Star Trek Online Community Q&A

[WpnX]

http://evavhost.com/i/news/startrekonline.jpg

MMO site Massively (http://www.massively.com/)has spoken to the folks at Cryptic Studios seeking new answers and clarification (http://www.massively.com/2009/11/16/ships-star-trek-online-community-qanda-answers/) (Get it? Instead of new life and civilization?) regarding their upcoming MMO, Star Trek Online.

The questions are reader-submitted, so fans can expect a high nerd-quotient with every query.

Javert: With the collapse of the Romulan Empire, is the Treaty of Algeron (treaty between the Romulans and the Federation stipulating that the Federation would not pursue research on or equip their vessels with cloaking technology without explicit permission from the Empire) still in effect, and, if so, why?

Starfleet vessels do not use cloaking technology as standard practice. There have been notable exceptions to this rule, and the same holds true for the current state of the Federation.

I'm sure this title can put a dent in the hull of the good ship World of Warcraft, but what happens when the Knights of the Old Republic MMO comes out?

[kwolf]

I wonder if anyone asked if they were planning on actually releasing a game with some content rather than what they did with CO.

[bean19]

I like the fact that the Federation doesn't use cloaks because that feels Star Trek and it will make a difference between Klingon vessels and Federation vessels that would not be as fun if they had the exact same gameplay with simply different models.

However, it would be cool if they had a lore reason why the Federation is still not using cloaks.

[Flatulus]

I wonder if anyone asked if they were planning on actually releasing a game with some content rather than what they did with CO.
OMG! You stole my question! :| I felt *really* bad purchasing the 6 months "package" and getting bored to hell after 2 weeks of play.

Don't get me wrong... they did some stuff to near perfection (character customization for example) but it was just so damn... boring for some reason.

[WpnX]

I like the fact that the Federation doesn't use cloaks because that feels Star Trek and it will make a difference between Klingon vessels and Federation vessels that would not be as fun if they had the exact same gameplay with simply different models.

However, it would be cool if they had a lore reason why the Federation is still not using cloaks.

Star Trek notwithstanding, I prefer to have each "team" have a specific skillset or abilities when it comes to team-oriented games. Moreso when it comes to Star Trek - as any fan will tell you there are distinct differences in outlook and tech with every race.

As for the Federation not using cloak - it's just that Starfleet has never really used cloak outside of the Defiant (plus that time with Riker). If I had to write it off as lore, I'd just say "The Federation is too far behind in its cloaking research to be able to effectively roll out a device for competent enough for active service." Keep in mind that cloaking technology, to be effective, must develop faster than scanner technology.

Then again, I am talking about an imaginary universe.

That being said, if I were making a Star Trek game, I wouldn't allow cloaking for Starfleet simply because most fans will tear you apart for it. As a general rule, the Federation doesn't NEED to sneak around. Plus, this is the first Prime-universe appearance since Nemesis or that small scene in Star Trek. It would be weirder, IMO, to say "oh - and also Starfleet ships can cloak." That would be akin to giving the Klingons the best scientists - just plain inaccurate.

I just hope they don't screw it up. I have been in serious Star Trek withdrawal since watching all of DS9 about 18 months ago. Above and beyond that, my dad recently bought a new i7 from Dell, and asked if he should upgrade to the premium video card. I told him the only game he might be interested in is Star Trek Online in February. I have tentatively agreed to play with him, and don't want to be stuck playing a terrible game because I promised my father we'd stick it out together.

[HALO 32]

Has anyone made a “For the Borg!” joke yet?

Anyway…it looks cool, but I think I’ll stick with The Old Republic…when ever it comes out.

[bean19]

WpnX - We seem to be in agreement that Star Fleet shouldn't be able to cloak for thematic and gameplay reasons.

