Valve on Rivals Boycotting Steamworks Games

[Emabulator]

http://evavhost.com/i/news/Valvehead.jpg

In an interview (http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/valve-rivals-miss-out-by-boycotting-steamworks-games) with GamesIndustry.biz, Jason Holtman from Valve addressed the concerns of online sellers that are refusing to sell Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 because of the title's Steamworks integration. Holtman also went on to say that "Steam sales actually scale with the game" and Modern Warfare 2 is "by and large one of our greatest sellers right now."

"To our minds, we think that if you're making a good game and it's got the services a customer wants it should get out in as many channels as possible. If you have a good portal and you're good at collecting money from folks, and attracting them, there's no reason why you shouldn't be," said Holtman.

"We try to make those services that developers and our customers want. Whether another distributor wants to carry them or not, we don't have any say in the matter, that's between Activision and other online distributors."

Although Direct2Drive in particular accused Steamworks (http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/direct2drive-refuses-to-sell-modern-warfare-2) of forcing users to install what it called a "Trojan Horse", Holtman shrugged off the suggestion, saying Steamworks features are all based on feedback from consumers and games developers.

[ldi222]

Valves coy suggestion that other portals should distribute successful games adds validity to the "trojan horse" accusation. Frankly, Steamworks should not be forced on the consumer, it should be a choice and is just one of many things that IW got wrong with MW2. Buying a game on steam is essentialy a rental copy and I avoid it at all costs.

[alienchild]

I had stopped gaming for years except for one MMO (the awesome Anarchy Online, check it out!) and Steam turned that around for me. I got one portal for my games, practically no installation, no 200-folder Programs folder in my start menu, no stupid updating of versions and certainly no CDs/DVDs that friggin wont work anymore (I'm looking at you Serious Sam Second Encounter!).

I do however understand that the Steam service should be an option. I'd much rather have games be "Steam enabled" rather than "Steam required". As for the "rental" thing, you might be right. When Valve crashes, and another company buys them, and that company crashes... then we're fucked. Or you can just download all games and apply a NO-CD crack to it (works on most games). That exe file contains the whole executable and can run your Steam game. At least then you payed for the game.

[Caerim]

Or you can just go offline and play the game up locally...

D2D is being shortsighted to refuse to sell a game if they're a storefront (digital or otherwise). Should Gamestop/EB/BB/WM not sell a game because it uses some form of digital protection?

Steamworks serves much of the same purpose and adds things for the developpers to use to make it easy for them to integrate it. You don't have to do mind-numbing things like maintain a server infrastructure for user authentication/activation and then watch it meltdown due to improper sizing (or worse oversize). You already paid for one by using Steamworks... Oh wait, it's free? Holy bananas...

[KlausFlouride]

I had some problems with Steam at first. I have tried the following DD sites:

- Direct2Drive: CS is total shit and you are FORCED to use their equally worthless download manager(ie if your connection goes down the dlm won't restart). They also took close to 3 weeks to patch Torchlight.
- pcgamerstore: no CS that I have seen. Three emails to tech support with zero response, not even an auto reply. Their DLM is totally bugged and won't install on 3 laptops running 3 different OS's I have. Glad I didn't give them money since I won the game when they started their site.
- Impulse: Their interface is crap. You can't type out the game name to search for it in their store. You have to find it by clicking through pages unless you know who made. I can't even remember my friends names half the time how am I gonna remember who made an indie game? In addition to the cluster fuck that their interface is when you buy a game you have to wait for the receipt to come before its added to your My Games tab. I had to wait 14 hours yesterday for them to email the receipt for RE5 I bought.
- Steam: Games are somewhat overpriced(ie EQ2 compilation is $40 on Steam and $20 on Sony's site).

This is just my experience.

[alienchild]

Or you can just go offline and play the game up locally...

