, don't dis the patent squatters. I'm still waiting for Sony to come out with a game that uses an anal thermometer to detect your body temperature and tell the game when you pass gas.

[GunnyMo]

Sony will be fine. I mean, they are charging $200 for a 4GB hard drive to attach to your PSP. That means for the cost of the system and that you can get a nice, little handheld system that plays PSX games for $450. How much was a GBA? Oh yeah, $80. Way to corner the market, Sony.

They'll be fine as long as people keep buying Sony accessories blindly.

[Eric_T_Cheng]

Sony will be fine. I mean, they are charging $200 for a 4GB hard drive to attach to your PSP.

Datel makes that 4GB HD/extended battery (http://www.darkplanets.co.uk/datel-4gb-harddrive.asp), not Sony.

[jpublic]

The patent as Immersion wrote it was for using rotational vibration generators in exactly that manner - as a feedback device. It's specific enough that it doesn't count as being one of those goofy patent claims, like what occured in NTP vs RIM.

Sony knew they infringed on the patent, but tried to get around it. They failed.

I stand by my hope this means we'll get Immersion mice again. My iFeel mouse from Logitech was my favorite mouse ever. I wish it still worked.

[sTubbs]

I actually do not notice rumble. On more than one occasion I have gone in to an options menu to turn it on only to find that it was already enabled. Now I just do not bother checking it all all. On or off, it really makes no difference to me. What is interesting is how many games have it off by default.

As for this ruling, good. If this company was ripped off by the big boys then they deserve every cent they have coming. One thing that does intrigue me about this entire saga is that Nintendo was never named. Even a year or so ago when this first came to light it was only ever Microsoft and Sony who were mentioned. I wonder what is so different about the GameCube rumble.

[Dirty Harry]

(Fictional) Sony Exec: 'It's okay, we can just add a dollar on to every Memory Stick we sell for the PSP. That should cover the cost nicely. And pay for our next trip to Hawaii.'
Fitbabits wtf man?, why are you trying to incite a flamewar with such a blazing false ideal. I know you are refeering to the Sony conference that was held in Hawaii, the reason it was choose was that the stateside and asian side offices decided to meet in the middle so the speak.
jpublic
Sony knew they infringed on the patent, but tried to get around it. They failed.
Also wth, Microsoft did exactly the same thing as Sony and instead of fighting it in the courts they purchased a sizeable sum of the stock and made a agreement between the two for fair use.

onto this actual problem while it does fubar things a bit, its not like what immersion is suing patent infringe is geniunely genius or even technically advanced. Its just two motors with unbalanced weights, I'm confident Sony will Reverse Engineer something.

[Twinkie]

One thing that does intrigue me about this entire saga is that Nintendo was never named. Even a year or so ago when this first came to light it was only ever Microsoft and Sony who were mentioned. I wonder what is so different about the GameCube rumble.
It's because they only use one motor in the center.

[GunnyMo]

Datel makes that 4GB HD/extended battery (http://www.darkplanets.co.uk/datel-4gb-harddrive.asp), not Sony.

Gah! I hate it when someone ruins my perfectly good rant with stupid, logical facts! Damn you, Cheng! :p

[emjoi]

An Immersion Suit?
Like a diving suit?

[mightbe]

Fitbabits wtf man?, why are you trying to incite a flamewar with such a blazing false ideal.

And look at that flamewar go! I don't think too many people here are wanting to have sony's babies anytime soon.

[Vandenh]

Funny thing is that Immersion is partially owned by MS now. I guess they are getting some money back ;)

[Reanimated]

Yeah, MS would get 15 mil of the current judgement amount. :cool:

[Lord Dongkey]

I think I'm against Immersion on this one. How long did they know that Sony was in violation of the patent before they turned around to cash in on it? I'm sure there's laws against that just as much as there are laws against what Sony did with their IP, so everyone's a shit-bag in this instance.

Except Nintendo. They're shiny.

[cppcrusader]

One thing that does intrigue me about this entire saga is that Nintendo was never named.

Well, according to another article I read this morning Immersion is actually partly owned by Nintendo.

[Sl1pstream]

You are absolutely right. Microsoft bought Immersion to sue Sony, it's that simple.

[jpublic]

I think I'm against Immersion on this one. How long did they know that Sony was in violation of the patent before they turned around to cash in on it? I'm sure there's laws against that just as much as there are laws against what Sony did with their IP, so everyone's a shit-bag in this instance.


Suit started shortly after Sony first released the Dual-Shock controller. For the PS1. It's just taken ages to be resolved.

[Grifter]

We should order a pizza!

[Dag-Sabot]

An Immersion Suit?
Like a diving suit?

LOL! Thank squirrel someone other than me got that!

Sony Appeal Denied in Immersion Suit:

My advice to sony: "Dont pee in the immersion suit".

[Magnanimous Gnome]

Those trying to blame Immersion for this need to look at the facts.

Immersion's patent is specific - they didn't patent something as silly as spectator mode.

Immersion did use their patent to make products.

Sony blatently copied the technology as did MS.

Sony refused to pay up for their mistake.

Sony lost.

Nintendo's tech is different, and I believe they have their own tech patented, but I could be wrong.