However, I think your lore reason might not be that strong. Star Fleet is at war with the Klingon Empire (which now includes the Gorn). With Romulus destroyed they do not have a reason to not use cloaking technology and it is a primary weapon of their enemy. Traditionally, Star Fleet has used their scientific acumen to adapt to enemy technologies and their diplomatic acumen to avoid conflict. Finding a lore answer really should involve some tradeoff technologically or diplomatically - not that the Federation simply isn't able to adapt. That doesn't feel right.

[brandonjclark]

Ugh, I don't consider myself that much of a Trekkie, but wasn't there a treaty (http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Treaty_of_Algeron) involved that defined the uses of cloaks? I thought that the Federation found it immoral, not that they couldn't bust up a Klingon ship and take the damn device.

[Wolfgang]

OMG! You stole my question! :| I felt *really* bad purchasing the 6 months "package" and getting bored to hell after 2 weeks of play.

Don't get me wrong... they did some stuff to near perfection (character customization for example) but it was just so damn... boring for some reason.

I think it must just not have been for you. Champions Online is basically WoW meets City of Heroes with a little bit of Ultima Online mixed in. The questing is WoW (Kill NPCs, fetch quests, instances, etc...), City of Heroes customization and look, Ultima Online open Framework with its own Gameplay -- more actiony -- block attacks, charge attacks, tap charge, fly, etc... Maybe they shouldn't have copied WoW as much from a questing design (lots of open world quests with some instances), but WoW is the king of the hill and obviously that influences a lot of MMOs and they probably thought they could get away with it since they aren't another high fantasy clone like Aion and Warhammer, but instead a Comic Book theme.

It could use more content -- which they have continued to add.

One of the biggest complaints leveled at Champions is lack of leveling content (they don't have many zones) and that picking powers is confusing. It is confusing for people who don't do research and don't try to create synergy between the frameworks by picking powers that use the same stats. It is kinda funny to me, Champions is one of the most open games (no classes) and people knock it for being too open and want classes, then you have class based games and people complain about classes -- developers can't win.

I enjoy Champions, but it obviously is not for everyone.

[kwolf]

I just hope they don't screw it up.
Cryptic put themselves on my "do not buy" list by their behavior during the pre and post-launch of CO. I don't think I've ever seen a dev team act so stupidly (and that's saying a lot -- I've seen it all from nerfed bank earthquakes in UO all the way to the launch day Cryptic panic patch).

[WpnX]

However, I think your lore reason might not be that strong. Star Fleet is at war with the Klingon Empire (which now includes the Gorn). With Romulus destroyed they do not have a reason to not use cloaking technology and it is a primary weapon of their enemy. Traditionally, Star Fleet has used their scientific acumen to adapt to enemy technologies and their diplomatic acumen to avoid conflict. Finding a lore answer really should involve some tradeoff technologically or diplomatically - not that the Federation simply isn't able to adapt. That doesn't feel right.

Well again it all comes down to the fact this is a made-up universe.

Are all cloaks created equal? In my last post I mentioned that cloaking tech would have to at least outpace sensor tech. I would argue that Sovereign class star ships have too large of an electronic footprint to be able to slap a cloak on and go invisible. Remember - cloaking ships must leave no heat, no radiation, no warp signature - they must be totally self contained. But what about Nova class science vessels or runabouts? Or the Defiant class?

Keep in mind that the Romulans did not only want Starfleet to refrain from using cloak, but rather refrain from developing cloak technology as a whole. If making that tech work was easy, don't you think the Cardassians or Dominion would have put it to use?

If I were at cryptic I would give it 6 months then announce that people can not modify their Lt. Comm. ships with cloaking due to a scientific breakthrough. That way starfleet gets cloak on smaller ships, with the Defiant being the most advanced ship able to equip the technology. At the same time, it's not like Cryptic would be randomly throwing cloak into the lore behind our backs.

If you want a more solid lore reason, I'd say they do it out of respect for the billions of dead Romulans, whom the Federation couldn't save. The few hundred thousand Romulans remaining still constitute a race (although their threat level is obviously diminished), and it would be very "un-starfleet" of them to break a treaty just because the Romulans sustained a massive disaster.