Their offline mode is completely ass, broken to hell, doesn't work etc. I used to travel somewhat (Im actually on a business trip right now) and always brought my laptop. Sometimes, when I was far out in the country I could only get a shitty hotel without internet. Firing up Steam then was pointless, because it never worked even once. The Steam forums used to be filled with requests of them fixing this horrible shit of a "feature", but it never happened. Now people just generally accept that you have to be online to play Steam'ed games. Sucks when you're in the middle of nowhere with no internet, and all you have to do is play around with Excel. At least the good old Excel 95 had a hidden game in it (one version even had a Doom'like FPS).

[surj0]

Bleh. I like and use Steam, but if this becomes required for purchase of titles I simply won't buy the game. It's utterly ridiculous to expect direct competition to install their software for a game, that will in turn encourage people to buy from someone else next time. I would prefer if there was an alternative 3rd party system for this or it became entirely optional (seriously, why isn't it?).

[Mav]

The only thing I dislike about Steam, not hate just dislike, is if Steam goes down your centralization of connecting to MP game servers is down. At least singleplayer you could do offline mode but the other kinda sucks.

Past that, I love Steam. I like being able to redownload games I've purchased, as many times as I need to. No DRM bullshit about X number of installations, no more carrying around a big ass cd wallet full of game discs, all there for the using. I like the buddy list intergrated across the platform, being able to update in one place, ease of purchase, etc

And while other places are decent (I've used D2D, they're ok), I think at least currently, Steam is as good as it gets for digital distro for games, its the iTunes of PC games.

[brandonjclark]

Doesn't Steam simply make you pay for the first month upfront? Isn't that why EQ is 40 there? Also, can't you "back up" the game and burn it to disc if you wanted to? Wouldn't that destroy the whole "rental" argument?

Steam is top dawg, but that doesn't give them a right to make me hold their dick if I want to play a game with them.

"Hey Steam, wanna play a game? I want you on my team."
"Sure, but you gotta hold my weiner"
"Well, you ARE the best player, OK":o

[revoc]

Valve is in dire need of being regulated. Right now gaming is at the point where it's kinda mainstream but not quite, so they can get away with it - for now. Luckily for them, the mainstream doesn't follow the gaming industry the same way they follow the OS, phone, and microprocessor industries and they had better pray it stays that way. Steamworks is a pretty insidious way of locking a game to Steam. I don't think bundling MW2 with Steam is ethical. At least let us choose.

[revoc]

From the interview:

"There's a lot of games that came out in 2009 with Steamworks, and they'll be a lot more games in 2010 that have Steamworks."

And those are games I won't be buying. :D

[sflufan]

Valve should've casually mentioned the OTHER games that use Steamworks that are readily available on D2D: FEAR 2, Empire: Total War, Zeno Clash, and Dawn of War II.

I guess D2D didn't have that much of a problem that the Steamworks "Trojan Horse" was included with those games, huh?

As for Valve being in "dire need of being regulated"...are you serious? It's the OPTION of another developer to use SteamWorks. No one at Valve is forcing them to use SteamWorks.

Or that D2D sells games that contain SecuROM, but just happens to NOT mention that as the DRM software in the description of the game.

[Fubl]

there was some complaints about DOWII when it came out i think that was really the first case then as yhe year went on and more games came out the complaints got more valid and bigger.

[Caerim]

I've used Steam on and offline many times without any issues so I haven't had the misfortune of not being able to play my games. I think Steam does do the digital distribution best right now. Impulse still has miles to go and D2D's site is terribly unclean (too many ads, to hard to get to content and complicated to get where you want to go).

[alienchild]

Doesn't Steam simply make you pay for the first month upfront?
Isn't that why EQ is 40 there?
Also, can't you "back up" the game and burn it to disc if you wanted to?
Wouldn't that destroy the whole "rental" argument?

- Steam (Valve) doesn't charge anything per month, the service is free.
- Um come again?
- Back up, sure, but the backup doesn't contain a working .exe file since part of the executable is downloaded after authentication when starting the game in Steam.
- Absolutely not, it is even written in the Steam agreement each time you buy a game that you only have it available for as long as the publisher and/or Valve see fit.