However, it is decidedly Starfleet to kill Klingons despite their stealth advantage. The Gorn and Naussicans were good brawlers, but probably arent known for their advanced ship designs. I'd say Starfleet's advantage would lie in propulsion and shield tech.

[modeps]

Cryptic put themselves on my "do not buy" list by their behavior during the pre and post-launch of CO. I don't think I've ever seen a dev team act so stupidly (and that's saying a lot -- I've seen it all from nerfed bank earthquakes in UO all the way to the launch day Cryptic panic patch).

Care to elaborate? I haven't kept up on that one.

[bean19]

Ugh, I don't consider myself that much of a Trekkie, but wasn't there a treaty (http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Treaty_of_Algeron) involved. . .
This is the 2nd post from you today that shows that you don't read other people's posts.

[bean19]

If you want a more solid lore reason, I'd say they do it out of respect for the billions of dead Romulans, whom the Federation couldn't save. The few hundred thousand Romulans remaining still constitute a race (although their threat level is obviously diminished), and it would be very "un-starfleet" of them to break a treaty just because the Romulans sustained a massive disaster.
This works.

[brandonjclark]

This is the 2nd post from you today that shows that you don't read other people's posts.


This is the first post from you today that I'm ignoring.

[Wolfgang]

Care to elaborate? I haven't kept up on that one.

They had a launch day patch which made the game harder. People weren't expecting it, it wasn't well communicated. It changed the effectiveness of Defensive powers and lowered the XP rate.

These were needed changes. Without these changes the game was way to easy and people were leveling to top level (40) in 3 days or less.

The way Cryptic handled it was rather poor, but people I think have blown it way out of proporition because it did improve the game. A game were you are super-man is fun for a few days -- eventually you will want a challenge.

[bean19]

This is the first post from you today that I'm ignoring.
Your posts show otherwise. Clearly you are ignoring many people's posts in this thread.

[bean19]

Wolfgang - My problem with Champions Online was scarcity of content. At level 20 I had done the content available for my level and up to level 21 or 22 in Millenium City and the content for my level in Canada, so I was fighting level 24+ mobs to do missions.

I could have grinded to make up the gap, but I don't enjoy that and the xp for mobs was rather poor. I also could have grinded the few open missions in the game (well the one in the Dessert that is appropriate for a level 20), but the xp/time on those are terrible. Plus, what I really wanted to do was PvP for xp and I was disappointed that the xp/time for PvP was ridiculously low.

The last straw was that they patched the game to improve performance and it reduced my performance while also nerfing my level 20 hero's power energy use (same attack damage, but archery suddenly cost a large amount of energy to shoot arrows but it was still all powers that activated slowly with long animations). Basically, they nerfed broadly without looking at the other sides of powers to balance them up versus other sets.

So lack of content and poor support = no longer interested

However, I don't hate the company as I really enjoyed CoX despite many of the same poor design decision (thoughtless general nerfing like the Enhancement nerfs with CoV and a lack of compelling content. . . CoX has too much of the same and as a villain you spend most of your time fighting other villains due to a lack of villainous content. . . honestly, NOW this is improved, but they still lack the ability to create a good endgame).

[Wolfgang]

Wolfgang - My problem with Champions Online was scarcity of content. At level 20 I had done the content available for my level and up to level 21 or 22 in Millenium City and the content for my level in Canada, so I was fighting level 24+ mobs to do missions.

This is only an issue at first because they didn't handle mission giving correctly and has since been fixed. There was never a content gap (I leveled without ever having to grind), but they didn't do a good job explaining how to get from one quest hub to the other. Also travel powers allow you to skip many quest givers because they never activate.

I could have grinded to make up the gap, but I don't enjoy that and the xp for mobs was rather poor. I also could have grinded the few open missions in the game (well the one in the Dessert that is appropriate for a level 20), but the xp/time on those are terrible. Plus, what I really wanted to do was PvP for xp and I was disappointed that the xp/time for PvP was ridiculously low.
Grinding sucks in all games. But for some reason some people seem to enjoy it... see Aion.

The last straw was that they patched the game to improve performance and it reduced my performance while also nerfing my level 20 hero's power energy use (same attack damage, but archery suddenly cost a large amount of energy to shoot arrows but it was still all powers that activated slowly with long animations). Basically, they nerfed broadly without looking at the other sides of powers to balance them up versus other sets. Balancing has also slowed, but I haven't played a MMO where the nerf hammer did swing to far and wide. Though I understand the frustration.


So lack of content and poor support = no longer interested

The Game has great support -- the MMO community has even held them up as one of the most open Developers: http://www.eldergame.com/2009/11/two-kinds-of-developer-relations/ I will not agree with that. Post that Day 1 they have been some of the most open and available developers of any video game. They post state of the games, respond to forums, give plenty of interviews, host Dev Chats, etc...

They have also already had 1 nice content patch, have a new lair by thanksgiving and will have another large content patch for Christmas. IMHO that is excellent support. They actively use their test center, give incentives to get on, and have listened to player feedback. I would rate Cryptic as having excellent support since thei Day 1 fiasco.

The game also have plenty of content for 1 character -- if you are into alts yes it needs more content for leveling and I would assume they are adding that.

The new instance due out at the end of Thanksgiving will be the first true end game instance staring your Nemesis along with other Villians. Don't know if it will be good, but it sounds fun.

[Wolfgang]

New Champions Lair coming for Thanksgiving: http://www.champions-online.com/nemesis_confrontation

The lair will be introduced to the game in an update scheduled to launch on Tuesday, November 24th, 2009. The update will also contain an additional two costume sets, the Gladiatorial and Shadow Destroyer sets. These sets will be unlockable to players through certain achievements attainable within the Nemesis Confrontation lair, and will also be available for purchase at the C-Store.

And what's a lair without loot? There will be a number of rewards for players to earn, which you can read about at the official Nemesis Confrontation update page here.

[WpnX]

So I guess this becomes a matter of Cryptic learning from their mistakes. Fortunately, with established lore, there is a ton of options for them to take in terms of instances and quests. Let's hope they put them to good use, because I hate the thought of my loser Star Wars friends bragging about a good MMO.

That's not fair. Star Wars had two tries.

[Wolfgang]

So I guess this becomes a matter of Cryptic learning from their mistakes. Fortunately, with established lore, there is a ton of options for them to take in terms of instances and quests. Let's hope they put them to good use, because I hate the thought of my loser Star Wars friends bragging about a good MMO.

That's not fair. Star Wars had two tries.

It was a rocky start, but they have learned. The game isn't for everyone (no game is), but Cryptic is at least doing a bang up job of working with the community now. Obviously people want stuff yesterday and it does take a while to create content, so you do have some people still upset.

Anoter Champions IRC Dev chat on 11/20 - http://www.champions-online.com/node/594709

Video of myself PvPing in the newly added Blood Moon PvP map: http://www.slashcry.com/?p=514

[Grumsh]

It was a rocky start, but they have learned. The game isn't for everyone (no game is), but Cryptic is at least doing a bang up job of working with the community now. Obviously people want stuff yesterday and it does take a while to create content, so you do have some people still upset.

Anoter Champions IRC Dev chat on 11/20 - http://www.champions-online.com/node/594709

Video of myself PvPing in the newly added Blood Moon PvP map: http://www.slashcry.com/?p=514

I am so MMO gun-shy right now. My wife Picked up Aion for both of us and the game is beyond a grind, which I quit doing with EQ1. She refuses to quit because everything looks "pretty". I would love to find an MMO we both could play, but after forking over 150ish for WoW and 100 for Aion, I am just not brave enough.