All in all the consumer rights when it comes to Steam is pretty damn weak.

[Flatulus]

The only thing I don't like about Steam is the offline mode. I had problems with it in the past. But aside from that, I love Steam crazy weekend deals... 75+% off!
I should unplug my internet cable and give it a try now... maybe it would be fine now?!

I got a couple of games (Dead Space & Neverwinter Night 2) from Direct2Drive and I have nothing to complain about. My only negative point is that I don't have a "client" on my PC so I'm not always aware of deals, prices and new games on D2D. So of course, Steam is more tempting... with weekly deals popping in my face.

[Johan]

I've never been able to get Steam to open up in offline mode. I've tried just to experiment with whether it will work, and it doesn't. I just tried again a few minutes ago. Won't work.

The deals you can get from Steam just beat almost anywhere else. I like having a centralized location for my games. I like that it "just works" without hassle.


Positives for me:
* Sales (reduced prices on games)
* Centralized service
* Works seamlessly in the background

Negatives for me:
* Cannot get offline mode to work
* Cannot figure out how to move my save files from one computer to another at all.

I don't blame their rivals for shying away from offering games with Steamworks integration, but I think their sudden stiffening of spine is too little, too late. The Steam 'cat' is out of the 'bag' so-to-speak. Just like with me, once they get you on one game, it's quite likely you'll be going back for more, until you have many, many games through their service and won't consider buying elsewhere.

[revoc]

So of course, Steam is more tempting... with weekly deals popping in my face.

Hence the trojan horse comparisons. You get enticed by a game like... COD: MW2 :), install it and bam, viral like, Steam gets installed too. As long as you want to play the game, you need to have Steam installed, and as long as Steam is installed, you get bombared by pop-up deals and the Steam store sales enticing you to buy more, more, more. You buy more games, you become heavily invested in it, you start defending Valve and Steam as the greatest thing since sliced bread.

This is generally what I see in internet land. We need to come up with a name for this condition, because IMHO it IS a condition. :)

How many virgin PC's did Valve manage to wiggle Steam into through COD:MW2?

[Johan]

Does anyone have the link to the thread here which mentioned a method for matching your Steam files between computers, so that you do not have to manually move game saves?

Anyone? Help? :(

Edit: Found it, for anyone else interested. (http://www.evilavatar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=99264&highlight=Steam)

:)

[DarkDaY]

Everything sucks, even gold right? whatever, steam works, I have fun, I get to play my games, live sucks, psn sucks, everything sucks.....


STFU lol. Actually, nvm that, keep it coming, its entertaining as shit.

[Strider]

Oh hey, you're asking for it.


If they go down, everything goes down.
If your ISP/Internet goes down or isn't available, bummer.
You don't own shit, but pay as if it were so.
No selling stuff you don't need anymore.
Price fixing, it's their price or no deal.
You can't choose whom to support.
Monopoly.
What will be in 5, 10, 20 years?


...and that's just off the top of my head. I'd love to see valve being regulated in some kind of way.

[Strider]

You have to use steam, the software, it's not an open protocol and there are no alteratives available.

[Strider]

I had some problems with Steam at first. I have tried the following DD sites:

(...)
- Impulse: Their interface is crap. You can't type out the game name to search for it in their store. You have to find it by clicking through pages unless you know who made. I can't even remember my friends names half the time how am I gonna remember who made an indie game? In addition to the cluster fuck that their interface is when you buy a game you have to wait for the receipt to come before its added to your My Games tab. I had to wait 14 hours yesterday for them to email the receipt for RE5 I bought.
(...)

This is just my experience.

I can't confirm the issues you have. The search works fine within client or website. Also, bought games immediately showed up in my games (if they were non-preorder, of course).

It'd be very helpful if you also noted which software has to be open to play the games (e.g. steam) and which not (e.g. impulse). For me having to run steam to run anything bought is a big no-go.

[lockwoodx]

Valve is in dire need of being regulated. Right now gaming is at the point where it's kinda mainstream but not quite, so they can get away with it - for now. Luckily for them, the mainstream doesn't follow the gaming industry the same way they follow the OS, phone, and microprocessor industries and they had better pray it stays that way. Steamworks is a pretty insidious way of locking a game to Steam. I don't think bundling MW2 with Steam is ethical. At least let us choose.

I agree 100%. Steam is becoming a 500lb gorilla in the room.

[Suicidal ShiZuru]

I dont really see the problems here. Just because there is a company out there still trying to be innovative everyone suspects them of foul play. IMO the whole MW2 issue was caused by D2D being scared of their loyal fan base ditching them for Steam after "forcefully" using it and finding out how superior it is.

Oh hey, you're asking for it.


If they go down, everything goes down.
If your ISP/Internet goes down or isn't available, bummer.
You don't own shit, but pay as if it were so.
No selling stuff you don't need anymore.
Price fixing, it's their price or no deal.
You can't choose whom to support.
Monopoly.
What will be in 5, 10, 20 years?


...and that's just off the top of my head. I'd love to see valve being regulated in some kind of way.

1 - Very unlikely but you can you know... download the games from torrents
2 - *Offline works for me...
3 - Pretty sure they wont jew customers out of their games unless the company goes under in which case... torrent again, cd crack blah blah but Valve has already mentioned a solution for this
4 - used video games is a rather bad practice
5 - Take your money elsewhere if you dont like the price
6 - Talk to IW
7 - Not really, competition just sucks
8 - One of many mainstream digital download mediums available for entertainment in general

* In Steam - Go to Settings to ensure the Do not store account information on this computer option is not selected

Supposedly that can help with offline mode issues.

[Caerim]

To Strider:

I don't see how it's price fixing, you either pay Steam's price or you go to another service and pay their price. Price fixing is everyone getting together and selling it at a specific price.

You want to support a specific software developper but you also want to sell your used games? There's a little bit of wackiness going on there.

PC games are all software licenses. You don't actually own the game just the right to play it. It's more an indictment of how PC gaming is different from console gaming.

It's only a monopoly if there's no viable competition. Impulse and D2D aren't as good but are still competition. Steam does account for a large portion on online game sales but not to the point where anyone would judge it a monopoly.

[see colon]

T
PC games are all software licenses. You don't actually own the game just the right to play it. It's more an indictment of how PC gaming is different from console gaming.
I read through this entire thread with this thought in my head, and you beat me to it.

Steam works for me. It removes many of the issues I have with PC gaming (matchmaking with friends across multiple games, disc checks, looking for patches) and adds things I care about like achievements. In my opinion, they are fixing many of the things that have plagued PC gaming for years, and steamworks and steamcloud go even further.

[Strider]

I dont really see the problems here. Just because there is a company out there still trying to be innovative everyone suspects them of foul play. IMO the whole MW2 issue was caused by D2D being scared of their loyal fan base ditching them for Steam after "forcefully" using it and finding out how superior it is.



1 - Very unlikely but you can you know... download the games from torrents
2 - *Offline works for me...
3 - Pretty sure they wont jew customers out of their games unless the company goes under in which case... torrent again, cd crack blah blah but Valve has already mentioned a solution for this
4 - used video games is a rather bad practice
5 - Take your money elsewhere if you dont like the price
6 - Talk to IW
7 - Not really, competition just sucks
8 - One of many mainstream digital download mediums available for entertainment in general

* In Steam - Go to Settings to ensure the Do not store account information on this computer option is not selected

Supposedly that can help with offline mode issues.

I'm not asking for a holy war here, however the last post on page 1 wanted this ;).

It's astonishing to see people defending a system which only has drawbacks for them.

I will however answer once more to the points:

1 - That's illegal, and I could do that without steam in the first place. Also, no guarantee my previously bought product would be available.
2 - Seemingly it doesn't for many people. Including me. Not only do you have to be online to go offline, but the feature itself still is very buggy.
3 - They can remove your access to anything and there's nothing you can do about it.
4 - Bad practice? WTF? I can sell what I want, be it a video game, house or car. Of course anyone selling any product doesn't like that, but it's a right and very moral thing.
5 - Steam bound products will result in profit for Steam. That was my point. It's a middle man that WILL get his money.
6 - I don't care about IW.
7 - See 5.
8 - I don't understand your answer. I was pointing out that no one knows if we can play paid steam games in several years. Yet we can still dig up that doom CD...

[Strider]

To Strider:

You want to support a specific software developper but you also want to sell your used games? There's a little bit of wackiness going on there.


How so? It's a very economy-oriented argument you're bringing up. It's not illegal nor immoral, heck someone buying a game used propably wasn't searching for it brand new.

Also, I can hardly keep this discussion up. Trying to defend a no-steam position is a losing fight on the internet nowadays. Maybe rightly so. Maybe not.

Time will tell and all I can say is the future of things I own is in my own hands. Steam is not. Pick whichever you like.

[Strider]

Maybe it just all boils down to this:

You're putting yourself at mercy from just one company. That's never been good.

[see colon]

How so? It's a very economy-oriented argument you're bringing up. It's not illegal nor immoral, heck someone buying a game used propably wasn't searching for it brand new.
In the PC space, it's usually a violation of EULA to sell a game because you don't own that game, you simply have a license to play it, and that license is non-transferable. Is it illegal or immoral to break a written agreement?

Steams user agreements are in line with boxed software. Where an issue would come up would be if Valve would go out of business and the Steam central servers would go down.

[Strider]

In the PC space, it's usually a violation of EULA to sell a game because you don't own that game, you simply have a license to play it, and that license is non-transferable. Is it illegal or immoral to break a written agreement?

Steams user agreements are in line with boxed software. Where an issue would come up would be if Valve would go out of business and the Steam central servers would go down.

You nearly got me. However, the EULA itself is illegal hence invalid in some (many?) countries. Especially in those where it's a (non-removable) basic right to do with your property as you see fit.

So no, I'm not breaking any agreement. I'm rather ignoring an agreement that should not have been there in the first place since it's breaking laws.

I'd rather ponder why this all is even possible. Morals and law seem to drift further and further apart in countries where the EULA is legal.

[Jotoco]

It's astonishing to see people defending a system which only has drawbacks for them.


If it wasn't for Steam several people in several countries wouldn't even have access to games. It was Steam that got me out of piracy, and I resorted to it for years because I couldn't even buy games around.

Besides, steam centralizes my saves, stats, achievments and stuff. I can talk to my friends cross games, join their games and a lot more features. I don't need to keep CDs (that I lose constantly), I can reinstall from anywhere without finding said Cds, I don't need to find patchs to apply, I get to buy things cheaper...

I could go on a lot more things steam adds for me, but you won't listen, so I will not bother.

Even though steam has drawbacks it is a lot better than not having steam.

[see colon]

You nearly got me. However, the EULA itself is illegal hence invalid in some (many?) countries. Especially in those where it's a (non-removable) basic right to do with your property as you see fit.
I know some countries ignore the EULA, and some don't, but what does that change about the morality of the situation. If it is a basic right to do with your property as you see fit, then why can't steam/valve/anyone rent you something or sell you something with limitations on it's use? Wouldn't that be their right? Hey look, we've just talked ourselves into a moral circle.

[brandonjclark]

I'd like to know what happens to you folks who are having issues with "offline mode". Have you tried simply disabling your network adapter? If it was disabled or your network cable unplugged (only temporarily until Offline mode launches) I don't see how it wouldn't work.

If network adapter is disabled or ethernet cabled unplugged:

Steam tries to connect to network > Steam fails connecting network > Steam asks if you want to start Steam in "offline mode" > You say yes > Steam loads in "offline mode"

Someone tell me where in that process it's failing for you, I'm dying to know.

[Caerim]

How so? It's a very economy-oriented argument you're bringing up. It's not illegal nor immoral, heck someone buying a game used propably wasn't searching for it brand new.

Also, I can hardly keep this discussion up. Trying to defend a no-steam position is a losing fight on the internet nowadays. Maybe rightly so. Maybe not.

Time will tell and all I can say is the future of things I own is in my own hands. Steam is not. Pick whichever you like.

The position is weak because you want to support a developper but are encouraging the market of used games that doesn't give anything back to the developper (one might even argue it just adds to their costs via support, server load etc).

Steam offers the one thing stores and physical copies don't and that's the ability to get my game back years down the line (Half Life is a good example) well after I've lost my CDs and CD keys. To be absolutely fair, I tend not to go back to games after I'm 'done' with them so either way, it's not that big a deal but at least with Steam, I have the option of going back :)

[Mav]

Also, can't you "back up" the game and burn it to disc if you wanted to? Wouldn't that destroy the whole "rental" argument?


These are PC games. You don't rent PC games, this isn't the console arena where you can hop down your local Blockbuster or use something like Gamefly to test out games.

This is no way shape or form Steams fault, its the way the PC industry is.

[sixtyfps]

Steamworks is a pretty insidious way of locking a game to Steam. I don't think bundling MW2 with Steam is ethical. At least let us choose.

The consumer can choose... to not spend money on it. This isn't a human-rights issue or even a basic service like water, electricity, gas, or garbage removal; one simply decides whether x home-entertainment product is worth one's money, or ignores it entirely.

Absent complete up-front disclosure (which I'll acknowledge isn't uniformly supplied by publishers and distributors, and which I'll also argue is the only form of as-yet-unimplemented mandatory regulation I support), we're getting exactly what we want already.

[see colon]

I'd like to know what happens to you folks who are having issues with "offline mode". Have you tried simply disabling your network adapter? If it was disabled or your network cable unplugged (only temporarily until Offline mode launches) I don't see how it wouldn't work.

If network adapter is disabled or ethernet cabled unplugged:

Steam tries to connect to network > Steam fails connecting network > Steam asks if you want to start Steam in "offline mode" > You say yes > Steam loads in "offline mode"

Someone tell me where in that process it's failing for you, I'm dying to know.

If you aren't logged into steam, or don't have the "remember password" box checked, you can't launch in offline mode. I've personaly run into issues when trying to log out of one account and into another (my HL2/CSS/HL1 are on a seperate account) without internet, and had friends have issues at a LAN without net access who didn't have their passwords remembered.

[brandonjclark]

If you aren't logged into steam, or don't have the "remember password" box checked, you can't launch in offline mode. I've personaly run into issues when trying to log out of one account and into another (my HL2/CSS/HL1 are on a seperate account) without internet, and had friends have issues at a LAN without net access who didn't have their passwords remembered.

So if you don't fix the settings as they should be you get the expected result? How is this an error or a problem?

[GBSOD]

Yeah I too am surprised at the complaints about offline play. I tend to play with steam offline all the time. I only connect to buy a game or occasionally dabble in multi.

There was a time when HL2 first came out, and switching between online sometimes meant that I lost my offline status and had to reconnect, but that was years ago.

And calling steam 'insidious' Trojan horse software is such a ridiculous exaggeration I thought it was a joke at first.

[see colon]

So if you don't fix the settings as they should be you get the expected result? How is this an error or a problem?
There isn't a "should be" with login settings. If you don't have your password saved for whatever reason, and your internet goes out for whatever reason, you can't play steam games. Not having your password saved can be a necessity in some cases. If I lived in a frat house, for example, I'm not sure I would be comfortable with 20 other people potentialy having access to my steam account. What if they installed some hacks and got your steam account blacklisted? What if they harrassed people on your friends lists? Or, in my case, I have a 6 year old who likes to go online and play webkins and stuff. I don't really want her having access to L4D2, or Assassin's Creed. But the fact is, because I'm being responsable with my account, I may find myself without those games.

[brandonjclark]

There isn't a "should be" with login settings. If you don't have your password saved for whatever reason, and your internet goes out for whatever reason, you can't play steam games. Not having your password saved can be a necessity in some cases. If I lived in a frat house, for example, I'm not sure I would be comfortable with 20 other people potentialy having access to my steam account. What if they installed some hacks and got your steam account blacklisted? What if they harrassed people on your friends lists? Or, in my case, I have a 6 year old who likes to go online and play webkins and stuff. I don't really want her having access to L4D2, or Assassin's Creed. But the fact is, because I'm being responsable with my account, I may find myself without those games.

Webkinz, FTW! *same at my house, bro:)


Seriously, man, there's nothing you have listed here that can't be handled with simple logon account control. Create a new user for your child, create new users for your frat members(or better yet, don't). Nothing here can't be handled with a Windows account or parental controls.

Also, when you install Steam you have to have an internet connection to authenticate once, at which point the "Save password locally" is checked by default. So, you have to MANUALLY deactivate it from saving your password.

Again, it works fine by default, you've changed your settings and are now paying the price of not understanding the configuration.

[brandonjclark]

Okay, now I'm having second thoughts about the default settings, but I do know it puts a checkbox right in your face underneath the password textbox.

Finally, about multiple user accounts, do that. You should let your kid have full administrative rights (as I'm sure your account has) anyway. (UAC or not)

[brandonjclark]

ARGGGHHH!!!!!! "shouldn't" let you kid.......

[Meusli]

I think the offline nightmare is so you can not go around installing your account on peoples computers, letting them play your games offline. But alas I have never had a problem with it either, once I lost my connection and could still play all my games. I have not tried it lately though with games like Empire Total War and DOW2.

[F3nyx]

As long as you want to play the game, you need to have Steam installed, and as long as Steam is installed, you get bombared by pop-up deals and the Steam store sales enticing you to buy more, more, more.

Uh, those are options that you can turn off.

[see colon]

Okay, now I'm having second thoughts about the default settings, but I do know it puts a checkbox right in your face underneath the password textbox.

Finally, about multiple user accounts, do that. You should let your kid have full administrative rights (as I'm sure your account has) anyway. (UAC or not)

It isn't like these setting are buried, or you have to exit some config files. It's a simple check box that could potentially cause you a nightmare. For the record, my daughter knows she isn't allowed to touch my gaming PC, but she does have full access to a junker laptop I own, with steam installed, that I prey to god she brakes before January because it'll be an excuse for me to get a newer, snappier one. I don't have my password saved on the laptop, and I sometimes use it to play Titan Quest (that I bought through steam) or Left4Dead (that it plays barely on the lowest settings) if I'm on the road. If I don't set it to offline mode before I leave, I'll end up searching for a wifi hotspot so I can log in just long enough to do so later. It can be a pain in the ass. If I do set it up for offline mode, and I stay somewhere with wifi, I have to go online to play L4D online, and then remember to go back offline while I'm online when I leave.

This isn't a huge deal for me, but I can see where other people could have a potential problem, depending on their usage. Offline mode is one of those features that is advertised and sounds good, but isn't 100% what it could be. I understand the reasons for it's limitations, but it doesn't mean it isn't a pain in the ass.

[ascl]

And to think, my biggest issue with steam is that I cannot assign voice to one sound card (well, usb headset), and game sounds to another...

[Syl]

And to think, my biggest issue with steam is that I cannot assign voice to one sound card (well, usb headset), and game sounds to another...
This is very game dependent. Source games, for some reason, won't let you do this. But other games that already have the support natively will.

[Anenome]

One time I had to update Steam but my internet was out. I couldn't play anything, much less set it to offline mode. Booooo, fix it, Valve. Offline mode should be available while offline.